Luas - Red Line General Discussion

Carroller16 wrote: »

True I really must try it out. But I work on Sir John Rogerson's Quay so getting off at Busáras is handy for me

There must be a handier 90 bus stop than Busaras Luas for Sir John Rogersons Quay? Eden, Custom House, North Wall Quays?

Interesting what the OP said about anti-social behaviour on the LUAs. As we all know, LUAS stations are unmanned and monitored only by CCTV and mobile patrols.

The current RPA plan for the metro is to build basic stations with little or no services in an effort to save costs. These stations will be similar to the LUAs stops - I imagine - but will be underground. These will become havens for anti-social behaviour. Are we going to end up with a situation where the Metro will become a no-go area for passengers who will fear for their safety?

One of the biggest challenges that many urban transit systems have faced in the past decades is reassuring passengers that the system is a safe means for all passengers to travel. Should the RPA rethink their strategy?

aliveandkicking wrote: »

No I wasn't joking. Comments like BrianD made earlier about stations becoming "havens for anti-social behaviour" really really gets up my nose. For the years the Luas was getting built we got a constant stream of negative scaremongering stories about the Luas that all turned out to be completely false. Stuff like how you can't put trams running into Tallaght at night because they would be vandalised, how trams would get stoned going past Fatima, how the trams were silent deadly killers, how an open fare system could never work in Ireland all, sorts of absolute bullsh1t like that.

Now we have BrianD starting it about the metro before the press have even started it.

I'll ask this again - why will underground stations in Dublin be "havens for anti-social behaviour" when they are not in London, Paris, Madrid etc. etc. etc. Are you saying we are the only city in the world with scumbags?

How many stabbings/shootings/rapes etc have taken place either on the Luas or at one of the stations since it opened. I can't think of one can you?

You missing the point! The fact of the matter is that stations on the systems that you mentioned are built to a specification that ensures public security. Let's face it a tram stop in Dublin is similar to a bus stop so you wouldn't expect it to be manned and in fact with CCTV is probably more secure than you average bus stop.

However, it would appear that the RPA are planning to put the LUAS stop model underground (given that the metro is a LUAS) and this is simply unacceptable from a security point of view and you will find that there will be passengers that will not use the system.

Is Dublin the only city that has scumbags? Of course not but you will find that there is a level of anti-social behaviour and thuggery here and is tolerated as the norm that you simply don't have in other cities. Give them an empty concrete box underground and they'll love it. Would I be correct in saying that thugs effectively 'ran' IR out of the station at Broombridge (may have incorrect station name)? Would you send your kids down to an unmanned Metro at night? It's all perception.


BTW Alive, I support the LUAS project and want to see more public transport projects built in the city but we must have standards.

It's no secret that there are serious security problems on the Luas. In-fact, Veolia has recently employed security for some stops. You can put all the CCTV you want at stops, but when you have groups of people off their face on drink and drugs, they just don't care.

I have posted here many times of stories involving serious anti-social behaviour. I would say any regular Luas passenger will have a story to tell. From early morning to late at night, the stops, particularly at Jervis, and Abbey Street constantly have drunks and junkies hanging around.

I have been harassed at stops, I have had junkies and drunks fall on me on the tram, I have been on trams where security have had to remove junkies who had passed out (the latest being last Thursday at Jervis), I have been on trams where the Gardai have been called because passengers have been harassed by a scumbag. I have seen junkies prepare their drugs on the tram. On numerous occasions, I've seen up to 20 teenagers jump on the tram while it traveled between Blackhorse and Fatima, and run screaming through the carriage. I was on a tram recently where the teenagers were taking turns to ride outside the tram, sitting on the rear windscreen.

I welcome how every drivers constantly presses the audio message to remind passengers of pickpockets. While it seems Veolia is taking the matter seriously, I believe the bigger problem involves the Gardai and the courts. I don't remember anybody ever being charged because of anti-social behaviour on public transport, which is a problem, as a lot of people view it as a dangerous way to travel.

Last week we had a major bus route pull out of an area in South Dublin because of driver attacks. There are currently two other areas of Dublin which do not a have a service after dark for similar reasons. Two years ago we had a man thrown from the upstairs of a moving double deck bus. What needs to happen before somebody takes control and makes public transport a safe place.

BrianD has made an excellent point of how we should be planning now for Metro. We should be looking at the current problems on Luas and making sure they are wiped out before Metro arrives.

Furthermore, I think underground stations need to be manned in the event of a non-scumbag emergency ... fire etc.

The Veolia patrols are largely ineffective for one reason only - they have no real power to police the lines. As someone else pointed out, we need to have a transport police with powers of arrest etc. This could be a part of the central or Dublin transport authority.