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ASTI and Increments (freeze)

MrJones1973

Just to warn people that The government has not agreed to lift increment freeze as agreed under HR. Why? Because we have not signed up to Lansdowne Road. I have been trying to get an answer from head office but they claim ,my e mails never arrtived

Just confirmed Department threatening to withhold increments from teachers unless we cave in. Until 2018. Keep this in mind before voting

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sitstill

When are we due our next increment... is it in March/April?

solerina

Surely a case could be taken if this were to happen ? I assume that you cant be denied what you are entitled to simple because you don't sign up to a new agreement. We have completed Haddington Road (well, we will have by July '16)so should be entitled to all we were guaranteed.

man_no_plan

solerina wrote: »

Surely a case could be taken if this were to happen ? I assume that you cant be denied what you are entitled to simple because you don't sign up to a new agreement. We have completed Haddington Road (well, we will have by July '16)so should be entitled to all we were guaranteed.

FEMPI legislation gives the minister the right to adjust pay and conditions. End of.

r93kaey5p2izun

man_no_plan wrote: »

FEMPI legislation gives the minister the right to adjust pay and conditions. End of.

FEMPI implies a financial emergency. With the government constantly heralding a recovery and talking of improved finances and increased tax takes, I think implementing that legislation would be open to challenge. Brendan Howlin has admitted as much himself. They can't have it both ways.

ytareh

They were already threatening to withhold the two 'tranches' of €750 to 'pay' us for S&S and now this ?! Final sting of dying scorpion hopefully due an imminent crushing ( in so much as retiring on a generous pension - and whatever else they got to sell out the country ?- is ' punishment') .Worst Irish government ever ?!

ytareh

sitstill wrote: »

When are we due our next increment... is it in March/April?

1 March as far as I know .

aratsarse101

Is there any chance that this is actually really good news and it could mean the end of the 33 hours and even give an opportunity to get out of the very unfair system of supervision and substitution that exists.

mirrorwall14

To be honest I'd prefer to hold out for the increment (which they will legally have to pay eventually!) not sign the agreement and take back my 33 hours!!

mirrorwall14

Also I imagine the S and S is even more of a legal minefield in that they have already deducted pay of those who didn't do it. They'll run into a big issue if they turn around and don't pay those who had to

ytareh

EXACTLY the same case was made before the last betrayal .Mysteriously we ended up still doing the odious extra hours and taking on even more .Whether due to foul play or membership apathy or both it was the last straw for me .I left the day after .

If they mirror the last fiasco they will cave from a position of strength weeks before an election and sign up to the agreement rather than sit tight .Then again maybe the new man is cut from a different cloth .Fingers crossed

MrJones1973

Just to clarify if you were due an increment in September-freeze meant delayed until March. You will still get increment in March (I think) but the six month forward in your increments will continue indefinitely. Ie you will always be six months behind in future increment payments. Under HR this was to stop but because we are not signed up to LR-they are tearing up HR. I will confirm the above with HQ

mirrorwall14

Had my labour candidate on the doorstep today who I politely ate alive for their 'worker' party supporting a government who are threatening pay to force a collective agreement through. In fairness he did ask me to email in my issues so they can be raised. May I suggest everyone says it to government tds

Darwin

I agree, everyone should be pushing their local TDs now about these shambolic agreements. Don't hold your breath on any reply though or getting anything meaningful back. On a different issue, I emailed three local TDs in relation to the technological universities bill (I'm an IoT lecturer) and got one callback from a FG secretary who said they would look into my email but heard nothing further. Looking on the bright side I don't know of any of my colleagues looking to support either FG or Labour come 26th February.

doc_17

mirrorwall14 wrote: »

Had my labour candidate on the doorstep today who I politely ate alive for their 'worker' party supporting a government who are threatening pay to force a collective agreement through. In fairness he did ask me to email in my issues so they can be raised. May I suggest everyone says it to government tds

Write the email but don't hold your breath for action!

Terri26

My understanding of it is that we're stuck with the S & S situation regardless if we sign up or not to LRA. However if we don't sign LR, our CP/HR hours should die when the HRA runs out this year. I wish the media/public would realise that we've kept our side of the agreements like we always do but the Government always come back to change and ask/demand more before the Agreements expire.

doc_17

The same way as they use FEMPI to withhold increments they can use FEMPI to try to impose CP hours. In that case it will necessitate a directive of non-compliance.

MrJones1973

Ask all parties for their views on Fempi

sitstill

Now that the election has been called, has there been any movement on the threatened TUI strike at second level?

Edit: Found the answer:
http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/education/strike-threat-for-half-of-countrys-secondary-schools-this-month-34421068.html

It's likely to be the week of the election

MrJones1973

Im trying to get FF Policy on FEMP. We seem to be in the dog house with most parties by my reckoning. Public servants as a whole.

2011abc

FF are no more credible than FG and like the latter their ' policy ' may as well be 'Free Ferraris For All' .It doesn't matter what their 'policy' is they will lie to get back into power , then Homer "Irish Voter" Simpson will do an almighty "D'Oh!!!" once more and swear not to make the same mistake ever again .
Public servants have always been undervalued in the boom times ,what made the last decade especially sinister was that we were expected to loose on the swings AND the roundabout and pay for the recovery .This was traditionally the time when us safe , sensible Corrolla driving , Marks and Spencers brown corduroy pants wearers would breathe a sigh of relief.This time we traded down to a Yaris and Penneys and watched aghast as our younger colleagues manned the local SuperValu checkout . Meanwhile Many of those private sector heads who already went through their ' dark night of the soul' financially are back past us again while we hope for our delayed increment and S&S payment for free work done .
Many of us will be on those checkouts eventually too if we don't grow a pair soon whether through unemployment or paltry pensions . For Gods sake don't vote FF/ FG/ Lab .

FEMPI was a fairy tale dreamed up to sell us into slavery .FEMPI is forever now , like USC , pension levy , property tax , Irish Water etc under right wing regimes and their puppet masters

Sick of campaigning already , just want this charade to end soon .Kenny on radio saying he will invest in Gardai as they take crime so seriously , Varadkar keeping hospitals in crisis to stimulate lazy staff ? Jesus wept !

MrJones1973

Ff have not responded so Take they are Pro FEMPI

amacca

2011abc wrote: »

For Gods sake don't vote FF/ FG/ Lab .

Who would you recommend voting for? What candidates are likely to be fair in their approach?

2011abc

Anyone except FF/FG/Lab / Greens worth a punt but SF/ Soc Dems / PBP/AAA or any of right To Water candidates worth giving a go .We KNOW what the rest will do , same as they've done for last hundred years , milk us dry and retire comfortably . These Sleveens haven't BEGUN their mission when elected , it's ended ! On the gravy train for life .Any of the ' recovery ' believers should take a walk around Dublin . Homelessness .Of course they've also made a bags of Gardai , schools , hospitals , infrastructure ( Water anybody?!) etc etc etc " Burn the Bondholders " Michael Noonan surprisingly did not burn himself ...

I felt that the last union vote on Haddington Road Agreement was the end for teachers and after that it was game over for us .It has been -they've done whatever they wanted since .Unions ignore teachers being used on Jobbridge , ignore calls for special EGM on multi tier payscales etc)

This is Ireland's last chance for democratic change in my opinion .Maybe some teachers are a bit conservative and insulated but I reckon If the same crew get back in there's a fair chance the next power shift in this country won't be at ballot box .People in working class communities ( and beyond) are sick of government for the 1% . Imagine if FF/ FG merge ?

MrJones1973

2011abc wrote: »

Anyone except FF/FG/Lab / Greens worth a punt but SF/ Soc Dems / PBP/AAA or any of right To Water candidates worth giving a go .We KNOW what the rest will do , same as they've done for last hundred years , milk us dry and retire comfortably . These Sleveens haven't BEGUN their mission when elected , it's ended ! On the gravy train for life .Any of the ' recovery ' believers should take a walk around Dublin . Homelessness .Of course they've also made a bags of Gardai , schools , hospitals , infrastructure ( Water anybody?!) etc etc etc " Burn the Bondholders " Michael Noonan surprisingly did not burn himself ...

I felt that the last union vote on Haddington Road Agreement was the end for teachers and after that it was game over for us .It has been -they've done whatever they wanted since .Unions ignore teachers being used on Jobbridge , ignore calls for special EGM on multi tier payscales etc)

This is Ireland's last chance for democratic change in my opinion .Maybe some teachers are a bit conservative and insulated but I reckon If the same crew get back in there's a fair chance the next power shift in this country won't be at ballot box .People in working class communities ( and beyond) are sick of government for the 1% . Imagine if FF/ FG merge ?

Very few under 40s attend meetings. They can easily take over Union if they want to but much easier to sit in staff room and moan. No point in a conference unless you have a plan. My plan would be a two week strike then they will take you seriously but then you get "I cant afford that" its a chicken and Egg but unless we go out for a long time-prepare for no major changes and eventually there will be just one scale-the new one as the likes of me will be retired and the new cheaper rate will still be there.

acequion

I completely agree with 2011abc I shudder to think of the state of public services after five more years of FG led Government. And that's exactly what the country is sleepwalking right into. Just like when we kept voting in FF to run the country into the ground, now we'll keep voting for the Blueshirts to basically sell us all out.

Any teacher who would vote for FG and Lab, especially, really want their heads examined.Those parties used the bust as an excuse to savage our pay and conditions and to utterly demoralise us. They used divide and conquer politics to frighten,bully and ultimately subdue and EVERY teacher must remember that on Friday.

Everything is lacklustre in this land of ours,except silent despair,so unsurprisingly the tone of this election campaign is muted and we're hearing very little outrage from the many who have a right to be outraged. Including teachers and especially the NQT's. Will they be still hanging in there in 5 years or or will they be working at checkouts somewhere and actually happier to do so?

I urge all collegues to get vocal and get angry with the begging boys on our doorsteps and then vote sensibly on Friday.

ytareh

Yes they have literally ran the country into the ground , destroyed services . Education , healthcare , policing , everything , to pay their rich friends ( Noonan was amongst the bailed out Bondholders - conflict of interest ? Alan Kelly's brother is on board of water utility in America and Coveneys brother on board of Glanbia . They refused a better bid (by Siemens to install water meters FOR FREE!!!) in order to further line their patron DO'B's pockets .You couldn't make this stuff up . Time for a change .

If you think I'm exaggerating then tell me how often can we teachers speak to someone on the phone about our payroll problems ? Is it 230-330pm on a flippin' Tuesday ???!!!Every second call to a public institution begins with a message "due to the high volume of calls" ( ie chronic understaffing ) .Pray God you never need an ambulance or Garda especially outside The M50 .

I can tell you from an insider ( something that won't be advertised) that the children's public dental care system has been scaled back from annual or biennial checks to once or twice in the kids entire school career ! You don't have to be a genius to work out that they now spend a lot more time on emergencies .And if that didn't seem idiotic enough they also send staff on service to deal with irate public .A bit like the banks having someone directing you to a cash machine inside the branch .

I'd be happy to pay my health insurance as extra tax for starters to live in a more equitable society .Why do the Govt apologists have to present the alternative as something like a post apocalyptic scenario .We should aspire to a system like Sweeden or Finland , God knows the 'experts' go on about the latters educational system enough .( It seems to be a conveniently forgotten fact that we had one of the very best systems in the world until not to long ago )

Time for a change !

political analyst

acequion wrote: »

I
Any teacher who would vote for FG and Lab, especially, really want their heads examined.Those parties used the bust as an excuse to savage our pay and conditions and to utterly demoralise us. They used divide and conquer politics to frighten,bully and ultimately subdue and EVERY teacher must remember that on Friday.

I reckon it's Labour that poses a threat to teachers because of what I regard as the contempt it has for middle-class professionals - in that respect, Labour is true to its roots.

A FG education minister might be more amenable to teachers.

mirrorwall14

political analyst wrote: »

I reckon it's Labour that poses a threat to teachers because of what I regard as the contempt it has for middle-class professionals - in that respect, Labour is true to its roots.

A FG education minister might be more amenable to teachers.

When I pulled up a labour td on the doorstep about forcing/bullying workers to sign an agreement when they are supposedly for a worker, his response was 'Sure would ye not just sign it'? Wtf like!

acequion

mirrorwall14 wrote: »

When I pulled up a labour td on the doorstep about forcing/bullying workers to sign an agreement when they are supposedly for a worker, his response was 'Sure would ye not just sign it'? Wtf like!

Wow,that's just incredible! Did you not want to throttle him!

political analyst wrote: »

I reckon it's Labour that poses a threat to teachers because of what I regard as the contempt it has for middle-class professionals - in that respect, Labour is true to its roots.

A FG education minister might be more amenable to teachers.

That's actually very interesting and I never thought of it like that. I always saw labour as a party for the worker, both blue and white collar and thought they would be the most likely to protect the worker. That's why I voted only Labour in the last election. NEVER again.I wouldn't vote FG either but now in hindsight we may well have been treated better by a FG minister. In any case it couldn't have been worse.

mirrorwall14

acequion wrote: »

Wow,that's just incredible! Did you not want to throttle him!

That's actually very interesting and I never thought of it like that. I always saw labour as a party for the worker, both blue and white collar and thought they would be the most likely to protect the worker. That's why I voted only Labour in the last election. NEVER again.I wouldn't vote FG either but now in hindsight we may well have been treated better by a FG minister. In any case it couldn't have been worse.

Oh trust me I did!! I nearly are him. And I emailed him later again I was still annoyed.