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Phoenix Park tunnel: 4 trains per hour from 2016

Lenton Lane

In today's Herald, can someone post up a link?

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SeanW

http://www.herald.ie/news/plans-for-four-trains-an-hour-in-phoenix-park-tunnel-next-year-31050092.html

Captain Chaos

The perfect units for this are the withdrawn 2700s. Run a 2 car set every 20 mins or so at peak times between Heuston platform 10 and either platform 1 or 7 at Connolly. It would be quicker and less effort than having to change to the Luas and back again that 100s of commuters do every day.

end of the road

Captain Chaos wrote: »

The perfect units for this are the withdrawn 2700s. Run a 2 car set every 20 mins or so at peak times between Heuston platform 10 and either platform 1 or 7 at Connolly. It would be quicker and less effort than having to change to the Luas and back again that 100s of commuters do every day.

yes agree. there would be more of the 2700s and i'm sure new couplers could be installed to allow doubling of sets should it be necessary? no gangways though which is annoying but never mind

Michael D Not Higgins

Captain Chaos wrote: »

The perfect units for this are the withdrawn 2700s. Run a 2 car set every 20 mins or so at peak times between Heuston platform 10 and either platform 1 or 7 at Connolly. It would be quicker and less effort than having to change to the Luas and back again that 100s of commuters do every day.

What about getting people from Heuston to Platform 10? It's about a half a km walk down the road. Then you miss a train and have to wait 20 mins. Might as well get the Luas that goes every 5 minutes and only takes 15 mins to get to Connolly.

Captain Chaos

Michael D Not Higgins wrote: »

What about getting people from Heuston to Platform 10? It's about a half a km walk down the road. Then you miss a train and have to wait 20 mins. Might as well get the Luas that goes every 5 minutes and only takes 15 mins to get to Connolly.

Same as walking from platform 7 in Connolly out to the Luas stop, it's a hike to get out of Connolly station at the best of times same as walking to platform 10 really. It's a good 500 metre walk. Same difference. The train, in theory, should be faster than a Luas stop to stop as 95% of the time the Luas has a 3min wait at O Connel street and another 3min wait at Bus Aras due to the light sequence.

Michael D Not Higgins

Captain Chaos wrote: »

Same as walking from platform 7 in Connolly out to the Luas stop, it's a hike to get out of Connolly station at the best of times same as walking to platform 10 really. It's a good 500 metre walk. Same difference. The train, in theory, should be faster than a Luas stop to stop as 95% of the time the Luas has a 3min wait at O Connel street and another 3min wait at Bus Aras due to the light sequence.

But 500m is the minimum distance to walk in Heuston. It can be twice that if you have to go from the other side of Heuston. It's also outside compared to within a station, and your 500m in Connolly is far from accurate as you'd be in the canal walking that far through the station.

LXFlyer

Starting this train from Platform 10 would never work. It would be far too messy in terms of connectivity, and ridiculous to expect people to walk all the way back from the main Heuston Station to Platform 10.

At the very least these trains should start at Hazelhatch where people would simply cross the platform or footbridge from their other train, and then serve all stations, including platform 10. At the same time, the 145 bus would be extended to Platform 10 and free transfers offered as far as the main station, thus retaining connectivity with the Quays area.

The trains will operate across the loop line to terminate at Grand Canal Dock offering a direct connection from the Kildare line to the CBD.

end of the road

Captain Chaos wrote: »

Same as walking from platform 7 in Connolly out to the Luas stop, it's a hike to get out of Connolly station at the best of times same as walking to platform 10 really. It's a good 500 metre walk. Same difference. The train, in theory, should be faster than a Luas stop to stop as 95% of the time the Luas has a 3min wait at O Connel street and another 3min wait at Bus Aras due to the light sequence.

both walks are the same distance? thats good news actually. i know i would certainly use this train service over the luas if i were to have to go to heuston

GM228

lxflyer wrote: »

Starting this train from Platform 10 would never work. It would be far too messy in terms of connectivity, and ridiculous to expect people to walk all the way back from the main Heuston Station to Platform 10.

At the very least these trains should start at Hazelhatch where people would simply cross the platform or footbridge from their other train, and then serve all stations, including platform 10. At the same time, the 145 bus would be extended to Platform 10 and free transfers offered as far as the main station, thus retaining connectivity with the Quays area.

The trains will operate across the loop line to terminate at Grand Canal Dock offering a direct connection from the Kildare line to the CBD.

Who said they will start at Platform 10? These will be trains to/from Kildare/Portlaoise and possibly additional trains from Newbridge and Hazelhatch bay platforms that will use the tunnel not a GCD-Heuston shuttle service, also unlikely that 2700s will be used for this.

It's only in the planing stage so too early to know for sure but I'm guessing a Platform 10-main concourse shuttle may operate like it previously did when Platform 10 was in use.

There are a few obstacles which need to be addressed before it happens though such as completion of the City Centre re-signalling and also track and signal alterations at Platforn 10 which will allow trains in both directions use the platform.

GM228

Captain Chaos

end of the road wrote: »

both walks are the same distance? thats good news actually.

I don't know if they are, in my mind they are about the same. I walk fairly quickly so 500metres is nothing to me really. When I lived around Howth Junction I used to drink across from Raheny station and would walk it alot even though it's well served by the DART. I walk that in 20-25mins even though it's 1.5km as the crow flies.

GM228

Captain Chaos wrote: »

I don't know if they are, in my mind they are about the same. I walk fairly quickly so 500metres is nothing to me really. When I lived around Howth Junction I used to drink across from Raheny station and would walk it alot even though it's well served by the DART. I walk that in 20-25mins even though it's 1.5km as the crow flies.

The exact distances are:

Connolly main concourse to Platform 7 = 273m or 317m to the furthest part of the platform.

Heuston main concourse to Platform 10 = 776m or 886m to the furthest part of the platforn.

GM228

LXFlyer

GM228 wrote: »

Who said they will start at Platform 10? These will be trains to/from Kildare/Portlaoise and possibly additional trains from Newbridge and Hazelhatch bay platforms that will use the tunnel not a GCD-Heuston shuttle service, also unlikely that 2700s will be used for this.

It's only in the planing stage so too early to know for sure but I'm guessing a Platform 10-main concourse shuttle may operate like it previously did when Platform 10 was in use.

There are a few obstacles which need to be addressed before it happens though such as completion of the City Centre re-signalling and also track and signal alterations at Platforn 10 which will allow trains in both directions use the platform.

GM228

Captain Chaos was suggesting it in post #3 above.

I fully understand what is involved in this plan - I was just refuting the suggestion above.

A crossover is planned north of platform 10 to allow bi-directional working to that platform.

GM228

lxflyer wrote: »

Captain Chaos was suggesting it in post #3 above.

I fully understand what is involved in this plan - I was just refuting the suggestion above.

A crossover is planned north of platform 10 to allow bi-directional working to that platform.

I missed that post!

GM228

ClovenHoof

Thank you Platform 11.

cgcsb

It'll be a welcome relief for luas commuters, the current squeeze between Heuston and Abbey st is unbearable

Captain Chaos

cgcsb wrote: »

It'll be a welcome relief for luas commuters, the current squeeze between Heuston and Abbey st is unbearable

What I always wonder is why the Luas bay platform at Heuston not used during peak times, timed to match big Irish Rail arrivals.

Between 4pm-6pm there can by enough people to fill an empty Luas 2 or 3 times over. Even with trams 5-7mins apart it's still crush load city. Commuters just don't want to take the bus options or it does not service their needs as well as Luas.

[Deleted User]

Captain Chaos wrote: »

What I always wonder is why the Luas bay platform at Heuston not used during peak times, timed to match big Irish Rail arrivals.

Between 4pm-6pm there can by enough people to fill an empty Luas 2 or 3 times over. Even with trams 5-7mins apart it's still crush load city. Commuters just don't want to take the bus options or it does not service their needs as well as Luas.

That's an extra tram though, do they have enough rolling stock?

Captain Chaos

Deleted User wrote: »

That's an extra tram though, do they have enough rolling stock?

Yeah, plenty I reckon. I pass the Red Cow depot every day during peak hours and there are always about another 8-10 trams parked up and then whatever else is inside getting major work.

The Red Line has 58 trams and I believe 2 are out of action with crash damage for a while now. They are in high usage and I'm not too well up on their maintenance schedules and down times.

thomasj

So can we forget about maynooth/northern line getting any extra trains.

Also what happened to plans for maynooth/northern trains to terminate at GCD?

Will be interesting to see how drumcondra copes with the extra passenger flow on match days and concert days.

Aard

Three things:

1. I hope they allow access to platform 10 from Clancy Quay, Conyngham Road, or St John's Road West. That way people from Islandbridge and Kilmainham will be able to use the new route without having to backtrack from the main entrance of Heuston.

2. Stick a Dublin Bikes station down there too. The one at the front of Heuston is very well used by traingoers. It's the exact same distance from P10 to the main concourse as it is from Trinity to Christchurch. About a 10 minute walk.

3. Name the station "Heuston West" or something, just to remind people that it's not really the same as Heuston station. Similarly, Heuston Luas stop will be closer to James's and Museum luas stops than P10.

end of the road

thomasj wrote: »

So can we forget about maynooth/northern line getting any extra trains.

Also what happened to plans for maynooth/northern trains to terminate at GCD?

Will be interesting to see how drumcondra copes with the extra passenger flow on match days and concert days.

trains terminating at GCD is still going ahead i believe when the works are done. i don't know about extra maynooth services i haven't heard anything, all though where the stock is going to come from i don't know as i can't see the 26 or 2800s coming back to dublin. all though maybe they might be able to have a couple of new services?

Greenmachine

Will believe all this when I see. This is being touted for years.

icdg

thomasj wrote: »

So can we forget about maynooth/northern line getting any extra trains.

Varadkar's constituency is largely Dublin 15, it would be amazing if as Minister he endorsed a policy that had direct adverse effects on his own constituency! of course he's moved on to Health since.

LXFlyer

thomasj wrote: »

So can we forget about maynooth/northern line getting any extra trains.

Also what happened to plans for maynooth/northern trains to terminate at GCD?

Will be interesting to see how drumcondra copes with the extra passenger flow on match days and concert days.

I don't see how this will impact on Drumcondra - we are talking one train per hour off-peak. That's not exactly going to put it under strain.

Peak frequency on the Maynooth line is fairly strong as it is from Clonsilla inwards, but I'd imagine that you will see more off-peak trains.

The northern line and Maynooth line trains will also use the turnback siding at GCD.

Aard

Is it possible atm to travel by train from Drumcondra to GCD without changing?

icdg

In that direction? Yes, but just one train a day, the 07:55 from Maynooth to Bray which reaches Drumcondra at 08:34.

Jamie2k9

What I always wonder is why the Luas bay platform at Heuston not used during peak times, timed to match big Irish Rail arrivals.

For whatever reason passengers don't seem keen on using that platform. They have ran services from it and in my experience a handful will use it while the majority will wait for normal services.

Believe it see regular use on Sundays

[Deleted User]

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

For whatever reason passengers don't seem keen on using that platform. They have ran services from it and in my experience a handful will use it while the majority will wait for normal services.

Believe it see regular use on Sundays

Do many people even know it exists? I didn't.

LXFlyer

Deleted User wrote: »

Do many people even know it exists? I didn't.

Well unless they are blind, it is there straight in front of them if they are standing on the main eastbound platform in front of Heuston.

Jamie2k9

Deleted User wrote: »

Do many people even know it exists? I didn't.

Well unless they are blind, it is there straight in front of them if they are standing on the main eastbound platform in front of Heuston.

It doesn't help when a tram from Tallaght/Saggert will nearly always arrive before the one in the bay departs but even if that wasn't the case I'm not sure it would still work. Remember once there was a packed platform at Heuston and maybe 20 or so boarded the tram on the center platform and it left and nobody seems that fussed.