Luas - Red Line General Discussion

Carroller16 · 26-10-2007 11:15am #1

Just set up this thread for general discussion on the Luas Red Line.

Myself I travel (HEUSTON - BUSÁRAS)(CONNOLLY - HEUSTON) 5 days a week.

My biggest peevs are bums and beggars on the Luas Platforms.

Especially at Connolly & Heuston where i get the classic " I haven't got enough money for my train home"

Then they are there the next day - Did you still not get that train home?

People with bags on they're backs on crowded luas' is also a major annoying thing.

People who try to cram on when there is absolutely no room..

Other than this i find it is actually a lifesaver of a service.
Don't know wat i would do without it.

Looking for your thoughts on it and your grievances

GreeBo · 26-10-2007 11:23am

Carroller16 wrote: »

Other than this i find it is actually a lifesaver of a service.
Don't know wat i would do without it.

What did you do before it?

Carroller16 · 26-10-2007 11:25am

Had to get the 10 bus from the Phoenix Park into town and be stuck in traffic on the north circular road for about half an hour

steve-o · 26-10-2007 11:31am

Carroller16 wrote: »

Other than this i find it is actually a lifesaver of a service.
Don't know wat i would do without it.

I don't use it myself, but I've seen comments here that the bus along the quays is often faster.

Carroller16 · 26-10-2007 11:35am

Normally it doesn't go up as far as Busaras though... and although the Luas does be jammers... them buses aren't very reliable and often more packed

BanzaiBk · 26-10-2007 12:19pm

Frequent Hueston - Connolly user here, for when I'm coming back/going to Cork. I'm using it a lot more than I thought I would considering where I'm living. I agree, I don't know what I'd do without it.

KC61 · 26-10-2007 1:11pm

From my own experience, the continuous bus lane along the quays means that the 90 and 92 now get you to O'Connell Bridge faster than the LUAS every time.

Even walking to Abbey Street from the bus I have found that I will still get there faster than the LUAS.

MiniD · 26-10-2007 1:57pm

KC61 wrote: »

From my own experience, the continuous bus lane along the quays means that the 90 and 92 now get you to O'Connell Bridge faster than the LUAS every time.

Even walking to Abbey Street from the bus I have found that I will still get there faster than the LUAS.

I would agree. The bus is a much quicker option than Luas. The tram crawls along for much of the route and the lights are programmed to stop every tram at Queen Street. The light at O'Connell Street can add an extra two minutes and if there is a car blocking the junction at Capel Street, the tram looses it's priority.

The bus has really improved on the north quays and will drop you off at Batchelors Walk, which is a more central location than Abbey Street.

It's mad to think, but by the time the Red Luas runs from Connolly to Heuston, the Green Luas has probably completed it's journey to Sandyford.

Carroller16 · 26-10-2007 2:31pm

True I really must try it out. But I work on Sir John Rogerson's Quay so getting off at Busáras is handy for me

paulm17781 · 26-10-2007 2:41pm

MiniD wrote: »

I would agree. The bus is a much quicker option than Luas. The tram crawls along for much of the route and the lights are programmed to stop every tram at Queen Street. The light at O'Connell Street can add an extra two minutes and if there is a car blocking the junction at Capel Street, the tram looses it's priority.

It goes to show, they spent all this money putting the Luas through the city when Bus priority would have done the same job.

BendiBus · 26-10-2007 2:54pm

Carroller16 wrote: »

True I really must try it out. But I work on Sir John Rogerson's Quay so getting off at Busáras is handy for me

There must be a handier 90 bus stop than Busaras Luas for Sir John Rogersons Quay? Eden, Custom House, North Wall Quays?

rednik · 26-10-2007 3:39pm

Again the wrong information is given. The tram does not have to stop at QUEEN STREET and has priority at this junction. It does have to stop at the previous junction inbound. Why do you think there have been so many accidents at the Queen St junction?, due to the idiotic drivers going through red lights on a continuous basis day after day.

Carroller16 · 26-10-2007 4:02pm

The previous junction inbound would be MONTPELIER HILL/ TEMPLE ST WEST ... does it really have to stop there

KC61 · 26-10-2007 4:20pm

BendiBus wrote: »

There must be a handier 90 bus stop than Busaras Luas for Sir John Rogersons Quay? Eden, Custom House, North Wall Quays?

The 90 does not stop at Busarus, but continues straight onto Custom House Quay.

There are several stops between Butt Bridge and Guild Street, handy for the pedestrian bridge/water taxi.

rednik · 26-10-2007 4:31pm

Actually the previous junction inbound is Blackhall Place and the trams used to have priority here also but due to drivers breaking the lights this was changed.

John R · 26-10-2007 4:40pm

Carroller16 wrote: »

True I really must try it out. But I work on Sir John Rogerson's Quay so getting off at Busáras is handy for me

The 90 stops outside the Custom House and continues down Custom House Quay until Commons St. That would leave you a few minutes closer than Busaras.

KC61 · 26-10-2007 5:00pm

John R wrote: »

The 90 stops outside the Custom House and continues down Custom House Quay until Commons St. That would leave you a few minutes closer than Busaras.

It actually continues to Guild Street John since it and the 90A were merged!

MiniD · 26-10-2007 8:52pm

rednik wrote: »

Again the wrong information is given. The tram does not have to stop at QUEEN STREET and has priority at this junction. It does have to stop at the previous junction inbound. Why do you think there have been so many accidents at the Queen St junction?, due to the idiotic drivers going through red lights on a continuous basis day after day.

Apologies, I got my junctions mixed up, but my point still stands. Does it really matter what junction the tram is forced to stop at? Passengers are still delayed!

While it may officially have priority at Queen Street, it seems drivers have been advised to slow down at junctions, as many trams I have been on have crawled these junctions.

The 90 stops outside CHQ, which is beside the new footbridge. I think this would be much handier than Busaras.

rednik · 26-10-2007 10:45pm

The point is why do the trams slow at this junction. Because of morons who do not respect the rules of the road. It is the same at O'Connell St with Dublin Bus and others blocking the junction even though there is a great big yellow box.
The service could be great but we do not live in an ideal world. Instead we have to make do with no enforcement of traffic laws.

Carroller16 · 26-10-2007 10:54pm

Carroller16 The previous junction inbound would be MONTPELIER HILL/ TEMPLE ST WEST ... does it really have to stop there

Thought about it and the junction previous inbound is actually Blackhall Place

monument · 28-10-2007 3:01pm

KC61 wrote: »

From my own experience, the continuous bus lane along the quays means that the 90 and 92 now get you to O'Connell Bridge faster than the LUAS every time.

Same here...

Carroller16 wrote: »

True I really must try it out. But I work on Sir John Rogerson's Quay so getting off at Busáras is handy for me

The 90 goes straight down the quays and will leaving you closer to the south Docklands then any Luas stop.

Get off just before the Sean O'Casey ped bridge, and Sir John Rogerson's Quay is just beyond the bridge (although it's long quay).

You're also more likely to get a seat.

SteM · 28-10-2007 4:24pm

I get the Luas, Tallaght - Busaras and back every day.

The amount of people that drag huge suitcases onto the Luas at rush hour and then just leave them in the middle of the aisle is amazing.

Also it's hard to understand why people who live in Smithfield would cram onto a luas for 3 or 4 stops in the morning. When I lived so close to the city centre I cycled in and out of work, there's no way I would have put myself through all of that hassle of a crammed tram every morning.

I've been living in Jobstown for 6 months now and in the evening it's quicker for me to

Walk Risnsend - Busaras
Luas Busaras - The Square
Cycle The Square - Jobstown

than it is for me to

Walk from my office to 77 terminus in Ringsend (1 minute)
Bus Ringsend - Jobstown
Walk - 77 terminus in Jobstown - my house (2 minutes)

That seems pretty crazy to me considering the bus goes a much more direct route. The traffic in this city is awful (I always lived in the city centre before and never really noticed!). It's no wonder people shy away from using Dublin bus.

OT about the 77 journey home - my biggest annoyance is when cars are pulling off Macken St left onto Pearse Street. When the lights are about to turn red some drivers pull through them but can't actually get onto Pearse Street so they block the bus lane. I've often been on the 77 to go home and this move has added 10 minutes onto the journey - junctions like this should have traffic cameras on them and drivers blocking bus or Luas lanes (happens at Hueston on the Luas line a lot too) like that should be fined.

Edit: Bus drivers in this city must have the patience of saints - driving in city traffic would drive me mad within a few weeks.

trellheim · 28-10-2007 6:37pm

Unfortunately there's no traffic cameras that issue fines [ a la London etc ] for illegal turns and so on [ The council would make a fortune ]

For example, where I live, Ranelagh. beside the barge , at the junction with the canal, you may note all right turns are banned. [ from any direction ]

Why ?

Because there's no pedestrian lights - so it adds some safety measure.

But every 2 minutes someone thinks "I'm special" and breaks this rule, frequently dashing across existing traffic and nearly killing a pedestrian who has enough problems trying to cross the traffic.

MiniD · 28-10-2007 8:42pm

SteM wrote: »

The amount of people that drag huge suitcases onto the Luas at rush hour and then just leave them in the middle of the aisle is amazing.

Also it's hard to understand why people who live in Smithfield would cram onto a luas for 3 or 4 stops in the morning. When I lived so close to the city centre I cycled in and out of work, there's no way I would have put myself through all of that hassle of a crammed tram every morning.

Considering the Luas connects two major rail stations and a bus terminal, you would think there would be more priority for people with luggage. It's worse with buggies, a buggy can take up the space of 3 people standing, and it's not uncommon for a tram to have many buggies on board.

As for people making short journies, you're probably right, but many connect with other modes of transport, so if someone in Smithfield can save 10 minutes in the morning then they will. Also, with many passengers holding a pre-paid ticket, they will want to use the service.

BrianD · 28-10-2007 8:54pm

Interesting what the OP said about anti-social behaviour on the LUAs. As we all know, LUAS stations are unmanned and monitored only by CCTV and mobile patrols.

The current RPA plan for the metro is to build basic stations with little or no services in an effort to save costs. These stations will be similar to the LUAs stops - I imagine - but will be underground. These will become havens for anti-social behaviour. Are we going to end up with a situation where the Metro will become a no-go area for passengers who will fear for their safety?

One of the biggest challenges that many urban transit systems have faced in the past decades is reassuring passengers that the system is a safe means for all passengers to travel. Should the RPA rethink their strategy?

aliveandkicking · 28-10-2007 11:27pm

BrianD wrote: »

The current RPA plan for the metro is to build basic stations with little or no services in an effort to save costs. These stations will be similar to the LUAs stops - I imagine - but will be underground. These will become havens for anti-social behaviour. Are we going to end up with a situation where the Metro will become a no-go area for passengers who will fear for their safety?

Ever thought of a career writing for the Sunday Business Post or the Indo? They love this sort of scaremongering bullsh1t. I remeber an article labelling the trams as "silent deadly killers." Sounds like you could be the man to do a similar article about the metro so why not send them your CV :rolleyes:

Seriously why will the underground stations become "havens for anti-social behaviour"? I really don't understand how you can think this . Brightly lit, CCTV everywhere, one way out. Every other major city in Europe has underground stations and they are not "havens for anti-social behaviour" why is Dublin so different.

murphaph · 28-10-2007 11:55pm

BrianD wrote: »

Interesting what the OP said about anti-social behaviour on the LUAs. As we all know, LUAS stations are unmanned and monitored only by CCTV and mobile patrols.

The current RPA plan for the metro is to build basic stations with little or no services in an effort to save costs. These stations will be similar to the LUAs stops - I imagine - but will be underground. These will become havens for anti-social behaviour. Are we going to end up with a situation where the Metro will become a no-go area for passengers who will fear for their safety?

One of the biggest challenges that many urban transit systems have faced in the past decades is reassuring passengers that the system is a safe means for all passengers to travel. Should the RPA rethink their strategy?

What's your solution to this perceived problem?

darkman2 · 29-10-2007 2:06am

aliveandkicking wrote: »

Ever thought of a career writing for the Sunday Business Post or the Indo? They love this sort of scaremongering bullsh1t.

Are you joking? Ive been on the Luas twice and both times scumbags you would not imagine where on the tram. The first time a lady overheard two little gougers talking about their time in the childrens court - which everyone heard (you see they hitch the ride to the court on the red line - probrably dont pay but thats beyond the point). The Lady (old) enquired - 'what were you there for?' Supprise, supprise among the litany of offences the little toerag mentioned - 'putting stones on the Luas track!' - Ive seen older groupy scumbags on the tram the second time (the return journey) you certainly would not want to meet in a dark, unmanned, underground station. :rolleyes:

aliveandkicking · 29-10-2007 2:40am

darkman2 wrote: »

Are you joking?

No I wasn't joking. Comments like BrianD made earlier about stations becoming "havens for anti-social behaviour" really really gets up my nose. For the years the Luas was getting built we got a constant stream of negative scaremongering stories about the Luas that all turned out to be completely false. Stuff like how you can't put trams running into Tallaght at night because they would be vandalised, how trams would get stoned going past Fatima, how the trams were silent deadly killers, how an open fare system could never work in Ireland all, sorts of absolute bullsh1t like that.

Now we have BrianD starting it about the metro before the press have even started it.

I'll ask this again - why will underground stations in Dublin be "havens for anti-social behaviour" when they are not in London, Paris, Madrid etc. etc. etc. Are you saying we are the only city in the world with scumbags?

How many stabbings/shootings/rapes etc have taken place either on the Luas or at one of the stations since it opened. I can't think of one can you?

monument · 29-10-2007 3:54am

aliveandkicking wrote: »

Ever thought of a career writing for the Sunday Business Post ...

Funny that since the Post talks down crime compared to nearly every other Irish newspaper. BUT lets not let facts get in your way!

BrianD · 29-10-2007 12:49pm

aliveandkicking wrote: »

No I wasn't joking. Comments like BrianD made earlier about stations becoming "havens for anti-social behaviour" really really gets up my nose. For the years the Luas was getting built we got a constant stream of negative scaremongering stories about the Luas that all turned out to be completely false. Stuff like how you can't put trams running into Tallaght at night because they would be vandalised, how trams would get stoned going past Fatima, how the trams were silent deadly killers, how an open fare system could never work in Ireland all, sorts of absolute bullsh1t like that.

Now we have BrianD starting it about the metro before the press have even started it.

I'll ask this again - why will underground stations in Dublin be "havens for anti-social behaviour" when they are not in London, Paris, Madrid etc. etc. etc. Are you saying we are the only city in the world with scumbags?

How many stabbings/shootings/rapes etc have taken place either on the Luas or at one of the stations since it opened. I can't think of one can you?

You missing the point! The fact of the matter is that stations on the systems that you mentioned are built to a specification that ensures public security. Let's face it a tram stop in Dublin is similar to a bus stop so you wouldn't expect it to be manned and in fact with CCTV is probably more secure than you average bus stop.

However, it would appear that the RPA are planning to put the LUAS stop model underground (given that the metro is a LUAS) and this is simply unacceptable from a security point of view and you will find that there will be passengers that will not use the system.

Is Dublin the only city that has scumbags? Of course not but you will find that there is a level of anti-social behaviour and thuggery here and is tolerated as the norm that you simply don't have in other cities. Give them an empty concrete box underground and they'll love it. Would I be correct in saying that thugs effectively 'ran' IR out of the station at Broombridge (may have incorrect station name)? Would you send your kids down to an unmanned Metro at night? It's all perception.

BTW Alive, I support the LUAS project and want to see more public transport projects built in the city but we must have standards.