Ireland Team Talk/Gossip/Rumour Thread IV

irishbucsfan wrote: »

No, but you are guilty of ignoring the vast majority of the game and selecting and misunderstanding a small portion of the game to come to a minority opinion on Rob Kearney.

Territory is not as easy to come by as you seem to think it is.

You are guilty of ignoring the vast majority of what I had posted...

Anyone notice both Kearneys were warming up...?

smiley_face wrote: »

You are guilty of ignoring the vast majority of what I had posted...

No, I read it. I read where you said that kicking the ball is bread and butter stuff. You clearly misunderstand that importance of it and just how difficult it is to be as good as Kearney.

If it was easy then fullbacks wouldn't keep winning player of the tournament. In recent years Halfpenny and Brown, with Kearney being nominated as well as Lee Byrne not so long ago. None of them known as untouchable counter-attackers, all of them sensible defensive players with excellent positional awareness and excellent ability to give their teams an advantage in the territory battle.

Neil3030

Deleted User wrote: »

Is it unreasonable that I'm irritated by people wearing a Munster jersey to an Irish match...

Deleted User wrote: »

Just saw some wanker in a Leinster jersey. Balance has returned to the universe

The reason people do this is actually well documented - they have overweight parents, specifically mothers, and their other halves are typically not particularly attractive.

What's most interesting though, is that they love being reminded of these facts, so as an act of good cheer, you should do same.

Film it for the rest of us.

irishbucsfan wrote: »

No, I read it. I read where you said that kicking the ball is bread and butter stuff. You clearly misunderstand that importance of it and just how difficult it is to be as good as Kearney.

If it was easy then fullbacks wouldn't keep winning player of the tournament. In recent years Halfpenny and Brown, with Kearney being nominated as well as Lee Byrne not so long ago. None of them known as untouchable counter-attackers, all of them sensible defensive players with excellent positional awareness and excellent ability to give their teams an advantage in the territory battle.

Halfpenny won it for goal kicking predominantly, Brown was outstanding for open play counter attacking.
Had little to do with kicking for territory.

smiley_face wrote: »

Halfpenny won it for goal kicking predominantly, Brown was outstanding for open play counter attacking.
Had little to do with kicking for territory.

OK, clearly you're not willing to accept that it's an absolutely essential part of a fullback's game. You can continue to think that incorrectly and Rob Kearney will continue to be firmly cemented as Ireland's starting 15.

irishbucsfan wrote: »

OK, clearly you're not willing to accept that it's an absolutely essential part of a fullback's game. You can continue to think that incorrectly and Rob Kearney will continue to be firmly cemented as Ireland's starting 15.

Kicking is a part of a fullback's job, but it's not as if that one aspect is the only one, and that nobody else can do a similar job, you're shifting the goalposts. I never said what you're claiming I did...

smiley_face wrote: »

Kicking is a part of a fullback's job, but it's not as if that one aspect is the only one, and that nobody else can do a similar job, you're shifting the goalposts. I never said what you're claiming I did...

It's an important part of a fullbacks job and Rob Kearney is better at it than almost anyone else. And no, other people can't just pitch up and do a similar job.

Tox56

smiley_face wrote: »

Kicking is a part of a fullback's job, but it's not as if that one aspect is the only one, and that nobody else can do a similar job, you're shifting the goalposts. I never said what you're claiming I did...

Nobody else in the Ireland squad can do a similar job to Kearney in that regard, why else do you think he starts every single game of any importance

irishbucsfan wrote: »

It's an important part of a fullbacks job and Rob Kearney is better at it than almost anyone else. And no, other people can't just pitch up and do a similar job.

Zebo MOTM
How'd you like them apples?

smiley_face wrote: »

Zebo MOTM
How'd you like them apples?

What?

I never said anything about Simon Zebo? Is there a language barrier at play here or something?

Buer

smiley_face wrote: »

Zebo MOTM
How'd you like them apples?

I think Zebo could now be Ireland's second choice full back ahead of Felix Jones.

irishbucsfan wrote: »

What?

I never said anything about Simon Zebo? Is there a language barrier at play here or something?

Ok, this is the last post I'll make on this topic, I swear.
I posited the point that fullbacks that offer more than the basics are worth starting with.
Passing, counter attacking, slicing through the defense, are aspects of a fullback that also count.
Zebo gave a performance that any sane person could see was worthy of praise and if he started against France and played like that then it may be better than what Rob Kearney does week in week out, i.e. solid but nothing special.

smiley_face wrote: »

Ok, this is the last post I'll make on this topic, I swear.
I posited the point that fullbacks that offer more than the basics are worth starting with.
Passing, counter attacking, slicing through the defense, are aspects of a fullback that also count.
Zebo gave a performance that any sane person could see was worthy of praise and if he started against France and played like that then it may be better than what Rob Kearney does week in week out, i.e. Nothing special.

You are completely failing to appreciate that Rob Kearney is a hell of a lot better than "Nothing special"

He's one of the best there is at the core functions of a fullback, and that's why he'll be starting. Passing and counter attacking are great (Zebo is certainly nothing special when it comes to passing btw) but they're secondary attributes. Those aspects aren't even remotely as important today as his ability under the high ball, which he displayed on numerous occasions, or his ability to make the correct decisions when kicking, which wasn't really tested.

Tox56

smiley_face wrote: »

Zebo MOTM
How'd you like them apples?

Honest to god, are you 12 years old? I think Im going to steer clear of this place post-match for the actual world cup games

Wang King

Buer wrote: »

I think Zebo could now be Ireland's second choice full back ahead of Felix Jones.

Felix Jones is a winger in Joe's eyes

andymx11

Where could one purchase one of those green Ireland jackets? I've looked in Lifestyle Sports & Elverys online and couldn't find one- although I may have blatantly missed it! Actually come to think of it maybe they aren't available with Canterbury and it was just Puma?

Wang King

Paulie says move!

http://www.balls.ie/rugby/paul-oconnell-push-zebo/305051

Clegg

First two games have demonstrated some very good rucking and pilfering at the breakdown. Scrum and rolling mauls have been effective too although our line out wobbled a bit today.

Negatives outweighed the positives though. Boss and D'arcy are finished at test level, although I struggle to recall if Boss was ever good enough to begin with.ndont get anything in attack of defence with Darce anymore. The service from the nine was crap too so Madigan, who was patchy anyway, couldn't deliver ball to our outside backs to attack. Tuohy and Toner were empty jerseys today. No physicality or presence on the pitch. Toner has credit in the bank, but Tuohy won't travel on that performance. On paper this wasn't as strong a pack as last weeks and it definitely showed on the pitch too. Too passive in defence and fell off too many tackles in broken play.

smiley_face wrote: »

Ok, this is the last post I'll make on this topic

At least this much I can agree with you on.

total former

My predicted team for Wales:

R Kearney
Trimble
Earls
Henshaw
D Kearney
Sexton
Murray
McGrath
Best
Moore/White
POC
Ryan
POM
Murphy
Heaslip

Cronin, Kilcoyne, White/Moore, Henderson, Henry, Reddan, Jackson, Jones

connachta

Clegg wrote: »

Boss finished at test level, although I struggle to recall if Boss was ever good enough to begin with.

Not me who said it:rolleyes:

Buer

total former wrote: »

My predicted team for Wales:

R Kearney
Trimble
Earls
Henshaw
D Kearney
Sexton
Murray
McGrath
Best
Moore/White
POC
Ryan
POM
Murphy
Heaslip

Cronin, Kilcoyne, White/Moore, Henderson, Henry, Reddan, Jackson, Jones

I think that's quite likely. A number of people are now out of contention and we won't see them involved again i.e. D'Arcy and Tuohy most obviously.

I think Marmion might get the bench spot again for a showing given Reddan has two appearances already. Boss didn't go well yesterday overall and, while I'd still say the likelihood is that Boss travels, Marmion should get more than 10 minutes to stake a claim.

The backs just gets more and more interesting. D'Arcy is gone. Gilroy gone. McFadden probably gone.

A lot depends on Trimble's fitness. He needs to play in this game or I'd think he'll be out of the reckoning; given he's not training at the moment, he might already be.

One guy who I think will have had a sleepless night is Luke Fitzgerald. He didn't actually go that badly yesterday. He got involved a huge amount, made some good hits and took the try well. He had a really poor knock on and a bad kick where he didn't make touch. But he's viewed as an 11 and nothing else for this team, it appears. Versatility is huge for such a limited squad. I think his fate might be out of his hands now. He just needs to hope that either Trimble isn't ready for next week or Schmidt now views Jones as surplus to get another crack next time.

Zebo really should have enough done at this point and Schmidt name checked DK after the game as having had a positive impact. Bowe is already there.

I would think our backs are now something along the lines of: Murray, Reddan, Boss, Sexton, Jackson, Madigan, Henshaw, Payne, Earls, Bowe, Rob Kearney, Zebo and two more from Dave Kearney, Jones, Trimble and Fitzgerald.

If Trimble gets to prove his fitness, I think he travels. If DK goes well next week, I think he travels. With that said, I don't think DK was that great yesterday. He didn't get involved a huge amount in his 25 minutes. Aside from the inside ball break, he touched the ball on only one other occasion. But it does appear he has been tearing things up in training.

bilston

The mad thing about the 11 jersey is that you could just as likely be in the starting XV as you could miss out from making the squad completely.

Buer

bilston wrote: »

The mad thing about the 11 jersey is that you could just as likely be in the starting XV as you could miss out from making the squad completely.

Quite true. It really is that tight. We've had multiple players start in that jersey in the last 18 months and all go well: Zebo, DK and Fitz have all been there in the last two 6N campaigns.

Bowe will travel but I think this will be the last time he'll go automatically as a proven top class performer. He turns 32 in the next Six Nations which is getting into pretty veteran territory for a winger. With the level of competition around him, he needs to hit the ground running this season and lift it from yesterday's pretty flat showing which has gone under the radar a little.

What kind of selection would be best against Wales?
A lot of question marks over fitness and injuries, but in general, should a full team be selected, or a nearly full team with a few hopefuls given a chance, or should it be a team made up of people who had the least match time so far?
Discuss...

smiley_face wrote: »

What kind of selection would be best against Wales?
A lot of question marks over fitness and injuries, but in general, should a full team be selected, or a nearly full team with a few hopefuls given a chance, or should it be a team made up of people who had the least match time so far?
Discuss...

Sexton and Murray will start against Wales. Probably Payne and Henshaw and Kearney also. 11 and 14 who knows.

Forwards will be mostly first choice, Moore to come in and POM. Pretty much first choice bar second row and back 3 potentially.

smiley_face wrote: »

What kind of selection would be best against Wales?
A lot of question marks over fitness and injuries, but in general, should a full team be selected, or a nearly full team with a few hopefuls given a chance, or should it be a team made up of people who had the least match time so far?
Discuss...

Think it's going to be very close to full strength. We've seen little or none of Sexton, Murray, POM, POC, Kearney, Henderson so I'd imagine they'll all be in. I'd like to see Earls on one wing, maybe Dave Kearney on the other, and Moore at TH if he's fit.

b.gud

Most people seem to think that we'll be bringing 5 props with Bent being used to cover both sides and I'm happy enough with this as he can certainly hold his own and will be very useful for the group stages, though I'm not sure how much he'll feature in the knock out stages.

A question occurred to me yesterday, who will replace him in the squad if he was to get injured in the first game? We don't really have anyone else who can cover both sides of the scrum