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Child Item

Portugal escorts Russian Ship away from its coast

losthorizon

Coming so soon after the Swedish incidents (although there were reports that that may have been a Dutch a sub) Russian ships and planes have been spotted off the coast of Portugal.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Cd6qFa7T-0

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cerastes

Looks more like research ship (read research or listening post/spying platform?)

dxhound2005 wrote: »

The rouble has dropped by 25% in value against the US dollar this year, to it's lowest value ever and continues to fall.

Why does that seem like a fairly dangerous thing? that concerns me a bit more than many things Ive read or heard.

The Backwards Man wrote: »

Russia is like the aul lad in the pub that won a boxing medal in 1958, before the drink got the better of him. Always sparring and simey dimeying with the young lads and spoiling for a row, acting the hard man, 'look into my eyes and don't blink' type stuff.

Sooner or later somebody will have just about enough of him and punch his lights out.

Well, if the aul lad just got younger, fitter, stronger? the Russians may not have the quantities they once had in the soviet Union, but they certainly have some more capable modern weapons, subs, aircraft, AAMs, not to mention nukes, lots of nukes.

DeadHand wrote: »

Your hilarious analogy would be accurate, if only the aul lad had the capability to kill every other person in the pub (nuclear power, remember)?

By "punch his lights out" I imagine you mean some kind of attack on or invasion of Russia. Remind me, what happened last time someone attempted to invade Russia? Who is in the Crimea now? Who could be in Stockholm, Kiev or Warsaw within a week if they decided to roll?

Aul fella in a pub... Right.

I at least feel a bit more confident that the Finns and Swedes will hold them back, better than former warsaw pact/soviet states which seem to fear Russia more, they just seem to waltz through those countries.

DanWall wrote: »

Why don't other countries play tit for tat and invade Russian territory/water

Presume they have to get permission to open fire with blank charges like that, noise etc
for some reason, I just see someone toppling that gantry into the ship or off the harbour wall, doesnt look secured.

Egginacup

And this from the BBC:

A Portuguese navy ship has escorted a Russian oceanic research vessel away from Portugal's maritime economic zone.
The incident happened early on Wednesday, Portugal's defence minister said. The Russian ship was in international waters, more than 12 nautical miles (22km) from the coast.

STOP with the bullsh1t, OP.

Egginacup

"John Kerry has definitive proof, through social media and twitter feeds that the crew did in fact know who shot down MH-17 and also supplied the mythical nerve gas to Bashar Assad"

You'll have to wait for a full investigation until 2016 (after the election of Jeb Bush) and it's all classified anyway.

Yurt2

Is Russia that powerful in reality? Despite its population its economy is only marginally bigger than basket case Italy.

Egginacup

Yurt! wrote: »

Is Russia that powerful in reality? Despite its population its economy is only marginally bigger than basket case Italy.

Are you familiar with the phrase

"It's not the size of the dog in the fight but the size of the fight in the dog that counts"?

The Vietnamese handed America's ass to them. The Afghans have done the same to the Russians, Americans, and British (4 times). The Lebanese have thumped Israel (a nuclear powered, tank wielding warhorse) in 40 days.

Go and attack Russia. Compare notes with Napoleon and Hitler and send them back to us from hell.

My name is URL

Yurt! wrote: »

Is Russia that powerful in reality? Despite its population its economy is only marginally bigger than basket case Italy.

Yeah, but it's mainly made up of natural resources that the rest of the world depend on.

cerastes

Yurt! wrote: »

Is Russia that powerful in reality? Despite its population its economy is only marginally bigger than basket case Italy.

No country that is deemed powerful is ever as powerful as they seem,
apart from the fact none of them could get the greater portion of their aircraft or ships moving through naturally occuring problems, some can barely afford it (UK?).
Some can operate smaller forces more efficiently by multiplying their effectiveness, with capable weapons means the cost to deliver bombs on target accurately is less.

Anyway, all that military might (of anyone), might end up being circumvented. Russia do seem like they would spend more time on basic preparations and having a nation wound up nationalistically might make it easier to conscript people for any military adventures, more so than that, they seem like they could have the willingness or even having the resources geared to or devoted to mobilisation, whereas more western countries seem more willingly to line their pockets and fcuk over their fellow citizens in business ventures, ie not so nationalistic or patriotic, mostly.

Iwasfrozen

Egginacup wrote: »

Are you familiar with the phrase

"It's not the size of the dog in the fight but the size of the fight in the dog that counts"?

The Vietnamese handed America's ass to them. The Afghans have done the same to the Russians, Americans, and British (4 times). The Lebanese have thumped Israel (a nuclear powered, tank wielding warhorse) in 40 days.

Go and attack Russia. Compare notes with Napoleon and Hitler and send them back to us from hell.

America's strategy is not to invade Russia but to surround it with highly militerised allied nations to contain it from the lands it historically had control over and force it into isolation.

So far that plan is working a treat. They have the Baltics, Poland and Turkey in Nato and on the Pacific side Korea and Japan as major non Nato allies. Russia is surrounded on all sides with no allies save Belarus and Kazakhstan.

stevedublin

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

Russia is surrounded on all sides with no allies save Belarus and Kazakhstan.

and China

...and maybe Iran

stevedublin

Egginacup wrote: »

The Lebanese have thumped Israel (a nuclear powered, tank wielding warhorse) in 40 days.

:eek: source?

Gatling

Looks like Russia is taking eastern Ukraine all together tons of tanks, heavy artillery and troops flooding across the border from Russia today,
And more airspace incursions taking place across europe

Elmer Blooker

Yurt! wrote: »

Is Russia that powerful in reality? Despite its population its economy is only marginally bigger than basket case Italy.

Its the untapped vast natural resources in Russia, particularly in Siberia thats the problem. Uncle Sam can't get his greedy hands on them - not until there's "regime change" in Russia and a puppet regime like Ukraine is installed, if thousands have to die in order to loot the place so what?

Lapin

Egginacup wrote: »

Well that's news. A friend who worked at the bar served a rake of US Marines and none of them looked like chaplains. Come to think of it, they were all allowed smoke inside a little compound in the terminal building.

That would be the smoking area.

Why wouldn't they be allowed to smoke there?

Anyone else can.

Lapin

Deleted User wrote: »

I think most people in Ireland swallow the Western media view on Russia as the "bad" guys regardless of the facts.

They are not perfect, far from it, but I think the world is better off having a counterpoint to the American world dominance.

So by that rationale, Russia is the obvious counterpoint?

Anyone who remembers the cold war would say fuck that.

With the emergence of the other BRIC powers, American world dominance is already becoming more and more diluted in any case.

Maximus Alexander

US GDP is around 8 times that of Russia. Annual defense spending in by the US is more than 7 times that of Russia and 3.5 times that of China, who spend the second most globally. It seems to me that people way overstate the might of Russia, who have been declining in relevance for the past three decades. Perhaps this is due to an outdated image of the Soviet Union during World War 2 and throughout the cold war.

There is no doubt that they are still a world power, but they're also pretty far from a superpower. Putin might be a despicable person, but he's no idiot. He'll know exactly how far he can push and where the line is, he's not going to go on a Hitler style romp across Europe.

Slot Machine

DeadHand wrote: »

The EU should stick to what it knows- the bullying of the ordinary people of Europe, social engineering, the erosion of democracy, cultural suicide/defeatism and self loathing.

You forgot to warn them about the lizard people! :mad:

bear1

Yurt! wrote: »

Is Russia that powerful in reality? Despite its population its economy is only marginally bigger than basket case Italy.

Care to explain that part?

Gatling

Egginacup wrote: »

Well that's news. A friend who worked at the bar served a rake of US Marines and none of them looked like chaplains. Come to think of it, they were all allowed smoke inside a little compound in the terminal building.

If you think that American supplies and personnel don't pass through Shannon

Were they tooled up for war ,

Body armour?

Side arms ?

M16s ?

Grenades ?

So basically service personnel for the United States disembarked an aircraft at a stop over and had a pint ,

Shock ,horror

topper75

dxhound2005 wrote: »

The rouble has dropped by 25% in value against the US dollar this year, to it's lowest value ever and continues to fall.

Not to mention falling prices for oil. That is the real noose tightening around Putin's neck.

BoJack Horseman

topper75 wrote: »

Not to mention falling prices for oil. That is the real noose tightening around Putin's neck.

Not his neck.
His multi-billion personal fortune will remain as is

Interest rates are at 10%
Inflation in Russia is over 8%
Food inflation is at 15+%
They have spent 1/4 of their total gold & currency reserves this year alone.

If there is a noose, its around the Russian peoples neck, not Putins.

topper75

Aye not initially his neck but over the medium/long term the people are not going to sit there and take it.

The Diabolical Monocle

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

US GDP is around 8 times that of Russia. Annual defense spending in by the US is more than 7 times that of Russia and 3.5 times that of China, who spend the second most globally. It seems to me that people way overstate the might of Russia, who have been declining in relevance for the past three decades. Perhaps this is due to an outdated image of the Soviet Union during World War 2 and throughout the cold war.

There is no doubt that they are still a world power, but they're also pretty far from a superpower. Putin might be a despicable person, but he's no idiot. He'll know exactly how far he can push and where the line is, he's not going to go on a Hitler style romp across Europe.

Worth noting however that there are macroeconomic factors to consider when the spending is compared.

The wage rate, and pension cost for example would be considerably lower for the average Russian soldier/sailor than in the US.
After taking personnel costs out of the equation the spend difference would be considerably lower.
Certainly US will still be outspending by a multiple but not as high as 8:1.

Back to Europe; Russia knows better, Putin knows better, but Putin may not be able to control his ego. Sooner he's fully out of the Kremlin the better for all.

Iwasfrozen

stevedublin wrote: »

and China

...and maybe Iran

China isn't a formal aly. Neither is Iran, neither can be trusted.

Beano

Iranoutofideas wrote: »

The amount of ****e that people spout on here about Putin and Russia is unbelievable.

Russia not relevant?

That's interesting. Because Forbes just released their most powerful list.

This is what they had to say about the list

It boiled down to Obama vs Putin.

And Putin came out on top. With damn good reason too.

Putin actually has balls?

Gatling

Am I the only one who thinks putin is a repressed homosexual all this macho bravado , riding horses bare chested, wrestling bears,
Makes you think does he wear lace lingerie under his presidential suits

Beano

Gatling wrote: »

Am I the only one who thinks putin is a repressed homosexual all this macho bravado , riding horses bare chested, wrestling bears,
Makes you think does he wear lace lingerie under his presidential suits

You're not the first person to notice that. The whole banning of gay propaganda is a bit odd as well. Perhaps he doesnt like being reminded?

DeadHand

Gatling wrote: »

Am I the only one who thinks putin is a repressed homosexual all this macho bravado , riding horses bare chested, wrestling bears,
Makes you think does he wear lace lingerie under his presidential suits

What relevance does his sexuality have beyond something you seem to enjoy thinking about?

DeadHand

Beano wrote: »

You're not the first person to notice that. The whole banning of gay propaganda is a bit odd as well. Perhaps he doesnt like being reminded?

More a cultural thing than an idea direct from Putin. Russia is still an ultra conservative society.

Anyway, the laws, while ridiculous, are rarely enforced.

Iwasfrozen

DeadHand wrote: »

What relevance does his sexuality have beyond something you seem to enjoy thinking about?

Well he is pretty dreamy...

DeadHand wrote: »

More a cultural thing than an idea direct from Putin. Russia is still an ultra conservative society.

Doesn't matter what way you try to cut it, it's wrong and Russia isn't doing itself any favors internationally. It's easy propaganda for the west.

Gatling

DeadHand wrote: »

What relevance does his sexuality have beyond something you seem to enjoy thinking about?

Welcome to democracy and the right to speak without fear intimation or fear of been murdered if your a journalist from those who abuse their power