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Leinster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread V

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    #2912
    LostArt
    Registered Users Posts: 1,797 ✭✭✭LostArt


    .ak wrote: »
    Treviso game aside, has Gopperth been in dire form? :confused:

    No he hasn't, I'd say he's been above average to good, but he suffers from

    1) Not being Johnny Sexton
    2) Not being Ian Madigan


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    #2913
    wise7
    Registered Users Posts: 485 ✭✭wise7


    .ak wrote: »
    Treviso game aside, has Gopperth been in dire form? :confused:
    Yes pretty poor. Why was Marsh not given a chance, even 10 minutes in a few of the games over the last few weeks? The Coach has a duty to bring on players and having a decent 10 in his 3rd year in the Academy who played consistently well in the B&I last season deserves a shot especially when Gopperth has been playing so badly.


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    #2914
    otbrugby
    Registered Users Posts: 189 ✭✭otbrugby


    wise7 wrote: »
    Yes pretty poor. Why was Marsh not given a chance, even 10 minutes in a few of the games over the last few weeks? The Coach has a duty to bring on players and having a decent 10 in his 3rd year in the Academy who played consistently well in the B&I last season deserves a shot especially when Gopperth has been playing so badly.

    because marsh is too small and inexperienced for MOC.


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    #2915
    .ak
    Registered Users Posts: 30,308 Mod ✭✭✭✭.ak


    wise7 wrote: »
    Yes pretty poor. Why was Marsh not given a chance, even 10 minutes in a few of the games over the last few weeks? The Coach has a duty to bring on players and having a decent 10 in his 3rd year in the Academy who played consistently well in the B&I last season deserves a shot especially when Gopperth has been playing so badly.

    Any examples of being poor? The odd mistake aside he's been pretty solid for us this season so far.


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    #2916
    .ak
    Registered Users Posts: 30,308 Mod ✭✭✭✭.ak


    LostArt wrote: »
    No he hasn't, I'd say he's been above average to good, but he suffers from

    1) Not being Johnny Sexton
    2) Not being Ian Madigan

    Ah, he's got a terrible case of notjohnnyiatus. :pac:


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    #2917
    wise7
    Registered Users Posts: 485 ✭✭wise7


    otbrugby wrote: »
    because marsh is too small and inexperienced for MOC.
    Its like going for a job interview and being told you have no experience. How do young players with potential get experience? Does the b&I count for nothing? Why is the word of the head coach final on every aspect of player development in the entire squad/ Do other coaches have no input or say or influence? Is this juts a dictatorship?


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    #2918
    wise7
    Registered Users Posts: 485 ✭✭wise7


    .ak wrote: »
    Any examples of being poor? The odd mistake aside he's been pretty solid for us this season so far.
    I think his game management is mediocre. He is a good English Premiership mid-table 10 at best. He is not a European Premier Club 10.


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    #2919
    .ak
    Registered Users Posts: 30,308 Mod ✭✭✭✭.ak


    As a way to maybe move on from the MOC-in-out discussion what team could be available to us this weekend? I'd go with...

    1. Bent
    2. Cronin
    3. Furlong
    4. Douglas
    5. McCarthy
    6. Ryan
    7. Jennings
    8. Murphy
    9. Reddan
    10. Gopperth
    11. Kearney
    12. Reid
    13. McFadden
    14. Fanning
    15. Kirchner

    16. Byrne/Struass
    17. Dooley?
    18. Hagan
    19. Denton
    20. Leavy
    21. Boss/McGrath
    22. Madigan
    23. McGrath


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    #2920
    otbrugby
    Registered Users Posts: 189 ✭✭otbrugby


    1. Bent
    2. Cronin
    3. Furlong
    4. Douglas
    5. McCarthy
    6. Ryan
    7. Jennings
    8. Murphy
    9. Reddan
    10. Madigan
    11. Kearney
    12. Reid
    13. Fitzgerald, if fit
    14. Fanning
    15. Kirchner, if fit

    16. Byrne
    17. Dooley
    18. Hagan
    19. Denton
    20. Conan
    21. McGrath
    22. Gopperth
    23. McFadden

    But there is almost no chance this team will be the one MOC goes with.


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    #2921
    .ak
    Registered Users Posts: 30,308 Mod ✭✭✭✭.ak


    wise7 wrote: »
    Its like going for a job interview and being told you have no experience. How do young players with potential get experience? Does the b&I count for nothing? Why is the word of the head coach final on every aspect of player development in the entire squad/ Do other coaches have no input or say or influence? Is this juts a dictatorship?

    Maybe the other coaches feel the same? Frankly we have no idea why isn't being picked, because we're not privy to that info. Could be multiple different reasons.


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    #2922
    .ak
    Registered Users Posts: 30,308 Mod ✭✭✭✭.ak


    I forgot about Conan. I'd imagine he'll be involved alright. Madigan could easily start this one, but I don't think he's the man to lead us into the quins games so I'd rather we stuck with Gopps.

    LF is unmentionable at the moment. No pics of him training either.


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    #2923
    Quint2010
    Registered Users Posts: 5,178 ✭✭✭Quint2010


    .ak wrote: »
    Any examples of being poor? The odd mistake aside he's been pretty solid for us this season so far.

    He was terrible in the Leinster Munster match (kicking the ball far too much, too far and to no-one, pass intercepted for Munster try) and terrible again last Sunday (kick charged down directly leading to try (I think it was his kick anyway), kicks out on the full, missed drop goal attempt from in front of posts to win match). Plus he missed an easy enough kick against Glasgow which could have won us the match.

    So...the odd mistake?...His mind is elsewhere if you ask me.


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    #2924
    shuffol
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,883 ✭✭✭shuffol


    wise7 wrote: »
    I think his game management is mediocre. He is a good English Premiership mid-table 10 at best. He is not a European Premier Club 10.

    And yet he's a better ten than Madigan, so what does that say about him?


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    #2925
    otbrugby
    Registered Users Posts: 189 ✭✭otbrugby


    shuffol wrote: »
    And yet he's a better ten than Madigan, so what does that say about him?

    he is a better 10 than madigan when trying to implement MOC's system..

    Madigan's a decent 10, as is Gopperth neither are world beaters. Madigan deserves a chance at 10, something he hasnt been given in awhile by MOC.


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    #2926
    stephen_n
    Registered Users Posts: 12,920 ✭✭✭✭stephen_n


    Hagz wrote: »
    They were looking good but there was still the reality that two of the most experienced and by far the most influential players were moving on.

    I firmly believe that regardless of the coach, Leinster will reclaim their spot as the top province next season because Jonathan Sexton is returning.

    That's a rather damning indictment of Goperth and Madigan's abilities tbh.


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    #2927
    wise7
    Registered Users Posts: 485 ✭✭wise7


    Quint2010 wrote: »
    He was terrible in the Leinster Munster match (kicking the ball far too much, too far and to no-one, pass intercepted for Munster try) and terrible again last Sunday (kick charged down directly leading to try (I think it was his kick anyway), kicks out on the full, missed drop goal attempt from in front of posts to win match). Plus he missed an easy enough kick against Glasgow which could have won us the match.

    So...the odd mistake?...His mind is elsewhere if you ask me.
    Agreed. His kicking game is just not there. It really is crazy that we sit and wait for the World's best 10 to come home next season while this season lumbers on with with a stubborn coach without a credible gameplan who is probably close to losing the dressing room and who continues to play a very average 10 week in and week out.


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    #2928
    Pudsy33
    Registered Users Posts: 10,737 ✭✭✭✭Pudsy33


    shuffol wrote: »
    And yet he's a better ten than Madigan, so what does that say about him?

    He's really not. He's fine. Madigan can do everything he can and has more cutting edge. Jimmy has been a great servant and has pulled us out of the fire many times. I'd still rather Madigan played 10.


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    #2929
    otbrugby
    Registered Users Posts: 189 ✭✭otbrugby


    A game on saturday too, we are struggling for props. They will be using either AIL props such as Brian McGovern or the sub-academy props.
    If you want to watch a good brand of rugby I recommend you go along.


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    #2930
    Buer
    Registered Users Posts: 24,197 ✭✭✭✭Buer


    otbrugby wrote: »
    doesnt mean people can want him to go or complain that they wont sack him early.

    Indeed but it's going to become quite tedious given he's here for another 18 months at least. It's a non-runner. We may as well complain that we're not going to sign SBW for centre.


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    #2931
    awec
    Administrators Posts: 53,553 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    errlloyd wrote: »
    I dunno if people agree but I don't think moc's tactics or selection are the problem, they are playing like a team who lack confidence.

    I just think it's an atmosphere thing. They need to be motivated better.

    The fans need to come up with more songs.

    I reckon signing "Leinssttteerrr" to the tune of S Club Party by S Club 7 would be up there amongst the best ever sung at the RDS.

    Leinsterrrrr, gonna show you howwwww... there ain't no player like a Leinster player...

    Madigan's doing his dance,
    Reddan has us in a trance,
    Heaslips getting down on the floor,
    Healy's always offering more...
    Want to see Toner sing (on form),
    Want to see Kearney doing his thing
    We used to have Joe, he had the flow
    Get ready everybody 'cos here we go!

    Leinstterrrr....

    Repeat, repeat, repeat.


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    #2932
    .ak
    Registered Users Posts: 30,308 Mod ✭✭✭✭.ak


    wise7 wrote: »
    I think his game management is mediocre. He is a good English Premiership mid-table 10 at best. He is not a European Premier Club 10.

    You're probably right. But Madigan's game management is worse. Gopperth has been solid, and at times very good. That's all we can ask for, until Sexton arrives.


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    #2933
    .ak
    Registered Users Posts: 30,308 Mod ✭✭✭✭.ak


    awec wrote: »
    The fans need to come up with more songs.

    I reckon signing "Leinssttteerrr" to the tune of S Club Party by S Club 7 would be up there amongst the best ever sung at the RDS.

    Leinsterrrrr, gonna show you howwwww... there ain't no player like a Leinster player...

    Madigan's doing his dance,
    Reddan has us in a trance,
    Heaslips getting down on the floor,
    Healy's always offering more...
    Want to see Toner sing (on form),
    Want to see Kearney doing his thing
    We used to have Joe, he had the flow
    Get ready everybody 'cos here we go!

    Leinstterrrr....

    Repeat, repeat, repeat.

    Listen, you may get away with that panto crap up in Belfast, but down here we sing with one tone-deaf note in a collective drone ad nauseam. That's the way my father did it, and that's the way my son and his grandchild will do it!


    Leeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeinstuuuuurrrrr.......


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    #2934
    .ak
    Registered Users Posts: 30,308 Mod ✭✭✭✭.ak


    Quint2010 wrote: »
    He was terrible in the Leinster Munster match (kicking the ball far too much, too far and to no-one, pass intercepted for Munster try) and terrible again last Sunday (kick charged down directly leading to try (I think it was his kick anyway), kicks out on the full, missed drop goal attempt from in front of posts to win match). Plus he missed an easy enough kick against Glasgow which could have won us the match.

    So...the odd mistake?...His mind is elsewhere if you ask me.

    I could pick any 10 from any the provinces and pick up on those sort of errors.

    What do you expect, a completely error free season?


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    #2935
    otbrugby
    Registered Users Posts: 189 ✭✭otbrugby


    Buer wrote: »
    Indeed but it's going to become quite tedious given he's here for another 18 months at least. It's a non-runner. We may as well complain that we're not going to sign SBW for centre.

    if we as fans don't voice our concerns with how things are going who will?
    just because we are powerless doesnt mean we should ignore what we see happening in front of us.. if its as simple as MOC's here to stay deal with it.. well thats depressing..


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    #2936
    wise7
    Registered Users Posts: 485 ✭✭wise7


    .ak wrote: »
    You're probably right. But Madigan's game management is worse. Gopperth has been solid, and at times very good. That's all we can ask for, until Sexton arrives.
    If that is so that what have got to lose to try a young outhalf like Marsh? Why have talent below if it is not trusted to be at least tried?


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    #2937
    P.Walnuts
    Registered Users Posts: 4,759 ✭✭✭P.Walnuts


    How did Conan get on btw at the weekend?


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    #2938
    .ak
    Registered Users Posts: 30,308 Mod ✭✭✭✭.ak


    otbrugby wrote: »
    he is a better 10 than madigan when trying to implement MOC's system..

    Madigan's a decent 10, as is Gopperth neither are world beaters. Madigan deserves a chance at 10, something he hasnt been given in awhile by MOC.

    Why does he deserve a chance? He isn't a charity case. He had his chance last season and didn't grab it. He may have had his chance this season but it was hardly anyone's fault that Reid got injured.


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    #2939
    ssaye2
    Registered Users Posts: 4,632 ✭✭✭ssaye2


    P.Walnuts wrote: »
    How did Conan get on btw at the weekend?


    Good break and offload for Daves try,
    Bad mix up at back of scrum for their try

    Solid 6/10


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    #2940
    .ak
    Registered Users Posts: 30,308 Mod ✭✭✭✭.ak


    wise7 wrote: »
    If that is so that what have got to lose to try a young outhalf like Marsh? Why have talent below if it is not trusted to be at least tried?

    Do you think Marsh would be a better 10 than Gopperth or Madigan?


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    #2941
    Hagz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,257 ✭✭✭Hagz


    stephen_n wrote: »
    That's a rather damning indictment of Goperth and Madigan's abilities tbh.

    I think it is more a statement on the influence of Jonathan Sexton.

    Again, could Joe Schmidt have won a European Trophy without Sexton? Could he have won the 6nations without Sexton?

    I've said it before and I have no problem repeating it, Jonathan Sexton has had a far greater influence on Leinster and Ireland's success than Joe Schmidt has.


This discussion has been closed.
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