The Flying Scotsman

steamengine · 04-03-2013 9:08pm #1

A Railway Romance - Programme on BBC 2 tonight at 9:00 pm :

All about 4472 the famous loco 'Flying Scotsman' - where's my 'greasetop'

corktina · 04-03-2013 11:08pm

quite a good programme. A little sparse with the full history but sufficent for Joe Public really.

steamengine · 05-03-2013 12:16am

She burned more than coal - left three millionaires with burned pockets, maybe more. Still, a fine sight at speed even on the telly, and it must be an awesome experience for those lucky enough to have seen her live in steam.

LordSutch · 05-03-2013 12:23am

I was amazed to hear thet she even payed a vsit to the US back in the early 70s! I hope to take a jaunt on her some day, although any steam loco would be a treat for me. Last time I was on a steam train was on the Isle of Wight, where they have a loco running on a small section of track.

nice.

Judgement Day · 05-03-2013 12:43am

LordSutch wrote: »

I was amazed to hear thet she even payed a vsit to the US back in the early 70s! I hope to take a jaunt on her some day, although any steam loco would be a treat for me. Last time I was on a steam train was on the Isle of Wight, where they have a loco running on a small section of track.

nice.

You make it sound like Stradbally. It's a bit more substantial than that http://www.iwsteamrailway.co.uk/

LordSutch · 05-03-2013 12:45am

Judgement Day wrote: »

You make it sound like Stradbally. It's a bit more substantial than that http://www.iwsteamrailway.co.uk/

I don't know Stradbally, but we did enjoy the IOW steam railway very much, and I hope to go back again this/next summer.

corktina · 05-03-2013 9:44am

LordSutch wrote: »

I was amazed to hear thet she even payed a vsit to the US back in the early 70s! I hope to take a jaunt on her some day, although any steam loco would be a treat for me. Last time I was on a steam train was on the Isle of Wight, where they have a loco running on a small section of track.

nice.

hold on to your hat...they didnt mention that she toured Aus too!

UK steam railways are awesome and there are dozens of them

steamengine · 05-03-2013 11:14am

corktina wrote: »

hold on to your hat...they didnt mention that she toured Aus too!

UK steam railways are awesome and there are dozens of them

In the mid 1900's, train spotting was massive in the UK and was the 'in' hobby for the majority of school kids, in much the same way as 'playstations' are now. A lot of the preservation movements came into being via a minority of these spotters, who in later years, were driven enough to turn their hobby into reality.

Train spotting in Ireland was very much a minority activity and therefore a widespread interest base of enthusiasts never really developed.

There are approximately 140 preservation venues, mostly steam, in the UK from broad gauge down to narrow gauge, miniature gauge, plus museums. The population here North and South is approx. 10% of the UK's so we should have about 14 venues including at least 2 broad gauge steam railways if the same interest had have been here. Anyone whose interested though can readily partake on either the RPSI steam trips, Downpatrick, Stradbally etc.

dregin · 05-03-2013 11:58am

Speaking of restoration projects, I joined County Donegal Railway Restoration Ltd. yesterday.

My membership pack's on its way in the post, so I'm not too sure of what their current activities are.

Does anyone have any more up to date info on their work at Barnesmore Gap? Their site mentions 100 metres of track laid in 2009 and impending work to be done on the trackbed through the gap, but I can't see any info on anything happening since. I've a few heads together interested in getting our hands dirty, so hopefully there's actually something to do and it hasn't fallen off the radar completely

LordSutch · 05-03-2013 3:07pm

steamengine wrote: »

There are approximately 140 preservation venues, mostly steam, in the UK from broad gauge down to narrow gauge, miniature gauge, plus museums. The population here North and South is approx. 10% of the UK's so we should have about 14 venues including at least 2 broad gauge steam railways if the same interest had have been here. Anyone whose interested though can readily partake on either the RPSI steam trips, Downpatrick, Stradbally etc.

Well I presume Downpatrick is already included in the 140 UK venue stats, as part of the UK,
so then, how many Steam preservation venues then do we actually have here in the Republic?

Is it just Stradbally?

dregin · 05-03-2013 3:20pm

LordSutch wrote: »

Well I presume Downpatrick is already included in the 140 UK venue stats, as part of the UK,
so then, how many Steam preservation venues then do we actually have here in the Republic?

Is it just Stradbally?

Fintown in Donegal.

Does Oakfield Park in Raphoe count? http://www.oakfieldpark.com/

steamengine · 05-03-2013 4:16pm

LordSutch wrote: »

Well I presume Downpatrick is already included in the 140 UK venue stats, as part of the UK,
so then, how many Steam preservation venues then do we actually have here in the Republic?

Is it just Stradbally?

These are the only other steam venues that I am aware of in the Republic, The Model Engineers Society run a miniature railway at Marlay Park.

http://www.dublin.ie/websites/dsmee/

There is a steam museum in Straffan Co.Kildare which features live working static engines, including a triple expansion marine steam engine.

http://www.steam-museum.com/

And the West Clare railway !

http://www.westclarerailway.ie/

Losty Dublin · 05-03-2013 4:57pm

Off the top of my head and I include static, diesel, tourist and anything railwayish and substancial and which have been open or recently open to the general public.....

Fintown (Diesel)
Belturbet (Static)
Downpatrick (Steam and Diesel)
Stradbally, Laois (Steam and diesel)
Waterford and Suir (Diesel)
Clonakilty (Static)
Dunsandle, Galway (Static)
Moyasta (Steam and diesel)
Tralee (Steam and diesel, currently closed)
Hell's Kitchen, Castlerea (Static)
Bushmill/Giant Causeway (Steam)
Oakfield, Raphoe (Diesel)
County Donegal (Barnesmore and Donegal town, Static)
Headhunters, Enniskillen (Static)
Dromod (Steam and diesel)
RPSI, Whitehead (Steam and diesel)
IRRS (Static)

The Clonmacnoise BNM railway is closed as is the Foyle railway in Derry. There are numerous pictorial, model railways and museum exhibits in museums and in some railway stations. RPSI run mainline tours in Ireland so to some extent it took away the attraction and challenge of setting up a standard gauge line here.

Please feel free to add to the list if I've forgotten anything of note.

steamengine · 05-03-2013 8:35pm

steamengine wrote: »

A Railway Romance - Programme on BBC 2 tonight at 9:00 pm :

Repeats tonight at 11:50 pm !!!

101sean · 05-03-2013 10:00pm

Ok programme with some good archive footage, plenty of wrong facts though.

Also completely glossed over the fact that the rebuild at the NRM is massively over budget, late and there have been serious issues with it, they put the boiler back on and missed the cracks in the frame stretchers so it had to come apart again. There's feeling amongst some that it should be retired completely, despite several earlier rebuilds the loco had been run in to the ground.

I had a good look over it when it was at Southall in 2002, I was there surveying the depot. It had lumps cut out of the smokebox to allow tubes to be pulled then.

end of the road · 06-03-2013 8:54pm

Losty Dublin wrote: »

Fintown (Diesel)

Losty Dublin wrote: »

Stradbally, Laois (Steam and diesel)

Losty Dublin wrote: »

Waterford and Suir (Diesel)

Losty Dublin wrote: »

Tralee (Steam and diesel, currently closed)

Losty Dublin wrote: »

Oakfield, Raphoe (Diesel)

Losty Dublin wrote: »

Dromod (Steam and diesel)
what diesels have these places got?

Losty Dublin · 07-03-2013 12:19pm

end of the road wrote: »

what diesels have these places got?

Fintown has a BNM Ruston for PW trains while its passenger trains use a push pull arrangement with a Simplex 102T and ex CDR railcar 18.

Stradbally has a few as per this link

Waterford/Suir has a few new built Lister engine, an ex UK Siimplex that say duty on bogland lines and the chunnel; there may be some ex BNM there as well.

Tralee had another Chunnel veteran loco borrowed from Moyasta while it famously has ex T+D steam locomotive 5T; this loco is sadly awaiting a refit and I've had no news from it as of late and am welcome to updates. I'll be down there in May so a visit will be made.

Oakfield had a good link on their tech spec

http://www.oakfieldpark.com/techspec.pdf

Dromod has way too many BNM diesels to speak of; it's steam engine is away getting restored while the partially restored ex Guinness 22 is worth a look as well.

One other project I forgot about was the Lartigue in Listowel.

http://lartiguemonorail.com/index.php

Judgement Day · 07-03-2013 12:32pm

5T is in bits in the shed at Blennerville so you ain't going to see much. A certain Santa Claus figure is believed to have his eye on it.

corktina · 07-03-2013 12:35pm

Ah Blennerville, so much potential, all turned to dust it seems. Were it in the UK there would be a growing band of enthusiasts running it, is there really noone interested in running Preserved Railways in the Republic ? (proper ones I mean)

Losty Dublin · 07-03-2013 12:36pm

Judgement Day wrote: »

5T is in bits in the shed at Blennerville so you ain't going to see much. A certain Santa Claus figure is believed to have his eye on it.

If he made an bid they'd be "stone" mad to refuse him as he is good for "concrete" offers.

Judgement Day · 07-03-2013 1:38pm

But do they even own the loco. The receipt for payment from Edgar T.Mead is made out to JD - believe it or not!

who the fug · 07-03-2013 1:42pm

She was in Victoria station London one morning some years back , massive q during rush hour to have a look at her.

Losty Dublin · 07-03-2013 2:20pm

Judgement Day wrote: »

But do they even own the loco. The receipt for payment from Edgar T.Mead is made out to JD - believe it or not!

If it is then why did this JD chap allow it to go there? Or is this a PM job?

gobnaitolunacy · 07-03-2013 2:39pm

The mods must've gone to sleep.

My take on the FS, worthy to buy it and preserve it, but completely barking mad to lug over 90 tons of steel around the world and expect to make money (or break even) out of it.

Could have been worse...we could have had 4477 or 2795 in the NRM

corktina · 07-03-2013 2:44pm

i thibnk she mainly went abroad as there was nowhere left in the UK to run her. Things changed in 1971 when King George V was left back on the rails (I was there that day!) Since then of course, plenty of places came about, including a proper main line with double track (not been there yet but I must)

steamengine · 07-03-2013 4:45pm

gobnaitolunacy wrote: »

The mods must've gone to sleep.

My take on the FS, worthy to buy it and preserve it, but completely barking mad to lug over 90 tons of steel around the world and expect to make money (or break even) out of it.

Could have been worse...we could have had 4477 or 2795 in the NRM

:eek:

steamengine · 09-03-2013 11:16am

One poster on this LNER forum link suggests the only thing left of the original 'Flying Scotsman' is 'the space she occupied in time', as in the grandfather's brush riddle. Handles and heads replaced over time - is it still the same brush ?

Judgement Day · 09-03-2013 11:44am

I think (?) in the enthusiast world it's accepted as the genuine article if the frames are the original ones that the loco was laid down with. "Slieve Callan" at Moyasta and No.90 at Downpatrick being two cases in point.

MGWR · 28-03-2013 6:42pm

LordSutch wrote: »

I was amazed to hear thet she even payed a vsit to the US back in the early 70s! I hope to take a jaunt on her some day, although any steam loco would be a treat for me. Last time I was on a steam train was on the Isle of Wight, where they have a loco running on a small section of track.

nice.

The 4472 was in the USA from the very late 60s to the early 70s.

Here's a picture of when she was in Newark, New Jersey's Pennsylvania Station, from 15/10/1969. These platforms are the same ones that the Acela Express currently leaves from. Notice the additions that the American Assocation of Railroads required, including bell, electric headlight, cow catcher and AAR "knuckle" couplers, the last item primarily for coupling on to the GG-1 electric engine.

corktina · 28-03-2013 6:58pm

several of the vehicles which accompanied her have now been repatriated too...couple of Pullmans (Lydia and Isle of Thanet and observation car 14

The Flying Scotsman

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