The Beatles

grumpytrousers · 27-06-2012 11:55pm

Ziegfeldgirl27 wrote: »

Huge fan here, though admittedly I only really truly like their early work. Pre- Pepper though I do like some of their later songs.

Here is something to get the discussion going.

In my opinion the force behind the Beatles was Paul. It saddens me how a lot of people, fans and non fans look to John Lennon like some God like character. When Paul a 15 year old boy first met John he couldn't even play proper guitar chords, Paul had to show him what he was doing wrong.
Paul's singing voice (had) a much greater range and nicer tone. His songs cover a wide range of notes and to me John's songs are a bit monotone like for instance Julia vs. I Will.
People think McCartney just wrote "the frog song" and Mull of Kintyre but I find his solo work a lot more inspiring than Johns. How can anyone think a song with Yoko wailing on it is good? I just don't understand it. I know Paul has wrote a few clinkers too but the good stuff outweighs the bad.

Have a listen to Beautiful Night, Letting Go, Call Me Back Again, Junk, Maybe I'm Amazed.

It's sad but I think when Macca is no longer with us hopefully he will get some respect and credit he so well deserves. He is one of the most talented people ever to be on this earth.

I think that's changing with time. The last few solo re-releases have got great reviews, and have finally been appreciated for the fine pieces of work they were. McCartney has never been deserted by his ear for melody, but sometimes he does take the easy way out with slushy arrangements or half arsed lyrics; the one thing he's missed for so long is a sparring partner like Lennon. Between 62-69, he was *largely* writing to impress Lennon. When he lost that, more of the dross started to creep in.

McCartney is now at the stage where if he decided to play an entire set of solo work, he'd still manage 3 hours of bloody great tunes. Perhaps still not as good as the stuff done by his old band, but stuff - nonetheless - that most songsmiths would give their right (and left) arms to have had a hand in a fraction of.

rcaz · 28-06-2012 12:23am

The Beatles never existed!

The Radiator · 30-07-2012 7:16pm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M-2lMstw6qs

karaokeman · 30-07-2012 7:30pm

Can we get an actual discussion about a particular aspect of the Beatles as musicians or about their influence going?

I really don't think this sort of general discussion, just everyone posting their favourite Beatles songs will work.

The Radiator · 30-07-2012 7:35pm

karaokeman wrote: »

Can we get an actual discussion about a particular aspect of the Beatles as musicians or about their influence going?

I really don't think this sort of general discussion, just everyone posting their favourite Beatles songs will work.

Ok, but you have to promise me you won't mention The Beach Boys

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=opOOhUbO8B8

Sindri · 31-07-2012 12:07am

Love this one.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wNRH7_Kd5Yc

Bobby Baccala · 31-07-2012 12:16am

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N8LZGQ4MkvQ

This and strawberry fields forever have to be my favourites, what a unique band.

karaokeman · 31-07-2012 10:01am

This conversation is still going nowhere.

Some of the fanboys here might already know this but the closest The Beatles ever came to reforming was at Eric Clapton's wedding in 1979 where all of them attended except for John Lennon.

Paul also said that if he reconciled with Lennon it would have happened eventually, but they always feared it would spoiled the whole idea of his band and what they represented in the 60s.

Latchy · 31-07-2012 11:04pm

karaokeman wrote: »

Paul also said that if he reconciled with Lennon it would have happened eventually, but they always feared it would spoiled the whole idea of his band and what they represented in the 60s.

John Lennon said ( quote) '' The public never got to see the Beatles as we were in our Hamburg days when we were rocking and jumping all over the stage in leathers '' .

I think it would have happened eventually and as Lennon said ( quote) '' if it happens it happens '' but he also said (Quote) '' I don't wanna be singing I wanna hold your head when I'm 60 '' .Their own post Beatle, individual, musical progressions would have meant that much compromise in the live set ( to say the least ) would have to be worked out .

The problem with the Beatles was they crammed in and absorbed to much ,to quick ,to soon and never really became the band Lennon would have really liked them to be .They had peaked as a pop band ,whereas bands like the Stones and The Who didn't have the expectations and limitations of 'Beatlemania ' to worry about .

karaokeman · 31-07-2012 11:29pm

Latchy wrote: »

John Lennon said ( quote) '' The public never got to see the Beatles as we were in our Hamburg days when we were rocking and jumping all over the stage in leathers '' .

I think it would have happened eventually and as Lennon said ( quote) '' if it happens it happens '' but he also said (Quote) '' I don't wanna be singing I wanna hold your head when I'm 60 '' .Their own post Beatle, individual, musical progressions would have meant that much compromise in the live set ( to say the least ) would have to be worked out .

The problem with the Beatles was they crammed in and absorbed to much ,to quick ,to soon and never really became the band Lennon would have really liked them to be .They had peaked as a pop band ,whereas bands like the Stones and The Who didn't have the expectations and limitations of 'Beatlemania ' to worry about .

Macca also said (Quote) "We could’ve decided we’d reform by now or we could’ve got together for big anniversaries or a big charity gig or something".

That is implying if it happened there is a huge likelihood it would have been a one-off Police-style, unlike a permanent reunion where they went on to make more and more music from then on.

He also said "It wasn't really a good idea then but I think if this much time had elapsed, I could easily see it happening".

That is saying if all four had of lived to the time of this interview (2010) it would have more than likely occurred some time in that 40-year gap since they split.

Glad to finally get a bit of a debate going on here, much more akin to what boards.ie is made for.

Chazz Michael Michaels · 09-08-2012 2:13pm

rcaz wrote: »

You probably know much more about them than I do, could you sum up exactly why you reckon they're the best musicians ever? I know it's said everywhere that they're the best band ever in popular music so far, but not much is usually said about the details that actually make them that good. What do you reckon really make them the best?

Tomorrow Never Knows - A song without precedent. If for no other reason, this song demonstrates their genius. It sounds like a modern electronic song, and yet it was 1966. Backwards tracks, speeding and slowing the tapes to create effects, samples, loops, this was all way ahead of it's time.

I don't think they were technically brilliant musicians (except McCartney), but songs like the above and the album Pepper were just light years ahead of their contemporaries (bar Brian Wilson). Strawberry Fields is simply stunning in terms of production which was similar to TNK in it's use of samples and loops but it was so refined and precise, you would be forgiven for not noticing the backwards hats with the forwards drums mixed. Nothing else like it, at the time.

kunst nugget · 13-08-2012 10:37pm

Chazz Michael Michaels wrote: »

Tomorrow Never Knows - A song without precedent. If for no other reason, this song demonstrates their genius. It sounds like a modern electronic song, and yet it was 1966. Backwards tracks, speeding and slowing the tapes to create effects, samples, loops, this was all way ahead of it's time.

I don't think they were technically brilliant musicians (except McCartney), but songs like the above and the album Pepper were just light years ahead of their contemporaries (bar Brian Wilson). Strawberry Fields is simply stunning in terms of production which was similar to TNK in it's use of samples and loops but it was so refined and precise, you would be forgiven for not noticing the backwards hats with the forwards drums mixed. Nothing else like it, at the time.

Does that not just show that they got lucky ending up being produced by George Martin and engineered by the likes of Geoff Emerick who had the technical know how to do whatever took the Beatles fancy? I'm a massive fan of the Beatles but songs like Strawberry Fields are 50/50 songwriting/production in terms of their brilliance.

Chazz Michael Michaels · 13-08-2012 10:42pm

kunst nugget wrote: »

Does that not just show that they got lucky ending up being produced by George Martin and engineered by the likes of Geoff Emerick who had the technical know how to do whatever took the Beatles fancy? I'm a massive fan of the Beatles but songs like Strawberry Fields are 50/50 songwriting/production in terms of their brilliance.

Yeah, to a certain extent, but it was only because The Beatles demanded so many different sounds and had the balls to try new things that Martin/Emerick came up with so many techniques, not the other way around. They were great innovators, The Beatles, which is why they stood out artistically.

But almost every album ever made owes something to the producer/engineer.

wandatowell · 13-08-2012 10:47pm

I like a bit of the Octopus's Garden in the morning, It gets me going till lunch time like

BobbyPropane · 13-08-2012 10:50pm

http://youtu.be/si2azEjkZU4

The Radiator · 15-08-2012 12:00am

BobbyPropane wrote: »

http://youtu.be/si2azEjkZU4

Wow, what a great contribution. I got a good chuckle out of that

taylorconor95 · 18-08-2012 7:03pm

BobbyPropane wrote: »

http://youtu.be/si2azEjkZU4

If you spent more time listening and less time thinking about "gay-ass haircuts" you'd realise whats so great about them

AlmightyDublin · 18-08-2012 7:10pm

taylorconor95 wrote: »

If you spent more time listening and less time thinking about "gay-ass haircuts" you'd realise whats so great about them

Just clicked on it there, saw the title, and clicked off it. Don't want to know

taylorconor95 · 18-08-2012 7:17pm

AlmightyDublin wrote: »

Just clicked on it there, saw the title, and clicked off it. Don't want to know

Ah should have watched it, bit of a laugh!

BobbyPropane · 18-08-2012 7:23pm

That video I posted is itself really a joke. The guy who uploaded loves the Beatles and his father has most of their autographs and a Paul McCartney bass Guitar

AlmightyDublin · 18-08-2012 7:25pm

taylorconor95 wrote: »

Ah should have watched it, bit of a laugh!

Ahh I might as well haha :P
Edit; Haha the parts about the album covers and not letting Yoko sing are funny

taylorconor95 · 18-08-2012 8:52pm

AlmightyDublin wrote: »

Ahh I might as well haha :P
Edit; Haha the parts about the album covers and not letting Yoko sing are funny

The guys made album covers what they are for gods sake! Oh and we all know what happens when Yoko sings... BIRTHDAY!

AlmightyDublin · 18-08-2012 9:53pm

taylorconor95 wrote: »

AlmightyDublin wrote: »

Ahh I might as well haha :P
Edit; Haha the parts about the album covers and not letting Yoko sing are funny

The guys made album covers what they are for gods sake! Oh and we all know what happens when Yoko sings... BIRTHDAY!

Haha yeah she also has a line in 'Bungalow Bill' too :P

paddyandy · 19-08-2012 11:23am

No question they were the best and in a class of their own and on their own but how they affected societie's values has never been even remotely addressed . Too dangerous .

Latchy · 19-08-2012 5:53pm

paddyandy wrote: »

No question they were the best and in a class of their own and on their own but how they affected societie's values has never been even remotely addressed . Too dangerous .

Edit- Not entirely sure where your coming from here but ...

It was George Harrison who said '' the world went Beatles mad and then blamed us when it all got to crazy '' . John Lennons '' we are bigger then Jesus '' quote didn't do them any favors but they were taken out of context to what he meant and if anything , made people question society's values back then which most likely would have been challenged anyway in some other way shape or form .At least we know now that religion ( to many millions ) is now the exception rather than the rule .

cometogether · 19-08-2012 7:48pm

paddyandy wrote: »

No question they were the best and in a class of their own and on their own but how they affected societie's values has never been even remotely addressed . Too dangerous .

What?

DEFTLEFTHAND · 19-08-2012 8:37pm

I liked George's sentiments before he died about the best album he wrote/played on. He stated that it was 'Brainwashed', a project that he finished with his son Dhani.

I suppose it meant the most for him. Class act of a man.

Latchy · 19-08-2012 9:30pm

George was the one who hated Beatlemania more then the others and also found it hard being the 3rd class passenger in the Beatles when it came to songwriting dues on albums ,even if it was the John and Paul combo partnership which got them to the ''toppermost of the poppermost '' . He was most paroniod about death threats after Lennon was shot and shame that his security let him down when he most needed it .

kunst nugget · 19-08-2012 10:17pm

paddyandy wrote: »

No question they were the best and in a class of their own and on their own but how they affected societie's values has never been even remotely addressed . Too dangerous .

That's a load of rubbish. A simple google search of 'Beatles effect on society' will yield you 49,900,000 results. They have analyzed over and over again with a fine tooth comb and their impact on and contribution to wider society has been debated at length.

trashcan · 20-08-2012 9:51pm

Was looking at some of the "Paul is dead" stuff on Youtube last night. Bizarre that anyone could give this stuff credence. One simple thing will tell you it's nonsense. We're supposed to believe that that they got in a doppelganger who was capable of writing (among other things) Hey Jude, Let it Be, The Long and Winding Road (and Maxwells Silver Hammer:D) Yeah, sure.

spodoinkle · 24-08-2012 10:09pm

I would have loved to be at the recording of You Know my name, Look up the Number.

Latchy · 25-08-2012 11:42pm

I would love to have been at the recording of their very first album, Please Please Me and watch Lennon & McCartney,George ,Ringo , George Martin and Geoff Emerick make musical history . It would be amazing watching Martins influence on the band and listen to Lennon screaming on Twist and Shout like he does .

The Radiator · 06-10-2012 10:21pm

I like The Beatles

GodsWallet · 07-10-2012 10:13am

I had the privilege to be invited into the Abbey Road studios about 7 years ago. The daughter of a friend of mine was launching an album (her career fizzled and is on hold for a while). Her record label at the time - Blue Note, I think - managed to 'book' one of the small theatres there. Being a Beatles fan for many years, I'd hoped to see some memorabilia, but that particular part of the building is off-limits, so I got to see nothing remotely associated with the Beatles. The building itself is like the Tardis.....when you get inside its massive (the parts I DID see). Anyway, I was still thrilled to be there.

I love the music, mostly, and like many others here, my favourites would change with the mood. This morning its 'here, there and everywhere'.

Mannix1888 · 08-10-2012 2:12pm

Good doc about The Beatles focusing on the "Magical Mystery Tour" film on the BBC4. It was shown Saturday night, will most likely be repeated. Contributions from McCartney, Ringo, Martin Scorsese and Peter Fonda among others.

Bassfish · 08-10-2012 11:23pm

Anyone else feel the way I do? I'm an avid Beatles fan, love their music and remain in a state of awe at how they managed to produce such a vast amount of amazing music in the space of about 9 years BUT i can barely listen to any of their post-Beatles solo work. I love John Lennon's Beatles work but the only solo songs i like are Imagine and Jealous guy. As far as i'm concerned Paul McCartney hasn't written a decent song since 1970, George had one or two nice songs and i think Ringo had the right idea doing Thomas the Tank Engine.
This really all came to me this evening when i watched a concert of John Lennon with the Plastic Ono Band in 1972 in Madison Square Garden, John's last full concert. The concert was actually rubbish and i really had to struggle to not change the channel.
I just find it strange that people who were such amazing songwriters collectively could produce so little good music as solo artists or collarborating with others. Anyone else agree or am i being unfair to Wings and Lennon's solo stuff?

Chazz Michael Michaels · 08-10-2012 11:37pm

I agree. Maybe they only worked well as a foursome.

taylorconor95 · 09-10-2012 8:53am

Bassfish wrote: »

Anyone else feel the way I do? I'm an avid Beatles fan, love their music and remain in a state of awe at how they managed to produce such a vast amount of amazing music in the space of about 9 years BUT i can barely listen to any of their post-Beatles solo work. I love John Lennon's Beatles work but the only solo songs i like are Imagine and Jealous guy. As far as i'm concerned Paul McCartney hasn't written a decent song since 1970, George had one or two nice songs and i think Ringo had the right idea doing Thomas the Tank Engine.
This really all came to me this evening when i watched a concert of John Lennon with the Plastic Ono Band in 1972 in Madison Square Garden, John's last full concert. The concert was actually rubbish and i really had to struggle to not change the channel.
I just find it strange that people who were such amazing songwriters collectively could produce so little good music as solo artists or collarborating with others. Anyone else agree or am i being unfair to Wings and Lennon's solo stuff?

Can't agree I'm afraid. Sure, Paul had a few poor patches (Ram) but have you not heard Band on the Run or Tug of War? (Nobody even knows about the latter) They are awesome! As for Lennon, just because his music wasn't amazingly commercially successful doesn't mean it wasn't fantastic music! The Plastic Ono album and Imagine were awesome, and I personally love Walls and Bridges.

As for Harrison, All Things Must Pass is an absolute work of art. And I can't quite name the album but that country album that Ringo released was actually quite good, too.

Temaz · 09-10-2012 9:30am

Some of Lennons solo work matches the Beatles imo

Ziegfeldgirl27 · 09-10-2012 9:56am

Bassfish wrote: »

Anyone else feel the way I do? I'm an avid Beatles fan, love their music and remain in a state of awe at how they managed to produce such a vast amount of amazing music in the space of about 9 years BUT i can barely listen to any of their post-Beatles solo work. I love John Lennon's Beatles work but the only solo songs i like are Imagine and Jealous guy. As far as i'm concerned Paul McCartney hasn't written a decent song since 1970, George had one or two nice songs and i think Ringo had the right idea doing Thomas the Tank Engine.
This really all came to me this evening when i watched a concert of John Lennon with the Plastic Ono Band in 1972 in Madison Square Garden, John's last full concert. The concert was actually rubbish and i really had to struggle to not change the channel.
I just find it strange that people who were such amazing songwriters collectively could produce so little good music as solo artists or collarborating with others. Anyone else agree or am i being unfair to Wings and Lennon's solo stuff?

Well I feel the same as you with regards to three of the former Beatles only I do think Paul McCartney has some amazing music after the Beatles. What songs/albums have you heard that you don't think measure up since 1970?

Latchy · 09-10-2012 12:08pm

I was watching the Love Me Do ,50th anniversary documentary on BBC 4 over the weekend and I was familiar with the story of how 3 different people Pete Best , Ringo Starr and Andy White all played on various takes of love me do (23 takes in all ) but there is still some dispute as to who played on the official single release .

In the documentary Andy White ( a session drummer hired by friend of George Martin ) tells of how he was laying down a track with a nervous looking Ringo looking on and how he's convinced it's his drumming on the released single .

Pete Best seemed to get some Joy out telling how Ringo was going through something similar to himself at that session ie, feeling like his Beatle career was over before it even began while he watched Andy White banging away with approving looks from George Martin a.

Best looks well for his age and is proud to have been part of that musical history ( ''you can't take that away from me '' he say's ) but you can still see some bitterness in his face from knowing he lost out to Ringo as the Beatles drummer and all the fame that went with it .

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b01nfbt2

notnumber · 09-10-2012 7:43pm

http://www.thegrandsocial.ie/event/mersey-beatles

anyone going?

Welsh Megaman · 09-10-2012 10:02pm

Latchy wrote: »

I was watching the Love Me Do ,50th anniversary documentary on BBC 4 over the weekend and I was familiar with the story of how 3 different people Pete Best , Ringo Starr and Andy White all played on various takes of love me do (23 takes in all ) but there is still some dispute as to who played on the official single release .

In the documentary Andy White ( a session drummer hired by friend of George Martin ) tells of how he was laying down a track with a nervous looking Ringo looking on and how he's convinced it's his drumming on the released single .

Pete Best seemed to get some Joy out telling how Ringo was going through something similar to himself at that session ie, feeling like his Beatle career was over before it even began while he watched Andy White banging away with approving looks from George Martin a.

Best looks well for his age and is proud to have been part of that musical history ( ''you can't take that away from me '' he say's ) but you can still see some bitterness in his face from knowing he lost out to Ringo as the Beatles drummer and all the fame that went with it .

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b01nfbt2[/QUOTE]

Excellent documentary. Best can't be too glum...the royalties from 'Anthology 1' made him a millionaire.

walshb · 10-10-2012 8:52pm

For simplicity in music and arrangements and melody they were remarkably good. For pure musicianship they were good.

I like them quite a bit. Not number 1, but damn they were good. They have many many tunes that I like; many I don't like as well, but with so many tunes that is bound to happen.

I_p_freely · 11-10-2012 9:23pm

Bassfish wrote: »

Anyone else feel the way I do? I'm an avid Beatles fan, love their music and remain in a state of awe at how they managed to produce such a vast amount of amazing music in the space of about 9 years BUT i can barely listen to any of their post-Beatles solo work. I love John Lennon's Beatles work but the only solo songs i like are Imagine and Jealous guy. As far as i'm concerned Paul McCartney hasn't written a decent song since 1970, George had one or two nice songs and i think Ringo had the right idea doing Thomas the Tank Engine.
This really all came to me this evening when i watched a concert of John Lennon with the Plastic Ono Band in 1972 in Madison Square Garden, John's last full concert. The concert was actually rubbish and i really had to struggle to not change the channel.
I just find it strange that people who were such amazing songwriters collectively could produce so little good music as solo artists or collarborating with others. Anyone else agree or am i being unfair to Wings and Lennon's solo stuff?

I watched that concert too and the sound quality was rubbish. I turned it off after a while.
I don't agree totally about their solo work - All things must pass by George Harrison is one of my favourite albums. The album Imagine is good - Oh Yoko! is a great song! And I really like crippled inside. Paul never did anything too great, though, except live and let die.

taylorconor95 · 11-10-2012 10:30pm

I_p_freely wrote: »

I watched that concert too and the sound quality was rubbish. I turned it off after a while.
I don't agree totally about their solo work - All things must pass by George Harrison is one of my favourite albums. The album Imagine is good - Oh Yoko! is a great song! And I really like crippled inside. Paul never did anything too great, though, except live and let die.

Why does nobody like Band on the Run!?! Its one of my all time favourite albums!

ADonoghue · 11-10-2012 11:00pm

I am and have always be a big Fan of the Beatles music , prior to them " coming on the scene" we had to put up with Cliff and Shadows who never made it in America ,Marty Wilde , Evis was the man at the time .

The Beatles in the early 60's, they were something different unusually writing their own songs which some are classics and have stood the test of time , have been sang by the likes of Shirley Bassey , Joe Cocker and many others .

My favourites of theirs being, Here , There, and Everwhere , Strawberry Fields Forever , Heres Comes The Sun ( Harrison ) to name a few .

THey have and will go down in history as Four Ordinary Lads who shook the world

Rothko · 11-10-2012 11:10pm

taylorconor95 wrote: »

Why does nobody like Band on the Run!?! Its one of my all time favourite albums!

I like Band On The Run. It's probably Paul's best album post-Beatles. I don't think it's anything compared to All Things Must Pass or John Lennon/Plastic Ono Band though.

mathepac · 11-10-2012 11:36pm

rcaz wrote: »

... I think the Beatles are pretty good, some of their stuff is fantastic, some of it I don't like at all. I don't think they're the greatest musicians of all time, though. But then who could answer that question definitively?

I can.

Collectively the most influential group of popular musicians ever assembled, and individually the effects of their creative abilities and output is still evident. As I've posted many times previously the were innovators and lead the charge into the mega out-door arena performances that became de rigeur after their retirement from touring (last concert performance Candlestick Park 1966).

Their catalogue of 'firsts' in popular culture is lengthy, I've listed a lot of them before, and their material has stood the test of time, with singers like Frank Sinatra rating George Harrison's "Something" as one of the top love songs of all time and George's soundtrack to "Wonderwall" still features in the Top 20/30 greatest film sound-tracks (movie is odd-ball and pretty ****e but the music is incredible. Mr Gallagher based his song of the same name on the sound-track and rates George as a genius).

Given the stuff they got involved in post-Beatles and their multi-instrumental capabilities, I think it's only fair to recognise them as polymaths.

DEFTLEFTHAND · 13-10-2012 7:35pm

Ziegfeldgirl27 wrote: »

Well I feel the same as you with regards to three of the former Beatles only I do think Paul McCartney has some amazing music after the Beatles. What songs/albums have you heard that you don't think measure up since 1970?

Band on the run was great, I also liked Tug Of War. After that though I found a lot of the stuff hit or miss.

The Beatles

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