The Breast Feeding Support Thread

Every 3 hours is more for bottle fed babies - for bf, you just gotta feed on demand. I was feeding non stop all day long in the early days, 3 hours is the absolute max between start of first feed and start of second feed, etc. Since feeds took so long in the early days, (60-90 mins), I was starting next feed around 60 mins later! It was tough.

The first 6 weeks are very hard going buy stick with it. Baby feeds non stop so as to build up your supply. Unrestricted access to the boob is absolutely necessary in order to be a success at it.

I had an emc last November and I managed to successfully bf my baby and we're still going strong at 8.5 months. As the posters say above is important to just let the baby feed feed feed in the early days. For me I learned to feed lying down as it was less painful for me with my wound. I remember some feeds would last 40 minutes plus and i'd put the baby in the hospital crib and almost immediately she'd make the signs to feed again so I'd feed again from the other side. It's tough going but your baby is feeding non stop to tell your body to produce milk. My milk came in on day 3. I kept ringing the bell looking for help when I needed it and tried to sleep when the baby slept. I know no different as this is my first baby but I don't see why you'd be told you can't or shouldn't feed after a c section. I did have latch problems after week 3 and I went to my local support group. I'd recommend attending any local groups before the baby arrives.

I'm trying to wean, baba is 8 months (and a week). My ligaments are in ribbons and I can't do ANY exercise, I'm still having physio since the birth and at this stage a shotgun is the only solution!
Only problem is that the little one has no intention of weaning.. normally I'd be thrilled but I'm at the stage of not being able to walk very far.
I've tried everything from giving her water, giving her to dad at bottle time to not being in the house but she'll refuse and has ended up constipated. She has my stubbornness anyway! Anyone have any advice?

spottybananas wrote: »

I'm having a pretty bad day with regards to my boy's sleeping pattern, and while on good days I want to feed him myself until 1 year right now even the 6 month mark is looking impossibly far away, he's almost 16 weeks now. If someone thinks this would be best posted elsewhere just let me know. I don't know where or who to ask really.

He feeds every 2-3 hours day and night, at night is usually bang on 2 hours when he wakes up to feed. We brought him swimming yesterday evening and while he conked out immediately afterwards and slept for 3 hours he then woke every 2 hours between 12am & 6am, then he's up for the day as far as he's concerned, napping again about 1.5 hours later for a little while but he wants out of the cot at 6am. How can he still need to feed every 2 hours at this age? I thought this was just the first few weeks

During the day he has gone 3-5 hours sometimes without a feed if we're busy, but at night not a hope. I've tried getting him to settle back to sleep without being fed in case I was reading it wrong and he wasn't hungry but just woke and couldn't get back to sleep, but he's not a baby that can wake, whinge a bit and calm down again to sleep. Once he starts making noise it will escalate into big sad crying if you don't intervene, and the longer he cries the more agitated he gets and the longer to settle (I've never left him to cry at all at home, I can't bear it, this knowledge of what he does if left to cry is gotten from when we've been driving or out in the buggy and I can't get to him straight away). It takes just minutes really to pick him up, feed him, put him back, but the frequency is killing me, and I'm back to work next week and feel very trapped and tired right now Expressing for a feed for my husband to do it isn't an option, by the time he'd even hear him I'd be wide awake, and he has a very loud cry which goes through me at night when my husband is even just changing his nappy. I also wouldn't be able to build up enough expressed milk to cover even one feed a night without about 2-3 days to do it. Cosleeping makes no difference, still wakes at same intervals. Really struggling today.

There's a sleep regression at 4 months. We'd a horrific time as it also coincides with a developmental leap, fun times! Just remember it passes, it's well know to be the worst leap, but it doesn't last forever. Think ours lasted nearly 2 weeks, only solution was to camp out and sleep with him in the bed, and feed lying down. I know that's probably not what you want to hear, but at least you know you're not alone!

He has been doing this pattern since he left scbu at 5 days so not a regression. He feeds every 2 hours during the day until he can feed no more so I don't see how I can increase that. He actively feeds everytime he wakes at night given the chance, massive gulps for about 10+ min. Last night he woke every hour, not hungry every hour but waking, feeding every second hour still.

I go to 3 bf/mum & baby groups, the lc at the bf group and all the other mums know his pattern, as does phn, nobody offers tips or advice as all the other mums babies stopped this type of interval much earlier and the lc and phn said he's feeding and putting on weight brilliantly so he doesn't need any help. He is teething now but as I said this had been consistently the same since almost birth, I can't vouch for nights 1-5 because I wasn't there.

Last night he went to bed early for him at 7 but he just conked out. Woke at 8.30 hungry (fed at 6.30), woke at 9.45 but I got him back to sleep. Woke to feed at 10.30, woke at 12 but I got him back down, woke at 1 to feed and cried and cried everytime we tried to put him back down, so at 2.30 he came into the bed as he was so agitated, and woke 3.45, 4.45, 5.45....and on and on. He's punctual and precise I'll give him that anyway.

All I ever hear is it passes, but like, that's fine except I haven't slept more than 2-3hr at a time since I was admitted to hospital in March, he was born April 6th, this isn't something that will "pass" in 2 weeks clearly! That was fine and comforting when he was 10, 12, whatever weeks, but now I think he's just going to be one of those kids who does this til 18 months or something, while I slowly die at work.

spottybananas wrote:

Last night he went to bed early for him at 7 but he just conked out. Woke at 8.30 hungry (fed at 6.30), woke at 9.45 but I got him back to sleep. Woke to feed at 10.30, woke at 12 but I got him back down, woke at 1 to feed and cried and cried everytime we tried to put him back down, so at 2.30 he came into the bed as he was so agitated, and woke 3.45, 4.45, 5.45....and on and on. He's punctual and precise I'll give him that anyway.

spottybananas wrote:

He has been doing this pattern since he left scbu at 5 days so not a regression. He feeds every 2 hours during the day until he can feed no more so I don't see how I can increase that. He actively feeds everytime he wakes at night given the chance, massive gulps for about 10+ min. Last night he woke every hour, not hungry every hour but waking, feeding every second hour still.

I hear you, my little girl is 8 months and still wakes 3 times a night. She has 3 bottles during the day, 2 spoonfeeds and I feed her in-between.
This is why I'm trying to wean her, getting up so often at night is killing. I've 4 other kids and I don't have the luxury of having a lie in!
I have a chicco next to me cot but cosleeping is the only way I can manage. Like you, my little girl spent 9 days in scbu but I never managed a routine with her, but, my eldest girl was the same. She was breastfed too til about 9 months.

Regarding the expressing, would you consider a hospital grade pump? Double pump which makes it easier to get a good few ounces per go.
I was told to pump one side when feeding from the other, then feed from the other side and pump from the first side, then whatever you get in the bottle to feed.
This will increase your supply and let you pump more in order to get enough to freeze. I never successfully pumped before this girl, but Google is great!

Persevere, but if it all becomes too much don't feel that you have failed, your body needs rest to produce milk.
Would you try sleeping in a different room one night and see does it make a difference.
For me, it got better with time. She's now able to latch herself on at night if I turn over and pull up my jammies top
She'll feed for about 15 minutes and then fall asleep. I couldn't cope with getting up out of bed, it's too much disturbance. I fall asleep quicker in my warm bed.
I also have a twenty minutes nap about 6pm when I feed her and she falls asleep in my arms..
Pm me at 3 4 5 am if you want to rant.. I should be awake too

God that's tough then spottybananas. Sounds like you have identified the issue and there's no easy answer. Would you talk to your PHN for advice? If she's no good then a different PHN? My PHN is not one of the terrible ones and she told me one of the best things you can do is to teach your baby to self-soothe. That involves crying though. My baby wakes 3 times so I haven't needed to do it yet.

Would you read some sleep books for ideas? I've learnt a lot from them.
No cry sleep solution is v gentle but takes a while with gradual improvements along the way.
The baby whisperer solves all your problems involves letting baby cry/soothe himself to sleep while you stay in the room with him.

One more thing-try and try to get him to take long daytime naps-babies sleep better at night when they have good naps.

Other people say to wait it out. That's ok if your baby is always waking for hunger/discomfort etc but if it's just habit, I think gentle sleep training is ok but everyone's different.

I asked phn on Friday and she had no advice, might try another. I've read one book that my sil gave me can't remember which now, but whatever it said didn't help, again I can't remember right now. I always swaddle him because he loves it, still wakes after the 2 hours though, he wouldn't sleep at all if I didn't swaddle him.

He goes ballistic if you put him on his stomach anywhere other than on your chest and there's just no way I can sleep with him like that when I need to be alert for work because I don't sleep if he's on me. I try to get him to nap well during the day, he naps a lot but again he often jolts awake and that's the end of it. This is what i find so tough, everything I try fails.

Will pick up a book or two today maybe, and maybe need to toughen up for a few mins of crying. I watched him on monitor last night when he woke an hour into sleep and started crying, buy my husband came over and basically said he couldn't let him cry and made out like was a horrible person if I could listen to it Sure the last thing anyone wants is to listen to their baby cry and do nothing.

Aveen wrote: »

My milk supply didn't really come in ( I only had cream watery liquid when I expressed, again on the advice of a midwife).

That's what breastmilk looks like!

spoke to someone who told me, women post sections shouldnt be encourage to bf but our body's are going though enough. Please tell me it can be do and I just was poorly ready with my DS.

I find that a rather undermining comment. Definitely can be done, you might just prefer some positions over others for a while, e.g. rugby ball, side-lying rather than cross cradle

Aveen wrote: »

Thanks ladies, feeling that I was very unprepared for bf my first 😳😔, is the any books that I could read to help prepare myself better for number two?

Nothing better than The Womanly Art of Breastfeeding.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Womanly-Breastfeeding-Leche-League-International/dp/1905177402
It's a big book, but very readable and easy to dip into.

Avoid any books that are written by nannies. They can only give advice about how to feed other people's babies (i.e. by bottle) and often give terrible advice about breastfeeding, e.g. Gina Ford, Jo Frost, Baby Whisperer can undermine breastfeeding

Good luck!

Oh ya I would ignore anything the Baby Whisperer says about breastfeeding. And she can be v strict about routines. But I find what she says about sleep useful.


Spottybananas just thinking your baby is going down sleepy, would it help if you could put him down awake? Then if he fully wakes at night he might fall back asleep if nothing else is wrong with him?

Also read up on tips for making naps longer. You say he naps a lot. Maybe he should take less naps, with naps lasting a longer time but with more time between each nap. Let enough time pass so he is tired enough for a long sleep?

I know what you mean about everything you try failing. That's why some people say to wait it out, you might get less frustrated.

I had a different sleep problem. Baby would only nap 40 mins at a time and was tired and books helped me so now he sometimes naps 1.5 or 2 hours. Other times he doesn't and those days he's in bad form so still frustrating.

Grrrr very cross hearing the advice for c section mammies. I fed both of mine post section and I'm still.feeding my second nearly two years on. It is tricky but feeding lying down is easier and you need to relax and take it easy so ideal for post section mammies to take to the bed and relax.

Spotty, if your baby was screaming all day today while holding him then there may be something else going on with him. Could his belly be sore, trapped wind, temperature, etc? With teething, my baby just needs lots of cuddles and the boob so I do just that.

How do you bf - as in what position? Can you just take to the bed with him and feed lying down side by side? He'll fall asleep that way because he'll be at his happy place (the boob) snuggled up to his mammy so will feel safe. Then once he's asleep transfer him to his cot. If he wakes up and is inconsolable, repeat. After a while, he may sleep longer on his own. Forget about stressing about naps also for now - the long sleep at night is more important. It also sounds like he's reversed his day and night so just offer the boob every 2 hours or so for now during the day and see if that helps with the night.

16w is still very small though and regular night feeding isn't unusual. And also a 16w old is very young to be able to self-soothe - I doubt many babies can self-soothe at that age, they just want their mammy!

Formula isn't the magic solution either - I've heard of people trying that and baby still doesn't sleep. It also may upset his tummy.

Spottybananas, sometimes they will not sleep without mammy. Especially breastfeeding. Side by Side, all night, is how some babies settle. It's only a short time in the scheme of things and if he sleeps it's worth discarding the cot for now. Sleep is more important than routine. And if you get the odd hour or two for grown up closeness.. then hurrah.. But sleep when you can
Keep us posted if only for a rant...

Aveen my son was born by emcs and I didn't get to even hold him let alone feed him until he was 30 hours old. I expressed colostrum the night he was born, "just" 5mls that I was told was plenty for a newborn and special care unit were delighted with it. Within 3 feeds/meetings/sittings whatever you want to call them he had latched on with the help of the scbu nurses and that was that. He's now 4 months old and doing great, he's a monster Feeding him was literally the only thing that went right in my prolonged hospital stay due to pre eclampsia and sustained high blood pressure.

There's a great fb page where you can get great bf advice, not sure if you can post links here so I won't but I can pm you the name if you like. The main thing is to understand that in the first few days you need to be firm with the staff that you want to bf, you don't want top ups, and to know that the first few days may be tough with continuous cluster feeding. I think midwives are mad to say ff would be easier after a section, lying around with baby on you feeding sounds much easier than having to faff with bottles and reach for baby and so on. It's awful that any woman has to fight her corner at such a vulnerable time with medical professionals.

Doing ok here. He still woke almost every hour, previous to this weekend it was every 2 hours so I think the hourly thing is related to leap. Managed to help him settle without feeding a few times so it was then 3 hours between feeds, and as a result at 5am he had the biggest feed I've ever managed to get him to take at night, both sides, he usually falls asleep after one in cradle hold but because he was beside me and hungrier he was more awake. Altogether he was in bed from 9pm to 8am, he woke at 6.30 for chats and giggles and nappy change with his dad but settled back to sleep again with no issues, snuggled up high beside me on the pillow.

He was much happier for longer this morning and I watched like a hawk for his first signs of tiredness, fed him again (upping daytime feeds) and helped him settle but didn't hold him, just shushed and held his head. I am spending today watching and learning and changing little things Thanks for all your advice.

I topped up my first for a few reasons, one of which was sheer exhaustion and I was getting the blues big time, but I managed to breastfeed very well too and the combination meant I kept feeding until I was six months pregnant with number two. Second time around I was much more proactive and told the nurses that I didn't want to be bothered with weighing and monitoring feeding, that I had fed my first and I knew how to work on it myself. I fed around the clock which was tiring - I'll never forget that newborn exhaustion - but stayed in bed a lot and kept my older child with her minder.

I probably would have used a bottle or two after a few weeks in hindsight as my second never took to them and I was tearing my hair out until I went with their needs and relaxed more. As I said, I'm still BF and he's nearly two. Getting that good start post section second time worked for me and I made sure to get my husband on board with refusing any mention of formula. But I would not beat yourself up whatever happens. I had two different BF experiences and I quietly pat myself on the back for both of them. It was easier second time because I knew so many of the old wives tales about hungry babies and not having enough milk were not true.

Thought I'd give a quick update to my previous miserable posts.

Since I posted I took some of the advice given here and read a bit here and there online. I knew I couldn't leave him cry (it has been said by MANY people that he has the saddest sad face ever, it's not just me being his Mom that makes it so tough apparently!), so I wanted to avoid that at all costs. We spent ages trying to get a decent cosleeping set up with his cotbed, we settled on it in its toddler bed format, shoved up against ours, with a chest of drawers at the "outside" of it and stuff under the mattress to bring it almost level with the bed.

I started to feed him more during the day, and he seems to be very taken with this idea. I feel like he never really fed for enjoyment or just for the sake of it, as in SCBU it was so regimented, and now he has stayed on me for up to an hour, feeding, smiling, "chatting", feeding a bit again, more smiles, it's lovely I then started by basically putting him to bed and staying with him but not picking him up, and running through everything I could think of until I found what helped him settle himself to sleep. I learned a lot about him doing this tbh. I learned that he is well able to sleep once he has my hand, he grips my forearm or rubs his face against my palm and it really calms him. He likes to gently thrash his head from side to side and it really soothes him. I also keep shushing, his eyes now roll in his head as soon as I start this sound For daytime naps I started swaddling him in his bouncer, bouncing, shushing, resting my hand on him, and within 2 days he was able to get himself to sleep for them.

Over the last few nights he has gone to bed at about 7.30-9, wakes 2 hours later for a feed, goes straight back to sleep and sleeps until 2.30am If he wakes before that I can comfort him slightly and he settles himself again. If he needs my hand I can just leave it there now with the new extra bed space. Then he sleeps until 5, then 6.30 and that's uppy time as far as he's concerned. For naps either a quick swaddle or just a quick cuddle is enough now.

I am like a new person. I think he's in better form too. We have a pretty rigid routine now all day and night, set by himself really, I just need to keep an eye for his tired cues and spend just a couple of minutes helping him settle sometimes. Just in time for me to start back to work, it's like he knew this was important! I'm self employed so am minding him and working at the same time, so naps and a happy rested baby (and mommy) are crucial.

Thanks so much for your advice and support.

I don't know what I'll do with a full nights sleep whenever it happens! Sure the first two nights he did the 10-2.30 I either woke at 12.30 thinking he was dead or my body decided I had had pleeeenty of sleep and I lay awake from 5am onwards, not fair at all! I've made an effort to pump too so I'm currently fantasising about a night in the near future where I get like, 6 hours??

Edit: Also, one of the nights my husband got a call to shut off an alarm at work at 2am, came back at 4am, and baby woke every hour again. THAT was a bad night. The next day a nurse kept saying how tired I looked and asking why I looked so tired, thanks, helpful!

Spoke too soon, of course!!

Last night he woke at 1 and 4, and at 4 husband was charged with changing his nappy, baby hates nappy and clothes changes so this always descends into screaming from him when my husband does it so slowly. This ended in a massive fight between the two of us at 4am, him storming off into the other bedroom (how convenient for him!!) and me being awake until 5.30 with the baby having a great time chatting to the ceiling and thrashing about. Awake again at 6.30, bribed him to sleep til 8 with cuddles. What a start to a long work day!

moving_home wrote: »

Spotty do you have to change his nappy? Is he dirty? I stopped changing wet nappies when she stopped night feeds around 8 weeks. Obviously if she was dirty I would change but she's never had a dirty nappy at night. It really woke up my little one when we changed her in the middle of the night.

Yes, he had to have his nappy changed. I don't change if it's just a bit wet either but he'd had this one on since before bed at 8 and it was completely soaked and heavy and was a bit dirty. He was dirtying his nappy every 2 hours day and night (with every feed) until he was 12 weeks old so we flew through nappies until then. And he hasn't stopped night feeds (which is my whole issue, it's still every 2-3 hours mostly) so he still needs them changed sometimes during the night. Usually he wakes at 6.30 for farts/with a dirty nappy but his routine was all off again last night. The screaming happens night and day with nappy and clothes changes, he calms again straight after so it doesn't usually keep him awake. It just drives me cracked when my husband takes an age to close some poppers and the screaming gets worse and worse.