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Playstation VR Discussion Thread

gerrybbadd

Sony are currently on stage at GDC 2016 and have confirmed PSVR for release in October this year. Cost is €399/$399/£349

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FAILSAFE 00

It's actually a risky buy. Sony have a history of abandoning products that don't sell well or get traction.

It's closer to €500 when adding the mandatory camera and the optional move controllers.

It's a bit too much on a closed system. What if it doesn't sell well. Are devs going even bother going to the extra hassle of making games for it if millions of owners don't even use one.

johnny_ultimate

What if Oculus Rift or Vive fail to sell? A homebrew and independent scene will struggle to maintain interest in VR as a platform if the mainstream market fails to take notice. All virtual reality is currently a risk, for players, developers and the technology makers alike - a new technology that not only requires a sizable investment, but requires a major culture shift before audiences get fully on board with it.

There's no doubt whatsoever anybody who wants the best VR experience is better going with the PC options. However, there's also no doubt the Playstation VR is an essential play for the wider adoption of virtual reality. Even with a camera, you're looking at a price several hundred euro lower than its competitors, with a much, much lower priced machine needed to run it in the first place (the €1000+ PC I bought last year is just about VR-ready - PC VR is currently effectively out of reach of all but enthusiasts). Compromises will have to be made to graphical fidelity to ensure the mandatory smooth frame rates given the PS4's limited capacities. But this, more than the Vive or Oculus Rift, is the big gambit to see whether VR is always likely to be a niche market (at least until the equipment is substantially cheaper) or whether it can translate to something bigger.

Captain Chaos

Sony should just go and do what MS are strongly considering and release a major hardware refresh of the current consoles. Re release the PS4 and XB1 in 12 months with double the power they currently have and have all the current games run as is or better.

The consoles are clearly not powerful enough to last the next 6-7 years of projected life. They appear to me maxed out already and do not seem to have the gains that was made with the last gen in them.

They should have held VR back until they had a much more powerful console on the market. The 18ms response time on this head set is bad, it should be at least half that. They are capped by a relatively weak console for VR.

Just imo.

OhHiMark

Captain Chaos wrote: »

Sony should just go and do what MS are strongly considering and release a major hardware refresh of the current consoles. Re release the PS4 and XB1 in 12 months with double the power they currently have and have all the current games run as is or better.

The consoles are clearly not powerful enough to last the next 6-7 years of projected life. They appear to me maxed out already and do not seem to have the gains that was made with the last gen in them.

They should have held VR back until they had a much more powerful console on the market. The 18ms response time on this head set is bad, it should be at least half that. They are capped by a relatively weak console for VR.

Just imo.

What are the response times on the other VR units?

Thargor

Releasing a new version of the same console would be suicide, nobody would buy it...

Oafley Jones

Captain Chaos wrote: »

Sony should just go and do what MS are strongly considering and release a major hardware refresh of the current consoles. Re release the PS4 and XB1 in 12 months with double the power they currently have and have all the current games run as is or better.

I still think this is a crazy idea. I just see problem after problem with it as regards the required technical solutions or simply from a marketing point of view. Why fracture the user base and introduce potential confusion where it's not needed. I wonder how much longer MS will stick with Xbox. Will they sell it off, or will Nadella simply absorb into PC/ a cloud platform. Xbox doesn't seem to align with his vision for MS. Sony (badly) need the money from hardware sales and the upgrade policy would carry an enormous risk from them.

Oafley Jones

Thargor wrote: »

Releasing a new version of the same console would be suicide, nobody would buy it...

What CaptainChaos is referring to would also include a potential upgrade box for your current machine. So, you'd either buy the XBO 1.5 as a complete unit or have an attachment that would upgrade your original XBO to the same power. They'd all run the same games, but the 1.5 would have more bells and whistles. It's seems reasonable but the reality is kinda idiotic.

I talked about confusion, Nintendo couldn't get people to buy a whole new machine because they failed to understand that the WiiU wasn't just an upgrade. Then you'd be dealing with the "it's good enough" demographic. People who'd be forced to buy the latest machine might just settle for an inferior version on the base console.

johnny_ultimate

Captain Chaos wrote: »

They should have held VR back until they had a much more powerful console on the market.

Unrealistic, unfortunately. VR is happening, well, right now, and I can easily see why Sony felt the need to get this out there ASAP. Wait and you risk the market being occupied or taken over by somebody else. A PS5 is a good while away yet, so who knows what could have happened in the interim.

On the plus side, there's no reason P-VR won't be compatible with whatever comes next.

Doge

Here's a nice review of PSVR and even a link to a YouTube video of the reviewers brother playing it so you know it's legit:

https://m.reddit.com/r/PS4/comments/3vy9dy/i_spent_3_hours_in_the_playstation_vr_at_psx_here/

In anticipation I picked up 2 PS Moves in CEX today for 8 quid each just in case I decide to take the plunge down the line.

I think PlayStation are onto a winner personally, they're ticking all the right boxes for mass market VR so far, and the pre Christmas release is very smart and gives developers more time to finish content.

My plan is to is maybe buy one, and wait year or a few to invest in a PC based system when it becomes more affordable and hardware has caught up with the requirements.

This is certainly looking like the best bet for entry level VR though.

Oafley Jones

Was there any mention of No Man's Sky? I seem to remember speculation that this was going to be PSVR's killer app. Always seemed like an huge ask of the hardware to me.

Otacon

Mine is ordered from Amazon. It should arrive on launch day as I was in early enough. Already have the camera and Move controllers.

So far, Battlezone and EVE Valkyrie seem like the games to get. Hopefully Golem will be good too.

Oafley Jones

Otacon wrote: »

Mine is ordered from Amazon. It should arrive on launch day as I was in early enough. Already have the camera and Move controllers.

So far, Battlezone and EVE Valkyrie seem like the games to get. Hopefully Golem will be good too.

Do they keep a hold of the amount on your card until shipping? I'm tempted, but super broke atm.

Benzino

I haven't tried VR yet so this would be a good entry point, I've been debating getting an Xbox One over the last year, but think I'll invest in this instead (looking forward to seeing more Hololens though).

I think the big difference between this "peripheral" over other peripherals is that VR is happening on PC now too, so anybody making a PC VR game will likely port it over to PS4 too, and vice versa to get as many users of the initial small market as possible. As has been mentioned, it's getting really favourable responses from people who have tried all the VR systems.

LookingFor

Captain Chaos wrote: »

They should have held VR back until they had a much more powerful console on the market. The 18ms response time on this head set is bad, it should be at least half that.

Why do you think that's bad?

I'm not sure of any headset out there offering a response time sub-9ms!

The target offered by Oculus is sub-20ms, in order not to notice the latency. Vive has the same target. Indeed PSVR may technically have the lowest latency of the three main solutions so far - the 120hz refresh rate of the screen is unique to it and might be responsible for that.

In terms of PS4's power - it's a lot more powerful than the phones serving Gear VR content. Although I know it's not the same thing as seeing things through a VR set, some of the games they've shown at GDC look great in videos.

Xenji

Oafley Jones wrote: »

Do they keep a hold of the amount on your card until shipping? I'm tempted, but super broke atm.

They take out the money as it is being prepared for dispatch, no holds on your card.

Otacon

Oafley Jones wrote: »

Do they keep a hold of the amount on your card until shipping? I'm tempted, but super broke atm.

Xenji wrote: »

They take out the money as it is being prepared for dispatch, no holds on your card.

What Xenji said

Oafley Jones

Thanks guys. Just preordered.

wandatowell

Pre-ordered this morning with in GS.

400 quid ain't a bad price. Was thinking about waiting but I figured why bother.

tok9

Captain Chaos wrote: »

Sony should just go and do what MS are strongly considering and release a major hardware refresh of the current consoles. Re release the PS4 and XB1 in 12 months with double the power they currently have and have all the current games run as is or better.

This is fantasy stuff. The ps4 is 350 at retail now, if they were to "double the power" you'd be paying at least another 150-200 euro on that. Never mind that it splits the audience base.

Captain Chaos wrote: »

The consoles are clearly not powerful enough to last the next 6-7 years of projected life. They appear to me maxed out already and do not seem to have the gains that was made with the last gen in them.

I never really understand what this means. Couldn't you have said the same thing about the last generation of games. We're about to get the likes of Uncharted 4 and Quantum Break which both visually look phenomenal.

We could honestly have consoles like high end PCs and we'd still have the same argument saying they are not powerful enough.

Sounds like you are looking for a PC because the console market won't be the one with the best specs.

nocoverart

tok9 wrote: »

This is fantasy stuff. The ps4 is 350 at retail now, if they were to "double the power" you'd be paying at least another 150-200 euro on that. Never mind that it splits the audience base.

I never really understand what this means. Couldn't you have said the same thing about the last generation of games. We're about to get the likes of Uncharted 4 and Quantum Break which both visually look phenomenal.

We could honestly have consoles like high end PCs and we'd still have the same argument saying they are not powerful enough.

Sounds like you are looking for a PC because the console market won't be the one with the best specs.

Fooking hell man, you talk way too much sense for the interweb.

Captain Chaos

tok9 wrote: »

This is fantasy stuff. The ps4 is 350 at retail now, if they were to "double the power" you'd be paying at least another 150-200 euro on that. Never mind that it splits the audience base.
.

The PS4 was 400 at launch and Sony were breaking even on that, it's had a hardware revision and its cheaper to make now so the price has changed to reflect that but their profit margin has shot up too.

In the mean time of the past 2 years parts have dropped in price as new tech becomes main stream. A PS4 at €400 today could wipe the floor with the current PS4s.

You can double the RAM, HDD, new generation GPU chipset and up the CPU clock speed and keep the same price point. Old tech drops in price as new tech is released.

It's the reason MS are really considering it for the XB1.

I'm just saying if you are going to bother to do VR at all why handicap yourself doing it on a platform that is not powerful enough for it. Personally I feel they should hold off on VR until PS5 and do it right instead of having tech demo games. It's like what happened Kinect, that could do head tracking for games but no game developers bothered to use it. It could have performed like Track IR5 does for the PC and took fps, racing and flight sim games to next level on consoles but the console developers stayed at the lowest common denominator.

OhHiMark

Captain Chaos wrote: »

The PS4 was 400 at launch and Sony were breaking even on that, it's had a hardware revision and its cheaper to make now so the price has changed to reflect that but their profit margin has shot up too.

In the mean time of the past 2 years parts have dropped in price as new tech becomes main stream. A PS4 at €400 today could wipe the floor with the current PS4s.

You can double the RAM, HDD, new generation GPU chipset and up the CPU clock speed and keep the same price point. Old tech drops in price as new tech is released.

It's the reason MS are really considering it for the XB1.

I'm just saying if you are going to bother to do VR at all why handicap yourself doing it on a platform that is not powerful enough for it. Personally I feel they should hold off on VR until PS5 and do it right instead of having tech demo games. It's like what happened Kinect, that could do head tracking for games but no game developers bothered to use it. It could have performed like Track IR5 does for the PC and took fps, racing and flight sim games to next level on consoles but the console developers stayed at the lowest common denominator.

You're essentially talking about making a backwards compatible ps5 a few years after the ps4 release. It would be absolute madness. The reason people didn't develop games for the Kinect was because there was no guarantee the whole Xbox user base would be able to play them, so you want to split the PlayStation user base between two different consoles?

Lord Spence

wandatowell wrote: »

Pre-ordered this morning with in GS.

400 quid ain't a bad price. Was thinking about waiting but I figured why bother.

did gamestop charge you straight away?

Digital Solitude

They're releasing it now to get a foot in the door, what's the point of releasing the tech 5 years after its been commercially launched? Anyone with a big interest in VR will have gotten a PC at that point, for a superior experience anyways.

I think the PS4 will be able to push it fine, the graphics are going to be poor, very cartoony and colourful to allow the high fps, I can see them being high immersion and a lot of fun, instead of sharp textures.

If they market it right, and manage to knock the price down some more somehow, they could really pull the fun, casual VR experience and sell buckets. Kinda like Gen 7, 360/PS3 had the hard graphics and more serious players, Wii cleaned up the fun/casual side. Sony may have a chance to nail both markets.

Or maybe that makes no sense because it's still €800 for the lot, but a possibility

Thargor

Captain Chaos wrote: »

The PS4 was 400 at launch and Sony were breaking even on that, it's had a hardware revision and its cheaper to make now so the price has changed to reflect that but their profit margin has shot up too.

In the mean time of the past 2 years parts have dropped in price as new tech becomes main stream. A PS4 at €400 today could wipe the floor with the current PS4s.

You can double the RAM, HDD, new generation GPU chipset and up the CPU clock speed and keep the same price point. Old tech drops in price as new tech is released.

It's the reason MS are really considering it for the XB1.

I'm just saying if you are going to bother to do VR at all why handicap yourself doing it on a platform that is not powerful enough for it. Personally I feel they should hold off on VR until PS5 and do it right instead of having tech demo games. It's like what happened Kinect, that could do head tracking for games but no game developers bothered to use it. It could have performed like Track IR5 does for the PC and took fps, racing and flight sim games to next level on consoles but the console developers stayed at the lowest common denominator.

Have you ever looked at whats happened historically when companies try to do this with add-ons? Its a disaster 100% of the time.

Oafley Jones

Thargor wrote: »

Have you ever looked at whats happened historically when companies try to do this with add-ons? Its a disaster 100% of the time.

Also he's ignoring that the increasing margin over the consoles lifespan is what Sony needs and has accounted for. It's what makes the machine financially viable for them day one. I suspect that if MS goes down the route it's because Nadella doesn't want to commit to Xbox long term.

Doge

Here's the full list of over 200 Game Developers and Publishers working on PSVR titles:

http://www.dualshockers.com/2016/03/15/sony-announces-developers-working-on-playstation-vr-square-enix-level-5-fromsoftware-and-many-more/

Tools and Middleware Developers

Doge

Whoops, the North America region didn't embed, fixed the post now.

Doge

Here's a cool video of NASA using the PSVR to train Space Robot Operators posted back in Decemeber.

Article

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mrpHJ5Qya90

Retr0gamer

Sony have released lists of developers before for the Vita which didn't turn out quite as you would expect so take that with a pinch of salt.

Apparently a developer let slip at the conference that their game would also run without VR and look much better. Looks like there will be some cuts to fidelity but that's understandable. I just hope Sony aren't using some of the tech they developed for their PS3 games. To cut down on processing many 3D elements were rendered as flat 2D shapes for the depth meaning character models ended up having this weird cardboard cut out look.