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2000 refuse council housing

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24

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    #32
    Toots
    Administrators, Business & Finance Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 16,905 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭Toots


    LeeLooLee wrote: »
    They can't be that desperate, then. There are plenty of families living in 2 bed apartments here in Spain. A bedroom wouldn't fit 3 beds? Not even bunk beds? The parents couldn't have made do with a small double?

    The second bedroom was tiny. It fitted a single bed with and there wasn't even enough room for a little nightstand beside it, a small double bed wouldn't have fitted, they measured it up. There are plenty of families living in 2 bedroom apts here in Ireland also. I'm living in a 1 bed apartment - myself, hubby and our 4 year old share a bedroom. I'd give my eye teeth for a 2 bed. I saw the apartment that my SIL was offered - it'd be more of a 1 bed + walk in wardrobe TBH.


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    #33
    Gatling
    Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Toots wrote: »
    The second bedroom was tiny. It fitted a single bed with and there wasn't even enough room for a little nightstand beside it, a small double bed wouldn't have fitted, they measured it up. There are plenty of families living in 2 bedroom apts here in Ireland also. I'm living in a 1 bed apartment - myself, hubby and our 4 year old share a bedroom. I'd give my eye teeth for a 2 bed. I saw the apartment that my SIL was offered - it'd be more of a 1 bed + walk in wardrobe TBH.

    How did they see and measure it ,you don't normally get to see or have access till you sign for the property .
    360_F_102352090_ie3kLjDIvgrT1sxVDknWCUh8PxgMYzM7.jpg




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    #34
    Spanish Eyes
    Registered Users Posts: 15,886 ✭✭✭✭Spanish Eyes


    Those on the housing list are presumably on RAS or in private accommodation with Rent Supplement.

    Why on earth would they move from a place THEY selected and is being paid for mostly by the taxpayer to move somewhere that doesn't suit them.

    No wonder there is so much resentment of these people really. It is just mind boggling.

    There seems to me to be absolutely NO point in building social housing at all. Because no one will move into them. Well some will, but many will refuse because of A B and C. and the merry go round goes round and round.

    It is not right, and it's not funny anymore.

    I noticed Fr. McVerry said the suspension of a housing list applicant after two refusals amounts to ""unreasonable coercion" by the Council. Now What The absolute F?

    Well the next time he comes on media moaning about homelessness I will be a bit more cynical to be honest.


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    #35
    Wanderer78
    Registered Users Posts: 28,813 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    i really wish people could spend some time in disadvantaged areas. you d learn a lot about life in them!


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    #36
    Slydice
    Registered Users Posts: 10,501 ✭✭✭✭Slydice


    What a mixed up article he wrote. He seems to be having trouble with his own numbers:
    "2,000 offers of social housing turned down"
    "More than 2,000 offers"
    "1,990 refusals of an offer of social housing"

    I don't think he's keeping his eye on the ball there with looking at refusals. The other number in his own article is SO HUGE:
    "130,000 are on social housing waiting lists"

    Let's stick in the number of Public and Private accomodation FROM 2013 AND 2014 onto a bar chart:
    367522.png

    Sources:
    His own article: http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/2000-offers-of-social-housing-turned-down-362579.html
    Dept of Environment Latest House Building and Private Rented Statistics: http://www.environ.ie/en/Publications/StatisticsandRegularPublications/HousingStatistics/FileDownLoad,15293,en.xls


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    #37
    LeeLooLee
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 422 ✭✭LeeLooLee


    Wanderer78 wrote: »
    i really wish people could spend some time in disadvantaged areas. you d learn a lot about life in them!

    I grew up in one and wouldn't want the same for my kids.


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    #38
    Wanderer78
    Registered Users Posts: 28,813 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    LeeLooLee wrote: »
    I grew up in one and wouldn't want the same for my kids.

    can completely identify with that and you ve obviously learned a lot from the experience. best of luck to you and your kids


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    #39
    quadrifoglio verde
    Registered Users Posts: 3,670 ✭✭✭quadrifoglio verde


    LeeLooLee wrote: »
    I grew up in one and wouldn't want the same for my kids.

    But given the choice of a secure roof over their heads, or living in a hotel room long term, which would you chose


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    #40
    ShaShaBear
    Registered Users Posts: 5,528 ✭✭✭ShaShaBear


    To be honest, we'd take whatever we were given. It's much easier to transfer from council house to council house than it is to get into one in the first place! We only put areas on our application that we knew would be suitable. It would be very ridiculous to tick the box for "X" and then refuse a house in "X" because it's not close to a school. It's no further away from schools than it was when you applied!


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    #41
    listermint
    Registered Users Posts: 33,666 ✭✭✭✭listermint


    Gatling wrote: »
    No its not .

    I'll glady live in any part of this country no matter who or what my neighbours are ,
    And I've said it multiple times over the years on here .

    It's easy to say things when you know you won't have to do it.

    I'd glady pilot a space rocket with little fuel to the moon.


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    #42
    Gatling
    Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    listermint wrote: »
    It's easy to say things when you know you won't have to do it.

    And who are you to say otherwise
    360_F_102352090_ie3kLjDIvgrT1sxVDknWCUh8PxgMYzM7.jpg




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    #43
    Paulw
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 13,381 Mod ✭✭✭✭Paulw


    Mod Warning: Enough of the tit for tat guys. If you want to have a one on one debate, then do it over PM.

    Keep it civil.


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    #44
    LeeLooLee
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 422 ✭✭LeeLooLee


    quadrifoglio verde wrote: »
    But given the choice of a secure roof over their heads, or living in a hotel room long term, which would you chose

    Oh yeah, I'd go for the house, but would make damn sure they appreciated and respected it. The estate I lived on as a kid was a kip mostly because nobody respected it and took it for granted that they were given a decent, warm home for hardy any rent.


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    #45
    Villa05
    Registered Users Posts: 4,513 ✭✭✭Villa05


    Eric Cartman wrote: »
    but you can't give into that. If you let a few decent people away with turning down accommodation in these estates, then the only solution is to move in other criminals or let the house get burned out / destroyed which just puts other people in that estate back on the list. If you have one lowlife in an estate you're best off surrounding them with decent people who will band together and report all the criminal activities and have them removed, rather than just put all the bad eggs together and create a nightmare in bricks.

    Do you live in the same country as the rest of us. Im sorry but our legal system is as broken as our property market. White collar and blue collar criminals get away with murder in this country.

    You see many homeless choosing cold and wet over sleeping in the same building as addicts,

    The criminal gangs in Ireland are well known, yet untouchable.

    The vast majority of systems with heavy state involement are broken


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    #46
    Toots
    Administrators, Business & Finance Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 16,905 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭Toots


    Gatling wrote: »
    How did they see and measure it ,you don't normally get to see or have access till you sign for the property .

    :confused: I wasn't aware of that, but they got to go up and see it beforehand. My SIL works with a girl who bought an apartment in another block in the same complex and warned her that some of the apartments that were being listed on daft to rent as 2 beds, had been sold as 1 bed plus office/study space, and that the second space wasn't big enough for a bedroom, so SIL requested an inspection. I don't know if she had hassle arranging it or what, but they were able to see it.


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    #47
    ShaShaBear
    Registered Users Posts: 5,528 ✭✭✭ShaShaBear


    Toots wrote: »
    :confused: I wasn't aware of that, but they got to go up and see it beforehand. My SIL works with a girl who bought an apartment in another block in the same complex and warned her that some of the apartments that were being listed on daft to rent as 2 beds, had been sold as 1 bed plus office/study space, and that the second space wasn't big enough for a bedroom, so SIL requested an inspection. I don't know if she had hassle arranging it or what, but they were able to see it.

    I would have imagined you would be allowed to inspect. I mean, it's possibly where you will be living for the rest of your life depending on your financial circumstances - surely you should be allowed to make sure it is suitable to live in? As you've just said, the council offering an apartment with two rooms to house 5 people is ridiculous enough, but then to not allow you to see if the rooms will even hold beds?


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    #48
    JustTheOne
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,681 ✭✭✭JustTheOne


    LeeLooLee wrote: »
    Oh yeah, I'd go for the house, but would make damn sure they appreciated and respected it. The estate I lived on as a kid was a kip mostly because nobody respected it and took it for granted that they were given a decent, warm home for hardy any rent.

    Give someone something for free and they don't value it.


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    #49
    Toots
    Administrators, Business & Finance Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 16,905 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭Toots


    ShaShaBear wrote: »
    I would have imagined you would be allowed to inspect. I mean, it's possibly where you will be living for the rest of your life depending on your financial circumstances - surely you should be allowed to make sure it is suitable to live in? As you've just said, the council offering an apartment with two rooms to house 5 people is ridiculous enough, but then to not allow you to see if the rooms will even hold beds?

    I'd have thought so! And what about if you had mobility issues? If my apartment was a social housing unit there's no way it would be fit for anyone who had any type of physical disability - the parking spot is ages away from the door, and up a load of steps! If someone signed up for it without seeing it they could end up in an apartment that they couldn't even access without assistance!


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    #50
    foggy_lad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,373 ✭✭✭✭foggy_lad


    JustTheOne wrote: »
    Give someone something for free and they don't value it.

    It is not free though, all council and rent allowance/RAS people have to pay rent to the local authority that has housed them. They pay council rent rates which are set at a rate to allow for the amount of income the person/family has each week.


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    #51
    Tigger
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,707 ✭✭✭✭Tigger


    foggy_lad wrote: »
    It is not free though, all council and rent allowance/RAS people have to pay rent to the local authority that has housed them. They pay council rent rates which are set at a rate to allow for the amount of income the person/family has each week.

    How much is it tho?


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    #52
    foggy_lad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,373 ✭✭✭✭foggy_lad


    Tigger wrote: »
    How much is it tho?

    about €30 per adult and €12 per dependant child, any income above the basic social welfare rate is means tested and rent is increased by 20% of the amount over the basic rate. Also if there is someone in the household working their earnings are also taken into consideration as well as the main tenant/householder. someone earning €400/week living alone would be paying about €80/week rent.


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    #53
    pablo128
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,221 ✭✭✭pablo128


    I live in a 2 bedroom council apartment in Tallaght, and it's tiny. There is literally no storage. A lot of our stuff is in our parents attics. The estate is a kip too, roaring and screaming into the early hours is common. Cars getting rallied etc. The only house I could Possibly get a mortgage on would be in one of the same kippy estates around here. And I'll admit, we refused our first offer because the complex was full of travellers who regularly run amok.


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    #54
    Tigger
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,707 ✭✭✭✭Tigger


    foggy_lad wrote: »
    about €30 per adult and €12 per dependant child, any income above the basic social welfare rate is means tested and rent is increased by 20% of the amount over the basic rate. Also if there is someone in the household working their earnings are also taken into consideration as well as the main tenant/householder. someone earning €400/week living alone would be paying about €80/week rent.

    12 more per child?
    Seems backwards


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    #55
    Grab All Association
    Registered Users Posts: 3,917 ✭✭✭Grab All Association


    Gatling wrote: »
    Nothing new here except the figure of nearly 2000 people /families turned down local authority housing last /this year ,
    In the supposed housing crisis we have people refusing multiple local authority houses ,

    Excuses range from size ,lack of privacy, on a long holiday in Rome .

    As someone currently 8 years on the sdcc list I'm seriously discusted reading the following

    http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/2000-offers-of-social-housing-turned-down-362579.html

    But doesn't this actually benefit you?

    Lets say a woman A refuses a house and it is offered to woman B who refuses it too. You could be 3rd or 4th priority on the list after these people. If A, B or C said yes to the house then you'll probably be waiting much longer to be housed.


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    #56
    al22
    Registered Users Posts: 169 ✭✭al22


    Stop offering any free housing at all. Increase them Social Welfare to match a minimum wages and let people to find and rent houses/accommodation where they want and quality they want themselves.

    Not enough money - their own problems. Work more or move to countryside or whatever.
    It is a time to stop that system of a free housing.


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    #57
    Atlantic Dawn
    Registered Users Posts: 81,269 ✭✭✭✭Atlantic Dawn
    M


    Any criteria that initially brings you top of the housing list, ie 9 kids by 8 different men or say a drugs problem or you are as Joe Duffy would say "unwell" should be reset to back of the q if you refuse a house anywhere in the country, a house is always better than a cardboard box under a bridge unless you are a pro freeloader.


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    #58
    handlemaster
    Registered Users Posts: 6,003 ✭✭✭handlemaster


    foggy_lad wrote: »
    about €30 per adult and €12 per dependant child, any income above the basic social welfare rate is means tested and rent is increased by 20% of the amount over the basic rate. Also if there is someone in the household working their earnings are also taken into consideration as well as the main tenant/householder. someone earning €400/week living alone would be paying about €80/week rent.

    Thats terrible they have to actually pay towards their housing!!!! What next for a complaint ....


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    #59
    sozbox
    Registered Users Posts: 1,399 ✭✭✭sozbox


    al22 wrote: »
    Stop offering any free housing at all. Increase them Social Welfare to match a minimum wages and let people to find and rent houses/accommodation where they want and quality they want themselves.

    Not enough money - their own problems. Work more or move to countryside or whatever.
    It is a time to stop that system of a free housing.

    You want to stop free housing but double the dole?? Every person on social welfare would stop looking for work and half the people working to get minimum wage would join the dole! Ridiculous idea!


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    #60
    ceannair06
    Closed Accounts Posts: 205 ✭✭ceannair06


    foggy_lad wrote: »
    about €30 per adult and €12 per dependant child, any income above the basic social welfare rate is means tested and rent is increased by 20% of the amount over the basic rate. Also if there is someone in the household working their earnings are also taken into consideration as well as the main tenant/householder. someone earning €400/week living alone would be paying about €80/week rent.

    A DISGRACE. 400 notes a week and they only have to stump up 80 quid ???

    Sickening to read that.


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    #61
    JustTheOne
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,681 ✭✭✭JustTheOne


    foggy_lad wrote: »
    It is not free though, all council and rent allowance/RAS people have to pay rent to the local authority that has housed them. They pay council rent rates which are set at a rate to allow for the amount of income the person/family has each week.

    I'm talking about people in receipt of rent allowance and unemployed.


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