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not what you know its who you know.

Hunter456

these days applying for a job is like looking for a needle in a hay stack dis-morning i applied for a few jobs and got one reply back the usual crap sorry need more experience then y in the hell would i apply for the job in the first place, i though this rubbish was long gone ''its not what you know its who you know''. being seeking employment for nearly 5 years now how many of ye are coming to up against a brick wall every time they apply for work.

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challengemaster

Hunter456 wrote: »

10 pages of replies and willing to help others all i can do is follow threw on the advise and get back into the the workforce and get more qualifications. i have attached my C.V will i keep the address like this or will i change it around.

Looks fine, just include the proper punctuation (commas) where appropriate in the address - the same as is done in your work experience.

Your CV actually looks like it's from a different person than the original one posted in the thread, and it gives off a great first impression. It's organised and neat, skills that are needed for working in IT.

I would like to point out one thing, now that it's obvious

Hunter456 wrote: »

dis-morning i applied for a few jobs and got one reply back the usual crap sorry need more experience

You've been receiving this feedback for a very good reason. Your work experience is seriously lacking - that's honest truth, not "the usual crap". Even calling it 3 years is embellishment. You need to accept this criticism and learn to deal with it rather than ignoring it, or worse.

I believe you've started to take that step as you want to get new qualifications, and you've started taking all the advice given to you. One of the things you'll be asked in an interview is to explain why each of your previous employments only lasted 1 month. You need to be prepared for that.

The best advice I can give to lessen the blow there has already been posted - get your CompTIA A+ cert and add it to your CV, and then get some new experience to add. It doesn't matter if it's jobsbridge.

Hunter456 wrote: »

how long should a cover letter be half a page no more than a few lines. i have being uploading my new cv to the job websites and fine tuned my automatic searches for specific role's .

Cover letters have to be specific to each application, you can't get away with writing one and changing who it's addressed to. Make sure to read the job ads entirely, quite a few will tell you how long your cover letter should be (maximum).

Hunter456 wrote: »

COVER LETTER SAMPLE

Dear, Sir/Madam

My interest in the position of () has prompted me to forward my C.V for your review and consideration.

Having worked/studied within the industry for many years, I have developed a wide range of skills that would meet, and exceed the expectations for this specific role. I am currently unemployed and eager to re-enter the workforce to better my skills and to be a part of a team, as you can see there is an employment gap on my C.V as I was a stay at home father because my wife worked but I continued to keep up to date with the continually upgrading I.T industry. I am seeking this position because I am confident my experience will make a positive contribution to the start-up or continuing profitable operation of a business in which I am so well experienced.

If you would like to get in touch to discuss my application and to arrange an interview please contact me via Phone or email.
I look forward to hearing from you soon.

First thing is first, formatting. Your address and contact information goes in the top right corner. The date goes below that. Then, on the left hand side (above where your introduction goes) is where you put the addressee's details (name and address).

Dear Sir/Madam is fine, only if you do not know who you are applying to. If you have their name you should use it. So: Dear Mr/Mrs/Miss/Dr/... Bloggs.

Your opening statement is fine, but a little succinct. Also, watch the punctuation. C.V. The following is a modified version of what I have used in the past. This is just the opening paragraph for now.

Dear ....

I am writing to apply for the position of X as part of the Y group/team listed on Z website as of (date job was listed). I have recently completed ( most recent qualification detail) and have done (work details) to further develop my skills within this area. I see this position as an excellent opportunity to further enhance my skills and gain valuable experience within this sector.

Obviously you fill in the blanks with your relevant details, or omit whatever doesn't fit. So, once you get your CompTIA A+ and if you do a jobsbridge, you can say "I have recently completed the CompTIA A+ Certification, and have completed an internship at (company) to further develop my skills and ensure I have practical, working knowledge of the information learned from my certification.

Having worked/studied within the industry for many years, I have developed a wide range of skills that would meet, and exceed the expectations for this specific role.

This is far, far, far too generic. This is where tailoring specific to the role comes in. However, I'll try give you an example. Take the following job: http://www.jobs.ie/ApplyForJob.aspx?Id=1472875. This is where you take the scope of the job and skills they want, and tell them how you have those exact skills.

During the course of my studies I have completed a number of subjects/modules covering PC hardware, network and software troubleshooting (you can give more detail here). This course also covered OS installation and troubleshooting, and I have experience performing this role in my previous position as an IT Assistant. Furthermore, I am also ECDL and CompTIA+ certified.

Aside from education, I have vast work experience from both retail and professional office backgrounds. Working in these roles have provided me with excellent communication and time management skills. Moreover, my studies have afforded me proficiency in English, communications and administration. As a stay at home father, I have great patience and first hand experience of learning new skills quickly.

I believe I am a suitable candidate for this position due to my qualifications, previous work experience, and my familiarity with the roles involved, but also due to my strong work ethic, passion for IT and my ability to work comfortably either independently or as part of a team. I believe I will be able to contribute positively and significantly to the group as a highly motivated support technician.

If you have any questions, or if you would like to schedule an interview, please contact me via email or at (phone). I look forward to hearing from you.

Sincerely,

The other thing to watch out for is you have a few really long sentences (I've pointed them out). You want to keep each sentence short and to the point, not drawl on.

I hope this helps somewhat - It's just an idea of what to work towards/from. I'm sure someone with more experience will be able to point out what to improve.

Hunter456

thanks for the post ya i have taken all of this advise in account and starting to watch the professor messer video courses on compTIA A+ and will do the exam and get that down on my C.V.

sebcity

You should have a look here too, OP.
https://www.coursera.org/

There may be something worth doing if it interests you.

MagicMarker

TBH OP I wouldn't even focus on applying for IT roles. You don't have the skills/experience necessary for most of them. You need to apply for anything and everything you can while continuing to up-skill in your own time. You'll pick up a job much faster if you broaden your criteria.

Hunter456

when i am ready to do the compTIA A plus exam where would i purchase and do the exam here in limerick.

challengemaster

MagicMarker wrote: »

TBH OP I wouldn't even focus on applying for IT roles. You don't have the skills/experience necessary for most of them. You need to apply for anything and everything you can while continuing to up-skill in your own time. You'll pick up a job much faster if you broaden your criteria.

Yeah, up-skilling and working are not mutually exclusive. Particularly in IT, you are expected to up-skill in your spare time, while working. I think Stheno is the best example of this to hand, doing a Master's degree and several other certifications in her spare time.

Get onto a jobsbridge ASAP and do the certification in your spare time.

Hunter456 wrote: »

when i am ready to do the compTIA A plus exam where would i purchase and do the exam here in limerick.

https://wsr.pearsonvue.com/testtaker/registration/SelectTestCenterProximity/COMPTIA/634930

Cenit College
RoseLawn House
National Technology Park
Co Limerick
Castletroy
Ireland

I would suggest contacting your Social Welfare officer in relation to taking the A+ Exams. SW should cover the cost of the exams, but you'll need to talk to them to figure out how this works.

Slutmonkey57b

Hunter456 wrote: »

COVER LETTER SAMPLE

Dear, Sir/Madam

My interest in the position of () has prompted me to forward my C.V for your review and consideration.

Having worked/studied within the industry for many years, I have developed a wide range of skills that would meet, and exceed the expectations for this specific role. I am currently unemployed and eager to re-enter the workforce to better my skills and to be a part of a team, as you can see there is an employment gap on my C.V as I was a stay at home father because my wife worked but I continued to keep up to date with the continually upgrading I.T industry. I am seeking this position because I am confident my experience will make a positive contribution to the start-up or continuing profitable operation of a business in which I am so well experienced.

If you would like to get in touch to discuss my application and to arrange an interview please contact me via Phone or email.
I look forward to hearing from you soon.

It's a good start but once again you're totally over-confident about your experience. You need to look at yourself from an *employer's* perspective, and from that perspective, you have effectively *zero* experience. You've never worked in a corporate environment. You've never done group project work. You've never dealt with office politics. Your letter's optimistic assertions are easily disproved by a quick glance through your previous jobs and qualifications.

What you need to emphasise here is
- your current attempts to get *recognised qualifications*.
- your desire to learn and adapt
- your hunger for hard work and opportunity to take on *responsibility*

Your comments re: "same old crap" indicate you still need to work on accepting the fundamental part of what challenges your desire to get "into IT":
You are not qualified, you're not experienced, and you're not familiar with the culture of working in an IT role.

Be honest, there are plenty of jobs being offered with relatively huge salaries, with descriptions like IT support, talking about user support, software installation, server maintenance etc.; are you looking at those thinking "sure I installed Windows in loads of machines, I could do that"?

Because you need to realise that right now, you can't *prove* that to an employer. And being honest, you *don't* have the skills to do it in a corporate environment, even if the work sounds similar. There's a reason IT salaries are high, it reflects the fact that employers are paying for knowledge, experience and qualifications. Not just for whatever actual work is involved.

Tell us what type of jobs you're applying for. Then we can advise whether you're aiming at something that's feasible for you.

Add mentioned above, you probably need to get *a* job in a company, while you do courses to get an IT job in the future. You need to prove you can work, as well as prove you can do IT work.

edanto

Hunter456 wrote: »

thanks for the post ya i have taken all of this advise in account and starting to watch the professor messer video courses on compTIA A+ and will do the exam and get that down on my C.V.

If you want to keep this thread updated with your progress towards the exam, you might get some encouragement from the group.

There's one habit that I'd encourage you to break. You said that you hardly ever read over what you type. That will cause a lot of problems in IT.

You don't want to close a support ticket and say that a critical service has been DISabled instead of ENabled. You don't want to get the reputation of the guy on the desk that always makes little mistakes (spelling mistakes when setting up someone's active directory account can be embarrassing for the department and cause a delay for the new start).

Writing without capitals or commas is fine on your own time or messages, but in the IT world where you might often be working with people you never meet, that writing style comes across as inexperienced.

It's really positive to see the different approach you're bringing to the thread. Keep it up and it could help you a lot. It might even get you to the point where you're a developer on the sunny top floor in Google.... and you can go back to forgetting about capitals and punctuation again!

Hunter456

Slutmonkey57b wrote: »

It's a good start but once again you're totally over-confident about your experience. You need to look at yourself from an *employer's* perspective, and from that perspective, you have effectively *zero* experience. You've never worked in a corporate environment. You've never done group project work. You've never dealt with office politics. Your letter's optimistic assertions are easily disproved by a quick glance through your previous jobs and qualifications.

What you need to emphasise here is
- your current attempts to get *recognised qualifications*.
- your desire to learn and adapt
- your hunger for hard work and opportunity to take on *responsibility*

Your comments re: "same old crap" indicate you still need to work on accepting the fundamental part of what challenges your desire to get "into IT":
You are not qualified, you're not experienced, and you're not familiar with the culture of working in an IT role.

Be honest, there are plenty of jobs being offered with relatively huge salaries, with descriptions like IT support, talking about user support, software installation, server maintenance etc.; are you looking at those thinking "sure I installed Windows in loads of machines, I could do that"?

Because you need to realise that right now, you can't *prove* that to an employer. And being honest, you *don't* have the skills to do it in a corporate environment, even if the work sounds similar. There's a reason IT salaries are high, it reflects the fact that employers are paying for knowledge, experience and qualifications. Not just for whatever actual work is involved.

Tell us what type of jobs you're applying for. Then we can advise whether you're aiming at something that's feasible for you.

Add mentioned above, you probably need to get *a* job in a company, while you do courses to get an IT job in the future. You need to prove you can work, as well as prove you can do IT work.

The kind of jobs i was applying for was Help Desk and IT Support on job.ie and irishjobs.ie websites.

Slutmonkey57b

Hunter456 wrote: »

The kind of jobs i was applying for was Help Desk and IT Support on job.ie and irishjobs.ie websites.

That's good. You now need to recognise that if a potential employer there has said you don't have enough experience for that role, what experience are they expecting? It could be one of a number of things:
- working in a call centre environment. The skill level there is very low, but it's very pressurised in terms of time management and stress, which is where experience comes in. There's a massive turnover in that industry, so they want to know that whoever they hire isn't going to break in a week's time and walk out. You can overcome this with a really good interview, emphasise you're applying for courses and indicate you're going nowhere until they're finished.

- working on support for particular software packages/engineering issues. Again, the helpdesk roles won't require a lot of skill but they might expect familiarity with particular systems or software, you'll need to look at the key skills to decide if it's something an employer will believe you have or can build up quickly.

- accuracy. Once again, you must be able to show you can complete very clean, correct written and verbal work. If your letter, cv, or interview aren't up to scratch, you'll fall down here.

You're making good progress already. Don't forget that getting back into work is hard, somebody has to take a pretty big gamble on taking you vs. someone just out of college or school. You can do it if you're honest about the work involved, target your efforts where you can actually get results, and ensure you've left nothing "on the table" which puts you at more of a disadvantage.

Hunter456

Slutmonkey57b wrote: »

That's good. You now need to recognise that if a potential employer there has said you don't have enough experience for that role, what experience are they expecting? It could be one of a number of things:
- working in a call centre environment. The skill level there is very low, but it's very pressurised in terms of time management and stress, which is where experience comes in. There's a massive turnover in that industry, so they want to know that whoever they hire isn't going to break in a week's time and walk out. You can overcome this with a really good interview, emphasise you're applying for courses and indicate you're going nowhere until they're finished.

- working on support for particular software packages/engineering issues. Again, the helpdesk roles won't require a lot of skill but they might expect familiarity with particular systems or software, you'll need to look at the key skills to decide if it's something an employer will believe you have or can build up quickly.

- accuracy. Once again, you must be able to show you can complete very clean, correct written and verbal work. If your letter, cv, or interview aren't up to scratch, you'll fall down here.

You're making good progress already. Don't forget that getting back into work is hard, somebody has to take a pretty big gamble on taking you vs. someone just out of college or school. You can do it if you're honest about the work involved, target your efforts where you can actually get results, and ensure you've left nothing "on the table" which puts you at more of a disadvantage.

All i can do is upskill my knowledge and and keep on trying even if its an internship its getting me back into the workforce and in preparation for real work.

uck51js9zml2yt

As you are not working you can do courses and exams through your local Intreo office.
Go onto the website, find a course and make an appointment with a case officer.
Some of the courses are blended or online learning but give you all you need to be able to do the exams. Fas will pay for them when you score well enough on Mark Up which is also provided by fas.

JTL

Slightly off topic but Job bridge has been mentioned a few times throughout the thread; am I right in saying that programme is directed more towards graduates who can't get employment due to lack of experience?

challengemaster

JTL wrote: »

Slightly off topic but Job bridge has been mentioned a few times throughout the thread; am I right in saying that programme is directed more towards graduates who can't get employment due to lack of experience?

JobBridge, the National Internship Scheme, provides work experience opportunities for unemployed people. It is aimed at people who have been either getting certain social welfare payments or signing for credits for at least 3 months. Participants in the scheme will be offered an internship of 6 or 9 months with a host organisation. If they take up an internship they will keep their social welfare payment and will get an extra €50 per week.

It's aimed at people that have a lack of experience, be they graduates or not.

MouseTail

It may be worthwhile mentioning on your cover letter that you are eligible for the JobsPlus scheme. This is a scheme where companies get a cash subsidy if they take on someone who is long term unemployed. Its something that just may tip the balance in your favour.

This thread should be stickied, some invaluable and generous contributions from posters.

Hunter456

Make it a sticky as the lads have really overturned my C.V now it looks more professional and the help is 10/10 in my book. can you direct me to more information on JobPlus scheme.

challengemaster

Hunter456 wrote: »

when i am ready to do the compTIA A plus exam where would i purchase and do the exam here in limerick.

Hunter456 wrote: »

can you direct me to more information on JobPlus scheme.

For someone supposedly well versed in IT, you seem incapable of using google to perform basic searches? You really need to start doing some legwork. There'll be nobody to hold your hand and spoon feed you information in a job, like you're expecting people to do here.

You've been given pages of good advice, now put some work in yourself.

Hunter456

challengemaster wrote: »

For someone supposedly well versed in IT, you seem incapable of using google to perform basic searches? You really need to start doing some legwork. There'll be nobody to hold your hand and spoon feed you information in a job, like you're expecting people to do here.

You've been given pages of good advice, now put some work in yourself.

quite capable of using google and other search engines.

Rantan

Hunter456 wrote:

10 pages of replies and willing to help others all i can do is follow threw on the advise and get back into the the workforce and get more qualifications. i have attached my C.V will i keep the address like this or will i change it around.

Wow..massive improvement. Well done. ITs nearly there. Still needs to illustrate how you did things rather then just what you did. As opposed to "I fixed computers" did you "resolve technical issues to enable opetarations to run smoothly" . Small example..but always look to big up every thing you did. .dont use plain language..be descriptive and always think of the angle..every word you use must add something to the cv. Literally. You don't need an address by the way. Just takes up space

Stheno

Hunter456 wrote: »

Make it a sticky as the lads have really overturned my C.V .

and ladies.

I have to say as someone who was quite harsh at the beginning of this thread, but imo no harsher than other posters, and as someone who did put time and effort into the OP, that I'm unsure I'd like to see it as a sticky for two reasons.

a. The OP is still as helpless and unable to progress things without an awful lot of guidance, frankly, that's not what this forum is for in the main, turning it into "redo my c.v. for me" would devalue it hugely, and for those who haven't read this thread, that's what happened here, the OP ended up with three posters devoting their personal time to assisting him quite heavily.

b. The OP doesn't appear to have learned much, despite claiming they are skilled in IT, they are looking for people to do pretty much everything for them, i.e. supply info on jobsplus

This is intended to be an advice forum, and it's one I like, and one where I hope I have occasionally contributed positively, albeit harshly at times. I know I've certainly gotten it wrong at times

I'd like to see it remain that way

You can paper over the cracks, and enable people, but they themselves have to take ownership and move themselves on

Hunter456

i had no clue of JobPlus scheme but since it was mentioned i have found all the details regarding this scheme i am eligible if a employer takes me on. This scheme and an internship are my best bet to gain employment in the I.T sector. i have watched alot of videos on professor messier compTIA A+ video course i would recommend it to anyone.

Stheno

Hunter456 wrote: »

i had no clue of JobPlus scheme but since it was mentioned i have found all the details regarding this scheme i am eligible if a employer takes me on. This scheme and an internship are my best bet to gain employment in the I.T sector. i have watched alot of videos on professor messier compTIA A+ video course i would recommend it to anyone.

My point here is that instead of going, "oh what's this jobsplus, I must google it", you instead asked for information on this thread.

It's indicative of a lack of initiative, which will kill you working in IT.

A few people have said it in a roundabout way, but being very very blunt, along with your IT skills, you need to work on your soft skills, work on your English and how you communicate, pay more attention to detail, and start taking the initiative, rather than assuming that a post on a message board will answer your questions.

Hunter456

Stheno wrote: »

My point here is that instead of going, "oh what's this jobsplus, I must google it", you instead asked for information on this thread.

It's indicative of a lack of initiative, which will kill you working in IT.

A few people have said it in a roundabout way, but being very very blunt, along with your IT skills, you need to work on your soft skills, work on your English and how you communicate, pay more attention to detail, and start taking the initiative, rather than assuming that a post on a message board will answer your questions.

After putting up this thread I have found out alot of stuff and that people still help one another and I'm thankfull truely, but I have taken all the advise on board and put some of it into practice and made the nessesary changes. I have researched back to work scheme and jobplus and hoping to find out more info tomorrow...

Stheno

Hunter456 wrote: »

After putting up this thread I have found out alot of stuff and that people still help one another and I'm thankfull truely, but I have taken all the advise on board and put some of it into practice and made the nessesary changes. I have researched back to work scheme and jobplus and hoping to find out more info tomorrow...

Ok fair enough, I don't mean to sound like a dragon. It's kinda like typing without reading back, think before you post, think before you ask a question.

Now coming from me, that's funny, as I now work as a consultant in IT and end up in loads of different organisations, and every five minutes I'm going "what's "insert TLA", "why are you worrying about "industry related news story" etc as I don't have the info.

There's a balance though and you equally need to work on those soft skills as the hard certifications.

Hunter456

Stheno wrote: »

Ok fair enough, I don't mean to sound like a dragon. It's kinda like typing without reading back, think before you post, think before you ask a question.

Now coming from me, that's funny, as I now work as a consultant in IT and end up in loads of different organisations, and every five minutes I'm going "what's "insert TLA", "why are you worrying about "industry related news story" etc as I don't have the info.

There's a balance though and you equally need to work on those soft skills as the hard certifications.

Very eventful few months instore for me fingers crossed I'll have something landed.

Stheno

Hunter456 wrote: »

Very eventful few months instore for me fingers crossed I'll have something landed.

Are you aware that they are active schemes out there to mentor people wanting to get into/progress in IT?

THere was a big one launched recently, I'm a mentor on there, it's called MINT (mentoring in technology) and the website is https://mint.idirus.com/

I've used mentors throughout my career, and as I progressed, was sometimes fortunate to move from considering them my mentor, to being a peer.

Mentors can be invaluable.

JTL

Stheno wrote: »

Are you aware that they are active schemes out there to mentor people wanting to get into/progress in IT?

THere was a big one launched recently, I'm a mentor on there, it's called MINT (mentoring in technology) and the website is https://mint.idirus.com/

I've used mentors throughout my career, and as I progressed, was sometimes fortunate to move from considering them my mentor, to being a peer.

Mentors can be invaluable.

Completely agree with this. I don't work in IT but have had mentors in most of my roles to date and they have been of great assistance to me.

Slutmonkey57b

Hunter456 wrote: »

no i haven't i type looking at the screen and sometimes i don't read over what i type.

This is an interesting comment. Think about what you've written there. You are looking at the screen while you are typing, which means you are watching the words pop up on the screen. If you can't spot obvious errors while you're looking at them, what does that tell you about your attention to detail?

It would make sense if you were looking at your keyboard while typing, then it would be expected you would only see mistakes when you look up at the screen.

If you tell an employer "I can touch type", and the employer looks at a letter or CV with mistakes in it, then the following things jump into their head (whether you want them to, expect them to, or even whether you think it's fair or not)

Touch typists are called that because they can type accurately, knowing their fingers will land where the appropriate letter is.
This person has left mistakes on the page they were typing.
This means either a) they're not telling the truth about being a touch typist, b) their education is lacking, or c) they do not take accuracy seriously.
This person knows they need to put on a professional air in an environment where they are being tested and judged, but they haven't put the effort into the basics.

You have a lot of bad habits you need to break.

Darkslide

Anyone else curious as to how the OP is getting on!?!

Hunter456

Darkslide wrote: »

Anyone else curious as to how the OP is getting on!?!

The ''better'' Cv is being noticed came out of an interview a few weeks ago it was for a Vodafone internet/network technicain position. Unfortunately i was unsuccessful with landing the position it went very well, To me that was a stepping stone to the right path.