The Story Of Ireland

bodhrandude wrote: »

I really enjoyed this last night, a well researched documentary on the history of Ireland, this would be on par with the History of Scotland. What did everyone else think of this.

Our history is noting like Scotland’s, don’t be taking in by films like Rob Roy and braveheart which 80% of it is bulls**t. England and Scotland always had a good relationship. The English never really seen the Scots as a natural enemy, they did however seen the Irish too rebellious and far more troublesome.

Was wondering if there was a thread about this because I think the program is fantastic.
Okay, I missed the first episode and have not seen the last episode (last night RTE2 appeared to show episode 4 and RTE showed episode 2 - was I mistaken) yet - will watch it on the Beed this weekend.

I am a big fan of history and I don't understand the nonsense that some people are saying in this thread (or on p.ie).
Yeah, it was high level and didn't cover everything, but what do you expect from a 5 hour series that covers over a thousand years of history.
(The World At War was a 26 part documentary about just 6 years)

From the perspective of how balanced the show was, after seeing episodes 2-4, I can't say I noticed anything wrong with it - it demonstrated the atrocities that were commited by the English mainly, but also by the Irish themselves. Most people in Ireland didn't (and probably don't) give two hoots who is ruling them as long as they are seen as fair.

The main thing though is that the vast majority of people in Ireland don't remember most of the material (ask the average Joe what the Flight of the Earls was or even who Trevelyon was and they wouldn't know).

Taken for what it is - it is an excellent, easy to follow, recap of the history of Ireland which is aimed at the typical TV viewer rather than enthusiast.

Ash.J.Williams wrote: »

Not a very nice man!!

Aye, and I bet if you asked the average man on the street he would say "Yeah, I know that name - oh yeah, its from The Fields of Athenry".
Thats about the limit of the knowledge of most people.

Cris Jones wrote: »

RTE show the repeat of the episode shown on the Tuesday before that on RTE 1. So you didn't see the episode 5 and you said you didn't see episode 1. I have watched all the episodes and can post my opinion here if I want to and so can the other forum members - especially if they have watched the series which you haven't yet.

Not once did I dare suggest anyone was not entitled to express their opinion in this forum, so lets get that straight first off!
I would hope you would extend me the same courtesy and not belittle my opinion because I am basing my opinion on just over half the series which is what most the posters in this thread are also doing.

Cris Jones wrote: »

So how can you say people have posted 'nonsense' if they have watched it all and you haven't.

Well, the first negative comment was on 10th Feb which I believe was the first episode, and that tone continued throughout the weeks and certainly covered episodes 2,3 and 4 which I did see. So, yes, both myself and the people who had a different opinion both watched the same episodes!

Cris Jones wrote: »

You then go on to say that not only the English did "atrocities" but the Irish you wouldn't be coming in on a biased opinion would you with that statement - I think you might - :rolleyes:

I would like you to clarify that statement. If you dare suggest that I in any way favour any person or country over Ireland, you are very very wrong and if anyone was to say that to my face, it would not end very well.

Cris Jones wrote: »

or maybe you read my post on the last page of the thread and are just answering back in spite or maybe you just don't know what you are talking about as you said yourself you haven't watched the whole series but are coming in here telling off the people who have.

Huh?
I have read many books on Irish history as history in general is one of my strong interests. Maybe this is why I have a different opinion than many on this thread.

Cris Jones wrote: »

You say "take it for what it is" a story of the history for people who don't know the history and you go on to say people here wouldn't have heard of Trevelyan eg, but now I see that you have read my post on the other page as it was me who said it was a history series maybe aimed at people who don't know all the history.

Maybe I did read your post, but my opinions are not one directed at any one person but instead the whole tone of the thread which appears to be one that to try and understand the situation and maybe see what the English were thinking is just treasonous.

Cris Jones wrote: »

I also said that was ok if they didn't know all the history - because the series is educational - but you are coming on here thinking you know it all without watching the whole series and you sound pretty rude TBH.

And that is why I was upfront and said I didn't see episodes 1 and 5 yet, but if the pro-English views were only limited to these episodes, then I would be surprised.

Cris Jones wrote: »

I actually thought the series was pretty good. I could argue with some things that were said in it but the BBC and RTE did a good job on the whole and they weren't rude [obviously you were not involved in the making of it then};)
"The vast amount of people in Ireland dont remember most of the material" how do you know - have you done a survey! Or are you just trolling. Probably.

Rude? You think it is rude that I think it wrong that people are name calling against both the presenter, researchers and production staff of the series?
And, your right, I had nothing to do with this, and am not even in the same industry.
You agree with me in general that it was a very good show, but you do you actually think that this has a pro-English agenda?

And, I don't have to employ the Red C to know the majority of people don't know who Trevelyan is. As I said, I have a very strong interest in history in general and most people I speak to have studied history up to the Inter/Junior and then forgot it all. This was one of the things that surprised me about this show - it mentioned things that I have not seen on RTE in a long time in a way that is accessible to all (there have been shows about very specific items such as the Flight of the Earls but it only really appealed to history anoraks).

Look, ask most people in Ireland about Cromwell and they will tell you he was a murderous bastid who killed loads of Irish in the cruelest way and specifically on the Cromwell segment, when I watched it, I was of the impression that there was no need to dwell too much on how oppressive Cromwell was to the Irish because as I said it was a 5 hour series covering 1000+ years and instead they were trying to go beneath the covers instead of rehashing the same stuff we all know.

I really think that many of the posters here would not have been happy unless the series was 5 hours of inciting our hatred of the English and any sort of understanding of the times that existed back then was seen as "biased".

Cris Jones wrote: »

yes and the same goes for professor john morill the english guy who stuck up for cromwell. Fergal just stood there nodding his head.

This is an exactly what I mean - the segment in question said that Cromwell done a lot of really bad things in Ireland but the people who came after him done worse but for some reason we don't care about the likes of Ludlow. So, you can see that segment as defending Cromwell or you could see it as no matter how evil he appeared, there were others who were just as bad or not worse that we should know about and hate as much.

Take another important part - the famine. It was well explained how the English government let the Irish die but instead of just following the party line and giving pro-Irish account, the program discussed what the English were thinking and why they done what they did.
Really, as much as I might get hammered for this, the English people at that time were not evil psychopath who wanted to see the Irish people suffer.

Here is the proof that RTÉ have bank rolled, given credibility and refused to allow any real critique of a "factual programme", which is essentially a
narrow-minded and ignorant British propaganda effort, part funded by the BBC, to airbrush Irish history and British-Irish relations.

The series slated by Irish viewers, and ridiculed by Irish historians as pompous, self-serving, jingoist (for the British) and ignorant, was presented by
"Irish journalist" Fergal Keane (who is an officer of the British empire no less).



An article he wrote for the UK Independent back in 2001 has resurfaced and intimates his British fascist leanings.

He claims how Britain must crush the self determined Ireland. (Unapologetically oblivious to the conflict caused in the North as a consequence of British expanision and violence!)

Keane wrote: »

" I have never had anything but loathing for the creed of Gaelic nationalist exceptionalism....
"A vast pasture of sacred cows has been dispatched to the abattoir and only a few green fascists are pining. In a generation or two even those pathetic remnants of muscular nationalism will have been consigned to history."

Referring to Ireland as populated by "green fascists", can only make
Mr Keane "pine" for the days of the British murder machine, which he has always insinuated kept Ireland down, and in check.

The Pax Britannia, according to Keane, and British culture was superior and more powerful than Irish "exceptionalism", and Irish independence should not nor never have been be tolerated.

http://www.independent.co.uk/opinion/commentators/fergal-keane--ireland-has-paid-a-high-price-for-its-dishonest-mythmaking-632796.html