Govt spending €10 million on PS/CS car parking facilities

Ghandee · 24-04-2012 1:16pm #1

Austerity measures seem to be taking place across the country, (depending on whom you work for)

When will the rest of us start to get fuel allowances, and paid for parking spaces? Some folk seem to be paid a salary, but other day to day expenses, (fuel, parking spaces etc etc) get paid out on top of that.

The gravy train is still steaming ahead, hopefully not for much longer.

Madness.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0423/govt-spends-10m-on-car-park-spaces.html

It has emerged that more than €10m is to be spent this year on renting car parking spaces for civil and public servants who do not pay for the privilege.

The State owns 9,479 car parking spaces around the country according to data supplied to the Public Accounts Committee by the Office of Public Works

However, because these numbers are insufficient, a further 2,967 spaces are being rented in Dublin at an average cost per space of €2,428.

While in regional areas, there are 1,608 spaces leased by the State at an average cost of €710.

The total cost nationwide is €8.34m.

The OPW also estimates a further €2m is spent on car parking costs in buildings where parking spaces are included with the rent.

A total of €10.3m is being spent annually paying for car parking spaces around the country for civil and public servants, who pay no fee or tax in return for the benefit.

Minister of State with responsibility for the OPW Brian Hayes told RTÉ News today that it is not acceptable that such a large amount should be spent on car parking spaces. He said he has asked for an entire review of the situation.

not yet · 24-04-2012 1:47pm

Round em all up and burn them.....shower of dirty leeches destroying the country with their free parking spaces.

davet82 · 24-04-2012 1:50pm

not yet wrote: »

Round em all up and burn them.....shower of dirty leeches destroying the country with their free parking spaces.

or you could just stop the free parking

micropig · 24-04-2012 1:53pm

They're entitled to it..You're a begrudger, Anyway, the politicians get paid more & the bankers*

*Saved the public service a few minutes of typing there so they can focus on their work

not yet · 24-04-2012 1:53pm

davet82 wrote: »

or you could just stop the free parking

Most factory workers in this country get free parking, anyone who works in blanchardstown centre gets it to, too name but a few. Why then do Joe public seem to jump at the first chance to attack anything to do with the PS

danmanw8 · 24-04-2012 1:54pm

Big dilemma here for the government. Hayes is right, it's a disgrace that the taxpayer is paying for parking for the protected species in the civil service....BUT:....most of the car parking space is in NAMA and therefore if it's not paid for, the same taxpayer will be the one to foot the bill.

It's a similar catch22 to the upward only rent issue

The best solution would be to give the civil servants an interim (taxable) allowance for parking so that the bill is reduced. And phase the allowance out over say 3 years.

micropig · 24-04-2012 1:54pm

not yet wrote: »

Most factory workers in this country get free parking, anyone who works in blanchardstown centre gets it to name but a few. Why then do Joe public seem to jump at the first chance to attack anything to do with the PS

Does that get paid out of money from the exchequer, or is it private property?

danmanw8 · 24-04-2012 1:57pm

not yet wrote: »

Most factory workers in this country get free parking, anyone who works in blanchardstown centre gets it to, too name but a few. Why then do Joe public seem to jump at the first chance to attack anything to do with the PS

I bet if you were offered a move to Blanchardstown you'd refuse it (or look for some sort of compensation)
Most people working in cities don't get free parking..FACT

davet82 · 24-04-2012 1:57pm

not yet wrote: »

Most factory workers in this country get free parking, anyone who works in blanchardstown centre gets it to, too name but a few. Why then do Joe public seem to jump at the first chance to attack anything to do with the PS

sorry you should have added an emoticon like so :rolleyes:

believe it or not as obvious as your post was, you'd be surprised the amount of people on here who would mean a post like that

anyways if its upsetting so many or costing so much i say get the bus (if possible) its just not worth it

Hootanany · 24-04-2012 1:58pm

micropig wrote: »

Does that get paid out of money from the exchequer, or is it private property?

I think the Local Government rates pay for this parking.

davet82 · 24-04-2012 2:00pm

danmanw8 wrote: »

Most people working in cities don't get free parking..FACT

if its costing the state money then stop paying for the parking but if some people are gettin free parking because its available and is costing nobody any money then let them have it

micropig · 24-04-2012 2:03pm

Hootanany wrote: »

I think the Local Government rates pay for this parking.

Local Government pays for this parking for factory workers and people in the private sector....

What planet are you living on..Planet delusional - Population: Public sector?

Cee-Jay-Cee · 24-04-2012 2:04pm

They should set up a 'working party' to review the situation, pay them plenty so as to encourage them to actually do the job...then never mention the results of their review and forget about the whole thing.

juan.kerr · 24-04-2012 2:06pm

This is outrageous.

not yet · 24-04-2012 2:08pm

Fcuk em...let them all eat cake.

kevincaomhin · 24-04-2012 2:11pm

davet82 wrote: »

if its costing the state money then stop paying for the parking but if some people are gettin free parking because its available and is costing nobody any money then let them have it

Agree. But I think they should go a step further. Look at all Departments that have free parking (i.e. not privately rented) available (e.g. Custom House, Hawkins House, Govt Buildings) and assign those spaces to Civil Servants on the basis of lack of public transport and distance travelled to work.
(i.e. a Clerical Officer commuting from Kinnegad should be more entitled to a space than a Principal officer from Rathgar.)

juan.kerr · 24-04-2012 2:13pm

kevincaomhin wrote: »

Agree. But I think they should go a step further. Look at all Departments that have free parking (i.e. not privately rented) available (e.g. Custom House, Hawkins House, Govt Buildings)

Or better still rent them out to the private sector.

davet82 · 24-04-2012 2:14pm

kevincaomhin wrote: »

(i.e. a Clerical Officer commuting from Kinnegad should be more entitled to a space than a Principal officer from Rathgar.)

management makes the decsions buddy, i do agree but not in a million years would that happen :pac:

davet82 · 24-04-2012 2:15pm

juan.kerr wrote: »

Or better still rent them out to the private sector.

ah-ha i though nobody in the private sector had any money!

micropig · 24-04-2012 2:15pm

davet82 wrote: »

management makes the decsions buddy, i do agree but not in a million years would that happen :pac:

But don't the non-management staff have unions to speak for them?

mikemac1 · 24-04-2012 2:16pm

PS Public Sector
PS Private Sector

We need something better

gazzer · 24-04-2012 2:18pm

kevincaomhin wrote: »

Agree. But I think they should go a step further. Look at all Departments that have free parking (i.e. not privately rented) available (e.g. Custom House, Hawkins House, Govt Buildings) and assign those spaces to Civil Servants on the basis of lack of public transport and distance travelled to work.
(i.e. a Clerical Officer commuting from Kinnegad should be more entitled to a space than a Principal officer from Rathgar.)

A lot of government departments only have limited parking though. I worked in 3 different government departments and never had parking. In fact in one of the offices (Revenue) there was (on average) a 5 year waiting list. You only moved up that waiting list if somebody retired, left the dept on a promotion or died.

In Agriculture on Kildare St you only get parking for a portion of the year (3 months I think).

I agree that the limited spaces should be divied out based on where the person is commuting from and not how long you have worked there.

juan.kerr · 24-04-2012 2:19pm

davet82 wrote: »

ah-ha i though nobody in the private sector had any money!

You mean other than the Banks and all the developers that Nama is funding?

davet82 · 24-04-2012 2:27pm

micropig wrote: »

But don't the non-management staff have unions to speak for them?

true but i still couldnt see it happening imo

if you are a receptionist in a big multi national company, ya dont park in the ceo's spot now, its the chain of command and i think it would be very hard to justify even in the PS

davet82 · 24-04-2012 2:27pm

juan.kerr wrote: »

You mean other than the Banks and all the developers that Nama is funding?

ok point taken :pac:

Doc Ruby · 24-04-2012 2:53pm

I don't see this as being too unreasonable to be honest, lots of private companies supply parking or give parking allowances to employees. There's plenty of more serious things to get outraged about in government spending.

Zebra3 · 24-04-2012 3:04pm

danmanw8 wrote: »

BUT:....most of the car parking space is in NAMA and therefore if it's not paid for, the same taxpayer will be the one to foot the bill.

You got a link to back that up?

mikemac1 · 24-04-2012 3:07pm

kevincaomhin wrote: »

(i.e. a Clerical Officer commuting from Kinnegad should be more entitled to a space than a Principal officer from Rathgar.)

Kinnegad?

Hmmm, if only we could move civil service jobs out to Tom Parlon country and then there would be no commute

What a great idea

24-04-2012 3:30pm

Ghandee wrote: »

When will the rest of us start to get fuel allowances, and paid for parking spaces? Some folk seem to be paid a salary, but other day to day expenses, (fuel, parking spaces etc etc) get paid out on top of that.

A number of multinational companies provide fuel cards and car allowances/company cars to people of a certain grade, I see no reason why the public sector shouldn't do the same. Parking is an necessity not a privilege and should be provided by all employers imo.

However certain people are blinded by the begrudgery bandwagon when it comes to the public sector.

micropig · 24-04-2012 3:34pm

Dangelo Deafening Bather wrote: »

A number of multinational companies provide fuel cards and car allowances/company cars to people of a certain grade, I see no reason why the PS shouldn't do the same.

However certain people are blinded by the begrudgery bandwagon when it comes to the PS. Also parking is an necessity not a privilege and should be provided by all employers imo.

Is there a lack of public transport to Kildare Street/ the other ineer city places mentioned? Luas Park & Ride.

What about decentralisation..I'm sure there would have been ample car parking space in towns other that Dublin, but ye didn't want that.

Do multi nationals take money from the Exchequer to mother their staff with fuel cards and parking?

Also go work in the private sector if the benefits are so much better.

24-04-2012 3:38pm

micropig wrote: »

Is there a lack of public transport to Kildare Street/ the other ineer city places mentioned? Luas Park & Ride.

What about decentralisation..I'm sure there would have been ample car parking space in towns other that Dublin, but ye didn't want that.

Do multi nationals take money from the Exchequer to mother their staff with fuel cards and parking?

Also go work in the private sector if the benefits are so much better.

I never said I worked in the public sector.

Multinationals do receive huge tax breaks and grants for setting up here, so technically yes they do get money from the exchequer. I totally agree with giving them the tax breaks and grants by the way.

Chucky the tree · 24-04-2012 3:39pm

Doc Ruby wrote: »

I don't see this as being too unreasonable to be honest, lots of private companies supply parking or give parking allowances to employees. There's plenty of more serious things to get outraged about in government spending.

Difference is everyone in the country doesn't pay for their parking spaces.

micropig · 24-04-2012 3:40pm

Dangelo Deafening Bather wrote: »

I never said I worked in the public sector.

Multinationals do receive huge tax breaks and grants for setting up here, so technically yes they do get money from the exchequer. I totally agree with giving them the tax breaks and grants by the way.

Ye = not personally you but you plural the public sector

24-04-2012 3:43pm

Chucky the tree wrote: »

Difference is everyone in the country doesn't pay for their parking spaces.

This comparison people use is stupid. You cant go around saying that the whole country is paying for this and for that, public service workers are as entiteled to be provided with benefits from their employer (the government) as any private sector worker.

All public sector workers lose a large amount in tax also from their wages so they are paying for it too, more than the equivalent private sector worker in a lot of cases.

Meauldsegosha · 24-04-2012 3:46pm

I hope Mr. Hayes' review includes the TDs, senators who get free parking for life in Leinster House. Political staff and journalists also get parking.

Chucky the tree · 24-04-2012 4:01pm

Dangelo Deafening Bather wrote: »

This comparison people use is stupid. You cant go around saying that the whole country is paying for this and for that, public service workers are as entiteled to be provided with benefits from their employer (the government) as any private sector worker.

All public sector workers lose a large amount in tax also from their wages so they are paying for it too, more than the equivalent private sector worker in a lot of cases.

It's not a stupid comparison, well it probably is if you are a public sector worker who wants to continue milking the system. Public Sector worker already get plenty of other benefits, namely a job for life no matter how inept they are. you don't get that in the Private sector and it's one of the reason why pay and other benefits are/should be above Public sector. Public sector workers should pay for it their own parking, not expect a handout from everyone else.

sdanseo · 24-04-2012 4:07pm

Discontent towards people getting perks should be directed towards those who earn hundreds of thousands of unnessecary euro per year. Not at those ordinary decent working folk who get a car parking space paid for them.

Now the management of this hair-brained little scheme is something different entirely - €2,500 per space per year is ridiculously expensive even if you were privately renting a single space - I know a premises in Dublin City, just off Parnell Street, that's renting spaces in a secure, enclosed, shuttered carpark for €120 a month + VAT. Value for money is certainly not being achieved and with so much vacant state-owned property lying around the city, one would think it could be put to good use and that workers in the Civil Service quarter, if you like, could park on the Anglo Site for example and perhaps walk the 1km or so to work - or failing that, catch a cheap Luas for the few stops.

People get their priorities mixed up in times like this, and it's part of the reason recessions go on so long.

seamus · 24-04-2012 4:13pm

Doc Ruby wrote: »

I don't see this as being too unreasonable to be honest, lots of private companies supply parking or give parking allowances to employees.

Yes, but in general (in the city especially) a private company provides a set number of parking spaces. If the car park is full, it's tough. Very few companies spend over €2k per employee renting a parking space for them.

Within urban areas, many companies provide no parking or parking costs at all.

Any sensible private company in the main urban areas (i.e. where public transport exists) started charging their employees for parking spaces years ago. The public sector seem to have gone the other way.

Chuck Stone · 24-04-2012 4:43pm

kevincaomhin wrote: »

Look at all Departments that have free parking available and assign those spaces to Civil Servants on the basis of lack of public transport and distance travelled to work.

That just sounds like adding another layer of senseless bureaucracy to the PbS. 'The department for allocating parking spaces to PbS employees'. A working group would have to be set up and then a team of people recruited with pay and pensions to consider and PbS unions to deal with..

... fuck that.

Dangelo Deafening Bather wrote: »

All public sector workers lose a large amount in tax also from their wages so they are paying for it too, more than the equivalent private sector worker in a lot of cases.

PbS sector taxes are not revenue generating for the state - PvS taxes are.

24-04-2012 4:49pm

Chuck Stone wrote: »

PbS sector taxes are not revenue generating for the state - PvS taxes are.

So? What difference does that make to the worker, either way its a reduction from their wages at the end of the month, do you think its any easier when they look at their pay slip and see the huge deductions?

Chuck Stone · 24-04-2012 5:42pm

You said.

Dangelo Deafening Bather wrote: »

All public sector workers lose a large amount in tax also from their wages so they are paying for it too

I replied.

Chuck Stone wrote: »

PbS sector taxes are not revenue generating for the state - PvS taxes are.

Your response to my reply.

Dangelo Deafening Bather wrote: »

So? What difference does that make to the worker,

I'll bring you back to what you said again.

Dangelo Deafening Bather wrote: »

All public sector workers lose a large amount in tax also from their wages so they are paying for it too

The bit in red is incorrect. Revenue generated from the PvS pays for the PbS. Saying the PbS is paying for its own car parking spaces is a bit like thinking that taking a bucket of water from the shallow end of the pool and pouring it into the deep end is adding to the overall volume.

In this case the 'water' comes from the PvS.

24-04-2012 7:08pm

Chuck Stone wrote: »

You said.

I replied.

Your response to my reply.

I'll bring you back to what you said again.

The bit in red is incorrect. Revenue generated from the PvS pays for the PbS. Saying the PbS is paying for its own car parking spaces is a bit like thinking that taking a bucket of water from the shallow end of the pool and pouring it into the deep end is adding to the overall volume.

In this case the 'water' comes from the PvS.

As far as a public sector worker is concerned they are losing money from their wage packet in tax, this is the very same pain a private sector worker feels so yes as far as the bottom line of their take home pay is they are paying for it.

Money that's being deducted from their wages are going towards running the country, its not difficult to understand.

Ghandee · 24-04-2012 8:00pm

Dangelo Deafening Bather wrote: »

However certain people are blinded by the begrudgery bandwagon when it comes to the public sector.

Can you blame them?

Pay cut after pay cut, tax hike after tax hike, redundancies left right and centre, all this happening whilst the CPA remains intact, and a lot of PS (I didn't say all) workers getting their pay increases.

Major overhaul of the whole system is required, sooner rather than later IMO.

true · 24-04-2012 8:17pm

micropig wrote: »

What about decentralisation..I'm sure there would have been ample car parking space in towns other that Dublin, but ye didn't want that.

If de-centralisation had happened as planned there would not be a problem. There would be less congestion and parking problems in Dublin etc.

If public servants want car parking spaces in cities let them pay for them.

Biggins · 24-04-2012 8:43pm

* http://bigginsblog.wordpress.com/2012/04/24/taoiseachs-office-costs-17-million-in-a-year/

I'll take that 10 million and raise you seven.

Short version: The top mans office: 17 Million but that includes €80 a month on tea - so all's well.

Vizzy · 24-04-2012 9:13pm

Chuck Stone wrote: »

The bit in red is incorrect. Revenue generated from the PvS pays for the PbS. Saying the PbS is paying for its own car parking spaces is a bit like thinking that taking a bucket of water from the shallow end of the pool and pouring it into the deep end is adding to the overall volume.

In this case the 'water' comes from the PvS.

Except next year the water will be coming from the PbS.
It will be metered and you will be charged by the litre to take it from the shallow end and put it in the deep end
.

except it you are unemployed,renting or a council tenant then you will have to pay nothing

Phill Ewinn · 24-04-2012 9:30pm

I don't begrudge anyone free parking. How anyone can be so petty is beyond me.

oppenheimer1 · 24-04-2012 9:34pm

Ghandee wrote: »

Austerity measures seem to be taking place across the country, (depending on whom you work for)

When will the rest of us start to get fuel allowances, and paid for parking spaces? Some folk seem to be paid a salary, but other day to day expenses, (fuel, parking spaces etc etc) get paid out on top of that.

The gravy train is still steaming ahead, hopefully not for much longer.

Madness.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0423/govt-spends-10m-on-car-park-spaces.html

These carparks are under lease. I believe these leases will not be renewed when they expire. It would be too expensive to buy out the lease to terminate them at the moment I guess.

hondasam · 24-04-2012 9:35pm

Biggins wrote: »

* http://bigginsblog.wordpress.com/2012/04/24/taoiseachs-office-costs-17-million-in-a-year/

I'll take that 10 million and raise you seven.

Short version: The top mans office: 17 Million but that includes €80 a month on tea - so all's well.

I think it's Barry's tea as well not even Lyons.

44leto · 24-04-2012 9:42pm

I agree with the OP and perhaps we should let some of the Valets go, but not all of them.

Perhaps they would still park the cars but they would only have to clean them once a week.

You see compromise we are all in this together.

Ghandee · 24-04-2012 9:43pm

Phill Ewinn wrote: »

I don't begrudge anyone free parking. How anyone can be so petty is beyond me.

How is ten million a year free

Ten million to the tax payer, ie you and me.

Govt spending €10 million on PS/CS car parking facilities

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