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Child Item

1000's of kids making their communion today

Kenny Bania

Are people just not aware that the Catholic Church molested 10's of 1000's of kids around the world and covered it up, or do they just not care?

Why are people cool with kids being molested, especially being parents themselves? And I believe they must be "cool" with it, otherwise why would they voluntarily choose to associate with this very same organisation.

And not only that, a few weeks before their communion, they send their kid into a box with a dirty old man who asks them about all the naught things they've been getting up to lately!! aka 'first confession'. They're 8 - they have nothing to confess to you, ya big weirdo FFS!

Am I the one that's crazy here? Is it okay to molest thousands of kids? People seem cool with it.

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TheExile1878

I have no issue with those who have no faith or who are unsure, BUT I do have a problem with pointless attacks on people's faith.

If you can't argue logically then wind your ****ing neck in.

Kenny Bania

TheExile1878 wrote: »

I have no issue with those who have no faith or who are unsure, BUT I do have a problem with pointless attacks on people's faith.

If you can't argue logically then wind your ****ing neck in.

I assume you're referring to One Eyed Jack & Absolam & Grover?

Because I backed up every statement I made with logic & facts & links to articles & stats. Still waiting for any of my claims to be disputed... anyone?

Do you know of a larger paedophile ring than the RCC?? C'mon - surely you do, because you wouldn't support the worlds largest ever paedophile ring, would you? Can you dispute my assertion??

Still waiting.

Absolam

Kenny Bania wrote: »

It's my assertion that the RCC is the largest worldwide paedophile ring ever discovered. Unless you know of another, I'm open to correction. Do you know of another? If so, just tell us - a link to an article - anything. Or you can avoid that question, which seems to be a knack of yours.

Sorry... I think you misread the word 'facts'. I said facts, not assertion. Facts please?

Kenny Bania wrote: »

And I see you're still avoiding the main question I've asked you 7 times now re your support for King Paedo himself - a simple question that you can't seem to answer.

This is the one that came after the one I asked you right? The one I said I'd be happy to move onto once you cleared up the whole pointing to a specific occasion where the Pope has defended anyone being a paedophile thing? How's that coming along?

Kenny Bania wrote: »

Because I backed up every statement I made with logic & facts & links to articles & stats. Still waiting for any of my claims to be disputed... anyone?

Oh! Me! Me! Me!
Can you point to a specific occasion where the Pope has defended anyone being a paedophile please?

And then maybe provide some facts (not CTs remember!) to support your assertion that the CC has been discovered to be a large paeodophile ring. After that we'll go on to how you've measured it's size in comparison to other large rings you appear to think you know about...

Kenny Bania

Absolam wrote: »

Sorry... I think you misread the word 'facts'. I said facts, not assertion. Facts please?

How about I claim that the RCC is the largest worldwide paedophile ring ever discovered - and you prove it isn't?

Isn't that how your religion works regarding the existence of a god?

So prove it isn't. Unless you want it to work the other way and the onus of proof is on both of us. You prove god, and I'll prove the RCC is the largest worldwide paedophile ring ever discovered.

Can you point to a specific occasion where the Pope has defended anyone being a paedophile please?

We've been over this 5 times now, little boy - try to process it. You're going around in circles - I keep answering you, you keep ignoring me & repeating a question I answered. The Pope provides pensions, housing, and private medical insurance to convicted paedophiles. Rather than disown them for their disgusting actions - he lets them know it's all cool - here's some cash. Retire here - use our saunas. Chill. Here's a pornhub voucher.

mach1982

OP you just cannot go calling all Priest or members a Religious order paedophiles. To honest it none yours , mine or the Pope if parents want their children to make their First Holy Communion .

The OP like a lot of people who attack the Church they are ignorant and can never back their arguments , the just like to shout down people and force their options on others.

In 1800s and even in last century it was social acceptable to marry off a girls at the tender age of 14 or younger in some aces, dose that make our ancestor evil . Things were different Ireland was different place the Church hand way too much power and influence that was not their fault the was fault of politicians and society they allowed it ,I'm not say that Priest molesting kids is ever social acceptable but people have got to stop look the the past with blinkers of the present.

The OP should shut up and mind their own business . Technical his insistence all Priests are and whole Church are peados is against the law , under the defamation act 2009 section 36 his insistence all Priests are and whole Church could classed as " publishes or utters blasphemous matter".

robindch

Kenny Bania wrote: »

It's my assertion that the RCC is the largest worldwide paedophile ring ever discovered. [...] your support for King Paedo himself [...]

TheExile1878 wrote: »

King Paedo? If you mean the Holy Father you're a disrespectful gob****e.

Folks - cut out the juvenile + stupid and/or offensive language or you'll be carded.

Kiwi in IE

mach1982 wrote: »

OP you just cannot go calling all Priest or members a Religious order paedophiles. To honest it none yours , mine or the Pope if parents want their children to make their First Holy Communion .

The OP like a lot of people who attack the Church they are ignorant and can never back their arguments , the just like to shout down people and force their options on others.

In 1800s and even in last century it was social acceptable to marry off a girls at the tender age of 14 or younger in some aces, dose that make our ancestor evil . Things were different Ireland was different place the Church hand way too much power and influence that was not their fault the was fault of politicians and society they allowed it ,I'm not say that Priest molesting kids is ever social acceptable but people have got to stop look the the past with blinkers of the present.

The OP should shut up and mind their own business . Technical his insistence all Priests are and whole Church are peados is against the law , under the defamation act 2009 section 36 his insistence all Priests are and whole Church could classed as " publishes or utters blasphemous matter".

I have never seen such a load of apologist nonsense as what I have highlighted above! You do know the timeframe of the sex abuse scandals don't you?

legocrazy505

mach1982 wrote: »

OP you just cannot go calling all Priest or members a Religious order paedophiles. To honest it none yours , mine or the Pope if parents want their children to make their First Holy Communion .

The OP like a lot of people who attack the Church they are ignorant and can never back their arguments , the just like to shout down people and force their options on others.

In 1800s and even in last century it was social acceptable to marry off a girls at the tender age of 14 or younger in some aces, dose that make our ancestor evil . Things were different Ireland was different place the Church hand way too much power and influence that was not their fault the was fault of politicians and society they allowed it ,I'm not say that Priest molesting kids is ever social acceptable but people have got to stop look the the past with blinkers of the present.

The OP should shut up and mind their own business . Technical his insistence all Priests are and whole Church are peados is against the law , under the defamation act 2009 section 36 his insistence all Priests are and whole Church could classed as " publishes or utters blasphemous matter".

Fair enough let's say generalising priests isn't the best point to make. That still doesn't mean we should just go "oh look this pedophile is still in priesthood, this is horrendous but I should shut up".

You claim a lot of people who attack the church are ignorant, you do know the same could be said about apologists. The people who are so loyal to their "truth" that anything even pedophiles within their organisation causes them to rush to the defense of them. These apologists should also be calling for reform and for these criminals to be put away.

It's different in the old days is a terrible excuse when most of the victims are living.... If the victim is alive there should be closure and justice should they seek it. You can't tell poor Tommy who's 45 that the abuse he suffered as a child was "ah sure nothing we can do about the past, shut up and live in the present". The criminals are living too, priests are supposed to be these community anchors for the parish, examples for their loyal subjects to follow. They are supposed to be living the life of Jesus. Some of them clearly aren't and you are proposing we do little to nothing because it was ok in the 1800s????

Also the whole blasphemy laws are backwards to begin with so don't get anyone started on those. This whole idea that religions are exclusive and immune from criticism is the leftovers of the Catholic Church's reign over Ireland that they still think they have when it suits them. I'll add to this that if the church can call gays unnatural, transgenders are "wicked in the eyes of God" then people are perfectly entitled to criticise and bash those views. Devout Christians, Muslims etc. can get away with saying anything and it doesn't break any law even if it's disgusting and backwards because it's their "belief". Yet criticise the belief and suddenly it's criminal.

Bristolscale7

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Kenny Bania

lol - it's what jesus would have wanted. Such a racket.... Glad I don't buy into it like a gullible sucker.

Bristolscale7

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Kenny Bania

Bristolscale7 wrote: »

Free shipping on large orders

It's the christian thing to do. God hates high shipping fees.

Absolam

Kenny Bania wrote: »

How about I claim that the RCC is the largest worldwide paedophile ring ever discovered - and you prove it isn't?

Nah, I think I'll stick with the usual standard on boards; you make the assertion you prove it.

Kenny Bania wrote: »

Isn't that how your religion works regarding the existence of a god?

Sounds like another unfounded assertion... how about you tell me why think you know how my religion works?

Kenny Bania wrote: »

So prove it isn't. Unless you want it to work the other way and the onus of proof is on both of us. You prove god, and I'll prove the RCC is the largest worldwide paedophile ring ever discovered.

No thanks; I'll stick with whoever makes the assertion proves it.

Kenny Bania wrote: »

We've been over this 5 times now, little boy - try to process it.

Is that me you're talking to? I don't think you know how old I am. Seriously, is there anything in your posts you haven't made up? Eve one statement with the most tenuous connection to reality?

Kenny Bania wrote: »

You're going around in circles - I keep answering you, you keep ignoring me & repeating a question I answered.

This sounds amazingly familiar... a poster who claims others are going in circles because he already answered a question that he never answered. So I guess I'll go with the familiar reply. If you answered, quote it.

Kenny Bania wrote: »

The Pope provides pensions, housing, and private medical insurance to convicted paedophiles. Rather than disown them for their disgusting actions - he lets them know it's all cool - here's some cash. Retire here - use our saunas. Chill. Here's a pornhub voucher.

And.... Can you point to a specific occasion where the Pope has defended anyone being a paedophile? That was the question, remember? Even though it's not the same as your original assertion, I don't think you can prove your next assertion that the Pope has provided any of those things to even one convicted paedophile either. Because we know, just like I said before, that the Pope is no more the Church than the President is the State, don't we?

Kenny Bania

It's amazing how much you type, whilst saying absolutely nothing.

Nonsense like this: "how about you tell me why think you know how my religion works?" Yeah ok.

Absolam

Kenny Bania wrote: »

It's amazing how much you type, whilst saying absolutely nothing.
Nonsense like this: "how about you tell me why think you know how my religion works?" Yeah ok.

So... no proof then? For any of it? It was all made up all along?

Hotblack Desiato

mach1982 wrote: »

Things were different Ireland was different place the Church hand way too much power and influence that was not their fault the was fault of politicians and society they allowed it

The RCC actively sought this power. They then chose to horribly abuse this power to commit serious crimes and get away with it. You can't blame anyone or anything else. Politicians and most people in society were terrified of the church.

I'm not say that Priest molesting kids is ever social acceptable but people have got to stop look the the past with blinkers of the present.

Sickening guff.

Kenny Bania

Absolam wrote: »

So... no proof then? For any of it? It was all made up all along?

You've avoided every single question I've asked - and I've answered yours, even though you keep saying I haven't.

Here's the proof you wanted - AGAIN:

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/frontline/article/pope-francis-defends-churchs-response-to-clergy-sex-abuse/
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/pope-francis-pedophiles-chile-juan-barros/
http://indiancountrytodaymedianetwork.com/2014/08/28/why-pope-francis-protecting-high-ranking-pedophile-156630
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/jul/10/pope-francis-sexual-abuse-victims-catholic-church
http://www.usnews.com/news/world/articles/2016-03-09/popes-abuse-accountability-tribunal-going-nowhere-fast
https://www.bostonglobe.com/ideas/2015/09/19/pope-francis-has-done-nothing-prevent-sex-abuse/q0ehzyO5MYw4GTKsgC9doM/story.html

6 different articles from 6 different independent news sources.

Now go ignore all of it again, and tell me how I still haven't answered your question.

Absolam

Kenny Bania wrote: »

You've avoided every single question I've asked - and I've answered yours, even though you keep saying I haven't.
Here's the proof you wanted - AGAIN:
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/frontline/article/pope-francis-defends-churchs-response-to-clergy-sex-abuse/
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/pope-francis-pedophiles-chile-juan-barros/
http://indiancountrytodaymedianetwork.com/2014/08/28/why-pope-francis-protecting-high-ranking-pedophile-156630
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/jul/10/pope-francis-sexual-abuse-victims-catholic-church
http://www.usnews.com/news/world/articles/2016-03-09/popes-abuse-accountability-tribunal-going-nowhere-fast
https://www.bostonglobe.com/ideas/2015/09/19/pope-francis-has-done-nothing-prevent-sex-abuse/q0ehzyO5MYw4GTKsgC9doM/story.html
6 different articles from 6 different independent news sources.
Now go ignore all of it again, and tell me how I still haven't answered your question.

Would you mind telling us if any of the articles that you've just linked (for the first time as far as I can see, I've no idea where that 'AGAIN' is coming from!) actually points to a specific occasion where the Pope has defended anyone being a paedophile? You'll understand I've no intention of reading a bunch of websites just because you link them; you'll need to actually point out where they specifically provide evidence that supports your assertion that the Pope has defended people being paedophiles.

In the meantime, can you show me where you answered the question "how about you tell me why think you know how my religion works?" that you were talking about? You say you've answered my questions (yet appear unable to quote yourself doing so); that's a pretty recent one that seems to have slipped through your net...

Kenny Bania

So sad to see a brainwashed apologist in action. Embarrassed for you.

mach1982

To make it clear I condemn any person be it religious or lay( and there been plenty of cases in this country where parents raped and abused their kids ) that abuse or molesting kids.

I’m dyslexic( 10 ,15 or even 20 society would have seen me as lazy and stupid), so some times , my mind goes fast than my hands can type and things I mean to say doesn't come out the way I want , to get my point across I have taken time to compose my thoughts which I did not do yesterday.

What really pissed me off ,was the OP they said any all Priest or anyone involved in religious life was a paedophile , I have relations who are in religious life, so when he call them paedophiles he was attacking my family and thousands of others .Also he seems to think it is business and to dictate to a parents how to raise their children just because their decision is an abomination in his eyes.

look the the past with blinkers of the present.

What I meant was that the way society dealt with problems was to brush it under carpet, it did not happen to them so was not their problem. That way of thinking only began to change in the last 10-15 years .Most of the people who reported their concerns were dismissed, the Priest carrying out the abuse had everyone wrapped around their little finger, Priests were seen as better than others because they were more the educated, men of God and in eyes of the society could do no wrong, society had put them on the highest plinth. It was very hard for a good Priest and there are a lot to be heard they were dismissed as trouble makers or as stupid little boys who should know their position and not question their superiors. More should of stood up but they were afraid, afraid the be kick out and lose their job. Keep your head down and do you job and not make any trouble that was the rule. The church should have vetted the people they were taking in and if there a report any inappropriate behaviour anf that person weather were the Pope or a Decon should have been be chucked out and reported to the Garuds. The Church made mistakes, they are trying to correct them now so that this will never happen again. The vast majority of people who are members of Catholic Church are good caring people.

That is all i am going say, I'm done, there no point arguing with igronat people that don't want to listen.

Kenny Bania

the OP they said any all Priest or anyone involved in religious life was a paedophile

Except I never said that at all. Why are you making stuff up?

The Church made mistakes, they are trying to correct them now

No they're not - they've done NOTHING to correct anything. What have the done exactly? Be specific.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/frontline/article/pope-francis-defends-churchs-response-to-clergy-sex-abuse/
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/pope-francis-pedophiles-chile-juan-barros/
http://indiancountrytodaymedianetwork.com/2014/08/28/why-pope-francis-protecting-high-ranking-pedophile-156630
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/jul/10/pope-francis-sexual-abuse-victims-catholic-church
http://www.usnews.com/news/world/articles/2016-03-09/popes-abuse-accountability-tribunal-going-nowhere-fast
https://www.bostonglobe.com/ideas/2015/09/19/pope-francis-has-done-nothing-prevent-sex-abuse/q0ehzyO5MYw4GTKsgC9doM/story.html

One eyed Jack

Kenny Bania wrote: »

Except I never said that at all. Why are you making stuff up?

Kenny you're hardly in any position to call people out for making stuff up, when you yourself post this kind of nonsense:

Kenny Bania wrote: »

Are people just not aware that the Catholic Church molested 10's of 1000's of kids around the world and covered it up, or do they just not care?

Why are people cool with kids being molested, especially being parents themselves? And I believe they must be "cool" with it, otherwise why would they voluntarily choose to associate with this very same organisation.

And not only that, a few weeks before their communion, they send their kid into a box with a dirty old man who asks them about all the naught things they've been getting up to lately!! aka 'first confession'. They're 8 - they have nothing to confess to you, ya big weirdo FFS!

Am I the one that's crazy here? Is it okay to molest thousands of kids? People seem cool with it.

Did you honestly expect that anyone should take that seriously?

That's the kind of thing I heard 20 odd years ago, and even then people didn't care about the fact that they were using real people's experiences and real people's suffering to slag off other people, to slag off the Church, to slag off religion, etc, etc.

If I even thought for a minute, that you were actually interested in having a serious conversation on the issues in Irish society and the role religion within Irish society, then I'd be more than interested in having that conversation with you.

But when you start off with an opening post which reminds me of the angry teenagers that used hang around outside the Church muttering "child molester" and "paedo" and all the rest of it, I couldn't take them seriously 20 odd years ago, and I'd find it very difficult to take your efforts seriously now. You haven't written anything that would change my opinion since.

Of course you can retort "Yeah well I can't take you seriously either you sky fairy believer" and thumb your nose and all the rest of it, but that's a very juvenile "I know you are, but what am I?" effort, reminiscent of what I used hear in junior infants. I really don't think we need regress to that level. I mean, you could, if you want to, but you'll get out of that conversation what you put in, and if your standard of discussion is poor, the standard of replies you'll get back will likely reflect your efforts.

mach1982

Was not going reply but you want proof fine

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pontifical_Commission_for_the_Protection_of_Minors

Can you not read your originally post you called the Roman Catholic Church a pedophile ring you called the Pope King Peado. I and millions of people are members there by your warped logic I and ever other member is a pedophile. Before you start shouting mouth you off remember the people you accusing are someone son daughter brother and sister.
You need learn to respect others.

The Church just a guide we can disagree over,nearly 66% did we have free will to make our minds up ourselves.

Now I wasted enough time on you I got more important things to do like be productive member of society.

Absolam

Kenny Bania wrote: »

So sad to see a brainwashed apologist in action. Embarrassed for you.

So... still no proof then? For any of it? It was all made up all along?

Kenny Bania wrote: »

Be specific.

Please. Do.

eviltwin

Kenny I can see where you are coming from. The church have left a terrible legacy in this country. The abuse scandal is an international disgrace, I am one of its survivors so I have no love for anything to do with the church or its people and I think the response to child sexual abuse has been disgraceful. There are many people out there who never got justice and who never will because of the actions of the church. I predict that in years to come in places like Africa and South America we will have another sex abuse scandal on a par with our own because so many of these people were moved.

However you cannot blame every single member of the church for that. I went to a funeral during the week in a Catholic church, my first time in a church in seven years. I don't see all those people as being culpable. I don't think I looked at the priest once and thought Paedophile. The people responsible are the ones who did the deeds and covered it up. Parents may have questions to answer about why they are joining a church that has such a bad reputation and one that is so vocally anti gay and anti women but that is for them to answer, they do not have to answer to us.

I understand your anger, its justified. But you are targeting the wrong people.

Bristolscale7

Absolam wrote: »

So... still no proof then? For any of it? It was all made up all along?

Boards history: the moment Absolam realized his religion was a sham.

Kenny Bania

eviltwin wrote: »

Parents may have questions to answer about why they are joining a church that has such a bad reputation and one that is so vocally anti gay and anti women but that is for them to answer, they do not have to answer to us.

That is all I asked in my first post - I wondered why people were okay being associated with such an organisation.

However you cannot blame every single member of the church for that

I never did - I said that the ones who commit the atrocities are guilty (obviously) but that there were also the ones who knew & did nothing about it - and some again that knew and covered it up. I called them complicit. I never blamed everyone. Newer priests probably never experienced any of it and weren't even around. I never blamed them.

One eyed Jack

Kenny Bania wrote: »

That is all I asked in my first post - I wondered why people were okay being associated with such an organisation.

No that isn't all you asked Kenny. You suggested people must be cool with child molesters.

It was always going to go downhill from there.

Kenny Bania

One eyed Jack wrote: »

No that isn't all you asked Kenny. You suggested people must be cool with child molesters.

Eh, that's the same thing. Why are people cool being associated with an organisation that has so many child molesters- that's what I asked. Well done for spotting it after 12 pages.

eviltwin

Kenny Bania wrote: »

Eh, that's the same thing. Why are people cool being associated with an organisation that has so many child molesters- that's what I asked. Well done for spotting it after 12 pages.

You kinda implied people who identify as Catholic and do all the associated stuff are condoning those actions by continuing to support it. I will be honest, I personally can't understand anyone who is under 80 and who considers themselves fairly open minded wanting anything to do with the organisation. Leaving all that negativity was a hugely liberating thing for me and I'm so glad my kids aren't exposed to it. But that's me. I don't expect anyone who does get something good from it to have to explain it or justify it. You sure won't get answers when you ask with such anger and hostility.