thinkstoomuch1 wrote: » Your actually telling me what I know I'n I'm totally against those two players Football no relevance to cork hurling this year so we should keep the point Jbm and cuthbhert too completely different managers and you are forgetting jbm dropped him last year and cussen was never a full back for cork hurling Of course skills guts had part play Kilkenney win no questions Questions is that won't matter in as you pointed out in cork had no full back and shane o neill has lots courage and skill but you need a full back as specialsed position You seem sure Kilkenney be fine at full back Who would you think is full back?! Your going on bout shane o neill as cover over kilkenny full back issues Cork fans know we have full back issues It's not case glynn being better than o Neil Point is jj greatest full back ever is gone and Kilkenney now won't be able to foul so new rule will affect them Thry had much better chance saving nash way than now better the enemy you know and all that
thinkstoomuch1 wrote: » Some great news I belive on the way for cork gaa in the next week great great news.
N20 wrote: » ttm1 You can be 'wan tick biy'
ontheditch2 wrote: » TTM, what did Daly ever do to you. Your condescending manner in which you try to to get your argument across is fairly pathetic. People are entitled to their opinion, whether you like it or not. If your way of winning an argument, is to bore people to death with your essays, then you are right, most people wont bother responding. What Daly said is (not exact quote, but the same idea(read the book)) "that you have to go 90:10 split in favour of Hurling over the other stuff. In 2012, Dublin did it the other way round, and no matter how much stuff you do outside Hurling, if you don't get the ball first, none of the rest of it matters" Every single team in the world has an element of "science" to their preperation. But unless you get the stuff on the field right, no amount of science will win you the game. Are you counting "Psychological" as a science, i have no doubt you are. Because Daly is one of the best Psychological Managers in the Business. It was interesting that you lauded Niall Moran in one of your earlier quotes about "science" and today he is on about how it was getting too much in schools. What you regard as "science" appears to be a very very broad term that covers everything outside of the drills and exercises done on the pitch. Just because a college offer a course on a subject, doesn't make it a "science". As regards, your method of belittling others "knowledge" with your comments. If YOU were so knowledgeable on the aspects of the game, then i suggest you go down to your local club (are you a member of one??) and give a hand on the training field. p.s. Less is more sometimes.
thinkstoomuch1 wrote: » You were the one started the debate and a selection of few decided that science in sport was wrong You are right certain few here alright brought argument to absolutely ridiculous views With reference to mention of stupidity Only stupirdly on the topic s imo people actually don't bar few know understand concept science in sport
homeofhurling wrote: » why would kilkenny suffer from the new rule, do you not think skill and guts and blood didn't play any part in all the all irelands well the 10 under Cody anyway. who said Holden would be fullback for kilkenny maybe with Ballyhale. the only ones making noise about kilkenny not getting there own way would be most corkmen, and cork refs alot of it would be now that we are gone well ahead of cork on the roll of honour , as for Glynn lad fullback with ucc whats the story here, tell you he couldn't be any worse than Shane O'Neill has been for cork the last two years i suppose with Micheal Cussen back with the footballers he might get a run at fullback for the hurlers best of luck in 2015.cheers.
thinkstoomuch1 wrote: » Always sign of a lad looses debate when goes off tangent regards other players no relevant to the game Debate the point in question which is Kilkenney will suffer from new rule They can't have it all their own way We have actually replaced those players bar the rock Obviously not yet achieved same standard as rest but cork just need a full back You need to do more research from the home of hurling surely you know frank murphy is actually a Kilkenney man I belive originally Kilkenney may well find a full back but there going have huge trouble in holden is not a full back and glynn lad with ucc certainly isn't I do agree kilkenny won't take age fill full back like cork
seventh7 wrote: » 100% agree. I have seen underage players at 15 and on the current Cork squads that have undergone very heavy gym work. I have seen bodies on some of these kids that have been sculpted by intensive weight training. I have also noted also that some of the kids have hip problems and logic tells me that this may be coming from squatting with weights. This puts extreme pressure on the labrum which results in tears and excessive wear on still developing tissue. Incorrect use of weights in teenagers has very rapid short term results but long term consenquences. I can see extremely driven kids doing inappropiate things with regards to weight training with little or no supervision. The hurling must come first, the motor skills have to be developed, hand eye coordination is paramount. Build in a good stretching and mobility program and we start to build a player from the ground up. let them hurl day and night if they wish as long as they are not running around with weights they will come to no harm.
thinkstoomuch1 wrote: » That's the ist actual logic post I read here among other jargon be fair It's balanced views Nobody ever wanted athletes over hurling but it's impossible be hurler on modern game unless your an athlete first and foremost Daly spoke a huge amount nonsense when like you said he actually befitted from strength and conditions at dublin Every team won all ireland at any level has had huge part in strength conditions etc If daly can prove one team done this with just ten per cent split I'd take notice but it's like looking for needle in a haystack he won't find one where a team won all ireland with ten per cent split over team with fifty fifty It all about balance No team will won all ireland without balance of speed work agility and strength conditions and nutrition and basic skills game combination of real real tactical nous in management and game flow management I agree in development squads must be balanced but you got start young as proven starting at nineteen is too late Science proves it Problem is not the strength and conditions or gym work problem is how and when it's done Like there is a cork under age team at moment that currently do cardiovascular training and gym work some times same nights That's wrong as even average gym goer tell you you don't do weights same day as running etc as muscles are tired and you strain them increase risk of injury It has huge part of the game once done correctly and not like something you see out of a rocky movie
N20 wrote: » This argument is really getting bogged down Firstly Hurling and Football require different skill sets so what works for one may not work for another but depends on a player - I'm not sure these methods has advanced hurling in Kerry ? but I'm being a little churlish everyone agrees that science has advanced sport and improved things hugely for players, with knock on benefits for teams, clubs, spectTors etc, no one is suggesting we return to archaic methods of flogging players, no hydration, S&C, nutrition etc it's the guys who are making careers out of exploiting it to ridiculous levels and the managers that get suckered into placing too much emphasis on it versus the skills of the games, that I for one was raising questions about the irony is with all the science and progression we have, BURNOUT remains a huge issue for our players and the science and it's application does not seem to be addressing that The deliberate stupid interpretation of some posts has really dragged this argument into the mire
commonsense. wrote: » Seems to be a bit of this on this forum from what I can see. I'd say 'deliberate misinterpretation' for whatever reason. I suppose some people have nothing better to do and like to be controversial just for the sake of it.
ciarriaithuaidh wrote: » Sorry to butt in here now, but Kerry's approach to training, Strength & Conditioning changed completely under O'Neill. Pat Flanagan before him had taken things up a notch but O'Neill has taken it up a level again. When you hear the Gooch say he's the best trainer he ever worked with, then you know there's something special there. He is excellent for players also in that he doesn't flog them for 6-8 months. As can be seen by Kerry's league results in recent years, the aim is to have a mini-peak in fitness in July for Munster Final, then a lull (results dependant) followed by hitting peak fitness for the year in August. I have to laugh at the lads scoffing at Sports Science here given that there are still counties flogging players with Stone age training methods out there. I saw an interview recently with a Westmeath player going on about the "old school" approach of their current trainer and how he reckoned it was good..loads of laps etc..That said 2 things to me. 1. The trainer is a dinosaur with no clue how to train a modern team. 2. Players do not necessarily know what is best for them and in a lot of cases need to be told. Some people scoffing at the Ed Coughlan interview, specifically his mention of "weak eye" training. Now, fair enough, that is never going to be done except with a rare few high level teams and it certainly isn't a priority, but if you think its bullsh*t, you are mistaken. Coughlan has the academic credentials to back up what he is saying, whether you like him or not. All that being said, I do wonder where we are going with all this in terms of getting kids to keep playing our games. It's becoming less and less enjoyable to play at any level, even club level with all that's going on. I think a properly structured club and county calendar would help enormously for one thing but I don't trust the GAA to do it. The current proposal of "oh just finish everything in the calendar year" is head in the sand stuff and unrealistic.
N20 wrote: Just to clarify my position as there seems to be a bit of misinterpretation - deliberate or otherwise
Smith614 wrote: » What proof is there that science is the vital ingredient. I have seen no Leitrim, cavan, Wicklow coming on leaps and bounds with new scientific approaches. The same counties are coming out on top in the science era and the pre science era. Nothing magic happened in Kerry when O Neill was there but its just that the media have a love affair with the new phenomenon. I think Joe Brolly is talking a lot of sense on this whole issue.
thinkstoomuch1 wrote: » Good to see you changed your attuide, fair play, quite understandable with logic clearly showing nonsense was being spoken just my opinion of course
thinkstoomuch1 wrote: » You need to evaluate what has actually been said by me regsrde daly I never took away here ot any thread what he achieved in progress with dublin However he's reached a plateau and even said last year quote correctly he had out grown them and despite media experts saying had a chance I write them off Point I making you need understand is daly never won an all ireland coach yet o neill , mickey Harte, ger cunningham jack Pyke connor. Fotzmaurice. Mcguinness, gavin who are all big on sport science have so there logic I's actually backed up Cody like wise is as proven in to it Kinnerks the same David Matthews with cork hurling And Michael ryan or is it gearoid I think ex athlete with your own county and ex clarinbridge man Liam o donughe who on back room team also hugely in to science like eammon o shea and sheedy was Hurling must come first and foremost but you can't become hurlers now and not an athlete The game has changed your an athlete and a hurler I'm still waiting for anyone prove me team won all ireland without these so called gimmick but people going around in circles with opinion fair enough their entitled to them but actually haven't backed them up with any logic in fact imo
homeofhurling wrote: » don't worry we won't suffer to much with jj gone, we will get another one somewhere we always did , unlike cork who haven't replace the likes of the rock sean og, Joe deane and Ben O'Connor, as for Keherchange his tune, its no wonder Frank Murphy hasn't his nose it it i suppose its because a corkman made this mess.
dcrosskid wrote: » As I have said I haven't seen the article, (did someone post the link?) but what I will say is that the Dubs have been one of the most powerful and fittest teams over the last few years, which imo was a huge factor in them being able to compete with KK fairly well on a good few occasions during Daly's tenure. So I would be very surprised if Daly wasn't embracing sport sciences given the athletic make up of the Dubs. In fact many thought they had gone over board with their fitness and not concentrated on enough hurling. However I am slightly surprised that he would say its a 90/10 split at senior level (if that is what he said) because that is not the case. 50/50 would be a far more accurate estimate at the requirements a player needs now. Considering the amount of time spent in gyms, physio tables, pools, ice baths, stretching, foam rolling, watching their diets, that would accumulate to an awful amount of time. Having seen many Tipp players in my own local gym I can testify to the long hours they put in off season, as i'm sure every serious county player is doing now. Therefor I would conclude that Daly was referring to his new role of looking after younger players by promoting a 90/10 split focusing on hurling.
thinkstoomuch1 wrote: » Yes nash was the first ever to do it and no one else did I don't think so and it's been well proven at this stage Davy john Fenton many others did it If I was a Kilkenney man I'd actually be leaning towards nash old style as the wheel I fear will turn a full circle as now goalies have no chance save penalty and kilkenny now awesome jj retires will actually suffer imo hugely and their days stopping man and ball are long gone as any penalty will be a goal Interesting as season prevail to watch Eddie keher change he's tune imo
