Full Length Amateur Drama Circuit 2012

poteen · 03-04-2012 3:37pm

Here is the marking system as per the ADCI site.

ADCI Marking
Acting 40 marks
Production 35 marks
Presentation 15 marks
Dramatic Achievment 10 Marks

Fair play to Silken and any other Silken for producing Sets like they do at festivals. Its worth the entrance fee alone to see them at times. But as smart people know, presentation alone doesnt win you festivals with a max. of 15 marks so Silken are obviously acting and producing at a high standard also which takes talent and you cannot copy cat talent.

I am not on the circuit this year but have alot of friends involved in groups that are, I have been in the past for numerous years and just want to share some opinions I have from attending festivals this year and talking to others competing.

I do have an issue with the marking system at present and the consistency of marking from adjudicators. Personally I think that for the time, effort and craft that goes into presentation it merits 20 marks whereby a clear breakdown should be given for sound, set, lighting, costume/makeup. At present we have too many adjudicating bodies with various marking structures and it is confusing groups to the point that marking sheets are pointless and you would think sheets are just put together as a rushed after thought after the adjudicator picks the top 3 in their head. The current ruling is that adjudicators are allowed to work at more than one festival in a year as long as its in a different province. I think this is a dated rule also with the modern road network in Ireland and groups willing to travel anywhere in the country - Basically what Im saying here is that i think one 3Act festival is enough each year for an adjudicator and at worst, they shouldnt have to judge the same Group twice in the same year.

Another point worth considering is the duplication of shows on the circuit. Lets say for example you have 5 'Translations' on the circuit next year. Should we maybe look at limiting this to one version of a play in each section (Open/Confined) by employing a system of registering your play with ADCI before the application process as a central database for all to see on the website which by the way is a site I think that could be further enhanced and used.

TrailerBob · 03-04-2012 3:57pm

poteen wrote: »

Silken are obviously acting and producing at a high standard also which takes talent and you cannot copy cat talent.

Couldn't agree more, as i said in previous posts.

I do also agree that the technical aspect of the production should be of more value than it is.

As for duplication, we had 2 versions of "Doubt - A Parable" last year and this year 2 of "The Seafarer". ( I think one year there were 4 versions of "Lughnasa") It must be difficult not to judge them against each other, separate to the competition. I know that comments made during last year's award ceremony, doing just that, did not go down well.

Also ADCI site needs a facelift big time, should have a lot more info too.

conoroconnell · 03-04-2012 4:19pm

Fair points guys, and thank you for the support that sadly JohnJoe and Vinny Chase don't agree with...

I think the beauty of the circuit is that for its tiny flaws at times we do love competing on it each year, giving out about adjudicators decisions and thoughts and going around the country competing ourselves and watching others to see who will the coveted prize at both the open and confined finals go to.. I love it and wouldn't change it for the world...

I do agree with updating ADCI website, but that will happen in time.

A lot has been done over the past number of years with promotion of RTE finals under the sponsorship of RTE and the festivals themselves are really upping their games with regards to promotion of shows and award ceremonies (not all festivals) but is starting to filter through.. After all we are in a recession so give it time..

As for the marking system, it is what it is.. The problem with adjudicators is that a minority seem to judge groups on the "play" they perform and not the "performance" of the play. Human Nature I know, but an adjudicator once stood up on the stage and said, and I quote, " I don't like this play. I don't like this Author. But I am not here to adjudicate either the play or the author but the group and their performance of the play.. Touche!!!

observe · 03-04-2012 4:28pm

Duplication of plays is unavoidable. Groups pick plays for different reasons and each year certain plays are in vogue. Athlone had three By the Bog of Cats, one year. I'm not sure that it would be practical to have a central database. What criteria would you use for choosing which group gets to go ahead with a production that more than one group wish to do? First in, first served? or do you look at a groups track record? In this case there might be groups who never get to do what they want.

Every year there are complaints about different aspects of the festival circuit - about festivals, adjudicators and even groups!! But, it's all heresay, always anecdotal. You want real change, then you start to put things in writing to the relevant authorities.

Anyway, congrats to all the groups who have made it to Shercock and Athlone. Enjoy the ride!

TrailerBob · 03-04-2012 4:44pm

conoroconnell wrote: »

I think the beauty of the circuit is that for its tiny flaws at times we do love competing on it each year,

That's what keeps me going when I'm driving the truck through random places in the 4 provinces at 2 a.m to get home for work!! Hope ye have booked into Athlone - Radisson sold out!

jorg · 04-04-2012 12:26am

TrailerBob wrote: »

That's what keeps me going when I'm driving the truck through random places in the 4 provinces at 2 a.m to get home for work!! Hope ye have booked into Athlone - Radisson sold out!

No way!! for every night??

TrailerBob · 04-04-2012 8:54am

Sorry Mr.B , should have specified, Final night booked out... I would imagine plenty available for other nights!

Looking forward to the draw on Monday

Jon Joe1 · 07-04-2012 2:28pm

On another note any predictions so far.....I'm going to say
First:Cornmill(The Seafarer)
Second:Silken Thomas(Jerusalem)
Third:Ballyduff(The Crucible)

This prediction comes after seeing all except Corofin and Estuary so they could be good but didn't here much about them....any other predictions????

cavalcaders · 12-04-2012 3:04pm

Hi guys, great to see another fantastic line up for Athlone!!!!.... Seems that we have all the big hitters again, Cornmill, silken, kilmeen and ballyduff. These groups seem to be able to reach Athlone year on year, a great achievement considering how hard it is to get there.

Prosperous are also back and if they are as consistent ove the next few years they can join the above mentioned group!!!!.....

Estuary are back this year which is great, this group seems to know how to win all Ireland's

Other groups like Bunclody and Thurlas make a welcome return to Athlone and it's great to corofin with what I think may be there first appearance to the finals!!!

Interestingly enough, it's funny how mis leading the league table can be. Being the nerd that i am i noticed that Although Cornmill sit on top they have only beaten two groups that are in Athlone. Groups like Bunclody and ballyduff although they are not on top have beaten more groups.

If I were a bookies I would have it as

Silken evens
Kilmeen 6/4
Ballyduff 3/1
Thurlas 3/1
Bunclody 7/2
Cornmill 4/1
Estuary 9/2
Prosperous 5/1
Corofin 15/2

cavalcaders · 12-04-2012 7:24pm

wow, sorry obviously touched a nerve, apologies for that i didn't see where they beat corofin, sorry again.

but thats beside the point, my argument is still the same, to be honest its not even an argument just an observation and its nothing against cornmil you can only beat what you are up against but i noticed for example ballyduff who have only two wins have beaten 5 groups that are in athlone, bunclody have beaten 4, thurlas have beaten 5 as well i think, yet all of those groups are behind cornmill.

its just interesting, its why i wouldn't have cornmill as the favourites to win athlone despite what the league table would indicate.

this is not a jibe at anyone, i think corn mill are a fantastic group......just an observation

Jon Joe1 · 15-04-2012 6:28pm

I do agree with your comment that the league table can be very deceiving, after doing some homework (which id say many have already done) on this years adjudicator Brian Majoribanks it seems that the league table means alot to him. In 2008 when he was adjudicating the all Ireland confined the top 3 in the table were Corofin, Backburners and Kilrush which was the exact order of the results!! So maybe he is a crowd pleaser and tries to go on the opinion of the other adjudicators opinions rather than his own?????

cavalcaders · 16-04-2012 9:17am

Ya maybe, but I wouldn't think that an adjudicator would be swayed by a league table, they all pride themselves on having their own opinion......we will see in about 4 weeks time!!!!!!!

cavalcaders · 16-04-2012 9:19am

Also kilmeen who won the all ireland last and deservedly so got 6 wins a second and a no place on the circuit........and who gave them the no place???.....a certain mr majorbanks......so he certainly isn't swayed by league tables

TrailerBob · 16-04-2012 5:04pm

Also, if I'm not mistaken, the same man gave Cornmill their only no place in 2010. (McPherson play too). Who knows what decision will be reached. I don't think we can say there's a clear favourite

poteen · 20-04-2012 2:23pm

Good Luck to all involved in the Confined All irelands which begin tonight in Shercock

Jon Joe1 · 21-04-2012 11:56am

Did anybody hear how Skibereen get on???

observe · 23-04-2012 12:20pm

@ John Joe, not too well by all accounts.

Vinny-Chase · 23-04-2012 12:31pm

Have to say Shercock are putting on a great festival. Really grateful for the effort everyone is putting in up there. Great people and a great atmosphere!

Jon Joe1 · 23-04-2012 4:52pm

I'd say that Letterkenny have it in the bag. Not too sure about open, well if one things for sure that the main in silken is sure to win actor, and Hester from bunclody to win actress. Supporting male to hard to call and supporting actress between bunclody and Ballyduff. Best set between weir, Ballyduff, silken and bunclody in my opinion any other predictions????

Vinny-Chase · 23-04-2012 6:39pm

Was speaking to someone up in Shercock on Saturday night and they said "If Letterkenny win, it will be bad for Amatuer Drama. They won't stick around. They won't be around next year. They're not like Silken and other groups who are there every year".

I didn't really understand what he meant by saying it, but thought it was an interesting comment.

poteen · 24-04-2012 10:08am

Im not sure what he meant by it either... Maybe its that they havnt competed on the circuit for a long time and thinks that they might win and not compete again next year in the open section which unless he knows somebody in the group that has directly said that is a bit odd to think. Ive heard that the show is so strong it would give Athlone a good shot and won the overall award in a couple of Ulster festivals ahead of Open groups who are in Athlone. The Ulster Finals I guess will be a good indicator of that and where the show really lies.

Ive heard the venue and atmosphere is brilliant in Shercock this year from a few people who have been so far and I intend to make it at some stage over the week. Well done to all involved. The Confined finals I often prefer to Athlone as I find the atmosphere is warmer and more genuine where sometimes there can be alot of BS around the Dean Crowe and falseness between groups . Has anybody from groups out there that have made the transition between confined and open any opinion on this?

TrailerBob · 24-04-2012 1:02pm

I remember our confined days in the early 90's and i suppouse there was a very cordial atmosphere then, maybe that was a different time in Irish amateur drama though, some of us were a bit more space-cadet-like about it perhaps, and are more serious in our approach now. Also we had a sizeable break from the 3-Act circuit so things changed a bit in the meantime. I find there's a lot of genuine people in the Open section too to be fair, and a decent bit of banter between most groups. There's always going to be a few ego's about, but thats everywhere.

As for Letterkenny being bad for drama, that would only be the case if they went back confined again next year, or even 2 years time assuming they were to win Shercock. It seems as though a talented group just got the right play, with the right cast and it has worked very well.

poteen · 27-04-2012 12:53pm

Only 2 more night left in the Confined All Irelands. Was talking to a guy who has been a few nights and so far he thinks it is pretty wide open.

Best of luck to all Groups when it comes to awards time on Sat night !

Jon Joe1 · 28-04-2012 5:18pm

Any predictions for tonight???

poteen · 30-04-2012 10:16am

As most of ye know by now, Letterkenny lived up to the hype on Saturday night in Shercock winning a bagful of awards and the overall winners. I was at the show and really liked it. I felt the first act was stronger than the 2nd act and it lost its way a bit but overall I felt it was a clear winner. The production side of the show was so slick and rehearsed. I do think its a shame that their is no Soud award for the confined all irelands as this important element in any show should be acknowledged , Letterkennys sound was simply brilliant.

After that, Doonbeg finished 2nd and Droichead Nua 3rd.

A quick word about Shercock. What a well ran festival ! The Atmosphere and craic there on Saturday Night was just brilliant. The venue looked very well and all of the groups seemed very happy with the technical aspects too.

On To Athlone now....

Vinny-Chase · 30-04-2012 12:10pm

poteen wrote: »

A quick word about Shercock. What a well ran festival ! The Atmosphere and craic there on Saturday Night was just brilliant. The venue looked very well and all of the groups seemed very happy with the technical aspects too.

Absolutely! Shercock was ran amazingly well. Couldn't fault a thing up there. The craic and hospitality was just brilliant. And the late nights...wow! And the awards are beautiful. Liking my one on the mantle

Mixed reviews about 39 Steps talking to the audience afterwards, but ye never know how impartial people are talking to a member of another group. But technically the show was absolutely superb! They deserved the win for all the effort involved.

That's it now. All over, including the shouting!

Jon Joe1 · 06-05-2012 12:05pm

Doesn't seem to be an evident leader yet but I think Silken Thomas are out of the running!!

David Taylor · 06-05-2012 3:57pm

Hi everyone,
I was pointed in the direction of this site by a friend of mine. I used to be an avid follower of the drama circuit before I had to move to the UK at the start of the recession.
In my opinion there are many technical people (set, lighting designers etc) out there that should be competing for an all ireland crown but dont get to showcase at Athlone as the acting/direction wasnt strong enough to propel them there. Is this still the case? If so, who do you think should have their names in the hat this year?

TrailerBob · 06-05-2012 5:39pm

Jon Joe1 wrote: »

Doesn't seem to be an evident leader yet but I think Silken Thomas are out of the running!!

Mr M isn't giving too much away, but he did seem critical of the first act of their show. And then he has had criticism of all 3 so far, so in my books it's all to play for. He had some pointers for our show on Thursday too, but we'll wait and see how it pans out!!

Jon Joe1 · 07-05-2012 1:02pm

Kilmeen are defenitly ahead now!!!! What a adjudication can anyone neat them????

Jon Joe1 · 07-05-2012 1:05pm

*beat

conoroconnell · 08-05-2012 3:00pm

R u from Kilmeen, John Joe??

They have a top class show, which was matched by a good adjudication just like all the groups.. But I wouldn't rule out Silken Thomas just yet.. Thurles were very strong last night so who's to say they are not ahead either. Mr. M is keeping his cards very close to his chest but overall (being on the stage Friday 4th May) we smashed a great show in the Dean Crowe and it is in the lap of the Gods now..

poteen · 08-05-2012 3:19pm

I havnt made it to Athlone yet due to work but Ive heard that The adjud. is keeping his thoughts pretty secret. Ive heard that the Thurles Seafarer was better received by the Adjud than Cornmills and may be in front overall.

Having seen some shows prior to the All Ireland, I still feel Kilmeens show will take alot of beating in Athlone. The Standard is just so high though and really to seperate the Top 5 groups you are really going down to fine detail and to be honest- the adjuds. personal taste. He could pick anyone of 5 odd plays and nobody could question it too much.

To be even in Athlone your show needs to be very good but that still doesnt make you exempt from taking crit from audience and adjud and you need to be able to take that too when you are putting yourself forward in competition to be judged.

Jon Joe1 · 08-05-2012 3:33pm

poteen wrote: »

I havnt made it to Athlone yet due to work but Ive heard that The adjud. is keeping his thoughts pretty secret. Ive heard that the Thurles Seafarer was better received by the Adjud than Cornmills and may be in front overall.

I would agree with that it looks like Thurles got a very good adjudication... Looking forward to Bunclody tonight and especially Ballyduff on Thursday hearing great things about it and heard it's better than it was on The circuit
so it most be really good!!

poteen · 08-05-2012 3:43pm

Jon Joe1 wrote: »

poteen wrote: »

I havnt made it to Athlone yet due to work but Ive heard that The adjud. is keeping his thoughts pretty secret. Ive heard that the Thurles Seafarer was better received by the Adjud than Cornmills and may be in front overall.

I would agree with that it looks like Thurles got a very good adjudication... Looking forward to Bunclody tonight and especially Ballyduff on Thursday hearing great things about it and heard it's better than it was on The circuit
so it most be really good!!

I saw the Bunclody show and felt there were one or 2 stand out performances most notably Hester and Josie but just too many average supporting performances for it to win Athlone.Presentation very good.

As for Ballyduff, Im hoping to make the show. They have a good record in Athlone and it is always remarked about how hard they work between the circuit and the finals. Ive heard that the production takes alot of risks which may or may not go down well with the Scotsman. Time Will tell.

Also hearing from loads of people how strong Estuary are. They know how to win so dont rule them out !

Jon Joe1 · 08-05-2012 3:49pm

poteen wrote: »

Jon Joe1 wrote: »

I saw the Bunclody show and felt there were one or 2 stand out performances most notably Hester and Josie but just too many average supporting performances for it to win Athlone.Presentation very good.

As for Ballyduff, Im hoping to make the show. They have a good record in Athlone and it is always remarked about how hard they work between the circuit and the finals. Ive heard that the production takes alot of risks which may or may not go down well with the Scotsman. Time Will tell.

Also hearing from loads of people how strong Estuary are. They know how to win so dont rule them out !

I've seen Estuary and I didn't like it personally, didn't like the set or one of the 3 characters... Not a fan!!

pat loughnane · 08-05-2012 9:07pm

First time for four of our five cast members to perform on the stage in Athlone last night and what an experience it was for all involved. Delighted with our adjudication of course but no matter what happens Saturday night it has been a fantastic season ! Best of luck to all involved with Bunclody tonight and the remaining groups . See you all at the party Saturday night.!

Jon Joe1 · 09-05-2012 1:20pm

Great adjucdication last night I have a feeling it's between Bunclody and Thurles!!!

pat loughnane · 09-05-2012 7:18pm

Jon Joe1 wrote: »

Great adjucdication last night I have a feeling it's between Bunclody and Thurles!!!

What about Kilmeen ? Another great adjudication there ! Its going to be a hard one to call me thinks !

poteen · 10-05-2012 9:45am

It seems this adjudicator might well be playing a bit of a game . If thats true then all groups are very much in with a shout in their own heads come Saturday night even but thats not to say that the adjud aint dismissed them.
Some groups seem to be getting a surprisingly good adjud. in Athlone which makes me Wonder.

Me Thinks Kilmeen and Silken will still be in the top 3 with a random group between them. Ill put my neck on the block before the awards.

Speaking of the awards, is the format changed tis year ?? Is it closed to just the competing groups or what ?

pat loughnane · 10-05-2012 3:42pm

Any play that is good enough to get to Athlone is entitled to good adjudication and there is nothing surprising about that . The standard is obviously very high . Everyone is in with a shout on Saturday night !

poteen · 10-05-2012 3:53pm

pat loughnane wrote: »

Any play that is good enough to get to Athlone is entitled to good adjudication and there is nothing surprising about that . The standard is obviously very high . Everyone is in with a shout on Saturday night !

I agree with you to a point Pat. But the standard is higher in Athlone than at Prelim festivals and so the expectation and demands on groups should also be higher in my opinion. I think the adjudications need to get right under the production and they should be informative for the audiences and they should be aware of the elements of a good production that the adjudicator is looking for.

That said you do not want the kind of adjudicatios that Tom Doherty gave a couple of years back which were just bang out of order.

pat loughnane · 10-05-2012 4:18pm

poteen wrote: »

pat loughnane wrote: »

Any play that is good enough to get to Athlone is entitled to good adjudication and there is nothing surprising about that . The standard is obviously very high . Everyone is in with a shout on Saturday night !

I agree with you to a point Pat. But the standard is higher in Athlone than at Prelim festivals and so the expectation and demands on groups should also be higher in my opinion. I think the adjudications need to get right under the production and they should be informative for the audiences and they should be aware of the elements of a good production that the adjudicator is looking for.

That said you do not want the kind of adjudicatios that Tom Doherty gave a couple of years back which were just bang out of order.

If the main objective of the adjudication is to inform the audiences then I think he is doing a good job

cavalcaders · 11-05-2012 1:18pm

Anyone see last nights show.........how did ballyduff get on???

TrailerBob · 11-05-2012 3:34pm

According to the Twitter feed last night, they did ok, had issues with lighting in act 1, and thought set limited the movement, but generally quite positive. Most of the adjudications have been like this too. This could go any number of ways!

pat loughnane · 12-05-2012 2:37am

TrailerBob wrote: »

According to the Twitter feed last night, they did ok, had issues with lighting in act 1, and thought set limited the movement, but generally quite positive. Most of the adjudications have been like this too. This could go any number of ways!

Yea ... anything could happen tomorrow night ! The atmosphere is going to be electric in Athlone ... can't wait !!!

pat loughnane · 12-05-2012 2:39am

Any word how corofin got on tonight ?

Peter grimes · 15-05-2012 8:43pm

Well, what do we think of the results!!!! What a great night at the Radisson. It was really well run, I thought! Results were strange but then when are they not!!! Felt really sorry for the groups who didn't pick up anything. It is so tough. Certainly results didn't go the way people were expecting. The set nominations were so strange. Not taking anything away from Prosperous but there were better sets.
Also very strange that the lead actress from Bunclody wasn't nominated.
What about the 1.2.3. Definitely wouldn't have been mine.

TrailerBob · 15-05-2012 9:42pm

Peter grimes wrote: »

. The set nominations were so strange. Not taking anything away from Prosperous but there were better sets. .

That's where opinions are a great thing, it picked up 5 set awards on circuit too, but i am biased!

Congrats to Kilmeen on a 2 for 2, great bunch of guys What i find more peculiar is that Kilmeen won, but got no awards other than direction - and that's not to say they didn't deserve it.. they did. I spoke to one of their guys about it and he was amazed too, how can the winning group not be best in at least a couple of other areas? Again... opinions!!

This happened to us last year with a certain Mr.Kelly, runner up, but not even a consolation of a summer school award (And popular opinion was we had the best set then too!!)

dos1965 · 15-05-2012 10:18pm

Peter grimes wrote: »

Well, what do we think of the results!!!! What a great night at the Radisson. It was really well run, I thought! Results were strange but then when are they not!!! Felt really sorry for the groups who didn't pick up anything. It is so tough. Certainly results didn't go the way people were expecting. The set nominations were so strange. Not taking anything away from Prosperous but there were better sets.
Also very strange that the lead actress from Bunclody wasn't nominated.
What about the 1.2.3. Definitely wouldn't have been mine.

Peter.

It really was a terrific night and hats off to all the award recipients. What a great sense of celebration. The organisation was wonderful.

but....

Why would you preface something with "not taking anything away ....but..." and then proceed to recommend the award was unwarranted ? You can't have it
both ways in fairness.

Full Length Amateur Drama Circuit 2012

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