leisure battery

joed571 · 26-01-2014 12:36pm #1

My leisure battery for camper is compeletly done. Where is the best place to get a new one. Looking to get camper back on road after winter

27-01-2014 2:20am

Not in Ireland

These are competitive by Irish standards.
http://www.batteriesdirect.ie/magento/index.php/leisure-batteries.html

27-01-2014 2:26am

http://www.tayna.co.uk/Leisure-Batteries-C45.html

Uk link, get it over there or take your chances having to ship a 30kg lead box back in the event of a returns claim.

joed571 · 28-01-2014 11:44pm

Sir Liamalot wrote: »

http://www.tayna.co.uk/Leisure-Batteries-C45.html

Uk link, get it over there or take your chances having to ship a 30kg lead box back in the event of a returns claim.

Thanks sir liamalot for the links, as usual my bad luck is in..
i need it next weekend for the galway rally and have inlaws coming from england by boat to visit the week after

niloc1951 · 29-01-2014 12:07am

Have a look HERE

Banner batteries, which are one of the few which actually do 'what it says on the tin' are widely available here.
Why not give Europower a call and they will tell you your nearest stockist.

moodrater · 29-01-2014 12:10am

joed571 wrote: »

Thanks sir liamalot for the links, as usual my bad luck is in..
i need it next weekend for the galway rally and have inlaws coming from england by boat to visit the week after

You could always borrow your car battery for the weekend just don't do the dog on it.

Halfords 100ah leisure battery is only €99 at the moment, it has lower cca than a lot of 100ah 'leisure' batteries which is good and if their weight estimation is accurate 29.8kg then its 30% heavier that most too. That points to decent semi traction like / heavy duty construction. They recently changed supplier from varta to yuasa for car batteries if the leisure battery is yuasa too it should be a quality thing. The manager may tell you the manufacturer. Shame the warranty is short but most leisure batteries die from sulfation and negligence which wouldn't be covered anyway. I'd want to verify that weight in person but if the figures add up I'd be chancing one myself.

http://www.halfords.ie/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_storeId_11101_catalogId_15551_productId_264265_langId_-1_categoryId_212435

Was going to suggest an energy bull myself. I just notices you're in donegal, if you're near letterkenny might be worth asking donagheys what they have then can be cheap for some things.

moodrater · 29-01-2014 10:49am

The 100Ah halfords leisure battery thats reduced from €159 to €99 appears to be the 110Ah varta hobby http://www.tayna.co.uk/813010-Varta-Hobby-Leisure-Battery-A28-P3641.html

Halfords used to sell it in black as 110Ah(20h) / 90Ah(5h) for €199.

And that hefty 29+kg seems to be acurate.

CJhaughey · 29-01-2014 10:59am

I don't think Varta are anywhere as good as they used to be, I can't speak for their leisure batteries but I was in a tyre and battery place the other day that had 2 pallets of Varta batteries going back under warranty. They are also changing from Varta to Yuasa.

moodrater · 29-01-2014 11:32am

CJhaughey wrote: »

I don't think Varta are anywhere as good as they used to be, I can't speak for their leisure batteries but I was in a tyre and battery place the other day that had 2 pallets of Varta batteries going back under warranty. They are also changing from Varta to Yuasa.

This battery is an old model though (assuming thats whats on the shelf when you go to collect it) the new varta 'professional' leisure batteries are high cca lightweight, low cycle starter jobbies.

The manager in halfords told me that they changed suppliers only because varta couldn't supply stop start batteries for many models and yuasa refused to supply them unless it got an exclusive contract. I'm sure they're probably using similar tactics elsewhere.

CJhaughey · 29-01-2014 12:29pm

moodrater wrote: »

This battery is an old model though (assuming thats whats on the shelf when you go to collect it) the new varta 'professional' leisure batteries are high cca lightweight, low cycle starter jobbies.

The manager in halfords told me that they changed suppliers only because varta couldn't supply stop start batteries for many models and yuasa refused to supply them unless it got an exclusive contract. I'm sure they're probably using similar tactics elsewhere.

Yes but two pallets of Varta batteries going back under warranty would make a person think?

joed571 · 30-01-2014 5:32pm

Thanks for all the replies folks. I got a 110ah one today in Donagheys for €89. It was the same as the one that was in it so happy enough.

moodrater · 30-01-2014 7:44pm

joed571 wrote: »

Thanks for all the replies folks. I got a 110ah one today in Donagheys for €89. It was the same as the one that was in it so happy enough.

Nice one they are great for some things, what make was it?

moodrater · 30-01-2014 7:56pm

CJhaughey wrote: »

Yes but two pallets of Varta batteries going back under warranty would make a person think?

Varta is just a label now varta silver = bosch silver = alphaline etc. so if you want to write off 'varta' you need to write off johnson controls which means probably 80% of batteries in europe. Batteries could be from germany, slovenia, china, korea, brazil etc. A bad batch of 063 batteries could easily account for those kind of returns. You never know what you're getting anymore or where its coming from or how its been changed since the last time you got one or since the lase review or batch. It may be a lump of ****e who knows but the spec and weight of the halfords one is more promising than the 1000cca 20kg 110ah so called leisure batteries sold under other names.

joed571 · 30-01-2014 9:01pm

moodrater wrote: »

Nice one they are great for some things, what make was it?

It was a wetline

niloc1951 · 31-01-2014 3:51pm

joed571 wrote: »

It was a wetline

Wetline is a brand supplied by Unipart. Unipart do not manufacture, they are a distribution company of bought in products.

The Wetline range of batteries are of unknown origin, probably the cheapest supplier which will give Unipart the biggest profit margin.

Personally I would recommend the purchase of a battery from a supplier/manufacturer who has at least a web presence which gives comprehensive specifications for its products. For example, Varta, Banner, Exide, Yuasa, to name just four.

€89 is real cheap for a 110 a/h battery, a premium one should cost at least double that price.
However it is probably good value if it is only for occasional use, never discharged below about 75% (not left go below about 12.2 volts when under constant load) and always fully charged immediately after use.
Such batteries can killed off quickly if subjected to frequent discharge below 12.1 volts, particularly so if left in that state for any length of time.

I have just replace my pair of Varta 95 a/h semi-traction batteries, which were original equipment, after eight years of heavy use

with a pair of Banner Energy Bull 115a/h

31-01-2014 6:54pm

Kudos on getting 8 years Niloc.

niloc1951 wrote: »

Personally I would recommend the purchase of a battery from a supplier/manufacturer who has at least a web presence which gives comprehensive specifications for its products. For example, Varta, Banner, Exide, Yuasa, to name just four.

Me too.

Good luck trying to find any useful practical information from Exide let alone comprehensive :rolleyes:.
Banner don't seem to provide much in the way of tech data either. Bosch are another reputable chief offender. Shame because if they did I'd give them more consideration. Have you got a recommended charge profile for yours? Bulk/absorption/float set points and temp. compensation rate?

niloc1951 · 31-01-2014 9:55pm

Sir Liamalot wrote: »

Kudos on getting 8 years Niloc.

Me too.

Good luck trying to find any useful practical information from Exide let alone comprehensive :rolleyes:.
Banner don't seem to provide much in the way of tech data either. Bosch are another reputable chief offender. Shame because if they did I'd give them more consideration. Have you got a recommended charge profile for yours? Bulk/absorption/float set points and temp. compensation rate?

Have a look HERE, it's quite educational as to what to look for in any battery purchase.

Take the 956 01 as an example.

The Capacity is listed as 80 (ah) at K20 so what does that mean

It means that the fully charged battery will be fully discharged after 20 hours of use.
Being rated at 80 amps that equates to having been discharged at a rate of 4 amps per hour after 20 hours it will have delivered up its 80 amps and be flat.

To complicate things the formula is not linear, so if for example the discharge rate is 8 amps per hour it won't last 10 hours (double the rate won't give half the time), it will in fact last quite a shorter time, about 8 hours.
It would therefore be an 8amp X 8hours battery, a 64 ah battery

By the same law Peukert Effect if the discharge rate is say 2 amps per hour it will last a lot longer than 40 hours (half the rate will give over double the time), about 50 hours
It would therefore be a 2amp X 50hours battery, a 100ah battery

So the ah rating marked on a battery without hourly rate of discharge used in the calculation by the manufacturer isn't worth Jack Sh1t when it come to knowing how the battery will perform and how much battery you are getting for your money,

Secondly the lack of a Cold Discharge EN (A) otherwise know as cranking power, an important figure for a battery designed for engine starting indicates that that particular battery is specially designed for leisure use and not for engine starting.

joed571 · 31-01-2014 10:34pm

The new battery is the same as the old which was in the camper when i bought it over four years ago and gets used at least once a month. So if i get another four years out of one that costs half the price of a good one im happy enough

01-02-2014 12:19am

niloc1951 wrote: »

Have a look HERE, it's quite educational as to what to look for in any battery purchase.

Charging requirements usually.
DOD vs cycle life graph.
De-rating for temperature graph.

They're not listed.
Nor is the technical guide very technical.

Alas.

Macspower · 01-02-2014 10:52am

I have 3 batteries in mine and 2 of them died during the year. Rotten Egg Smell..

these were the 2 newer ones and bought from Halfords but I did get 4 years from them. They are actually warped now that I look carfully at them.

In the meanwhile I just disconnected them and worked off the original battery which is 10 years old and still going. I'm going to replace them this year but I'm just going to run with 2 batteries as I think the 3 was overkill

moodrater · 02-02-2014 1:35am

Macspower wrote: »

I have 3 batteries in mine and 2 of them died during the year. Rotten Egg Smell..

these were the 2 newer ones and bought from Halfords but I did get 4 years from them. They are actually warped now that I look carfully at them.

In the meanwhile I just disconnected them and worked off the original battery which is 10 years old and still going. I'm going to replace them this year but I'm just going to run with 2 batteries as I think the 3 was overkill

60/70ah or 100/110ah? The 60/70ah battery is not a real leisure battery its identical to the standard spec 072 standard car battery in every way. Did you check electrolyte, and top up as necessary, whats your float voltage?

Aidan_M_M · 03-02-2014 10:27am

I wouldn't take a present of an Exide leisure battery unless it was going to the metal recyclers! I used have to replace then on brand new MHs.

moodrater · 03-02-2014 12:57pm

moodrater wrote: »

The 100Ah halfords leisure battery thats reduced from €159 to €99 appears to be the 110Ah varta hobby http://www.tayna.co.uk/813010-Varta-Hobby-Leisure-Battery-A28-P3641.html

Halfords used to sell it in black as 110Ah(20h) / 90Ah(5h) for €199.

And that hefty 29+kg seems to be acurate.

A great example of the moving of furniture that goes on in the battery world.

Halfords Leisure Battery:

Bosch L4 Leisure Battery:

Lucas LP663:

Varta Promotive:

"The original Varta Hobby batteries are still available it seems, under the Bosch branding and are the L4 type series"
http://www.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/view-profile.asp?action=view&uid=448

http://www.ebay.ie/itm/12V-110AH-LUCAS-663-Heavy-Duty-Lorry-Truck-Taxi-Marine-Boat-Leisure-Battery-/190646490066

kelbal · 19-03-2014 1:04am

Hi guys. I need to get a new battery myself. Was originally veering towards the Banner Energy Bull 115AH.....
http://www.batteriesdirect.ie/magento/index.php/leisure-batteries/banner-energy-bull-95901-12v-115ah.html

But after looking at the 100Ah Halfords one for €99, it has me tempted. Anyone bought it?

niloc1951 · 19-03-2014 3:15pm

kelbal wrote: »

Hi guys. I need to get a new battery myself. Was originally veering towards the Banner Energy Bull 115AH.....
http://www.batteriesdirect.ie/magento/index.php/leisure-batteries/banner-energy-bull-95901-12v-115ah.html

But after looking at the 100Ah Halfords one for €99, it has me tempted. Anyone bought it?

Banner are a major manufacturer/supplier of original equipment to various auto manufacturers and have come out well in tests carried out by The Caravan Club and other organisations into 'leisure batteries'.
http://www.caravanclub.co.uk/media/6552072/technical.pdf
http://www.practicalcaravan.com/forum/technical/leisure-battery-investigation-caravan-club

The Halfords one is definitely cheaper but quality costs

kelbal · 19-03-2014 4:06pm

niloc1951 wrote: »

Banner are a major manufacturer/supplier of original equipment to various auto manufacturers and have come out well in tests carried out by The Caravan Club and other organisations into 'leisure batteries'.
http://www.caravanclub.co.uk/media/6552072/technical.pdf
http://www.practicalcaravan.com/forum/technical/leisure-battery-investigation-caravan-club

The Halfords one is definitely cheaper but quality costs

Phoned Halfords, that €99 one is a Yuasa battery. They seem to have a decent reputation? Its probably not a dud thing ( like the exide ones Aidan mentioned) ??

20-03-2014 12:39am

niloc1951 wrote: »

http://www.caravanclub.co.uk/media/6552072/technical.pdf
http://www.practicalcaravan.com/forum/technical/leisure-battery-investigation-caravan-club

You always have the best battery porn Niloc

.

I recently operated a 2 ton scissor lift running on 4 x T-105s parallel series to give 450Ah @ 12v except one of the 6v's had fallen in battle and was engulfed in it's own gubbins. :eek:
So I could only speculate the scissor lift was operating with 300Ah at 9v and self-discharging like an open balloon.
Three hours operating no bother and back to docking station for decommissioning on my recommendation.
Forget camping batteries folks; 6v industry grade; scissorlifts, golf buggies, mobility equipment.

kelbal · 20-03-2014 2:36am

I was talking to a retailer today, and he was of the opinion that a battery which is the standard leisure battery size, roughly 35x18x23cm, is never in reality going to be more than about 90Ah. It may say 110 or 115, but in reality that won't be the case.
Is there any merit to what he says do you guys reckon?

thanks

20-03-2014 3:31am

Eh, you can do some things with plate structure, grid composition, electrolyte specific gravity, material purity etc..
I'd default to the if it's not heavy it's not lead school of thought.

The charging system is more important than batteries. Longer service life, self-discharge defeating etc.
Batteries are just a buffer not a source.

A bad or mediocre charging system/regime will not fully charge batteries and therefore cause permanent capacity loss, a bank could be down 50% capacity by charge cycle 200 from most generic chargers I look at, combined with climate, unless you float them between cycles.

20-03-2014 3:33am

CCA means many different things to many different companies too. It's not standardised to voltage min or temperature.

niloc1951 · 20-03-2014 11:26am

As Sir Liamalot says, 2 X 6 volt traction batteries are best, but a very expensive option only to be considered if long-term off grid use is contemplated combined with multiple cycles of very deep discharge.

For the ordinary punter the best investment for long term value are genuine leisure batteries of the flooded semi-traction construction type combined with a decent four or five step charging system.

Anything with engine starting capability is a different beast.

leisure battery

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