Formula 1 2014: Round 4 - Chinese Grand Prix

losthorizon · 20-04-2014 5:24pm

LIGHTNING wrote: »

Well that was a pretty boring race, very little happened.

Have to agree. I hope Bahrain wasnt a one off. At this stage we are depending on the Mercedes drivers fighting each other to make races interesting and when that does not happen things kind of go flat.

Although I thought that Mercedes although dominating were not as all powerful as other races. They seem to have been reeled in a small bit. If that was down to the cold weather or the nature of the track remains to be seen.

SnowDrifts · 20-04-2014 5:53pm

freestyla wrote: »

I love F1 2014 style! every race pure wheel to wheel stuff!

freestyla wrote: »

Free to express opinion OK but..

maybe you should switch channel to a ping-pong match if wanted more performance per minute or something :rolleyes:

Glad you enjoyed whatever race you were watching - it was a good job you didn't see the F1 race because that was a borefest. :pac:

Agree with the comments on here regarding Brundle being harsh on Massa regarding the collision at the start - definitely looked to me like Alonso turned in on him.

Thought Vettel showed his ass a bit giving out about Kobayashi unlapping himself - he was faster and perfectly entitled to do so.

Hopefully Spain has a more exciting race in store.

dloob · 20-04-2014 5:55pm

Bugatti wrote: »

Yeah it was Brazil 2002: http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2002_Brazilian_Grand_Prix

Although...

So I'm not sure why that regulation wouldn't be applied today

Different scenario today, it's not that the flag wasn't shown, it was shown too early.
The regulation is if the flag is shown too early the result will be from the end of the previous lap.

traecy1 · 20-04-2014 5:57pm

Hanalei wrote: »

Doesn't seem right in a way that Rosberg is still leading the championship, the mechanical failure for Hamilton in Australia is the difference between being 4 points behind Rosberg and potantially 28 points ahead of Rosberg. A 32 point swing!

Should three seconds and one first outweigh three firsts?

Does seem a bit strange alright that Hamilton is still only 2nd in the championship. I suppose consistency has to be rewarded. Didn't Keke Rosberg only win one race in 1982 when he won the championship. Of course Nico will need to win more than one this year, as at the moment DNFs look like the only thing that will stop this succession of Mercedes 1-2s.

Joeseph Balls · 20-04-2014 6:26pm

Frankie Lee wrote: »

I know that credit has to go to Mercedes for developing such an impressive car but they are ruining the entertainment with their dominance.

Red bull fan?:p

losthorizon · 20-04-2014 6:27pm

traecy1 wrote: »

Didn't Keke Rosberg only win one race in 1982 when he won the championship. Of course

Back then there was a huge number of DNFs and nobody won more than two races. Different times. I actually remember that season vaguely - I was 13.

Sadly a few drivers were killed as well.

Gillespy · 20-04-2014 8:41pm

They got away lightly here. Doesn't look great from Alonso, it makes it look worse than it was I think though.

christy c · 20-04-2014 9:56pm

Maldonado's opinion on Massa & Alonso:

freestyla · 20-04-2014 10:16pm

and the engine sound is sooo awwfuuu LOL come on haven't hear that yet today?? jeusus

_rebelkid · 20-04-2014 10:27pm

21-04-2014 1:00am

Gillespy wrote: »

You must be thankful Webber is finally out of F1 then, what a waste of space that guy was? Vettel has been exposed, these four races tell us more about him than his four championships on the bounce. Alonso is making a mockery of Kimi, no one is saying anything about that because Kimi is Kimi, he's a fan's favourite. Massa was lauded for ignoring team orders a few weeks ago, people are lining up to have a go at Seb for doing something similar today despite letting him through.

Meanwhile it's smooth sailing for our Lewis, under the old scoring system he would be leading now, right? Too many points for second place. Can he beat Seb's nine wins in a row?:)

Alonso has been used to a **** car for years now. Kimi has been driving within limits since he came back, Fernando has more experience with getting the best out of dogs.

21-04-2014 1:02am

Gillespy wrote: »

They got away lightly here. Doesn't look great from Alonso, it makes it look worse than it was I think though.

TBH Alonso simply didn't see him and turned into him. Not much fault on his part, easy mistake to make. But if it were one of several other drivers they'd deserve to be put down.

R00ster · 21-04-2014 3:21am

The gap between Hamilton & Rosberg is the same now as it would have been anyway with the old points scoring system: 34-30

andyman · 21-04-2014 5:00am

Lads, Nico Hulkenberg is 4th in the standings.

How much longer until a top team takes him on ffs.

Mike Litoris · 21-04-2014 8:33am

Deleted User wrote: »

TBH Alonso simply didn't see him and turned into him. Not much fault on his part, easy mistake to make. But if it were one of several other drivers they'd deserve to be put down.

I'd have to call it 50/50. Massa went for an ever decreasing gap and Alonso should have used his mirrors.

In fairness to Alonso, he didn't turn into Massa and kept the one trajectory while Massa kind of darted into the gap. That slowed down gif makes it look worse than it was.

Mike Litoris · 21-04-2014 8:47am

R00ster wrote: »

The gap between Hamilton & Rosberg is the same now as it would have been anyway with the old points scoring system: 34-30

...under the pre 2003 system it would be 30-28 to Lewis and previous to that system they'd be neck and neck on 27-27 with a percentage a drivers best races counting towards the championship.

Gillespy · 21-04-2014 9:01am

Deleted User wrote: »

Alonso has been used to a **** car for years now. Kimi has been driving within limits since he came back, Fernando has more experience with getting the best out of dogs.

Same excuse is being used with the RB drivers, Ricciardo probably thinks he won the lottery while Seb misses all the grip from last year.

R00ster wrote: »

The gap between Hamilton & Rosberg is the same now as it would have been anyway with the old points scoring system: 34-30

10,6,4 system would have Hamilton leading. There wasn't much wrong with that scoring method

lolie · 21-04-2014 11:08am

R00ster · 21-04-2014 12:51pm

Gillespy wrote: »

Same excuse is being used with the RB drivers, Ricciardo probably thinks he won the lottery while Seb misses all the grip from last year.

10,6,4 system would have Hamilton leading. There wasn't much wrong with that scoring method

There wasn't no, but I suppose reliability is so much better these days.
Saying that, last year the podiums were shared around between a lot of the drivers anyway and there would only be three drivers who wouldn't have scored points under the old system.
I'd like to see points for pole and fastest lap brought back. That would have Hamilton out in front

Hanalei · 21-04-2014 1:01pm

Gillespy wrote: »

Same excuse is being used with the RB drivers, Ricciardo probably thinks he won the lottery while Seb misses all the grip from last year.

10,6,4 system would have Hamilton leading. There wasn't much wrong with that scoring method

I preferred the 10-6-4 system myself but it couldn't be brought back now, wouldn't be right to cut points scorers from top 10 back to just top 6.

One system I liked was used by CART (Indy Car) up until it went bust. Top 12 scored points (20-16-14-12-10-8-6-5-4-3-2-1) and a point was awarded for pole and fastest lap.

traecy1 · 21-04-2014 1:35pm

andyman wrote: »

Lads, Nico Hulkenberg is 4th in the standings.

How much longer until a top team takes him on ffs.

Indeed, he always seems to overperform regardless of the car he has. Although to be fair the Force India with that Mercedes engine is probably in the top 4 or 5 this year.

SamAK · 21-04-2014 1:53pm

What is up with Kimi!?

Frank Bullitt · 22-04-2014 1:01am

H3llR4iser · 22-04-2014 11:50am

mrkiscool2 wrote: »

Never said anything about the team orders, I hate team orders. Think they ruining racing which is why I am liking Mercedes even more. Don't like Hamilton as a man but there is no denying he is a great driver. Vettel won 4 championships in a row because he had by far and away the best car. Now that he hasn't he is struggling. I've said it before that Vettel is not as good a driver as his 4 world championships would have you believe! If everyone had the same car he would be down in 5th or 6th every week!

Can be said of many multiple world champions - afterall, even Schumacher won most of his championships because he had "by far and away the best car"; And with no opponents whatsoever as his own team mate was relegated to be 2nd by contract. Yet, Vettel is the subject of an hatred I've never seen before. For reasons unknown, he's considered almost a "villain" - a thing I'm certain will cease the moment he puts his behind in the most popular car of the grid - a Ferrari.

As for the second point, "if everyone had the same car", it's quite simply the stupidest thing that can be said. If "everyone had the same car", there's no guarantee whatsoever that the guys at the front would be who we expect them to be; I'm impressed with the lack of understanding on the part of a lot of people watching F1. If the 2014 championship is proving anything, is that the characteristics of the car and how well it suits a driver are possibly the most important factor at play - depending on how the hypotetical "same car for everybody" behaves, Kobayashi or Bianchi might become the guys at the top.

Myrddin · 22-04-2014 12:22pm

H3llR4iser wrote: »

Can be said of many multiple world champions - afterall, even Schumacher won most of his championships because he had "by far and away the best car"; And with no opponents whatsoever as his own team mate was relegated to be 2nd by contract. Yet, Vettel is the subject of an hatred I've never seen before. For reasons unknown, he's considered almost a "villain" - a thing I'm certain will cease the moment he puts his behind in the most popular car of the grid - a Ferrari. .

I think while he had some haters in the past, most people were simply tired of him winning every race. That changed suddenly though after the multi-21 fiasco, the boo'ing on the podiums etc all started after that. So while he is a bit vilified today, personally I don't think that's because of his winning streak, & more so his attitude on track. (an attitude shared by many revered greats mind, so it is a bit contradictory)

H3llR4iser · 22-04-2014 12:46pm

Myrddin wrote: »

I think while he had some haters in the past, most people were simply tired of him winning every race. That changed suddenly though after the multi-21 fiasco, the boo'ing on the podiums etc all started after that. So while he is a bit vilified today, personally I don't think that's because of his winning streak, & more so his attitude on track. (an attitude shared by many revered greats mind, so it is a bit contradictory)

That's exactly it; Alonso's diva tantrums have been far worse than anybody else's in recent history, yet his awful "me me me me and f@{} the others" attitude is hailed and lauded as "highly aggressive" and the "mindset of a champion", even when he de facto undermines his team's morale.

Schumacher flatly refused to have an egalitarian team mate for his entire career, and anybody who drove alongside him had something along the lines of "you'll never get in Michael's way" written on the contract.

Prost, Senna, Mansell, Piquet, Lauda...no way any of these guys would have been happy with a "just stay second" order, and they were and are still revered exactly for that attitude.

Heck, in the 1950s it was even common for a team to almost literally sacrificate one driver for the benefit of their top guy, by making the unfortunate sod stop and hand over his car.

Yet, somehow only Vettel comes across as the villain...

lolie · 22-04-2014 1:28pm

SamAK wrote: »

What is up with Kimi!?

Raikkonen thinks F1 driving style hurt him during Chinese GP

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/113592

Brian_Zeluz · 22-04-2014 2:12pm

H3llR4iser wrote: »

Yet, somehow only Vettel comes across as the villain...

Possibly because those who dislike him do so for reasons other than his win at all costs attitude like you've said. I didn't like him right from the start because I can't stand the hypocrisy of portraying yourself as one thing to the media while being another. Schumacher and Senna were ruthless like Vettel but they never tried to hide it.

H3llR4iser · 22-04-2014 2:53pm

Brian_Zeluz wrote: »

Possibly because those who dislike him do so for reasons other than his win at all costs attitude like you've said. I didn't like him right from the start because I can't stand the hypocrisy of portraying yourself as one thing to the media while being another. Schumacher and Senna were ruthless like Vettel but they never tried to hide it.

How exactly? Outside of the cockpit, both Senna and Schumacher were (in the case of the second, hopefully still IS) genuinely likeable guys.

Piquet was a well-known prankster. Jackie Stewart essentially brought the concept of safety in F1. James Hunt...we all know; Hakkinen comes across as a soft spoken gentleman-type; Even those drivers historically seen as the "villain types", e.g. Prost and Lauda, had a lot of following.

But for them all, once the visor came down only one thing existed: winning, with almost no regards about the meanings to achieve it.

Vettel is no different: while not in the Red Bull's cockpit, he's just a 27 years old guy with a fondness for the Beatles, British culture in general and making impressions of Kimi Raikkonen. While driving, he transforms in a ruthless driving machine. I genuinely don't think anybody ever claimed otherwise.

As far as fans go however, I heard everything - including the fact that he apparently "doesn't get along with other drivers" and is "isolated", even when the post-race moments show Sebastian talking and joking with other drivers just fine, while a certain Spaniard is the one quite always sulking and staying on his own.

Quite honestly, I see the truth as follows: Vettel came along and stole the proverbial thunder from fan-favourites such as Alonso and Hamilton, and this is possibly his biggest guilt in the eyes of most...

Brian_Zeluz · 22-04-2014 5:12pm

H3llR4iser wrote: »

How exactly? Outside of the cockpit, both Senna and Schumacher were (in the case of the second, hopefully still IS) genuinely likeable guys.

Piquet was a well-known prankster. Jackie Stewart essentially brought the concept of safety in F1. James Hunt...we all know; Hakkinen comes across as a soft spoken gentleman-type; Even those drivers historically seen as the "villain types", e.g. Prost and Lauda, had a lot of following.

But for them all, once the visor came down only one thing existed: winning, with almost no regards about the meanings to achieve it.

Vettel is no different: while not in the Red Bull's cockpit, he's just a 27 years old guy with a fondness for the Beatles, British culture in general and making impressions of Kimi Raikkonen. While driving, he transforms in a ruthless driving machine. I genuinely don't think anybody ever claimed otherwise.

As far as fans go however, I heard everything - including the fact that he apparently "doesn't get along with other drivers" and is "isolated", even when the post-race moments show Sebastian talking and joking with other drivers just fine, while a certain Spaniard is the one quite always sulking and staying on his own.

Quite honestly, I see the truth as follows: Vettel came along and stole the proverbial thunder from fan-favourites such as Alonso and Hamilton, and this is possibly his biggest guilt in the eyes of most...

First off I agree with everything you've said above.

"How exactly?" The whole multi21 ordeal is probably the best example. If from the start Vettel came out and said he ignored the orders to win and would do it again (something I feel Schumacher or Senna would have done) then I could respect that but instead he said he was sorry and wished he hadn't then turned around later and said the opposite. It's the hypocrisy I can't take.

For me though if you want a really simple answer it's that I just do not like him despite his at times funny demeanour and his clearly evident skill. I understand that plenty of other fans don't share my opinion of him and I'm more than willing to agree to disagree with them.

Formula 1 2014: Round 4 - Chinese Grand Prix

Comments