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Your Motorhome / Conversion, VRT and You.

1356

Comments

  • #102
    barnabee90
    Registered Users Posts: 6 ✭barnabee90


    I was wondering would insurance brokers even consider insuring a 22year old in a van conversion? Is it legal to carry passengers in the rear seats of the camper if seat belts are fitted... :confused:


  • #103
    Buford T Justice
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,260 ✭✭✭Buford T Justice


    barnabee90 wrote: »
    I was wondering would insurance brokers even consider insuring a 22year old in a van conversion? Is it legal to carry passengers in the rear seats of the camper if seat belts are fitted... :confused:

    Yes and yes.


  • #104
    Poula
    Registered Users Posts: 61 ✭✭Poula


    stevire wrote: »
    Going to book in with Cawleys in Sligo next week for the NSAI check, CosyClassics have an SQI that comes in once a week or so but he charges €150 and only does a visual inspection for less than 5 mins! What a job!!

    What's involved in the NSAI check?

    I got all this done at the motor tax office only a few weeks ago. She did the inspection outside the tax office and did all the paperwork for me. Did you try this? Might be worth a go for the money it'll save you.


  • #105
    moodrater
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,638 ✭✭✭moodrater


    Poula wrote: »
    I got all this done at the motor tax office only a few weeks ago. She did the inspection outside the tax office and did all the paperwork for me. Did you try this? Might be worth a go for the money it'll save you.

    Whcih office was this?


  • #106
    Poula
    Registered Users Posts: 61 ✭✭Poula


    Kildare

    http://kildare.ie/countycouncil/motortax/MotorTaxGuide/

    See the bit for Motorcaravans. I printed this off and brought it in with me. the girl who inspected it seemed more concerned about weither the taps worked!!!


  • #107
    Buford T Justice
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,260 ✭✭✭Buford T Justice


    Poula wrote: »
    I got all this done at the motor tax office only a few weeks ago. She did the inspection outside the tax office and did all the paperwork for me. Did you try this? Might be worth a go for the money it'll save you.

    You're talking about taxing the vehicle, we're talking about re-classifying it from a commercial van to a motorhome.


  • #108
    stevire
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,512 ✭✭✭stevire


    Buford T Justice wrote: »
    You're talking about taxing the vehicle, we're talking about re-classifying it from a commercial van to a motorhome.

    I'm not so sure... I was in the Naas tax office a couple of months ago taxing my van and informed the lady i was converting it to a camper. She gave me a very basic camper conversion sheet and said I needed to book an appointment to have it inspected. It said on the sheet that the 1.8m rule would be measured, I asked the lady about this and she said if it's under 1.8m then they can't reclassify it. I left it at that and have gone down the main route of sending the forms to the CVO. It looked to me that Naas were still doing it the old way of rocking up to the tax office and have it inspected!


  • #109
    Poula
    Registered Users Posts: 61 ✭✭Poula


    No. It was registered as a van and taxed as such. I went to the tax office with my vlc (commercial van). Explained what I wanted to do. She inspected the van to make sure it was camper compliant.She Wasnt too concerned tbh. Just glanced around. Never measured height or anything
    Then i signed a form declaring that I was chnging the tax class to motorcaravan. She stapled this to my vlc and told me Id get a new updated one in the post. Sure enough about a week later it arrived. It said motorcaravan on it. I popped back down with this and taxed it as a camper. Like I said. give it a go. Be nice, play dumb and you might save yourself a few quid.


  • #110
    stevire
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,512 ✭✭✭stevire


    Poula wrote: »
    No. It was registered as a van and taxed as such. I went to the tax office with my vlc (commercial van). Explained what I wanted to do. She inspected the van to make sure it was camper compliant.She Wasnt too concerned tbh. Just glanced around. Never measured height or anything
    Then i signed a form declaring that I was chnging the tax class to motorcaravan. She stapled this to my vlc and told me Id get a new updated one in the post. Sure enough about a week later it arrived. It said motorcaravan on it. I popped back down with this and taxed it as a camper. Like I said. give it a go. Be nice, play dumb and you might save yourself a few quid.

    What is the internal height of your van?


  • #111
    Poula
    Registered Users Posts: 61 ✭✭Poula


    its 1.86m at its lowest point. Its a medium high roof Nissan Interstar van.


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  • #112
    Shaymeyabu
    Registered Users Posts: 64 ✭✭Shaymeyabu


    Just off the phone with Louth CoCo. Seems they're still doing the old way.


  • #113
    stevire
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,512 ✭✭✭stevire


    I'm a bit confused, looks like they changed the process again. I sent the forms, photo's etc to the CVO last week. Got a letter in the post yesterday with the log book returned with a stamped note saying "declaration of camper with x seats, bodytype SA etc" in the Notes section of the log book.

    Hoping to get to the tax office over the next day or two so see what happens!


  • #114
    Buford T Justice
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,260 ✭✭✭Buford T Justice


    Did you leave any fields blank? sounds to me like what they did when they sent mine back to me in the first instance. Clear as mud as usual.


  • #115
    stevire
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,512 ✭✭✭stevire


    Buford T Justice wrote: »
    Did you leave any fields blank? sounds to me like what they did when they sent mine back to me in the first instance. Clear as mud as usual.

    No everything was filled out, along with a load of pics and a couple of invoices. They stamped and signed the logbook along with a note about what it is to be converted to. The letter said to bring the logbook to the tax office to complete the declartion of conversion to campervan.

    I'll report back after a trip to the tax office!


  • #116
    Poula
    Registered Users Posts: 61 ✭✭Poula


    At what stage do you get a vrt bill?


  • #117
    Buford T Justice
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,260 ✭✭✭Buford T Justice


    Poula wrote: »
    At what stage do you get a vrt bill?

    They gave it to me once they got the forms sent in. Had to pay it before I got my new log book.

    That said, it seems like the goalposts are changed all over again now, and its only this time last year I did mine.


  • #118
    Greenwoods
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3 ✭Greenwoods


    I've been following this thread which has been extremely helpful, I am just about to send off the forms, photos etc to Rosslare, but before I do, I just want to check beforehand how have the goalposts changed exactly?

    My situation is I have converted a 2011 panel van, it was registered by the garage but never taxed, I purchased it in 2012. I don't have a logbook, I have a RF 100 form which I am to fill in myself, this includes selecting a motor tax class.

    Again great information and much appreciated.


  • #119
    Poula
    Registered Users Posts: 61 ✭✭Poula


    Buford T Justice wrote: »
    They gave it to me once they got the forms sent in. Had to pay it before I got my new log book.

    That said, it seems like the goalposts are changed all over again now, and its only this time last year I did mine.

    I just did all me business in the Local Motortax office. All very simple. Seems a bit unfair that depending on where you live there are different rules to the same game.


  • #120
    Poula
    Registered Users Posts: 61 ✭✭Poula


    Greenwoods wrote: »
    I've been following this thread which has been extremely helpful, I am just about to send off the forms, photos etc to Rosslare, but before I do, I just want to check beforehand how have the goalposts changed exactly?

    My situation is I have converted a 2011 panel van, it was registered by the garage but never taxed, I purchased it in 2012. I don't have a logbook, I have a RF 100 form which I am to fill in myself, this includes selecting a motor tax class.

    Again great information and much appreciated.

    My brother finished his camper and only had an rf100 form. No logbook. He brought this and his van to the local motortax office and they did all the paperwork for him after they inspected the van. 2 weeks later he had his VRC with Motorcaravan on it. This was last november so recently enough. he didn't have to send anything to Rosslare. All done in the tax office. I then tried the same with my VRC and same same.
    Yet some people on here have had a ball of trouble doing the same thing. their local motor tax office have refused to handle it and have refered them to Roslare and a major paperchase..


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  • #121
    jamesbil
    Registered Users Posts: 662 ✭✭✭jamesbil


    any one know what the new regs coming in on 29April re conversions needing to be done by a workshop are?
    or where to find them?


  • #122
    Buford T Justice
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,260 ✭✭✭Buford T Justice


    All you need to know is here

    You can still build your own, but it needs to be certified by an NSAI registered garage.


  • #123
    jamesbil
    Registered Users Posts: 662 ✭✭✭jamesbil


    This is where I got the 29 April date; http://bluetdi.blogspot.com/2011/06/irish-camper-van-status.html


  • #124
    brian_m
    Registered Users Posts: 96 ✭✭brian_m


    Hi Guys,

    I am toying withe the idea of a camper/day van for my mountain bike excursions. From reading the other threads I have gained a lot of useful knowledge but am still a bit unclear on a few items. A Mazda Bongo would be ideal size wise but they are a bit on the expensive side for what I want and seem quite hard to come by outside the UK. Another suitable vehicle on my radar is a MKII Nissan Serena/Elgranda people carrier. They seem to be priced reasonable and look like they would carry a bit more comfort than a panel van.. What I want is a diesel engine, a rock and roll bed, probably a fridge and a sink set up with a hose to run outside for a quick wash down of the bikes. I am not that bothered with cooking tbh but willing to install a cooking set up to come around reclassification terms. I am confident in carrying out the work myself.

    1. My understanding is that the 1.8m rule no longer applies for VRT classification so I am good to go on that front but it may be a motor tax issue depending on who I meet/which tax office I go to?

    2. As a Serena is already classed as a private car I would not have any additional VRT liability to pay when its is classed as a camper?

    3. Does anyone have any experience of what the storage space stipulation consists of..? As space in a Serena is limited enough I was thinking one or two small cupboards or a roof box for my conversion?

    any help appreciated :)


  • #125
    spaceHopper
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,028 ✭✭✭spaceHopper


    There is a nice but old VW day van on done deal at the moment.


  • #126
    stevire
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,512 ✭✭✭stevire


    brian_m wrote: »
    Hi Guys,

    I am toying withe the idea of a camper/day van for my mountain bike excursions. From reading the other threads I have gained a lot of useful knowledge but am still a bit unclear on a few items. A Mazda Bongo would be ideal size wise but they are a bit on the expensive side for what I want and seem quite hard to come by outside the UK. Another suitable vehicle on my radar is a MKII Nissan Serena/Elgranda people carrier. They seem to be priced reasonable and look like they would carry a bit more comfort than a panel van.. What I want is a diesel engine, a rock and roll bed, probably a fridge and a sink set up with a hose to run outside for a quick wash down of the bikes. I am not that bothered with cooking tbh but willing to install a cooking set up to come around reclassification terms. I am confident in carrying out the work myself.

    1. My understanding is that the 1.8m rule no longer applies for VRT classification so I am good to go on that front but it may be a motor tax issue depending on who I meet/which tax office I go to?

    2. As a Serena is already classed as a private car I would not have any additional VRT liability to pay when its is classed as a camper?

    3. Does anyone have any experience of what the storage space stipulation consists of..? As space in a Serena is limited enough I was thinking one or two small cupboards or a roof box for my conversion?

    any help appreciated :)

    Best of luck with your venture, whatever you go with in the end!!

    1. You shouldn't have any issues when at the motor tax office once the CVO gives it an inspection. Some motor tax offices are also carrying out inspection which rules out the CVO.

    2. I'm not fully sure on where the VRT comes into it any more, I had a Private 94 Ambulance up for VRT December 2010 but my latest is a 98 Caravelle down as a Private MPV which didn't require any VRT...

    3. You'll need a two gas hob, bed and sink to pass the requirements as a campervan. Haven't heard of any requirements re storage space...

    There's new requirements that all work has to be carried out by qualified body/individual. I'm sure there are ways and means around it, but these requirements were due to come into play at the start of this month.


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  • #127
    brian_m
    Registered Users Posts: 96 ✭✭brian_m


    spaceHopper wrote: »
    There is a nice but old VW day van on done deal at the moment.

    great, will check it out thanks


  • #128
    brian_m
    Registered Users Posts: 96 ✭✭brian_m


    stevire wrote: »
    Best of luck with your venture, whatever you go with in the end!!

    1. You shouldn't have any issues when at the motor tax office once the CVO gives it an inspection. Some motor tax offices are also carrying out inspection which rules out the CVO.

    2. I'm not fully sure on where the VRT comes into it any more, I had a Private 94 Ambulance up for VRT December 2010 but my latest is a 98 Caravelle down as a Private MPV which didn't require any VRT...

    3. You'll need a two gas hob, bed and sink to pass the requirements as a campervan. Haven't heard of any requirements re storage space...

    There's new requirements that all work has to be carried out by qualified body/individual. I'm sure there are ways and means around it, but these requirements were due to come into play at the start of this month.

    thanks Steve,

    2. Ya i cant imagine anything else is due as full VRT would have been charged on the original registration here when imported from Japan..

    3. Ok sounds good, thought i read that somewhere

    really... that could scupper the whole plan.. can anyone else mention a way around this if one has been found?


  • #129
    jamesbil
    Registered Users Posts: 662 ✭✭✭jamesbil


    on the Bongo/Serena topic; are these now classed as campers and can they be taxed as such?


  • #130
    sparrow100
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1 ✭sparrow100


    Hi Guys

    I am a young guy just arrived to your beautiful country because of professional reasons. My wife and me want to take the opportunity to discover Irelands beauty in the weekends and are therefor searching for a small campervan, cheap, doesnt have to have a lot of comfort, but just in order for at least 1-3 years of discovering Ireland!

    But I am reading all this info about MOT, VRT Etc that I lost my way. For the moment I am looking at 1) an old Nissan van (1995) for 900 EUR (not converted to a camper, but good enough for some mattresses and boxes - commercial vehicle and has a Mot) and

    2) an even older Toyota Hiace (1985) for 2200 EUR (converted to camper, needs nct test, low taxes).

    Does anyone has advice?

    Do I need an extra test to get insurance for 1) or 2)? What will be the prices around?

    Is the chance realistic that the old Nissan will not pass the test? (I don't want to use the van only for some months only of course).

    What tests will I have to do for 1) or 2)?

    MANY thanks for your answer or help, while we are completely lost :)-


  • #131
    moodrater
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,638 ✭✭✭moodrater


    sparrow100 wrote: »
    Hi Guys

    I am a young guy just arrived to your beautiful country because of professional reasons. My wife and me want to take the opportunity to discover Irelands beauty in the weekends and are therefor searching for a small campervan, cheap, doesnt have to have a lot of comfort, but just in order for at least 1-3 years of discovering Ireland!

    But I am reading all this info about MOT, VRT Etc that I lost my way. For the moment I am looking at 1) an old Nissan van (1995) for 900 EUR (not converted to a camper, but good enough for some mattresses and boxes - commercial vehicle and has a Mot) and

    2) an even older Toyota Hiace (1985) for 2200 EUR (converted to camper, needs nct test, low taxes).

    Does anyone has advice?

    Do I need an extra test to get insurance for 1) or 2)? What will be the prices around?

    Is the chance realistic that the old Nissan will not pass the test? (I don't want to use the van only for some months only of course).

    What tests will I have to do for 1) or 2)?

    MANY thanks for your answer or help, while we are completely lost :)-

    That hiace looks nice 4 speed auto could be thirsty especially above 55mph probably 25 - 30mpg. Beware of tinworm in a van that age. Beware of underseal its a great cloak of invisibility that can hide all sorts.

    Van conversion take 10 x times the time you think it will and you'll spend a small fortune by the time you've added up everything. If the nissan is €900 by the time you've bought mattresses, cooker, pots and pans, curtains, gas bottle, lights, wiring, insulation, timber, roof vent etc. etc. you'll be close to the cost of the hiace and the extra tax for 3 years would bring you over the price of the hiace.

    With the price of fuel now if it was just the two of us I'd probably build a decent sized teardop trailer or get a folding caravan like a esterel and tow it with our car rather than hulking around a couple of tons of steel and chipboard.


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  • #132
    carmad
    Registered Users Posts: 50 ✭✭carmad


    Guys if I bought this;
    http://vans.autotrader.co.uk/bodytype/panel-van/makemodel/make/volkswagen/model/transporter/mileage/min/39999/sellertype/trade/price/11000/max/stock-item-id/8a6ae5b63810748c01382d59b7293d27/advert

    Reg it as a van (50?) and get it converted to a camper will I save?
    Or what is the best/legal route and the costings?


  • #133
    stevire
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,512 ✭✭✭stevire


    carmad wrote: »
    Guys if I bought this;
    http://vans.autotrader.co.uk/bodytype/panel-van/makemodel/make/volkswagen/model/transporter/mileage/min/39999/sellertype/trade/price/11000/max/stock-item-id/8a6ae5b63810748c01382d59b7293d27/advert

    Reg it as a van (50?) and get it converted to a camper will I save?
    Or what is the best/legal route and the costings?

    It will work out the same, if you register it as a van you will pay 50e VRT (not sure if this is still the standard rate?) to get it to a commercial. When going from commercial to camper you will have to pay additional VRT which is worked out as 13.3% of the OMAP of the vehicle as a camper.

    If you got a minibus you wouldn't have to pay additional VRT when going from bus to camper but the VRT when importing it would be a lot higher.


  • #134
    moodrater
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,638 ✭✭✭moodrater


    I should think they'll fleece you on the omsp for a 2011 van though.


  • #135
    motherofdivine
    Registered Users Posts: 9 ✭motherofdivine


    Great post,Thanks!!!! I have just bought a 01 transit that's been converted but not reclassified, how do the calculate VRT? Anyone got a rough idea how much it would be for a van that age?


  • #136
    moodrater
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,638 ✭✭✭moodrater


    motherofdivine wrote: »
    Great post,Thanks!!!! I have just bought a 01 transit that's been converted but not reclassified, how do the calculate VRT? Anyone got a rough idea how much it would be for a van that age?

    No one knows how they calculate it no transparency here you're probably looking at 500-800 quid depending on how big/well converted it is berths etc.


  • #137
    motherofdivine
    Registered Users Posts: 9 ✭motherofdivine


    Thanks, it's a bit tatty inside and I've started to do it up, think I will leave doing anything to it until it's valued and they calculate the VRT, Basic body and engine are fine and it meets all the requirements so should pass, €500 to €800 ?? mmmm, now I know why I got it so cheap!
    Thanks for getting back to me.


  • #138
    stevire
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,512 ✭✭✭stevire


    The interior doesn't really matter when it comes to calculating the VRT but would be a strong basis for an appeal (but you can only appeal after you pay the VRT!!). Have a look on DoneDeal for any transit campers of 01 and it'll roughly be 13.3% of the average asking price.


  • #139
    ianx
    Registered Users Posts: 22 ✭ianx


    Currently converting a Mercedes Vario 4x4 to a Class C. The VRT convo should be interesting.....


  • #140
    moodrater
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,638 ✭✭✭moodrater


    ianx wrote: »
    Currently converting a Mercedes Vario 4x4 to a Class C. The VRT convo should be interesting.....

    Don't worry the vrt will be nothing compared to the diesel, parts and maintenence :pac:


  • #141
    Mikesound
    Registered Users Posts: 17 ✭Mikesound


    Any update on this topic?
    Whats the position now?


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  • #142
    jamesbil
    Registered Users Posts: 662 ✭✭✭jamesbil


    Good question, I'm looking for a van to convert too...


  • #143
    Buford T Justice
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,260 ✭✭✭Buford T Justice


    Same as it was before.

    What made you think they've changed things to simplify them for us?


  • #144
    jamesbil
    Registered Users Posts: 662 ✭✭✭jamesbil


    Buford T Justice wrote: »
    What made you think they've changed things to simplify them for us?

    nothing, just wondering if they have made it harder or impossible..


  • #145
    CharlieZeroOne
    Registered Users Posts: 290 ✭✭CharlieZeroOne


    the VRT should be nothing, becauuuu...... oh yeah.

    if you were changing it to another type of goods vehicle, there would be no vrt. but, since your changing it to a camper there will be vrt. it cant be too much though, those varios, feckit, nothing at all, sells for much these days. theyre "market price" scam took a dent with the recession.


  • #146
    gogathome
    Registered Users Posts: 5 ✭gogathome


    Buford T Justice wrote: »
    I see no reason why not, since the height requirement is no longer an issue. However, be sure that you pass the other requirements for a motorhome. i.e. cooking facilities of no less than 2 rings, plus a seating area, plus fixed sleeping acommodation (which may be part of the seating area once converted)

    Are there any more requirements for a vehicle to be classed as a motorhome ?
    I hope to buy a VW camper/van which meets the above criteria for a camper but thats about it. i.e. it doesn't have a toilet or a sink/shower.

    So would it be classed as a camper ?

    Also, would it help if it's already classed as a camper in the UK or do the Irish VRT crowd do their own checks anyway ?

    Regards,

    Colm.


  • #147
    Irishgoatman
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,741 ✭✭✭Irishgoatman


    gogathome wrote: »
    Are there any more requirements for a vehicle to be classed as a motorhome ?
    I hope to buy a VW camper/van which meets the above criteria for a camper but thats about it. i.e. it doesn't have a toilet or a sink/shower.

    So would it be classed as a camper ?

    Also, would it help if it's already classed as a camper in the UK or do the Irish VRT crowd do their own checks anyway ?

    Regards,

    Colm.

    A toilet is not a requirement but a sink is, as far as I can remember but I can't find the documents at the moment. Check on the various threads here on Campervan Testing or the RSA website.

    If it's already registered in the U.K. as a camper they might not look inside the vehicle but who knows?. They didn't when I imported mine.


  • #148
    niloc1951
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,058 ✭✭✭niloc1951


    gogathome wrote: »
    Are there any more requirements for a vehicle to be classed as a motorhome ?
    I hope to buy a VW camper/van which meets the above criteria for a camper but thats about it. i.e. it doesn't have a toilet or a sink/shower.

    So would it be classed as a camper ?

    Also, would it help if it's already classed as a camper in the UK or do the Irish VRT crowd do their own checks anyway ?

    Regards,

    Colm.

    A passenger vehicle with, seats, a table, sleeping accommodation which may be converted from the seats, cooking facilities and storage facilities is a motor caravan as defined by the EU.
    It's as simple as that and EU governments are bound by that regulation.


  • #149
    Irishgoatman
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,741 ✭✭✭Irishgoatman


    niloc1951 wrote: »
    A passenger vehicle with, seats, a table, sleeping accommodation which may be converted from the seats, cooking facilities and storage facilities is a motor caravan as defined by the EU.
    It's as simple as that and EU governments are bound by that regulation.

    Not quite that simple.
    gogathome was questioning the fact that his has no sink. I seem to remember reading, somewhere, that a sink was part of the requirement for being classed as a motor caravan here, regardless of other countries which may or may not have this as a condition.


  • #150
    gogathome
    Registered Users Posts: 5 ✭gogathome


    Thanks for the replies lads.

    No straightforward rules that I can find so far anyway.

    I have checked other threads on here but can't get a definitive answer, sounds like there used to be a rule of min height internally of 1.8M but I think that is gone.

    I will try the RSA website as recommended, if I find any rules that are set in stone I will be back to share them here.

    (Though don't hold your breath :( )


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  • #151
    gogathome
    Registered Users Posts: 5 ✭gogathome


    I found a document entitled "FAQs in relation to Motor Caravan testing" on the RSA website. (Link provided below)
    http://www.rsa.ie/en/RSA/Your-Vehicle/Your-Vehicle-/Commercial-Vehicle-Testing-/Testing-of-Motor-Caravans-/
    At the end of the first page, it reads as follows:

    What is the definition of a motor caravan?
    A motor caravan has the meaning given to it in Annex II of the Type-approval Framework Directive; .i.e.
    A vehicle of Category M with living accommodation space which contains the following equipment as a minimum:
    (a) seats and table;
    (b) sleeping accommodation which may be converted from the seats;
    (c) cooking facilities;
    (d) storage facilities.
    This equipment shall be rigidly fixed to the living compartment. However, the table may be designed to be easily removable.

    Happy days ;)


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