Low electricity users hit with extra charge

#1 · 27-02-2012 10:32am #1

Wtf? All to line the pockets of an overpaid ESB. Guess the mild winter has hit ESB profits hard, they had to find out a way to punish users who do try to cut their bills :mad:

Electric Ireland has set another charge on more than 100,000 householders because they are not using a lot of electricity.

A new 'low user standing charge' came into effect on February 1 targeting customers who use an average of two units or less per day.

According to the Irish Times, their bills will increase by 15.5 cent per day - that is €9.45 in a two-monthly bill.

Householders have been told about the increase in bill inserts in the past fortnight.

Read more: http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/low-electricity-users-hit-with-extra-charge-541340.html#ixzz1nZZw69IN

Biggins · 27-02-2012 10:33am

More details here: http://www.thejournal.ie/energy-customers-face-minimum-charge-for-not-using-enough-electricity-366894-Feb2012/

Its a bit much by them.
They try and give good reason for it but frankly as the saying goes "It leaves a bad taste in the mouth".

the groutch · 27-02-2012 10:37am

it will be mostly 2nd homes or holiday homes effected, it's almost impossible to live on less than 2 units a day in a property

silly · 27-02-2012 10:40am

When is this sh1t going to end...

Run_to_da_hills · 27-02-2012 10:40am

Just fit a timer that will switch something on for a few minutes a day.

Caveman1 · 27-02-2012 10:42am

Only in Ireland

Nothingbetter2d · 27-02-2012 10:44am

switch electricity provider.

Jesus Shaves · 27-02-2012 10:45am

Nothingbetter2d wrote: »

switch electricity provider.

Exactly, No point complaining and then doing nothing about it.

pcardin · 27-02-2012 10:46am

Rip-off Ireland :mad:

Paparazzo · 27-02-2012 10:48am

Nothingbetter2d wrote: »

switch electricity provider.

Exactly. If a phone company or any other service provider put up their charges would their be a thread about it?
Change provider and stop moaning

jack presley · 27-02-2012 10:49am

the groutch wrote: »

it will be mostly 2nd homes or holiday homes effected, it's almost impossible to live on less than 2 units a day in a property

Yeah but there are no sensationalist headlines if that point is emphasised

gbee · 27-02-2012 10:50am

It's really the mad house, isn't it?

Lower your carbon footprint by using less electricity and we'll charge you more anyway.

Don't use a toll road and we'll pay the company to mind and empty road.

I'm sure there are more.

Biggins · 27-02-2012 10:53am

It reminds me of Ryanair and their debit cards!
Use it enough and supposedly you don't get charged for possession of it - don't use it as much and you do get charged.
My point is that sadly if Ryanair can do this type of thing - the prospect of ESB being stopped from doing something somewhat similar, will be low.

ejmaztec · 27-02-2012 10:58am

I think the ESB solved the problem for me by connecting my meter to ten houses and a factory, so I'll never be charged over the odds for using too little.

Biggins · 27-02-2012 10:58am

ejmaztec wrote: »

I think the ESB solved the problem for me by connecting my meter to ten houses and a factory, so I'll never be charged over the odds for using too little.

You too!

ejmaztec · 27-02-2012 11:01am

Biggins wrote: »

You too!

Yeh:(

mike65 · 27-02-2012 11:39am

Bord Gais Energy will no doubt follow once any low users who are pissed off move over.

Doc Ruby · 27-02-2012 11:45am

Looks like the mandarins in the ESB have appointed themselves as revenue commissioners now. Those €3000 "getting married" bonuses aren't going to pay themselves you know.

Bad Panda · 27-02-2012 11:48am

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

Just fit a timer that will switch something on for a few minutes a day.

The point is you shouldn't fcuking have to!

Ridiculous. Sooner I'm out of here the better! :mad:

Biggins · 27-02-2012 11:48am

Bad Panda wrote: »

The point is you shouldn't fcuking have to!

True!

Dubit10 · 27-02-2012 11:52am

Lol you really could'nt make this stuff up. What a banana republic. That said we deserve it for having fck all backbone as a people.

Biggins · 27-02-2012 11:59am

Dubit10 wrote: »

Lol you really could'nt make this stuff up. What a banana republic. That said we deserve it for having fck all backbone as a people.

Some are afraid to show they have a backbone - they fear our government might next, tax that too!

eth0 · 27-02-2012 12:00pm

2 units per day is possible if you use gas to cook and wood stove to heat the house (or other heating system that doesnt require a pump or a boiler that uses electricity).

In the summer somedays there is definitely no reason why id use more than 2 units

Priori · 27-02-2012 4:00pm

Piss poor decision by ESB/Electric Ireland. It's as if they're trying to push customers away so that they keep below the 60% market share (go above that and they'll be regulated again).

At the very least the threshold should be lower - 122kWhs per billing period could be clocked up by somebody very energy efficient.

If you're caught out by the charge, switch supplier. Really hope this doesn't open the gate for the other suppliers to follow suit and introduce a low user charge of their own.

Wouldn't be surprised though.

facemelter · 27-02-2012 4:07pm

In fairness to the ESB fuel is getting more and more expensive , and they comsume massive amouts compared to every day use , they've already slashed their workers pensions and pay. its not like your getting the worse deal out of everyone effect by them try to save money

charlemont · 27-02-2012 4:08pm

Its a scandalous decision by a scandalous company..

Run_to_da_hills · 27-02-2012 4:12pm

charlemont wrote: »

Its a scandalous decision by a scandalous company..

And the same company now employs a foreign thug company to sort out its customer debts.

http://www.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/latest-news/esb-uses-uk-debt-collectors-as-130000-in-arrears-on-bills-3029085.html

Gurgle · 27-02-2012 4:15pm

the groutch wrote: »

it will be mostly 2nd homes or holiday homes effected

Even if true, why is this relevant?
2nd home / holiday home owners should be taxed accordingly by government.
They're already paying the standing charge for a service they rarely use, I see no possible justification for billing them extra for not using it.

booboo88 · 27-02-2012 4:16pm

gbee wrote: »

It's really the mad house, isn't it?

Lower your carbon footprint by using less electricity and we'll charge you more anyway.

Don't use a toll road and we'll pay the company to mind and empty road.

I'm sure there are more.

Its for the people who use less thqn 2units a day

eth0 wrote: »

2 units per day is possible if you use gas to cook and wood stove to heat the house (or other heating system that doesnt require a pump or a boiler that uses electricity).

In the summer somedays there is definitely no reason why id use more than 2 units

Are actually for real? So the pc/laptop you have plugged in while on boards wont use any electricity, nor the charger for your phone, Im assuming you dont shower or wash your clothes,like, ever:rolleyes:
Why do people always assume its just the heating/cooking/lighting that uses leccy

smash · 27-02-2012 4:18pm

The issue is that these fúckers provide the electricity to the other suppliers so they'll never go out of business.

eth0 · 27-02-2012 4:20pm

facemelter wrote: »

In fairness to the ESB fuel is getting more and more expensive , and they comsume massive amouts compared to every day use , they've already slashed their workers pensions and pay. its not like your getting the worse deal out of everyone effect by them try to save money

So what they do about it is encourage people to use more electricity so they have to burn more fuel?

Priori wrote: »

Piss poor decision by ESB/Electric Ireland. It's as if they're trying to push customers away so that they keep below the 60% market share (go above that and they'll be regulated again).

At the very least the threshold should be lower - 122kWhs per billing period could be clocked up by somebody very energy efficient.

If you're caught out by the charge, switch supplier. Really hope this doesn't open the gate for the other suppliers to follow suit and introduce a low user charge of their own.

Wouldn't be surprised though.

I'd say all the other companies are writing their low usage charge now. They probably see low usage customers as unprofitable and prefer some other company looks after them.

Chuck Stone · 27-02-2012 4:23pm

Can someone tell me why electricity isn't automatically cheaper off peak?

At present the electricity suppliers have to have the resources for a massive surge in energy use at certain times.

If people thought they'd be charged less for putting on a tumble dry at 12.30 am they would and there wouldn't be a need for such residual supply.

I'll start a thread in consumer issues if there is no reasonable answer.

Biggins · 27-02-2012 4:24pm

eth0 wrote: »

So what they do about it is encourage people to use more electricity so they have to burn more fuel?

...And thus bit by bit with each one, increase Ireland's carbon limit output to some extent?
...For which we can be fined on in Europe if we go over a certain limit?

CardBordWindow · 27-02-2012 4:26pm

Time to wire up the hamster wheel!

Son Of A Vidic · 27-02-2012 4:27pm

Biggins wrote: »

Some are afraid to show they have a backbone - they fear our government might next, tax that too!

But only if they can find it and I suspect that will prove to be quite difficult for them.

CardBordWindow · 27-02-2012 4:27pm

Chuck Stone wrote: »

Can someone tell me why electricity isn't automatically cheaper off peak?

At present the electricity suppliers have to have the resources for a massive surge in energy use at certain times.

If people thought they'd be charged less for putting on a tumble dry at 12.30 am they would and there wouldn't be a need for such residual supply.

I'll start a thread in consumer issues if there is no reasonable answer.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0nagdcULlAk

Biggins · 27-02-2012 4:27pm

Chuck Stone wrote: »

Can someone tell me why electricity isn't automatically cheaper off peak?

At present the electricity suppliers have to have the resources for a massive surge in energy use at certain times.

If people thought they'd be charged less for putting on a tumble dry at 12.30 am they would and there wouldn't be a need for such residual supply.

I'll start a thread in consumer issues if there is no reasonable answer.

Technically it's probably possible but a wide-scale change of meters might be required to have clocks with record whats used and at what time exactly (which can be further adjusted correctly and not tampered by other means by a member of the public) ?

Paparazzo · 27-02-2012 4:29pm

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

And the same company now employs a foreign thug company to sort out its customer debts.

http://www.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/latest-news/esb-uses-uk-debt-collectors-as-130000-in-arrears-on-bills-3029085.html

Yes, scandalous that they employ foreigners :rolleyes:
That's up there with "they took our jobs". And if you think this is a disgrace, wait till they're sold and are a private company.

eth0 · 27-02-2012 4:32pm

Biggins wrote: »

Technically it's probably possible but a wide-scale change of meters might be required to have clocks with record whats used and at what time exactly (which can be further adjusted correctly and not tampered by other means by a member of the public) ?

The meters already exist but they'd probably want us to pay another 200e fixed tax that everyone with a house has to pay supposedly for the meter. While of course the meters are imported from Chickity China land for about 20e - the rest goes to TD's friends and the troika.

We should organise a mass switching-on of heavy appliances at around 7pm just as a way of telling these fckers to cop themselves on. Better than calling up Joe "Sure aren't we all strugglin" Duffy and forgetting about it

maggy_thatcher · 27-02-2012 4:33pm

booboo88 wrote: »

Its for the people who use less thqn 2units a day

Are actually for real? So the pc/laptop you have plugged in while on boards wont use any electricity, nor the charger for your phone, Im assuming you dont shower or wash your clothes,like, ever:rolleyes:
Why do people always assume its just the heating/cooking/lighting that uses leccy

Last summer, I used approximately 7 units a day. That's with an electric cooker, and an electric pumped shower (though it is gas, not electrically heated), and with 4 people in the house. I could well imagine that if somebody were to take a 3 week holiday in the summer as well as having a gas cooker instead of an electric, it could very easily slip into the high charge zone on occasion. I'm with Airtricity, not ESB so this particular charge doesn't affect me (yet), but if it were, it would certainly cause me to keep a close eye on it.

Things like phone/laptop chargers use very little power in the grand scheme of things.

hatrickpatrick · 27-02-2012 5:08pm

Paparazzo wrote: »

Exactly. If a phone company or any other service provider put up their charges would their be a thread about it?
Change provider and stop moaning

If they introduced a new charge to circumvent those who save by using their phone less, then yes, yes there would.

hatrickpatrick · 27-02-2012 5:12pm

To anyone defending this on grounds of it only hitting holiday homes etc: If you have a holiday home and you're not currently using any electricity in it, then you shouldn't have to pay any electricity bills for it. Simple as.
An electricity bill is NOT a tax, it's a price you pay for receiving a product. If you're not using that product then there's no excuse for charging you for it.

This is absolutely moronic.
If they want to introduce a subscription charge or something they should be honest about it and say it like it is.

woodoo · 27-02-2012 5:16pm

Is that not what the standing charge is for. If you are connected you are still paying money to the ESB anyway even if no electricity is being used.

midlandsmissus · 27-02-2012 5:20pm

I just got a 200 euro bill for the last two months. :mad: 1 person in small flat. Surely that can't be right?

maggy_thatcher · 27-02-2012 5:32pm

midlandsmissus wrote: »

I just got a 200 euro bill for the last two months. :mad: 1 person in small flat. Surely that can't be right?

It depends - how is your flat heated? Often small flats use electric storage heaters - perhaps the most inefficient/expensive ways to heat anything (esp. if you don't have Night-Rate electricity).

Also - check if it's an estimated reading, vs a true reading.

Paparazzo · 27-02-2012 5:36pm

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

To anyone defending this on grounds of it only hitting holiday homes etc: If you have a holiday home and you're not currently using any electricity in it, then you shouldn't have to pay any electricity bills for it. Simple as.
An electricity bill is NOT a tax, it's a price you pay for receiving a product. If you're not using that product then there's no excuse for charging you for it.

This is absolutely moronic.
If they want to introduce a subscription charge or something they should be honest about it and say it like it is.

This might sound crazy, but if it's costing too much, change provider. End of problem. This is a complete non story. O2 have shíte data plans now. Is there an After Hours thread on it? No, you don't sign up with them. Doesn't matter a shíte that ESB are semi state. The market is open and there's other companies you can go to.

OctavarIan · 27-02-2012 5:43pm

gbee wrote: »

Lower your carbon footprint by using less electricity and we'll charge you more anyway.

Anyone who worries about their carbon footprint and uses less than two units wouldn't be with ESB anyway.

Nothingbetter2d · 27-02-2012 5:45pm

midlandsmissus wrote: »

I just got a 200 euro bill for the last two months. :mad: 1 person in small flat. Surely that can't be right?

phone them up and give them a meter reading.... i bet your newly adjusted bill will be alot smaller

midlandsmissus · 27-02-2012 5:48pm

maggy_thatcher wrote: »

It depends - how is your flat heated? Often small flats use electric storage heaters - perhaps the most inefficient/expensive ways to heat anything (esp. if you don't have Night-Rate electricity).

Also - check if it's an estimated reading, vs a true reading.

Hey oh great maybe you can help me with it, yeah I do have storage heaters, and definitely don't think I was using them right,

Never had them before, I would often just put them on for half an hour like around 9pm, but I just rang ESB to make a payment and she said the night tariff comes in at 11pm, so are you meant to switch them on after 11 and leave them on all night?

Midnight Sundance · 27-02-2012 5:57pm

I'm not always in my house. What would on average use 2 units a day? If you have fridge and freezer on would that be enough?? I've a sky box on standby also.

So if you are on holiday and everything is turned off, will they charge you for not using electricity for the "two weeks" your away not using it even tho perhaps you're using over 2 units the rest of the time???

maggy_thatcher · 27-02-2012 5:58pm

midlandsmissus wrote: »

Hey oh great maybe you can help me with it, yeah I do have storage heaters, and definitely don't think I was using them right,

Never had them before, I would often just put them on for half an hour like around 9pm, but I just rang ESB to make a payment and she said the night tariff comes in at 11pm, so are you meant to switch them on after 11 and leave them on all night?

Usually there are two power lines into a storage heater - one that's wired into the night-rate meter, and one that's connected to the standard circuit. You'd usually turn off the day-rate one, unless it's really cold, and just have the night rate one on.

See Wikipedia for more details.

If you're cold in the evening, personally I think you're better off with getting a regular fan heater or similar for quick boosts rather than trying to use a storage heater in boost mode - they're generally pretty slow at heating a room, though things may have changed (it's been many years since I've used one).

Some countries (e.g. Germany) have banned storage heaters in new builds, as they are very inefficient. The BER cert for your flat is probably down at 'F' or 'G' as a direct result of having them.

Low electricity users hit with extra charge

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