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ESB Electric Ireland to increase prices by 14.8%

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    #32
    slimjimmc
    Registered Users Posts: 7,787 ✭✭✭slimjimmc


    Daroxtar wrote: »
    Airtricity are hiking prices too due to ....an increase in the price of wind??!!??
    latenia wrote: »
    It's nothing more than an organised extortion racket.


    http://www.independent.ie/business/irish/average-pay-and-pension-of-esb-workers-near-euro100000-2065160.html

    Must be an international one then

    Power NI increased 20%
    British Gas increase 16%
    http://www.ukpower.co.uk/home_energy/price_updates


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    #33
    msg11
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,572 ✭✭✭msg11


    15% rise. I think the goverment needs to lower the standing charge across such bills. The price of petrol is going to go threw the roof and then that stupid carbon tax is going to go up again.

    As for the wind farms? No body wants to look out there window and see one so they can't be built..


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    #34
    thewing
    Registered Users Posts: 661 ✭✭✭thewing


    jack presley wrote: »
    No, and they don't have to pay the USC either and they won't have to pay water rates or the house charge next year either. They all live like Kings.

    What a fantastic piece of fiction that is!!!


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    #35
    Crann na Beatha
    Registered Users Posts: 11,763 ✭✭✭✭Crann na Beatha


    This post has been deleted.


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    #36
    Wertz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11,909 ✭✭✭✭Wertz


    Oh, and in before the nuclear lobby show up...


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    #37
    msg11
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,572 ✭✭✭msg11


    Wertz wrote: »
    Oh, and in before the nuclear lobby show up...

    Well it's home grown energy. Sure if it blows up it blows up, we might as well have one. Cause if the one across the water blows up were just as ****ed.


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    #38
    suicide_circus
    Registered Users Posts: 19,802 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    Nulty wrote: »
    From wht I've heard, they needed to start putting up the prices last year. The price of energy has gone up across europe and the ESB are one of the last to raise their prices. They have been absorbing costs for a year. This is my cumulative knowledge...don't ask for sources!
    Surely this is the point of a semi state orginisation? The ESB get piles of tax dollars in order to allow them to absorb losses during hard times rather than. passing on extra charges to the public. But no. Johnny Taxpayer first subsidises through taxes and then pays extra in top of their usage bills and pays vat on the power they use and a fat charge on the bill and admin charges.........and all the while the average ESB employee gets almost 100k p/a....yep, sounds about right.


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    #39
    ilovesleep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,619 ✭✭✭ilovesleep


    I thought electricity prices across europe decreased during the past couple of years whereas ours remained the same or rose.


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    #40
    highgiant1985
    Registered Users Posts: 1,777 ✭✭✭highgiant1985


    thewing wrote: »
    What a fantastic piece of fiction that is!!!

    yeah i agree that is rubbish Bord Gais workers do pay the USC. Possibly the poster meant they don't pay the pension levy though? I'm unsure for sure but I suspect as a semi private company they do not pay the pension levy but I am open to correction.


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    #41
    Shenshen
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 9,453 Mod ✭✭✭✭Shenshen


    Adyx wrote: »
    While I don't disagree with your point, remember that this is Ireland and therefore there are fúck-all places to put a dam and when it comes to wind pretty much everyone is "not in my backyard".

    Since when is off-shore in anyone's backyard?
    Also, we tend to have sea around us on all sides, the French started building tidal power stations way back in the 70s...


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    #42
    Kivaro
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,105 ✭✭✭Kivaro


    But someone has to pay for the average ESB worker salary of €75,500 a year, which are worth €94,300 when generous pension contributions are included.

    Their own union rep called them 'spoilt', but hey it's Ireland, and no-one has the balls to stand up to this crap.


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    #43
    jack presley
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,687 ✭✭✭✭jack presley


    thewing wrote: »
    jack presley wrote: »
    No, and they don't have to pay the USC either and they won't have to pay water rates or the house charge next year either. They all live like Kings.

    What a fantastic piece of fiction that is!!!

    Of course it was a piece of fiction (I can't believe some people bought it). Don't believe everything you read whether it be on boards or the Irish independent


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    #44
    Fulton Crown
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,493 ✭✭✭Fulton Crown


    Spread wrote: »
    Have the ESB workers taken a hit across the cards like others?

    Not really....wasn't there reports in the Media sometime back that they actually got wage INCREASES.

    Wasn't it also discovered that these guys were also getting very substantial free lecky to their own homes. ?

    I moved from ESB to Airtricity not because of an expectation of substantial savings but because I remember when these greedy bast@rds held us all to ransome by constantly threatning strike action.

    Their CEO is also paid a really huge wedge which I prefer not to contribute to in these straitened times.

    The averageamount that the ESB worker trousers is 98K according to media reports...which means that anybody in a reasonably senior position or with long service is on a very substantial wedge.

    Wages and conditions are way out of kilter with European norms ...this should not have been allowed to happen.


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    #45
    jack presley
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,687 ✭✭✭✭jack presley


    Fulton Crown wrote: »
    Not really....wasn't there reports in the Media sometime back that they actually got wage INCREASES.

    Wasn't it also discovered that these guys were also getting very substantial free lecky to their own homes. ?

    I moved from ESB to Airtricity not because of an expectation of substantial savings but because I remember when these greedy bast@rds held us all to ransome by constantly threatning strike action.

    Their CEO is also paid a really huge wedge which I prefer not to contribute to in these straitened times.

    The averageamount that the ESB worker trousers is 98K according to media reports...which means that anybody in a reasonably senior position or with long service is on a very substantial wedge.

    Wages and conditions are way out of kilter with European norms ...this should not have been allowed to happen.

    You do realise that ESB still OWN all the network and carry out all the installations and repairs don't you? So regardless of which supplier you are with, you are still contributing 'in these straitened times'.

    I also love quotes that include phrases like "according to media reports" etc. It was in the media so it must be true? And I'm not specifically referring to ESB here. it's the same when people are complaining about the public sector or teachers or whoever the media's target is on that specific week. It was Bord Gais earlier on this week, ESB today and it'll probably back to the public sector next week. Actually Breakingnews.ie had a great story last week as well about some government department buying Ipads for a few members of staff. The comments section below the story was hilarious!


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    #46
    drdeadlift
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,189 ✭✭✭drdeadlift


    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056367326&page=2

    told yee this would happen


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    #47
    Manach
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 9,680 Mod ✭✭✭✭Manach


    So long as I can afford enough electricity to finish writing th


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    #48
    Fulton Crown
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,493 ✭✭✭Fulton Crown


    jack presley wrote: »
    You do realise that ESB still OWN all the network and carry out all the installations and repairs don't you? So regardless of which supplier you are with, you are still contributing 'in these straitened times'.

    I also love quotes that include phrases like "according to media reports" etc. It was in the media so it must be true? And I'm not specifically referring to ESB here. it's the same when people are complaining about the public sector or teachers or whoever the media's target is on that specific week. It was Bord Gais earlier on this week, ESB today and it'll probably back to the public sector next week. Actually Breakingnews.ie had a great story last week as well about some government department buying Ipads for a few members of staff. The comments section below the story was hilarious!

    Yes yes I do realise that ESB networks own the networks etc etc and of course I realise that some of my dosh will go to these "privildged and spoilt people " to quote their own Union Official.

    Now pal i do not work for the ESB nor do I care sufficiently about them to find out personally what the average wedge they trouser.

    But if a figure is quoted in the media and their is NO REBUTTAL from the company concerned ...then I think you can take it that there is some truth in it.....hmmmm ?

    You seem to have forgotten that it was the media that broke the banking scandal and the FAS scandal and the Nationwide scandal.

    Are you proposing that the Media do not investigate the public sector /catholic Church etc and let things be swept under tha carpet.

    Because that's what it sounds like....:confused:


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    #49
    Logical Fallacy
    Registered Users Posts: 5,933 ✭✭✭Logical Fallacy


    Jagle wrote: »
    over 40 years ago id say we realised that coal and oil and gas would run out.

    so because ESB didnt bother investing money into rewenable energy, dam, hydro, tidal, wind and continued to pump money into oil and gas now we all suffer..

    why dont esb begin to invest money into cheaper energy

    This has **** all to do with it. For the past however many years there has always been 40 more years of oil and gas left. We can currently estimate about 160 years left for coal.

    Because new ways to get at the oil and gas are always being developed area's that were considered unreachable no longer are...so it's always sitting around 40 years and will be for a long time.

    It has **** all to do with how the energy is generated and pretty much everything to do with ESB being saddled by a thousands pricks who do ****ing nothing, have huge wages that can't be cut and are pretty much impossible to fire.


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    #50
    gigino
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,350 ✭✭✭gigino


    If every business in the world paid their employees an average of 90k a year, like the ESB does, and gave huge pensions + perks, think how expensive everything would be. Shame on the ESB when the rest of us are struggling.


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    #51
    Fulton Crown
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,493 ✭✭✭Fulton Crown


    gigino wrote: »
    If every business in the world paid their employees an average of 90k a year, like the ESB does, and gave huge pensions + perks, think how expensive everything would be. Shame on the ESB when the rest of us are struggling.

    I fully agree poster...but there are a lot more than the ESB,,,a lot, lot more !


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    #52
    OPENROAD
    Registered Users Posts: 11,692 ✭✭✭✭OPENROAD


    gigino wrote: »
    If every business in the world paid their employees an average of 90k a year, like the ESB does, and gave huge pensions + perks, think how expensive everything would be. Shame on the ESB when the rest of us are struggling.

    This can't be true :eek: do we still see ourselves as a top 4 Premier league club ?


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    #53
    Zen65
    Registered Users Posts: 2,630 ✭✭✭Zen65


    Jagle wrote: »
    so because ESB didnt bother investing money into rewenable energy, dam, hydro, tidal, wind and continued to pump money into oil and gas now we all suffer..

    why dont esb begin to invest money into cheaper energy

    But since before the foundation of the Irish State ESB invested in Hydro energy. Hydro isn't cheap, as the capital cost of hydro stations is much higher than other forms of energy. I'm open to correction, but I understood that ESB had more renewable energy installations than any other company in Ireland??

    And as for "cheaper energy" .... up till recently that was gas closed-cycle-combustion turbines, and everyone who built new energy plants in this country built gas. When international gas prices went up all of the generation companies had to raise their prices.


    Z


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    #54
    Zen65
    Registered Users Posts: 2,630 ✭✭✭Zen65


    terradactyl84 wrote: »
    Doesn't our money as taxes fund this semi-state company? Surely then we have a say in how it's run?

    No, State-Commercial companies like ESB and BGE do not receive any money from the state. They are privately funded through the money markets (loans). We call them "State" companies because they are established by Statute (laws passed by the Irish State). They pay a dividend to the state, so taxpayers receive a net benefit from them.

    As for having a say as to how a company is run, it is illegal for the Board of any company to run their business in order to make a loss, so nobody could direct a State commercial company to operate at a loss. I'm absolutely sure that all of the State commercial companies could be more efficient, but in real terms they have been a far greater benefit to the people of the state than most private companies and I constantly marvel at threads here that castigate them without recognising the benefit we have all derived from them. The staff are probably over-paid, but I find that less objectionable than companies that earn large profits here and repatriate their profits elsewhere.


    Z


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    #55
    Fulton Crown
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,493 ✭✭✭Fulton Crown


    Zen65 wrote: »
    No, State-Commercial companies like ESB and BGE do not receive any money from the state. They are privately funded through the money markets (loans). We call them "State" companies because they are established by Statute (laws passed by the Irish State). They pay a dividend to the state, so taxpayers receive a net benefit from them.

    As for having a say as to how a company is run, it is illegal for the Board of any company to run their business in order to make a loss, so nobody could direct a State commercial company to operate at a loss. I'm absolutely sure that all of the State commercial companies could be more efficient, but in real terms they have been a far greater benefit to the people of the state than most private companies and I constantly marvel at threads here that castigate them without recognising the benefit we have all derived from them. The staff are probably over-paid, but I find that less objectionable than companies that earn large profits here and repatriate their profits elsewhere.
    Z

    So it's OK then for this priviledged cabal to be grossly overpaid ?

    That is the logic of your statement ?? :confused:


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    #56
    booboo88
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,107 ✭✭✭booboo88


    LighterGuy wrote: »
    From RTE news piece



    :( So 14.8% ...
    But ... apart from that Bord Gais was approved the price hike by 22% come october too ... ( link )

    Its bad isnt it? times are tough and the utility services raise prices?

    it would help if the ridiculously high paid muppets at the top took a pay cut


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    #57
    gk5000
    Registered Users Posts: 851 ✭✭✭gk5000


    Fulton Crown wrote: »
    So it's OK then for this priviledged cabal to be grossly overpaid ?

    My question is: Realistically how are we going to change this?
    Or how are we going to get back at them somehow? Will their chickens ever come home to roost?


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    #58
    Paparazzo
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,398 ✭✭✭Paparazzo


    Jagle wrote: »
    over 40 years ago id say we realised that coal and oil and gas would run out.

    so because ESB didnt bother investing money into rewenable energy, dam, hydro, tidal, wind and continued to pump money into oil and gas now we all suffer..

    why dont esb begin to invest money into cheaper energy

    Wind isn't cheap because it has to be backed up. Hydro and dam is the same thing and we have a good few of them anyway. Tidal costs a fortune too. The only cheaper energy option is nuclear.


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    #59
    Zen65
    Registered Users Posts: 2,630 ✭✭✭Zen65


    Fulton Crown wrote: »
    So it's OK then for this priviledged cabal to be grossly overpaid ?

    That is the logic of your statement ?? :confused:

    Absolutely not.

    Nobody should be over-paid for what they do: not ESB staff, not BGE staff, not surgeons, not Premier division footballers and not bankers. The wrongdoing is not altered by being in private or semi-state ownership.

    Overpaid ESB/BGE staff contribute to higher energy prices for everybody (but in truth payroll costs make up a relatively small percentage of the overall costs of electricity production & distribution). While not denying the speciality of the expertise that some of these staff have, it is inappropriate for them to earn such high income at the expense of all energy users.

    But the earnings of staff in such industry pales by comparison to the earnings of (e.g.) Senior Consultants in public hospitals. These consultants are largely funded through our taxes (so we pay for their services throughout our lives whether we need them or not). Their high earnings directly remove wealth from others in the community, making all commodities (including energy) less affordable. Their salaries very directly lead to a two-tier system of care for the public.

    Premier footballers earn huge incomes in what might be considered a fully "private" enterprise. Yet their earnings are sourced from direct charges (the cost of admission to football grounds) and indirect charges (advertising revenue, sponsorship). The companies who place advertisements (which is pretty much every company) in order to bring their products to market have to pay a higher rate for advertisements because so much money is directed to the footballers, hence all products include a higher cost because a very select few people earn such high fees. Television channels also incur these high costs (for broadcast rights, which are driven by player fees among other things) which drives up TV Licence fees and further contributes to advertising fees which further drives up product prices.

    The same is true of Hollywood actors, Rock singers, etc.

    My point originally was that while it is wrong for people in ESB/BGE/Aer Lingus/An Post to be over-paid, we should not single them out for criticism simply because they are under state ownership. All over-paid jobs result in wealth being diverted to a small privileged few in society. We certainly should not make untrue statements such as suggesting that these people are paid through our taxes.

    I'm not advocating a communist approach to the running of society either. I do believe in simply earning an honest day's pay for an honest day's work, and that everybody should earn enough to live in relative comfort, while also taking care of those in our communities who cannot care for themselves. The uniquely Irish response to having our economy destroyed by the reckless activities of private business has been to turn on those working for the state and castigate them for having good jobs. See how quickly our government opted to buy the now-worthless private companies with our monies, and then look at how well-run state-owned companies and assets could be given to the private sector for less than their actual value so that the bankers and private enterprise could once again embark on wild profiteering with these assets!!!!

    (((sigh))) - but of course this is the After Hours forum, so perhaps I should not think so deeply about the issues raised?


    Be at peace,


    Z


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    #60
    Anita Blow
    Registered Users Posts: 1,933 ✭✭✭Anita Blow


    suicide_circus wrote: »
    Surely this is the point of a semi state orginisation? The ESB get piles of tax dollars in order to allow them to absorb losses during hard times rather than. passing on extra charges to the public. But no. Johnny Taxpayer first subsidises through taxes and then pays extra in top of their usage bills and pays vat on the power they use and a fat charge on the bill and admin charges.........and all the while the average ESB employee gets almost 100k p/a....yep, sounds about right.
    The ESB doesnt receive any taxpayer money (and never has as far as i know)


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    #61
    jd1983
    Registered Users Posts: 186 ✭✭jd1983


    I sent the following email to Pat Rabbitte, I recommend other outraged consumers do the same to try and force action. The only emails I could find for Pat are pat.rabbitte@oireachtas.ie & minister.rabbitte@dcenr.gov.ie but maybe there are others.

    Hi Pat,

    I'm outraged as a consumer to hear that energy prices are being drastically increased in the midst of a recession. What makes this more outrageous is that two state owned companies are the dominant players in this market (ESB & Bord Gais) and yet their inefficient staff are being given incredible remuneration packages. Therefore the government and yourself the energy minister have the ability to influence these price changes.
    So I'd like to know what actions if any are taken to make ESB & Bord Gais more efficient which will in turn allow their prices (which are the highest in Eurpoe!) to decrease. Or is it a case that this government are more concerned in protecting the interests of a union backed spoilt minority of the population rather the majority who have to put up with these price hikes.
    As the energy minister I expect immediate action to be taken and this action to be communicated to the public. Otherwise the outburst against Pat Carey in this youtube clip (which inspired me at the time!) will be seen for what is really was. That is hot air and electioneering.

    Yours Faithfully,
    xxxxx

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zqx4E5tq1Bo

    http://www.independent.ie/national-news/esbs-euro75500-staff-spoilt-admits-union-chief-2859455.html


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