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Dairy Chit Chat- Please read Mod note in post #1

Timmaay

24/6/16

Recently we saw three posters close their accounts over disagreements in the dairy threads. While there is a lot of frustration and discontent with current milk prices and the processing industry, the recent tendency for dairy threads to become tit-for-tat arguments isn’t tolerable for those not involved.

All farming sectors go through difficult periods and during such times there may need to be changes in how threads are moderated.

Dairy threads are going to be more closely monitored and subject to stricter moderation for a while.

To that end we won’t tolerate baiting of posters, constantly reviving old arguments, posters with agendas or crusading for a cause.

Whether it’s discussion of the business or politics of the dairy or other sectors, we expect civility and tolerance toward each other and other opinions as diversity of opinion is needed as a source of different ways of looking at a situation.

"The aim of argument, or of discussion, should not be victory, but progress." - Joseph Joubert

Also please be aware that what you may post as light-hearted banter can be read totally differently by someone adversely affected by the subject matter and evoke a reaction you hadn’t intended.

The ‘Off-Season’ forum, and its anonymous posting, is available for anyone to chat about their situation.

The Mod Team.

10 away from the 10000 posts! Frazz I think it's fair to say this thread has been a success!

Indeed it was! First thread can be found here- http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056872221

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Comments

Dawggone

blackdog1 wrote: »

but if it comes in will it revert back to original quota or will 2015 be the base?. If 2015 was based I don't think a lot of people will be complaining.

Word is that it will be the original quota.

Why I'm saying this is there is a nice 140ha after coming on the market near me, and in applying for the permit to buy it they are looking for my original quota and my current production.

Muckit

God that roadway would be passig through some savage lamd!!

mf240

A Wexford chap would die of the hunger farming in Galway.

Did you take any pictures of rushes or turf to show your friends!!!!!!

mf240

The French can hang up there cows and buy cheap Irish milk for their cornflakes.

jaymla627

Dawggone wrote: »

Word is that it will be the original quota.

Why I'm saying this is there is a nice 140ha after coming on the market near me, and in applying for the permit to buy it they are looking for my original quota and my current production.

Would that be in the context of a litres/b litres thinking, if it's a stonewall original quota and implemented eu wide including Ireland it would bankrupt a lot of new entrants who might have no quota along with alot of established guys aswell who have doubled/trebled numbers....
Couldn't see a scenario like above getting implemented unless their was compensation schemes for "new milk"....
Then you have to take into account the money invested by co-ops in new steel, they'd have to be reimbursed aswell

Timmaay

jaymla627 wrote: »

Would that be in the context of a litres/b litres thinking, if it's a stonewall original quota and implemented eu wide including Ireland it would bankrupt a lot of new entrants who might have no quota along with alot of established guys aswell who have doubled/trebled numbers....
Couldn't see a scenario like above getting implemented unless their was compensation schemes for "new milk"....
Then you have to take into account the money invested by co-ops in new steel, they'd have to be reimbursed aswell

Sugar beet all over again ha?

Greengrass1

mf240 wrote: »

A Wexford chap would die of the hunger farming in Galway.

Did you take any pictures of rushes or turf to show your friends!!!!!!

I'll turn it into top notch grazing ground

keep going

Ah dg what are yo doing trying to do to fellas heads.we know theres going to be some messing done to suit the french but wait until the weather has cleared and the grass is growing

jaymla627

Timmaay wrote: »

Sugar beet all over again ha?

Funny thing is if Great Britain pull the plug and vote to leave the eu it will put the whole thing up in the air re cap funding and the fact that over 40% of our dairy produce is exported to the UK... I wonder could covney get enda to have a word with Cameron about buying some cheap quota sure they won't be needing it anyway

freedominacup

Dawggone wrote: »

Catherine Lascurettes of the IFA gave the report of the Irish situation.

The Dutch and the French are now saying that if you increase the herd by 50% you also increase environmental pollution by 50%...
Holland, France and Germany are saying that the 50% increase is at the expense of all EU dairy farmers and if Ireland isn't willing to cut supply other solutions will have to be found.

The sooner a government is formed the better. Ireland may need a strong Ag minister...

Don't shoot the messenger!

Dairy and beef are the things we do well. For all sorts of structural reasons not to mention climate we can't compete in other farm enterprises. I'll sign up to quotas etc on milk the day after we get a series of production caps and some Ireland specific funding and subsidies that will allow me to compete with continental farmers in areas like veg, grain, fresh flowers and whatever you're having yourself. I've always said quotas were protecting farmers in the rest of the eu from us not any outside country.

trixi2011

mf240 wrote: »

A Wexford chap would die of the hunger farming in Galway.

Did you take any pictures of rushes or turf to show your friends!!!!!!

when I was on ag collage a few year ago was telling the lads about wet summers in the west and a few old fellas making cocks of hay. had to produce pictures for them to believe me :eek:. Also used had a picture of a jd 6610 with a finger bar mower on it stuck in a tiny field in co letrim. lads from the east couldn't believe there was fields that small and most of them had never seem a fingerbar mower

trixi2011

Think there is a lot of scare mongering going on eu wide about Irelands increase in milk supply. When you look at it in litres bases a lot more countries producing a hell of a lot more milk now than Ireland. Ireland really is only a drop in the ocean compared to some of the bigger milk producing countries but seem to be a easy scape goat for all the dairy media

Dawggone

trixi2011 wrote: »

Think there is a lot of scare mongering going on eu wide about Irelands increase in milk supply. When you look at it in litres bases a lot more countries producing a hell of a lot more milk now than Ireland. Ireland really is only a drop in the ocean compared to some of the bigger milk producing countries but seem to be a easy scape goat for all the dairy media

+1.

The Irish aren't playing ball with the big bully boys and that's not liked.
We were good boys when we bailed out French and German banks...remember Sarkozy patting Enda on the head when he was best in class?

Dawggone

mf240 wrote: »

The French can hang up there cows and buy cheap Irish milk for their cornflakes.

Who'd make cheese?

Not Calvita mind.

Dawggone

keep going wrote: »

Ah dg what are yo doing trying to do to fellas heads.we know theres going to be some messing done to suit the french but wait until the weather has cleared and the grass is growing

Ok.
I'm only the messenger Kg.

Buford T. Justice XIX

trixi2011 wrote: »

Think there is a lot of scare mongering going on eu wide about Irelands increase in milk supply. When you look at it in litres bases a lot more countries producing a hell of a lot more milk now than Ireland. Ireland really is only a drop in the ocean compared to some of the bigger milk producing countries but seem to be a easy scape goat for all the dairy media

While our milk production is small overall, we have to export 90% of all our production so we are fairly large in terms of milk powder exporting countries and overall percentage of traded powder.

rangler1

Dawggone wrote: »

The squeaky wheel gets the grease Rangler...

Pity irish farmers don't realise that, could be a good time to get our demands added to some of the prominent rural independents cost of support to whoever

kowtow

Buford T. Justice V wrote: »

While our milk production is small overall, we have to export 90% of all our production so we are fairly large in terms of milk powder exporting countries and overall percentage of traded powder.

Exactly.

This isn't a row about the European milk price, it's a row about the global price of marginal milk.

Look around the world - every producing nation is blaming everybody except themselves, except the USA, which is just getting on with things more or less.

It's not Russia, it's not Europe, nor New Zealand alone - it's global overproduction which has not yet really slowed down (because commodities are cheap and expanding farms are desperate to spread fixed costs) and for which there is no demand (because commodities are in oversupply) and which there is no money to buy (because global demand is static at best - which in turn is making commodities cheaper).

The reintroduction of quota, by any other name, would take a little pressure off large liquid EU markets who produce little marginal milk.

It would make absolute chaos of Ireland - because our herds are inefficient on any nitrate based quota regime, and because virtually all our milk is marginal, added to which our carefully spun cost of production is now relatively more expensive compared to commodity driven intensive milk.

Hopefully EU politicians have the sense to realise that they can't buck the market - it must take care of itself - but if they don't, there must be real dangers for Ireland in any political kludge.

Midfield9

Out of interest has anyone any idea what the average farm quota was in France, Germany, holland, GB before they were scraped?

Dawggone

Midfield9 wrote: »

Out of interest has anyone any idea what the average farm quota was in France, Germany, holland, GB before they were scraped?

In 2010 the vast majority of French dairy farmers (78k) had a quota of 318k liters.

There are now 68k dairy farmers with an average herd of 55 cows (up from 47 cows in 2010).

Midfield9

Dawggone wrote: »

In 2010 the vast majority of French dairy farmers (78k) had a quota of 318k liters.

There are now 68k dairy farmers with an average herd of 55 cows (up from 47 cows in 2010).

Thanks, I'm surprised it's so low

RightTurnClyde

Midfield9 wrote: »

Thanks, I'm surprised it's so low

We've heard and seen so much about NZ, UK and US dairy herds that we'd be surprised about average herd size in most of continental Europe

freedominacup

Dawggone wrote: »

In 2010 the vast majority of French dairy farmers (78k) had a quota of 318k liters.

There are now 68k dairy farmers with an average herd of 55 cows (up from 47 cows in 2010).

So France has around the same milk production as NZ?

RightTurnClyde

Average EU dairy farm size
Attachment not found.
These figures are from 2009, interesting all the same

bogman_bass

Supprised the average herd size is so large in Slovakia, Czech Republic and Estonia

Dawggone

freedominacup wrote: »

So France has around the same milk production as NZ?

I think that France produces around 26 billion liters p.a.
That does not include milk for artisan use, Coop supply only.

I've no idea what the Kiwis supply but I'd assume it would be more than France as regards litres, but France would/should be way ahead regarding value of product/revenue.

Dawggone

RightTurnClyde wrote: »

We've heard and seen so much about NZ, UK and US dairy herds that we'd be surprised about average herd size in most of continental Europe

I can only speak of France Clyde.
Ireland and France traditionally had very close ties because of farm/ herd size.

The Irish have got the message with the new world market scenario...get bigger or get out. The French haven't.
I listened to a dairy farmer from Brittany this morning bitching and moaning about how he can't make ends meet now and in the late 90's he was comfortable enough to put his children through Uni.

kevthegaff

Surprised ireland have lowest labour per cow, thought with scandanavias/dutch with highly mechanised systems would have more cows per man. I think the typical dairy farmer these days is essentially a slave.

bogman_bass

kevthegaff wrote: »

Surprised ireland have lowest labour per cow, thought with scandanavias/dutch with highly mechanised systems would have more cows per man. I think the typical dairy farmer these days is essentially a slave.

Scandinavians and Dutch are intensive indoor systems. indoors = work

kowtow

kevthegaff wrote: »

Surprised ireland have lowest labour per cow, thought with scandanavias/dutch with highly mechanised systems would have more cows per man. I think the typical dairy farmer these days is essentially a slave.

think it's labour per farm not per cow?

ie.

Ireland = 1 man = 36.25 cows = 185 tonnes milk
UK = 1 man = 45.7 cows = 327 tonnes milk approximately

I could be reading it wrong!

Interesting figures though, shows up a lot which per litre costs disguise.