listermint wrote: » What failed status quo?? The only failed part was that money that was meant to be for the infrastructure was pushed into other mismanaged slushy funds. FAS, HSA amongst them. The infrastructure can and was being managed on tight budgets by existing councils. But they were devoid of funding. Address the spending and the qwangoes like you said you would FG which will free up cash to go where its meant to go.
listermint wrote: » I dont know, Do you ? Have you asked anyone or are you just making this crap up. That people are protesting due to a few snap headlines. Have you even been following this story since the start of the year ? Il bite. Outline all the great things Irish Water has achieved so far to warrant your unabated admiration..............
PropJoe10 wrote: » Fair points, thanks for your input. It seems to me that Irish Water has been one of the biggest PR disasters in the last 30-40 years. They had an opportunity to do this right and have completely thrown that opportunity away with their reckless spending and total arrogance. A standing charge obviously wouldnt have been ideal but at least they would've been making money to put into the water infrastructure, which as far as I'm aware, is the main cause of the wasting of water due to leaking pipes. Its going to be interesting to see what happens!
fxotoole wrote: » Direct debits are full access, as you have no control over how much the utility can take out of your account.
hju6 wrote: » No they are not full access, are you saying they know how much you spend each month? Do they get your bank statement?
hju6 wrote: » After this debacle no one is going to be elected or re-elected by going any where near water charges.
Little CuChulainn wrote: » Providing a ppsn is much safer than providing bank details. A ppsn is simply an identifier. It's like giving someone your phone number. They can check if its yours easily enough but they don't get access to anything on your phone just by having it.
Banjo String wrote: » Well if you want to treat it the same as any other utility bill, we'll start with this question. What other utility company operates a two tiered pricing structure, one price for people who blindly hand over their PPS number, and another pricing tier that punishes those for refusing to hand it over, even though the legality of them actually asking for it is even being doubted by the DSP?
Grandpa Hassan wrote: » No major party will have a straight elimination of water charges in their manifesto. The only debate is about the execution / structure and level of exemption for the less well off
Guy:Incognito wrote: » So scrap free allowances and everyone pays for every litre. Do(or did, nor sure what they still get covered on) oaps have to provide ppsn's to get allowances for phone or any other things?
shinzon wrote: » Every single day I look at this thread and its the same thing, going round and round in circles spouting the same pro-anti water mantras, honestly the mods should look at closing this thread because truly what is it accomplishing, absolutely nothing. The anti water meter people will never convince the pro people and vice versa. Its great to have a debate but this is just the same **** over and over.
Little CuChulainn wrote: » I suppose the easiest way to satisfy the ppsn fearmongers would be to move the registration of allowances to social welfare for processing. You send your application to the, they confirm your allowances and then notify IW of the house occupancy.
Banjo String wrote: » Jesus, you must let the viper direct debit you so. Pretty sure Vodafone, 3, Sky, Airtricity etc all either email me, or post out a bill to me with my estimated direct debit amount .. If it's way above the norm, I'll question it, no explanation or resolution , I'll instruct the bank to cancel it.
fxotoole wrote: » But there's still the potential for it to be "way above the norm", unlike a standing order.
Banjo String wrote: » Which you will be notified in the form of a bill, usually two weeks before the date of the debit. A direct debit agreement isn't like handing the company your atm card and pincode and telling them "work away lads".
Guy:Incognito wrote: » Just going back to the reasons for peoples objections to the charges. The guy from right2water was on the radio earlier and he seems to be claiming the protests as theirs so if thats the case can we assume their reasons are the peoples too? They'd be the only group whos banners/posters I can remember off hand anyway. Heres whats in their about section: About the campaign The United Nations “Recognizes the right to safe and clean drinking water and sanitation as a human right that is essential for the full enjoyment of life and all human rights” – UN Resolution 64/292, July 2010. Who are we? If you believe that water is a human right then we are you! The provision of sufficient water and sanitation is an essential public service and a human right recognised by the United Nations. It should be freely available to all regardless of wealth or income. All citizens need clean drinking water and quality sanitation. Right2Water.ie is a public campaign by activists, citizens, community groups, political parties/individuals and trade unionists who are calling for the Government to recognise and legislate for access to water as a human right. We are demanding the Government abolish the planned introduction of water charges. Why we’re against water charges Water charges will discriminate against working people and the unemployed in favour of the wealthy and are another regressive tax taking vital money out of the pockets of people and out of our economy. Our public water system is already paid for through general taxation which is progressive and we wish it to remain that way. They just seem against paying for water from what I can see.
hju6 wrote: » Not really when it's allready paid for via taxation
fxotoole wrote: » Not anymore.
fxotoole wrote: » Social Welfare would still need your PPSN to verify it's you. i.e. How do they tell two different David Murphy's with the same place of birth and same date of birth apart?
Little CuChulainn wrote: » Like I said, you send your application to Social Welfare instead of IW. They confirm your pps numbers and then notify Irish Water of the number of occupants in each home.
listermint wrote: » It still is btw.
Guy:Incognito wrote: » We should have a nice big budget surplus so...... It seems to have been missed the last couple of times but I'll ask again. Have those tax additions covered every cent spent on water to date plus asurplus to parrot the infrastructure investment that everyone agreeds is needed?
the groutch wrote: » for those who were giving about at Garda resources being "wasted" protecting meter installers.http://www.rte.ie/news/2014/1029/655530-irish-water/
shinzon wrote: » Every single day I look at this thread and its the same thing, going round and round in circles spouting the same pro-anti water mantras, honestly the mods should look at closing this thread because truly what is it accomplishing, absolutely nothing. The anti water meter people will never convince the pro people and vice versa. Its great to have a debate but this is just the same **** over and over. Either Irish water will be killed off or it wont Shin
