Chivito550 wrote: » Yeh I'd be the same. I think Coe was clean, but I have no strong basis for that belief, and wouldn't bother trying to argue a case for why I think so, as my belief is only based on a hunch. I'd be very confident Cram is clean listening to him talk about doping, though that's no guarantee either.
The Rape of Lucretia wrote: » Those guys culd have a lot of leeway to be very economical with the truth. If they were ahead of the curve in using PEDs, which three white guys setting the pace and performaces that do stick out as anomolous (one guy possbly, three guys? From the same country ? The wrong race ? Against known dopers ?), then stuff that was not banned at the time, gives them plenty of scope to be anti-banned substances in their statements now. Murky.
walshb wrote: » As mentioned, or alluded to, back in the 70s and earlier 80s the white men were the ones leading the way in doping.
shels4ever wrote: » Yep I agree
walshb wrote: » Legal blood doping!
shels4ever wrote: » Should do what was done in javlin a few years back, scrap all old records and start again.
walshb wrote: » Or simply ban banning PEDs.....It's become a joke.
Chivito550 wrote: »
walshb wrote: » Let them at it. Maybe bring in threshold levels for a list of PEDs. Man will always strive to progress. Why hold back the tide? It happens in F1, and other sports too use money and technology to be better than their competitors. May actually see a more level playing field if the authorities simply allow humans to compete in T&F.
Notwork Error wrote: » No.
Chivito550 wrote: » 0/10 1) This is dangerous for one's health, and basically tells kids that in order to succeed in the sport, you have to dope, and risk your long term health. 2) It would never be a level playing field, and those with the most money, best contacts etc, would get access to the best drugs.
walshb wrote: » It would be a lot more level than it is now with the OTT convoluted drugs bans in place. It's a joke. Regarding the kids. Nobody is telling them anything. Adults in sport or whatever should be allowed the choice and chance to improve. Sport, at least some sports at the highest level are a health risk. Adults and elites should be allowed use reason and judgment and choice. That's what makes us human. Yes, those with the best money would have the best access to the best aids. How is that different to the field today? There are countries with a lot more money and potential and facilities than others. There are athletes with a lot more facilities and money and access to improvements than others. Limiting humans in what they can do as mature adults is against the spirit of sport. Judgment and reasoning are two things what makes us humans.
Chivito550 wrote: » LOL. You truly are a funny man. May as well allow shotguns during 800m races too while you're at it. Hang back at the back of the field, and pick one off one by one.
bring in threshold levels for a list of PEDs
walshb wrote: » No, that's silly. I am not claiming this. There is "cheating" going on by virtue of genetic make up as we speak. I don't see it as cheating. Humans should be allowed use whatever is available to them to improve their performance, within reason of course. The event stays the same. Man runs or jumps or throws as he/she is. No mechanical aids or equipment additions etc. Like it or not there is a lot of cheating happening that is legal and allowed. Should we ban it? I am not alone in this view. Maybe here I am firmly in the minority, but I am sure there are many people who would argue for allowing humans to improve and progress without limiting them.
Chivito550 wrote: » Well it does explain why you idolise Carl Lewis. Everything has become so much clearer.
walshb wrote: » It would be a lot more level than it is now with the OTT convoluted drugs bans in place. It's a joke. Regarding the kids. Nobody is telling them anything. Adults in sport or whatever should be allowed the choice and chance to improve. Sport, at least some sports at the highest level are a health risk. Adults and elites should be allowed use reason and judgment and choice. That's what makes us human. Yes, those with the best money would have the best access to the best aids. How is that different to the field today? There are countries with a lot more money and potential and facilities than others. Do we need to ban or reign this in? There are athletes with a lot more facilities and money and access to improvements than others. Are they cheating? I'd say it's no different to an athlete using technology (PEDs/aids) to improve. Limiting humans in what they can do as mature adults is against the spirit of sport. Judgment and reasoning are two things what makes us humans.
walshb wrote: » Silly response, Chivito!
Notwork Error wrote: » Before EPO was banned in sport and in widespread use without limits, at least 19 cyclists died from strokes because it has thickened their blood to such an extent that the heart couldn't pump it anymore. The same could be said about amphetamine before as countless athletes lost their lives. Even if sport was fairer without bans (which it wouldn't be as you would take away other people's genetic advantages while simultaneously strengthening others weaknesses), I would rather see an unfair sport than see athletes die because they felt they had to take drugs to compete in what is essentially a game. As much as you would like to believe that judgement is part of human nature, the vast majority of athletes have no idea what these drugs do to their health. Legalising doping would just lead to a race of who can take the most drugs just like the 90's in cycling and lead to countless unnecessary deaths again. Do you really want to repeat history?
Chivito550 wrote: » Think about it. You have tended to assume everyone who is great, is doing so by natural means. You have said you believe Lewis was 100% natural. You think the same about Bolt. So if you think this, why would you now be advocating the use of PEDs?
average_runner wrote: » But all you said above is still happening in sport and will always happen
walshb wrote: » Would you ban athletes with asthma?
Chivito550 wrote: » What's your obsession with skin colour? This is the late 70s, early to mid 80s we are talking about. Most distance events were won by white people back then. You are applying today's athletics environment (East Africans dominating) to 30 years ago, which is frankly clueless.
