Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

Building a Mosque close to ground zero

Options
1…89111314…19

Comments

  • Options
    #302
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    Hezekiah Shrilling Watercolor wrote: »
    That's 'muslim-bashing' is it?

    Taking the verses out of context, along with trying to proclaim Islam as uniquely violent........

    Take it - for the sake of argument - that his interpretation of the Koran is correct. Where then, is the infidel killing and general mayhem thats supposed to be the belief and duty of every muslim...?


  • Options
    #303
    MagicMarker
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 32,865 ✭✭✭✭MagicMarker


    Nodin wrote: »
    Taking the verses out of context, along with trying to proclaim Islam as uniquely violent........

    Take it - for the sake of argument - that his interpretation of the Koran is correct. Where then, is the infidel killing and general mayhem thats supposed to be the belief and duty of every muslim...?

    Millions of Muslims don't believe he's taking the verses out of context. Plus he never said EVERY muslim, I don't know why you keep insinuating that he did?


  • Options
    #304
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    MagicMarker wrote: »
    I'm really trying to see how from that article, you've come to the conclusion that he's assuming all Muslims are linked to 9/11? Or that violence is unique to Islam, or even that it's associated with the majority of Muslims? I'm just not seeing it.

    I'm beginning to wonder if you read it...... .......
    At this point in human history, Islam simply is different from other faiths.
    And honest reasoning declares that there is much that is objectionable—and, frankly, terrifying—about the religion of Islam and about the state of discourse among Muslims living in the West
    The first thing that all honest students of Islam must admit is that it is not absolutely clear where members of al Qaeda, the Taliban, al-Shabab, Lashkar-e-Taiba, Hamas, and other Muslim terrorist groups have misconstrued their religious obligations. If they are “extremists” who have deformed an ancient faith into a death cult, they haven’t deformed it by much.

    Thus, when Allah commands his followers to slay infidels wherever they find them, until Islam reigns supreme (2:191-193; 4:76; 8:39; 9:123; 47:4; 66:9)—only to emphasize that such violent conquest is obligatory, as unpleasant as that might seem (2:216), and that death in jihad is actually the best thing that can happen to a person, given the rewards that martyrs receive in Paradise (3:140-171; 4:74; 47:5-6)—He means just that. And, being the creator of the universe, his words were meant to guide Muslims for all time.
    And it is not a form of bigotry or racism to observe that the specific tenets of the faith pose a special threat to civil society.
    The claim that the events of September 11, 2001, had “nothing to do with Islam” is an abject and destabilizing lie.


  • Options
    #305
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    MagicMarker wrote: »
    Millions of Muslims don't believe he's taking the verses out of context. Plus he never said EVERY muslim, I don't know why you keep insinuating that he did?

    You might try re-reading that post.....


  • Options
    #306
    MagicMarker
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 32,865 ✭✭✭✭MagicMarker


    Nodin wrote: »
    I'm beginning to wonder if you read it...... .......
    Nodin wrote: »
    You might try re-reading that post.....

    lol, you might want to take your own advice.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #307
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    MagicMarker wrote: »
    lol, you might want to take your own advice.

    I'm in awe of your new analysis.



    No, really.


  • Options
    #308
    Turtwig
    Registered Users Posts: 26,578 ✭✭✭✭Turtwig


    Nodin wrote: »
    ...because were you to read that article, you'd be almost under the impression that (a) violence was unique to Islam (b) violence was associated with the majority of muslims. It isn't.

    I've read the article and I can't help but find it bizarre how you got that impression from it.
    Yes, it is true that the Old Testament contains even greater barbarism—but there are obvious historical and theological reasons why it inspires far less Jewish and Christian violence today.

    Seems to me like someone has just expressed an opinion of violence being contained in Christianity too.
    This murder of 3,000 innocents was viewed as a victory for the One True Faith by millions of Muslims throughout the world (even, idiotically, by those who think it was perpetrated by the Mossad)

    This statement is actually true. They represent a minority proportion of Islam, but these people do exist.

    Where in the article does he say that the majority is focused on violence?


    (Btw, I'm inclined to disagree with his article, but I'm just perplexed at your understanding and representation of it. )


  • Options
    #309
    wes
    Registered Users Posts: 11,747 ✭✭✭✭wes


    A great article from Salon, that details how the "outrage" was manufactured by a fringe group, and is now being embraced by the main stream right wing nutjobs:

    How the "ground zero mosque" fear mongering began


  • Options
    #310
    desertcircus
    Registered Users Posts: 2,648 ✭✭✭desertcircus


    buzzdroid wrote: »
    "despite the fact that anti-Western jihad realistically dates from Sayyid Qutb's theories in the 1950s."


    that is a staggering level of ignorance of history.. to such an extent that I dare not comment beyond one hint.

    The Battle of Tours.


    Go look it up.
    So you really can't tell the difference between a war of conquest fought thirteen hundred years ago and a terrorist campaign inspired by Western liberalism and the treatment of Palestine?


  • Options
    #311
    Turtwig
    Registered Users Posts: 26,578 ✭✭✭✭Turtwig


    wes wrote: »
    A great article from Salon, that details how the "outrage" was manufactured by a fringe group, and is now being embraced by the main stream right wing nutjobs:

    How the "ground zero mosque" fear mongering began

    ^^

    That's despicable. Distortion of truth to pursue agendas is something I'm very much used to but each time it happens and the mainstream media falls hook line and sinker for it a little part of me dies inside. :(


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #312
    Pauleta
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,778 ✭✭✭Pauleta


    Caoimhín wrote: »
    Could you explain why exactly?

    Can you imagine how happy the people who planned the attack would be when they found this out. They will see this as a victory.

    Forest Master wrote: »
    Notice how Pauleta hasn't had the guts to come back & defend his/her retarded comment.

    I do have a life away from this forum ;)


  • Options
    #313
    Turtwig
    Registered Users Posts: 26,578 ✭✭✭✭Turtwig


    Pauleta wrote: »
    Can you imagine how happy the people who planned the attack would be when they found this out. They will see this as a victory.

    Oh no doubt they will and they will post internet videos to mainstream media boasting it. They're disillusioned though (that, or more cynically producing proganda in attempt to divide a society). This will be a victory for western values and liberties.* Censoring the building of the a mosque is exactly the type of backward progression that these extremists are looking for.



    *In reality though it shouldn't even be a victory or topic for either side.


  • Options
    #314
    Ash.J.Williams
    Registered Users Posts: 20,937 ✭✭✭✭Ash.J.Williams


    amacachi wrote: »
    Didn't Frankie Boyle suggest this a few years back?
    Yeah a mosque or a runway!


  • Options
    #315
    Pauleta
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,778 ✭✭✭Pauleta


    Malty_T wrote: »
    Oh no doubt they will and they will post internet videos to mainstream media boasting it. They're disillusioned though (that, or more cynically producing proganda in attempt to divide a society). This will be a victory for western values and liberties.* Censoring the building of the a mosque is exactly the type of backward progression that these extremists are looking for.



    *In reality though it shouldn't even be a victory or topic for either side.


    You make a good point in fairness


  • Options
    #316
    Overheal
    Registered Users Posts: 82,254 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    Malty_T wrote:
    backward progression
    ...Regression?


  • Options
    #317
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    Malty_T wrote: »
    I've read the article and I can't help but find it bizarre how you got that impression from it.



    Seems to me like someone has just expressed an opinion of violence being contained in Christianity too.



    This statement is actually true. They represent a minority proportion of Islam, but these people do exist.

    Where in the article does he say that the majority is focused on violence?


    (Btw, I'm inclined to disagree with his article, but I'm just perplexed at your understanding and representation of it. )

    Fairly evident from these two, taken together...
    And it is not a form of bigotry or racism to observe that the specific tenets of the faith pose a special threat to civil society. Quote:
    The claim that the events of September 11, 2001, had “nothing to do with Islam” is an abject and destabilizing lie.


  • Options
    #318
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    Pauleta wrote: »
    I do have a life away from this forum ;)

    Yep. But now you're back you still haven't defended said comment.....


  • Options
    #319
    Jeboa Safari
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,202 ✭✭✭Jeboa Safari


    Is there any truth about how someone wants to build a gay bar for muslims beside the mosque?


  • Options
    #320
    Donkey Oaty
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,533 ✭✭✭Donkey Oaty


    Jeboa Safari wrote: »
    Is there any truth about how someone wants to build a gay bar for muslims beside the mosque?

    That would be Hugh Betcha of the Canada Free Press.

    No.

    Edit: Although I see that Greg Gutfield of Fox News wants to do the same, and that he is "dead serious on this one" so maybe it's true!


  • Options
    #321
    fontanalis
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,619 ✭✭✭fontanalis


    Donkey Oaty wrote: »
    That would be Hugh Betcha of the Canada Free Press.

    No.

    Edit: Although I see that Greg Gutfield of Fox News wants to do the same, and that he is "dead serious on this one" so maybe it's true!

    Like there are no gay bars in that area already!


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #322
    Donkey Oaty
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,533 ✭✭✭Donkey Oaty


    fontanalis wrote: »
    Like there are no gay bars in that area already!

    This one goes a bit further.
    Gutfeld plans to cater specifically to Muslims, by serving 72 virgin drinks. The potential names for the gay bar include Ji-Hot, Ram-a-Dan, You Meccan Me Hot, and Suspicious Package.

    Source: Newsoxy.com


  • Options
    #323
    Terry
    Registered Users Posts: 26,061 ✭✭✭✭Terry


    Jeboa Safari wrote: »
    Is there any truth about how someone wants to build a gay bar for muslims beside the mosque?
    http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055996555


  • Options
    #324
    g5fd6ow0hseima
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,787 ✭✭✭g5fd6ow0hseima


    Nodin wrote: »
    Yep. But now you're back you still haven't defended said comment.....
    Nodin, id like to see what to make of this article. Unlike Harris, the author makes the distinction between good muslim and bad muslim.

    http://bit.ly/cBwt41


  • Options
    #325
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    Hezekiah Shrilling Watercolor wrote: »
    Nodin, id like to see what to make of this article. Unlike Harris, the author makes the distinction between good muslim and bad muslim.

    http://bit.ly/cBwt41

    It's perfectly fair enough. The Wahabi school is a regressive influence and theres no denying it.

    She does point out that the community center and mosque are being led by an entirely different mindset, IMO.


  • Options
    #326
    fayrae
    Closed Accounts Posts: 50 ✭✭fayrae


    Originally Posted by starbelgrade viewpost.gif
    I don't think they should build the Mosque near Ground Zero. I think they should build the thing on Ground Zero.

    How sensitive of you! :rolleyes: Like there is no other place to build this Mosque/Islamic Center? :confused: Even Muslims, those who dare to speak out, are saying some Muslims, including those proposing this project, will see this as a Muslim victory over the US.


  • Options
    #327
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    fayrae wrote: »
    How sensitive of you! :rolleyes: Like there is no other place to build this Mosque/Islamic Center? :confused: Even Muslims, those who dare to speak out, are saying some Muslims, including those proposing this project, will see this as a Muslim victory over the US.

    A Sufi is in league with an extremist Wahabi offshoot?

    A few links to back that accusation up, if you would.


  • Options
    #328
    fayrae
    Closed Accounts Posts: 50 ✭✭fayrae


    Originally Posted by starbelgrade viewpost.gif
    I don't think they should build the Mosque near Ground Zero. I think they should build the thing on Ground Zero.

    How sensitive of you! :rolleyes: Like there is no other place to build this Mosque/Islamic Center? :confused: Even Muslims, those who dare to speak out, are saying some Muslims, including those proposing this project, will see this as victory for Islamic terrorists groups.


  • Options
    #329
    LukeQuietus
    Registered Users Posts: 160 ✭✭LukeQuietus


    It is Allah's plan. DEATH TO THE INFIDELS!!!!


  • Options
    #330
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    fayrae wrote: »
    How sensitive of you! :rolleyes: Like there is no other place to build this Mosque/Islamic Center? :confused: Even Muslims, those who dare to speak out, are saying some Muslims, including those proposing this project, will see this as victory for Islamic terrorists groups.

    Why are you posting that again....?

    And wheres those links....?


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #331
    Turtwig
    Registered Users Posts: 26,578 ✭✭✭✭Turtwig


    LukeQuietus wrote: »
    It is Allah's plan. DEATH TO THE INFIDELS!!!!

    The problem here (as outlined by succinctly by Harris) is that it is not entirely clear which plan is actually Allah's. One plan opposed the attacked on 9/11 another embraced it. Both plans were inspired by the one book, the only difference is the interpretation of that text. (Naturally, both plans say they have nothing to do with the other misguided one.) So who's death, exactly, are wishing. Those who abhor the 9/11 atrocities or those who welcome them?


Advertisement