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Ahern demands apology from the GRA

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    #2
    Liam Byrne
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,163 ✭✭✭✭Liam Byrne


    Poly wrote: »
    “The Justice Minister also demanded an apology for the Irish people”]

    I don’t really need an apology from the GRA, however, I would like an apology from FF!
    FF and their cronies have destroyed this country.

    +1, and that's precisely what I was going to type based on the thread title.

    It's Ahern & Co that should be apologising to the GRA and the rest of us.


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    #3
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    eh no. FF had a little help in destroying the country - from the public service wanting massive pay rises for nothing, from developers building houses that nobody wanted, from people on crap wages who bought massively overpriced houses they couldn't afford, from people who bought many houses (like some gardai *cough*), from the banks, from the people who ran up huge debts on frivolous things like new cars and holidays.

    If anyone thinks it's right for the PROTECTORS of the laws of this country to be threatening corruption etc if they don't get their way, then I'm sorry but you are a fúcking tool. The Gardai are most certainly not supposed to go anywhere near politics.


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    #4
    Liam Byrne
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,163 ✭✭✭✭Liam Byrne


    Rojomcdojo wrote: »
    If anyone thinks it's right for the PROTECTORS of the laws of this country to be threatening corruption etc

    Do you think it's OK for the MAKERS to actually engage in corruption ?
    Rojomcdojo wrote: »
    then I'm sorry but you are a fúcking tool.

    :rolleyes:
    Rojomcdojo wrote: »
    The Gardai are most certainly not supposed to go anywhere near politics.

    The Gardai are meant to deal in facts and the truth, which the speech was.

    Anyway, the thread is specifically about the irony of Ahern demanding an apology on behalf of the Irish people, when his bunch of leeches haven't even acknowledged the damage they have done.

    It goes to show that Ahern and his party don't have a clue what real people are thinking, because - your concerns aside (and there is some validity in them) - most people would have agreed with the accusations in the speech, if not with the implied threat.


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    #5
    Rosahane
    Registered Users Posts: 1,399 ✭✭✭Rosahane


    It's Ahern who should apologise to the Irish people:mad:


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    #6
    Floppybits
    Registered Users Posts: 7,582 ✭✭✭Floppybits


    Damn right Ahern and his party should apologise to the people for what they have done to the country. Also remember Ahern behaviour when wee willie was lying through his teeth in the dail to save is ass. No it is Ahern who needs to apologise. As for the GRA, fair play to them for saying what is the truth, if only more people would maybe just maybe we might get some change for good in this country.

    Ugh I am just getting more and more at FF and their carry on. if I could have my way they would be marched out of the dail in sack cloth and ashes for what they have done.


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    #7
    Laminations
    Registered Users Posts: 4,693 ✭✭✭Laminations


    Rojomcdojo wrote: »
    eh no. FF had a little help in destroying the country - from the public service wanting massive pay rises for nothing,

    The government gave this with benchmarking
    Rojomcdojo wrote: »
    from developers building houses that nobody wanted,

    The government incentivised this and land was rezoned and planning permission given
    Rojomcdojo wrote: »
    from people on crap wages who bought massively overpriced houses they couldn't afford,

    The government encouraged this and failed to regulate lenders
    Rojomcdojo wrote: »
    from people who bought many houses (like some gardai *cough*), from the banks,

    The government gave tax breaks for this again encouraging this behaviour
    Rojomcdojo wrote: »
    from the people who ran up huge debts on frivolous things like new cars and holidays.

    These people are resppndible for their personal debts. The government allowed wreckless lending and borrowing develop into a bubble. People are now responsible for the debts of others as well as their own due to the guaranteeing of anglo and nationalisation of private wrongdoings.
    Rojomcdojo wrote: »
    If anyone thinks it's right for the PROTECTORS of the laws of this country to be threatening corruption etc if they don't get their way, then I'm sorry but you are a fúcking tool. The Gardai are most certainly not supposed to go anywhere near politics.

    The gardai are protectors of the law and must respect the institutions of the state. They have no obligation to protect or respect FF, in fact highlighting their treasonous acts should be within their remit. All the posters who want an apology from FF are right, Dermot Ahern has it the erong way round


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    #8
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    The government gave the people what they wanted. The Gardai should keep their mouths shut.


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    #9
    bryaner
    Registered Users Posts: 3,181 ✭✭✭bryaner


    Rojomcdojo wrote: »
    eh no. FF had a little help in destroying the country - from the public service wanting massive pay rises for nothing, from developers building houses that nobody wanted, from people on crap wages who bought massively overpriced houses they couldn't afford, from people who bought many houses (like some gardai *cough*), from the banks, from the people who ran up huge debts on frivolous things like new cars and holidays.

    If anyone thinks it's right for the PROTECTORS of the laws of this country to be threatening corruption etc if they don't get their way, then I'm sorry but you are a fúcking tool. The Gardai are most certainly not supposed to go anywhere near politics.

    There's always one!


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    #10
    anymore
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,672 ✭✭✭anymore


    Ahern and the GRA deserve each other; question is, do the Public deserve either the GRA or Ahern ?


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    #11
    mickstupp
    Registered Users Posts: 1,764 ✭✭✭mickstupp


    Rojomcdojo wrote: »
    The Gardai are most certainly not supposed to go anywhere near politics.
    Why not? Genuine question, it's something I don't understand.


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    #12
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    mickstupp wrote: »
    Why not? Genuine question, it's something I don't understand.

    We live in a sovereign democratic republic, the Gardai are there to uphold the laws which are passed by democratically elected governments - and that's it. Can you honestly see no problem with the upholders of the law interfering in politics?

    There's always one!

    One what? Sensible person?


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    #13
    mickstupp
    Registered Users Posts: 1,764 ✭✭✭mickstupp


    Rojomcdojo wrote: »
    We live in a sovereign democratic republic, the Gardai are there to uphold the laws which are passed by democratically elected governments - and that's it. Can you honestly see no problem with the upholders of the law interfering in politics?
    I don't quite see why they're not entitled to a political view. But then again, I've honestly never given it any thought, so I'm getting the impression there's something I'm missing here.


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    #14
    Laminations
    Registered Users Posts: 4,693 ✭✭✭Laminations


    Rojomcdojo wrote: »
    The government gave the people what they wanted.

    Yep and this is called bad governance so we are back to the government being to blame.

    Unfortunately theres always more than one, and they keep voting in these sheisters


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    #15
    anymore
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,672 ✭✭✭anymore


    Poly wrote: »
    “The Justice Minister also demanded an apology for the Irish people”

    http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/garda-commissioner-to-meet-gra-today-455869.html#ixzz0mZKePrAy

    I don’t really need an apology from the GRA, however, I would like an apology from FF!
    FF and their cronies have destroyed this country.
    Just out of curiosity, why did you not just post a thread looking for an apology from Ahern/FF ?


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    #16
    danman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 583 ✭✭✭danman


    I'll ask the same question I asked in the last thread that no one answered.

    Do you think a police force should interfer with the politics of a state?


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    #17
    Laminations
    Registered Users Posts: 4,693 ✭✭✭Laminations


    anymore wrote: »
    Just out of curiosity, why did you not just post a thread looking for an apology from Ahern/FF ?

    Well this way it shows how out pf touch with reality FF are. The party and their members/supporters love playing the victim card, thinking they are being punished and abused for no good reason by an uneducated public. The old lines of denial 'of course you want us gone, you're ABFF'. Demanding an apology for legitimate, even if strong, criticism while denying their own blame shows their arrogance.


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    #18
    Laminations
    Registered Users Posts: 4,693 ✭✭✭Laminations


    danman wrote: »
    I'll ask the same question I asked in the last thread that no one answered.

    Do you think a police force should interfer with the politics of a state?

    Can airing members unhappiness be considered interference? Its not like they are suggesting policy or planning a coup


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    #19
    danman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 583 ✭✭✭danman


    Laminations wrote: »
    Can airing members unhappiness be considered interference? Its not like they are suggesting policy or planning a coup

    They can air their greivencess quite easily without the sort of statement they made.
    They should always appear to be apolitical.

    The statement released was as far from apolitical as you you can get.
    It doesn't matter which party the statement was addressed towards, it shouldn't have been made.

    They might have spoken the truth, but that doesn't mean that THEY should have said it.

    If no one on this forum can understand this, you need to take a step back and think about it for a moment.


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    #20
    Liam Byrne
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,163 ✭✭✭✭Liam Byrne


    Rojomcdojo wrote: »
    The government gave the people what they wanted. The Gardai should keep their mouths shut.

    I certainly didn't want Anglo, NAMA or even FF, or overpriced houses and crap infrastructure or loads of "green" taxes and disincentives.....

    So do you want to rethink that ?


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    #21
    Liam Byrne
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,163 ✭✭✭✭Liam Byrne


    danman wrote: »
    They might have spoken the truth

    They didn't actually, because the speech was never made because Ahern didn't want to hear the truth.
    danman wrote: »
    .....but that doesn't mean that THEY should have said it.

    Who do you reckon should have said it ? And considering that Ahern refused to listen, who do you think could say it and have FF actually listen and take it on board ?
    danman wrote: »
    If no one on this forum can understand this, you need to take a step back and think about it for a moment.

    I've stepped back, and all I can see is that someone finally offered the truth and FF refused to listen, and they've been exposed.

    Fine by me.


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    #22
    PeterIanStaker
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,072 ✭✭✭PeterIanStaker


    GRA should cast a vote of No Confidence in Ahern. F**k him.


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    #23
    danman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 583 ✭✭✭danman


    Liam Byrne wrote: »
    They didn't actually, because the speech was never made because Ahern didn't want to hear the truth.



    Who do you reckon should have said it ? And considering that Ahern refused to listen, who do you think could say it and have FF actually listen and take it on board ?



    I've stepped back, and all I can see is that someone finally offered the truth and FF refused to listen, and they've been exposed.

    Fine by me.

    liam, take the blinkered hatred of FF glasses off for one minute.

    They released the speech prior to giving it, which is why Aherne didn't show up and the speech wasn't made. But it was in the public domain once it was released.

    They should never have said it. Any union or any other group can say this, but not the police force of the state. Is that so hard to understand.

    They are not a union, for obvious reasons.

    A police force should not interfer with the politics of a state.


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    #24
    Laminations
    Registered Users Posts: 4,693 ✭✭✭Laminations


    Please explain how its interference, and do you think the gardai should remain mute regardless of what a government does, either to them or the country?


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    #25
    danman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 583 ✭✭✭danman


    Laminations wrote: »
    Please explain how its interference, and do you think the gardai should remain mute regardless of what a government does, either to them or the country?

    Yes, it's as simple as that. You got in in one.
    Any other group can say whatever they like, the Guards are a different case entirely.

    If FF bring in a law that makes redheads with glasses illegal, it not the police forces right to question that law. They only uphold the law and arrest those red headed glasses wearers who are flounting this law.


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    #26
    mickstupp
    Registered Users Posts: 1,764 ✭✭✭mickstupp


    danman wrote: »
    If FF bring in a law that makes redheads with glasses illegal, it not the police forces right to question that law. They only uphold the law and arrest those red headed glasses wearers who are flounting this law.
    That kind of sounds like it's getting towards "Hey I was only following orders" territory. Government brings in a law, guards follow the law, no matter what? They're not allowed to have a view on the ethical ramifications of a law, or indeed the actions of law makers? They should just shut up and follow orders? I think I disagree.


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    #27
    Laminations
    Registered Users Posts: 4,693 ✭✭✭Laminations


    So the gardai are just following orders? They couldnt even object to Godwins law?


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    #28
    danman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 583 ✭✭✭danman


    mickstupp wrote: »
    That kind of sounds like it's getting towards "Hey I was only following orders" territory. Government brings in a law, guards follow the law, no matter what? They're not allowed to have a view on the ethical ramifications of a law, or indeed the actions of law makers? They should just shut up and follow orders? I think I disagree.

    that is their duty.
    My God, I can't even believe we're having this debate.


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    #29
    Laminations
    Registered Users Posts: 4,693 ✭✭✭Laminations


    danman wrote: »
    that is their duty.
    My God, I can't even believe we're having this debate.

    Wow in that case im amazed the government hasnt made it illegal to support the opposition. It would at least give them a fighting chance come next election although rounding up 75% of the population would be difficult and the gardai would want overtime but who are they to complain


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    #30
    mickstupp
    Registered Users Posts: 1,764 ✭✭✭mickstupp


    danman wrote: »
    that is their duty.
    My God, I can't even believe we're having this debate.
    I apologise. I'm not trying to be obtuse, I genuinely don't grasp your point of view. I've heard that it's their duty to not question the law, that they shouldn't be allowed interfere in politics, or indeed have a public opinion on political matters, but I don't understand the why of it. It doesn't make any sense to me that members of a democracy should not be permitted to question or comment on those in charge. It baffles my noggin.


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    #31
    Floppybits
    Registered Users Posts: 7,582 ✭✭✭Floppybits


    danman wrote: »
    Yes, it's as simple as that. You got in in one.
    Any other group can say whatever they like, the Guards are a different case entirely.

    If FF bring in a law that makes redheads with glasses illegal, it not the police forces right to question that law. They only uphold the law and arrest those red headed glasses wearers who are flounting this law.

    I remember from my history classes that something like this did happen around the 1930's or so in a place called Germany, basically no one in authority questioned the actions of the ruling party and this led to a war and death of millions and millions of people.

    Danman, No the Gardai should not just put up and shut up, what was in that speech was the truth like it or not and it is about time people did stand up and question the actions of the leading party in Government.


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