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Howth Cliff Rescue Pics Mark II

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04-10-2008 3:34pm

#1

tricky D

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Coastguard heli EI-MES in action again.

Woman with broken ankle getting lifted about 2 hours ago. Photos are from almost the same position as Mark I just the other direction.

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#2 04-10-2008 4:21pm
TheNog

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Question:

Where is the patient taken to after airlift? Would she be brought straight to hospital (i know of only one hospital that has a Helipad) or will she be brought to Coastguard base and transported by ambo?

WHere is the coastguard based in Dublin?

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#3 04-10-2008 4:35pm
tricky D

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According to the Howth Coast Guard site, the casualty from my last set was brought to Beaumount.

http://www.howthcoastguard.com/page/3/
The casualty was airlifted to Beaumont hospital where he is expected to make a full recovery.

I can't find any obvious pad in Beaumount on GMaps, but there is plenty of open ground for landing to the south of the main entrance and public multi-storey carpark - 1 min ambulance ride.

Coast Guard helio is based in Dublin Airport.

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#4 04-10-2008 4:39pm
deadwood

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Great quality pics.
If I finished the turf and "sprained " my ankle. Would they pick up a few bags and drop them home, while they're at it, like.

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#5 04-10-2008 4:49pm
Eru

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Question, was the cost and time of this operation really justified for someone with a broken ankle? Its not life threatening and people were able to walk to her. Surely she could simple have been assisted back to an ambulance?

Lets be honest, last time a broke my arm I got a lift to A&E and Im not unique in this regard.

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#6 04-10-2008 4:51pm
deadwood

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Karlitosway1978 wrote: »

Question, was the cost and time of this operation really justified for someone with a broken ankle? Its not life threatening and people were able to walk to her. Surely she could simple have been assisted back to an ambulance?

Lets be honest, last time a broke my arm I got a lift to A&E and Im not unique in this regard.

They should have thrown her in the back of the patrol car!!!:D

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#7 04-10-2008 4:57pm
Eru

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deadwood wrote: »

They should have thrown her in the back of the patrol car!!!:D

Personally I would have told her to walk her ass to hospital, sure isnt there a big 10 foot x 10 foot sign saying 'dangerous cliffs' FFS! :P

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#8 04-10-2008 5:04pm
deadwood

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Karlitosway1978 wrote: »

Personally I would have told her to walk her ass to hospital, sure isnt there a big 10 foot x 10 foot sign saying 'dangerous cliffs' FFS! :P

She tripped on the sign.

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#9 04-10-2008 5:06pm
metman

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#10 04-10-2008 5:09pm
deadwood

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#11 04-10-2008 5:27pm
tricky D

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Karlitosway1978 wrote: »

Question, was the cost and time of this operation really justified for someone with a broken ankle? Its not life threatening and people were able to walk to her. Surely she could simple have been assisted back to an ambulance?

Lets be honest, last time a broke my arm I got a lift to A&E and Im not unique in this regard.

Pfffft. Back in my day we would have done a McGyver, padded the ankle with grass and fashioned a splint from sticks, wrapped with twine from bark and continued our business. Wouldn't even have bothered with those hospital places.

Here's a bird's eye view of the area. The Mark I (back in May) route out is in cyan, today's casualty was at the red X. I was at the red dot. Between the X and the red 1 is very steep 20%ish gradient, the path isn't a path, it's a small stream and is slippy, especially today. It's also no more than a foot at its widest and too thin to get 2 stretcher bearers abreast. There are also bollards (red at the bottom which are designed to stop bikes and horses, so a stretcher would have to lifted up about 4 feet. There's also another Dangerous Cliffs sign there.:rolleyes:

(found it)

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#12 04-10-2008 5:41pm
therewillbe

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Beaumont Hospital Helicopter Landing. A few months back I was getting into my car when I heard what I THOUGHT WAS THE END OF THE WORLD.
No , just a helicopter landing outside. Where , on the small football pitch which is located at the Beaumont Road side. All very professional, roads closed , security around green, ambulance waiting.

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#13 04-10-2008 6:18pm
Eru

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therewillbe wrote: »

Beaumont Hospital Helicopter Landing. A few months back I was getting into my car when I heard what I THOUGHT WAS THE END OF THE WORLD.
No , just a helicopter landing outside. Where , on the small football pitch which is located at the Beaumont Road side. All very professional, roads closed , security around green, ambulance waiting.

Be thankful your not near the airport, have dived off the toilet for cover some of them are so loud!

Tricky,
Nice explanation cheers. I still think she should be ashamed causing all that trouble.

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#14 04-10-2008 6:22pm
TheNog

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deadwood wrote: »

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#15 06-10-2008 8:03am
cyrusdvirus

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Karlitosway1978 wrote: »

Be thankful your not near the airport, have dived off the toilet for cover some of them are so loud!

Tricky,
Nice explanation cheers. I still think she should be ashamed causing all that trouble.

Yep, your right...... Cos of course she set out to have a fall and break her ankle. It was all part of her cunning plan

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#16 06-10-2008 9:09am
MrDylan

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gatecrash wrote: »

Yep, your right...... Cos of course she set out to have a fall and break her ankle. It was all part of her cunning plan

Yea exactly, a bit of sympathy for the lady, could have been anyone or anyone's mother who just missed her step. She doesn't decide what the response is.

"Ashamed"....?? The shame should be on the person writing those comments.

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#17 06-10-2008 9:42am
delly

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Well fire brigade charges exist which normally are covered by your house insurance, whats to say the coastguard couldn't try and charge the VHI if she has it?

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#18 06-10-2008 12:11pm
Eru

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delly wrote: »

Well fire brigade charges exist which normally are covered by your house insurance, whats to say the coastguard couldn't try and charge the VHI if she has it?

Good idea providing it was for non emergency situations. I wouldnt like to see seriously injured people trying to get to hospital themselves to avoid the charge.

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#19 06-10-2008 1:10pm
BizPost

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Karlitosway1978 wrote: »

Good idea providing it was for non emergency situations. I wouldnt like to see seriously injured people trying to get to hospital themselves to avoid the charge.

Probably wasn't the woman who called for the helicopter so why should she be charged.

Am sure she would have preferred to have a stretcher party bring her down to the ambulance, be less fuss.

The other side is maybe the helicopter just got it as a person fallen on the cliffs, that could be anything so better to send the helicopter anyway.

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#20 06-10-2008 1:49pm
Paulzx

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delly wrote: »

Well fire brigade charges exist which normally are covered by your house insurance, whats to say the coastguard couldn't try and charge the VHI if she has it?

Fire Brigade charges where they exist are immoral and wrong. You are now suggesting that another of our emergency services should start to bill people. I am amazed to think that you could actually suggest this.

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#21 06-10-2008 3:09pm
delly

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Paulzx wrote: »

Fire Brigade charges where they exist are immoral and wrong. You are now suggesting that another of our emergency services should start to bill people. I am amazed to think that you could actually suggest this.

Not bill people, bill there private healthcare if they have it, which equates to no extra charge to people themselves.

While i'm not doubting the legitimacy of the need for a heli evac in this account, would it not be unreasonable to put some form of accountability upon the people who put themselves in this scenario? This is not an uncommon occurrence in Howth, so despite the warnings people still put themselves in this position.

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#22 06-10-2008 4:07pm
Paulzx

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I think your way off the mark here. What's next?. When you dial 999 for an ambo you get asked if you have a medical card or health insurance. If we stopped sending emergency resources to people who have done stupid things we could probably close down most of the emergency services in the country.

I deal with idiots every day of the week who have got themselves into trouble due to there own complacency. I might give out about them but i certainly don't agree with not assisting them or billing them because it was their own fault.The 3 principles on which the fire service is based are

1. To save life

2. To save property

3. To render humanitarian assistance

Nowhere does it say

1. To save life ( if its not there own fault)

2. To save property ( if the owner hasn't been stupid)

3. To render humanitarian assistance ( when the victim proves they havent been negligent )

I'm sure the coastguard and other services operate off similar principles. When a fishing vessel radios for assistance its not asked why it has put out in bad weather. Assistance is provided and questions can the be asked after the event. Should they get billed?. I certainly don't think so.

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#23 06-10-2008 4:19pm
deadwood

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delly wrote: »

Not bill people, bill there private healthcare if they have it, which equates to no extra charge to people themselves.

And it all adds up to more expensive healthcare for other policy holders.

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#24 06-10-2008 4:54pm
delly

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And nowhere did I say that should be the case. Of course your not going to ask if they have been negligent, but after the emergency services have done there work is where I'm suggesting that costings could be looked at for irresponsible people.

In my neck of the woods there are three rescue services operating on the Boyne, as well as offshore lifeboats and some media reports lately stated the frustration of the rescue services having to deal with powerboaters who have ran out of fuel. Again, i'm not saying they should not be assisted, but if the boaters are negligent enough not to prepare for there trip in advance, then maybe they should pay for rescue services time.

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#25 06-10-2008 5:04pm
deadwood

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Well said delly.
I agree. Everyone should get as best a response as any service can provide. "Nuisance" callers should really contribute though.

I thought it was customary in maritime circles to make a donation to the RNLI, when they towed ones' gin palace back to the slip after a rescue? Maybe it's because people are generally more aware that they rely on donations.

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#26 06-10-2008 5:52pm
tricky D

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Idiots and time wasters should pay, genuine accidents shouldn't. Unfortunately there's a lot of grey in between.

I wouldn't be too quick to point the finger in this case. It's not like she was stupidly looking over a cliff edge. She was just walking along on what seems to be a bog-standard path but isn't. The terrain where she and the fella in Mark I got injured is very deceptive and very variable - loose rocks and gravel, paths that are actually streams, thick undergrowth, nettles, rabbit holes and so on. Anybody unfamiliar with the area could easily hurt themselves. Locals like myself know that you need to watch where you're stepping every time.

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#27 06-10-2008 6:16pm
BizPost

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tricky D wrote: »

Idiots and time wasters should pay, genuine accidents shouldn't. Unfortunately there's a lot of grey in between.

I wouldn't be too quick to point the finger in this case. It's not like she was stupidly looking over a cliff edge. She was just walking along on what seems to be a bog-standard path but isn't. The terrain where she and the fella in Mark I got injured is very deceptive and very variable - loose rocks and gravel, paths that are actually streams, thick undergrowth, nettles, rabbit holes and so on. Anybody unfamiliar with the area could easily hurt themselves. Locals like myself know that you need to watch where you're stepping every time.

What was the response to the incident anyway, Ambulance/Helicopter/ Guards?

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#28 06-10-2008 6:44pm
deadwood

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tricky D wrote: »

nettles

:eek:
The poor ould Dubs!

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#29 08-10-2008 3:25am
Tony46

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The incident actually happened approx 10-15 mins walk from the point marked here. The coastgaurd helicopter was not available at the time so the emergency services transported the patient across the hill to the spot you have marked where the helicopter became available and airlifted the patient. Was the helicopter justified, yes. The cliff walk is quite treacharous and for the crew to carry a stretcher two abreast would be quite dangerous, the route across the hill likewise. To say that the patient should be held responsible is ridiculous. Is someone out enjoying a stroll irresponsible? No they are not. Accidents can happen anywhere at anytime and if anything this should instill peoples confidence in the emergency services in the knowledge that if something does happen to them we have an excellent emergency response there to help.

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#30 08-10-2008 9:15am
BizPost

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Karlitosway1978 wrote: »

Be thankful your not near the airport, have dived off the toilet for cover some of them are so loud!

Tricky,
Nice explanation cheers. I still think she should be ashamed causing all that trouble.

I agree tony and comments like the ones above are shameful to say the least.

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#31 08-10-2008 9:21am
delly

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Tony46 wrote: »

The incident actually happened approx 10-15 mins walk from the point marked here. The coastguard helicopter was not available at the time so the emergency services transported the patient across the hill to the spot you have marked where the helicopter became available and airlifted the patient. Was the helicopter justified, yes. The cliff walk is quite treacherous and for the crew to carry a stretcher two abreast would be quite dangerous, the route across the hill likewise. To say that the patient should be held responsible is ridiculous. Is someone out enjoying a stroll irresponsible? No they are not. Accidents can happen anywhere at anytime and if anything this should instil peoples confidence in the emergency services in the knowledge that if something does happen to them we have an excellent emergency response there to help.

Well not having the full facts, i'm not going to question the use of the helicopter, and again i'm already said that no change in response would happen. What I am however suggesting, and only putting the idea out there is if somebody puts themselves in a dangerous position voluntarily then maybe there could be some way of recouping costs. Theres a big black and yellow sign stating 'DANGEROUS CLIFFS', so you know what your getting into. Perhaps adding a sign stating 'EMERGENCY RESCUE SERVICES ACCEPT VHI/BUPA' would make people think

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