nav[aria-label="Primary Navigation"] { padding: 0; & ul { list-style: none; width: 100%; display: flex; flex-direction: row; justify-content: start; align-items: start; gap: 30px; padding: 0; & li { margin: 0; } & ul li { list-style: none; } } }

Child Item

Is it self defeatist to say that some men are meant to be alone??‏

SharpshooterTom

I'm just beginning to wonder about this because I've recently turned 28 (so I'm not exactly a kid anymore) and I've never been in a relationship, never kissed a girl, and and yes not surprisingly I'm still a virgin LOL. And whats more depressing is that I've never been remotely close in actually having any of those experiences!

If I am being hoenst I've been plagued with all sorts of social problems throughout my teenage years and adult life, social anxiety (putting people off me as if I smell of B.O.) which lead to me socially avoiding people (I felt I was so unappealing to people I felt I had no choice) and so a viscous cycle had then ensured. This continued throughout school and university to the point where I snapped and fell into deep depression and few years back (extremely low self esteem) I attempted suicide.

I got help though with therapy and CBT (I used to post in the depression thread in AH and people there were a great help!), so I'm ok now, I'm improving aspects of my life. But I've still not yet improved aspects of my social life greatly in any real way. Sure I'm not as socially anxious, and certainly not socially avoidant, but I still don't have any real friends. I get the impression I'm just not that appealing as a person and perhaps its the way its meant to be.

I mean in the 40 year old virgin, he at least he had a happy ending, unless I went to an escort, there's every chance I'm probably going to die this way! :eek:

Is it too self defeatist to suggest that some men, whether they like it or not, are destined to be alone for the rest of their lives? Is it too unrealistic for some us to contemplate a relationship?

Find more posts tagged with

Quick Links

Comments

diveout

paddy1990 wrote: »

Well I appreciate your comment. I'd say i am a pessimist at heart. What really changed me was when i was able to act like a c*nt to girls and still get them, while my good mates treat them much better and get nowhere. A few girls actually im convinced never even liked my personality but had no qualms with giving me their bodies. It's kind of like realizing that your favourite movie star was actually a fraud. I've seen how downright shallow women are. I know the girls i'm with are mainly with me because of my looks. If i looked like Danny Devito, they wouldn't even look at me. And i'm the same. if they looked like a fat old warpig I wouldn't touch them either.

men are more honest about this though, to be fair.

I guess i just hate the entire dynamic. We are all genetically wired to be slaves to LMS, simple as that. And the guys who have a low LMS, like my unfortunate mates, are doomed to be struggle for scraps. what did i ever do to deserve what they can't get? they deserve success with women far more than me and women treat them like dogs if they try to chat them up.

i don't understand my own psychology but i'd say it's a combination of the above factors that annoys me

The fact that women so brazenly lie about this is what annoys me the most I guess. There were girls in the ladies lounge saying that a full blown disfigured burns victim should have no problem finding women to date him. meanwhile they wouldnt touch him.

I'm not sure whether it's stupidity or cognitive dissonance.

the hopeful feminized men that buy into it provide me with nothing but laughter though.

I think this is a crock of **** to be honest. If you are ugly, then maybe, but very few people are really that ugly.

Secondly, I can look objectively at someone, man or women, and think yes they are very good looking, nice physique what have you.

But none of that has anything to do with chemistry, and chemistry is where the draw will be.

I think you are just angry that these girls like you for superficial reasons. You are mean to them and they use you for sex anyway. Well... ya know...don't be mean and you might attract someone who wont use you.

pwurple

Lmao at "feminized men". Meaning: if you don't agree with me, then you are all smelly girls. This kid is a teenager at best!

paleoperson

Now that he's brought it up, I've wondered before if trolling isn't a little homoerotic, not in a typical way as the vast majority of homosexuals are but a promiscuous sense. Enjoying prancing around acting "silly", getting attention from (mainly) a bunch of guys and enjoying it when they get a bit rough with him.

But the thing is that he's telling absurd lies, and lies are damaging. I think it's worth repeating that almost everything he's said is a complete lie. It's all well and good for who are old enough to know better, but there could be people out there who think that there might be actually something to what he's saying, affecting their life perception and decisions, and that's not right.

Bafucin

paleoperson wrote: »

It's all well and good for who are old enough to know better, but there could be people out there who think that there might be actually something to what he's saying, affecting their life perception and decisions, and that's not right.

I don't think you need to worry I don't think anyone believes it. And if they are silly enough to there is no hope for them anyway.:rolleyes:

Bafucin

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

My point was that a lot of women prefer older men. I might have done a better job of articulating it if I'd used a 38 year old guy with a 26 year old woman as an example instead. I completely take your point though.

I have observed the opposite. I think most people prefer a partner with no more than a five yr age gap. People generally like a partner roughly around their own age. I think of age gaps as the exception really and that is what I have observed.

It is not something I usually see.

Bafucin

paddy1990 wrote: »

Not true. Most couples are around the same age. 7-10 year age difference is far from the norm.

This is the only thing in your post that I have observed to be true.

Bafucin

paddy1990 wrote: »

Well I appreciate your comment. I'd say i am a pessimist at heart. What really changed me was when i was able to act like a c*nt to girls and still get them, while my good mates treat them much better and get nowhere. A few girls actually im convinced never even liked my personality but had no qualms with giving me their bodies. It's kind of like realizing that your favourite movie star was actually a fraud. I've seen how downright shallow women are. I know the girls i'm with are mainly with me because of my looks.

Some guys are exactly the same. I would never be a good looking girl unless she was a decent person.

If you do act like a c**t to anyone of any gender ...then YOU are the bad person.

There are some awful girls out there I would never bother with them.

SoupMonster

Paddy might like to read "The Object of Desire: How Being Objectified Creates Sexual Pressure for Women in Heterosexual Relationships" available at http://pwq.sagepub.com/content/early/2014/07/31/0361684314544679.full.pdf

"They found that men who frequently objectify their partner's bodies by excessively focusing on their appearance are more likely to feel shame about the shape and size of their partner's body which in turn is related to increased sexual pressure (i.e., the belief that men expect sex and that it is a woman's role to provide sex for her partner) and sexual coercion, both in general and through violence and manipulation. ... The data also supported the idea that women internalize objectification from their partners. This internalization is related to feeling shame about their bodies, a decrease in asserting themselves, and a decrease in expressing what they do and do not want to do sexually." (See Rhianna, Nigella, Cheryl Cole. Pretty people don't necessarily have it easier.)

Does Paddy objectify women and have a propensity for shaming and coercion? TBH, this is how I read his posts.

For the OP.
Study: "The preferred traits of mates in a cross-national study of heterosexual and homosexual men and women: an examination of biological and cultural influences." Abstract here http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17380374
"Across all participants, the traits ranked most important were: intelligence, humour, honesty, kindness, overall good looks, face attractiveness, values, communication skills, and dependability. ... Women ranked honesty, humour, kindness, and dependability more important than men did."

Study: "The Object of Sexual Desire: Examining the 'What' in 'What Do You Desire?'" Abstract here http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25131552, looks at desire in the context of long-term relationships.
"Women were significantly more likely to endorse desire for intimacy, emotional closeness, love, and feeling sexually desirable than men."

Study: "Kind toward whom? Mate preferences for personality traits are target specific" (http://www.cep.ucsb.edu/papers/LukaszewskiRoney2010.pdf)
The key take-away seems to be that any male dominant behaviour should only be directed towards romantic rivals, and men find this attractive in women too. Inflicting reputational damage on other women is a good strategy for women, men like it!

The OP only seems to lack the communication skills and the confidence it brings, hope is not lost. Many women in the world, and there are billions of them, want exactly what he wants.

[Deleted User]

ThomasFlynn wrote: »

I'm just beginning to wonder about this because I've recently turned 28 (so I'm not exactly a kid anymore) and I've never been in a relationship, never kissed a girl, and and yes not surprisingly I'm still a virgin LOL. And whats more depressing is that I've never been remotely close in actually having any of those experiences!

If I am being hoenst I've been plagued with all sorts of social problems throughout my teenage years and adult life, social anxiety (putting people off me as if I smell of B.O.) which lead to me socially avoiding people (I felt I was so unappealing to people I felt I had no choice) and so a viscous cycle had then ensured. This continued throughout school and university to the point where I snapped and fell into deep depression and few years back (extremely low self esteem) I attempted suicide.

I got help though with therapy and CBT (I used to post in the depression thread in AH and people there were a great help!), so I'm ok now, I'm improving aspects of my life. But I've still not yet improved aspects of my social life greatly in any real way. Sure I'm not as socially anxious, and certainly not socially avoidant, but I still don't have any real friends. I get the impression I'm just not that appealing as a person and perhaps its the way its meant to be.

I mean in the 40 year old virgin, he at least he had a happy ending, unless I went to an escort, there's every chance I'm probably going to die this way! :eek:

Is it too self defeatist to suggest that some men, whether they like it or not, are destined to be alone for the rest of their lives? Is it too unrealistic for some us to contemplate a relationship?

I haven't read the therad but I will advice to the best of my ability. Well body odour is not good and you should make sure you shower regularly to stop that from happening. I am sure you have some positive aspects but you just can't see that cause you are down on yourself. If you want to attract women you have to let them see your good qualities whether that is humour, looks, personality etc. I would think to help improve your look you could get a haircut, new clothes, keep clean, groomed, exercise to keep in shape etc doing some of the above might help you feel better about yourself ( you have to love yourself before someone else will).

I would say try online dating I haven't tried it myself but a good few of my friends have with success and I can tell you my friends that did online dating were nothing special some were below average in the looks departments and still managed to get dates. Get some good photos of yourself and put effort into the writing on your profile this should help you get attention. When you are messaging girls make sure you put effort into the messages you send and dont come on to strong. Make sure you personalise every message so it doesn't look like you are just mass emailing different girls.

On the topic of escorts if you want to lose your virginity this might be a controversial opinion but getting an escort and being with a women might actually give you some confidence, which might help you have more confidence in meeting women to date. The topic of escorts everyone will have different opinions and I don't see anything wrong with them but I don't think we are allowed talk about escorts on this forum so I'll just leave the escort talk at that.

The 40 year old virgin is a movie and you will not die alone unless you choose too. There is someone for everyone on this planet and you just haven't found her yet. Just have patience and make sure to put effort in and it will come.

Bafucin

SoupMonster wrote: »

Study: "Kind toward whom? Mate preferences for personality traits are target specific" (http://www.cep.ucsb.edu/papers/LukaszewskiRoney2010.pdf)
The key take-away seems to be that any male dominant behaviour should only be directed towards romantic rivals, and men find this attractive in women too. Inflicting reputational damage on other women is a good strategy for women, men like it!

The OP only seems to lack the communication skills and the confidence it brings, hope is not lost. Many women in the world, and there are billions of them, want exactly what he wants.

So be kind towards the one you want

someone who is relatively unkind toward many classes of people may still be highly desirable as a mate if they romantic partners.

I think i kind of intuitively do this anyway doesn't everyone? I treat people who are important to me with a lot of kindness. The rest can **** off.

I think that article is actually one of the few links worth reading on here.

I have always gone for girls who treat me and others with a lot of deference. It's the thing I look for how do you treat others and myself. How do you treat people near you. How do you talk to them and how do you talk about people in your life.

It's all very well being pretty but if she hasn't got that I won't initiate anything.

I think it is a good rule of thumb to go by.

Likewise, it is entirely possible that
people may prefer that their partners direct opposite patterns
of behavior toward different classes of individuals (e.g.,
dominant behaviors toward unrelated rivals but nondominant
or even subordinate behaviors toward self and family). If
true, such target-specific mate preferences could fundamen-
tally challenge accepted conclusions regarding the most
preferred traits in an ideal partner by demonstrating that
preferences are importantly qualified by the targets of behavioral acts

I will have to read that again tomorrow it's a bit late!

[Deleted User]

ThomasFlynn wrote: »

If I am being hoenst I've been plagued with all sorts of social problems throughout my teenage years and adult life, social anxiety (putting people off me as if I smell of B.O.) which lead to me socially avoiding people (I felt I was so unappealing to people I felt I had no choice) and so a viscous cycle had then ensured. This continued throughout school and university to the point where I snapped and fell into deep depression and few years back (extremely low self esteem) I attempted suicide.

I think some of you need to re-read the OP.

He's saying the social anxiety puts people of as if he smells of BO, not that he does.

Bafucin

Karsini wrote: »

I think some of you need to re-read the OP. He's saying the social anxiety puts people of as if he smells of BO, not that he does.

Usually people have no love life because of their problems rather than they have problems because they have no love life.

A lot of men like Paddy for instance blame women rather than realize they have an issue.

The OP has a problem with other people. I would wager his anxiety is not limited to socializing either.

Some men do have problems limited to connecting to women but it's usually part of a larger issue making a deeper intimacy based connection rather than anything to do with women.

If someone says all the world is an asshole then the world is not the problem they are.

The OP needs to feel better in life and in his own skin anything else is a band aid.

I think the real issue is he fears that he will always be alone because no one will accept him because even if he works on himself it is likely he might be of an anxious disposition or he fears things will not improve.

OP things will get better. And you will meet the right person for you when you are ready. These things are not the solution though.

There is more to life than women.

I think most men who feel women are the be all and end all don't have deep relationships with others and a support network. Having those deep relationships will help show you that's what women are for. I think a lot of guys reach their thirties and are not even sure what relationships are there for.

You are not MEANT to be alone you create that reality for yourself and if you believe it then you will make that happen. Create your life for yourself. You are doing it subconsciously. You are possibly chasing away people in your life already both men and women.

Be good with you first.

[Deleted User]

Karsini wrote: »

I think some of you need to re-read the OP. He's saying the social anxiety puts people of as if he smells of BO, not that he does.

Yeah I read that wrong my mistake. Ignore that part of my previous post

Mike747

pwurple wrote: »

Lmao at "feminized men". Meaning: if you don't agree with me, then you are all smelly girls. This kid is a teenager at best!

He has a point. Feminists are doing their level best to create a society where gender roles are screwed up, male sexuality is demonized, masculinity is a dirty word and boys grow up without strong male role models.

And then women wonder why men are too shy to approach them!

SharpshooterTom

diveout wrote: »

Female here. I think you need to stop thinking in general big abstractions about men and women, you are just enforcing the whole otherness of the opposite sex.

Oh I don't normally, I suppose its because I don't have a lot of experience with the opposite sex generally and then I hear/read so much about women having it easier, ladies can get a shag anytime they want and all this stuff, and all I'm doing here is just asking others whether or not these 'stereotypes' are true (because I don't really know). Having said that I don't tend to categorise men and women so broadly as I know its unhelpful to think in those terms. Although it is worth noting statistically women are actually less likely to still be virgins at 40 than men are (1.2% to 0.3% according to a US government study on sexual behaviour), but I take your point regardless I don't draw huge conclusions based on somebody's sex.

diveout wrote:

Everyone is vulnerable, everyone cocks it up, everyone has masks. And alot of insecurties about what other people think of you are pure fantasy because rationally speaking you cannot have any idea of what people think of you. It's all your imagination.

Yes I agree but you need to understand however I've not had any friends since the age of 13, as much as I've avoided people, many people actively have avoided me also and then when I try to speak to people and initiate conversations at school or uni or whatever people have looked and acted uncomfortable wanting to get away from me, because I was so awkward. Time and time again throughout school people reacted negatively/uncomfortably towards me every time I went near them, so that's when I started deliberately avoiding people, compounding my problems even more so making it worse. I decided to go into the halls for my first year at uni (BIG mistake!), I said hello to a few people and went into the kitchen and never came out of my room. I hardly knew anyone, and I'm sure most of those guys thought (and rightfully so) that I was weird/strange/creepy. But I was convinced the entire world hated me at that time and didn't want me ruining their social experience with all the 'normal' people so by avoiding people I felt I was helping them. I was crying out for help then in truth but my parents kept telling me I was normal/nothing wrong with me/you'll grow out of it, it was only when I attempted suicide with my increasing depression that I knew I needed help.

diveout wrote:

Dating takes risks for both you and the other person. That is just how it is. All this advise about joining social groups.... that is not for everyone. If you are introverted, that will absolute you exhaust you and you will have nothing to give.

Sorry I'm in disagreement with this. I may not overly enjoy some activities sure but how else can I be expected to improve my social skills and create those social opportunities otherwise? Surely that's the whole point if somebody is naturally introverted is put myself out of my comfort zone and ultimately defeat my social anxiety? It 'exhausts' me and have 'nothing to give' is because I'm not used to those situations in the first place and don't have the necessary skills to be in them.

I mean I could ignore a lot of social occasions and stay as an introvert but that would leave me with the same problems as before and almost certainly they would never get corrected. The reason why I am an introvert isn't because I don't like social situations, or because I think they're boring, its because I'm scared of them and ultimately worried that I'll make an idiot of myself. Its a fear I have of social situations.

Karsini wrote:

I think some of you need to re-read the OP. He's saying the social anxiety puts people of as if he smells of BO, not that he does.

Thanks for somebody finally pointing that out! My hygiene's fine, I wash daily, brush my teeth twice a day (did I tell you I wanted to become a dentist :pac:), I would like to improve my fitness and diet a bit more though so I'll tackling that in due course.

Bafucin

Oh I don't normally, I suppose its because I don't have a lot of experience with the opposite sex generally and then I hear/read so much about women having it easier, ladies can get a shag anytime they want and all this stuff, and all I'm doing here is just asking others whether or not these 'stereotypes' are true (because I don't really know). Having said that I don't tend to categorise men and women so broadly as I know its unhelpful to think in those terms. Although it is worth noting statistically women are actually less likely to still be virgins at 40 than men are (1.2% to 0.3% according to a US government study on sexual behaviour), but I take your point regardless I don't draw huge conclusions based on somebody's sex.

They have it different.

Daveysil15

Mike747 wrote: »

He has a point. Feminists are doing their level best to create a society where gender roles are screwed up, male sexuality is demonized, masculinity is a dirty word and boys grow up without strong male role models.

And then women wonder why men are too shy to approach them!

What does any of that have to do with this thread? He said this is feminized even though its TGC and the majority of the posters are male.

Mike747

Pug160 wrote: »

They actually have lots of things right - not just one thing. 'Social proof' is another one that is almost certainly important in many cases - especially if you're showing pictures of yourself. If you're not very outgoing and you're out socialising it becomes equally as important, as people will want evidence that you have friends and are trusted and respected etc. When a couple of women are in your social group it is a huge bonus.

That childish three letter acronym that we're not allowed to type on here is long out of fashion now anyway I think, and it's been replaced with general advice - good and bad. The numbers game works but developing a thick skin is unbelievably hard for some people. Being rejected is rarely personal but it's still tough for lots of men. One thing I've noticed about men who don't care about rejection is that they quite often don't take women seriously in general. Women are unable to hurt them the same way a man would. That actually sounds like chauvinism on the surface but it could very well be a positive trait in some cases. I'm by no means saying it applies to all men who don't care about rejection but it's just something I was thinking about.

Every ladies man I know has a low opinion of women and they're are also pretty cynical in general. I guess that's the downside of being good with women.

I've been thinking a lot about this thread and I believe there are four reasons why a man would have absolutely no luck with women.

1. He's absolute bottom of the barrel, beyond redemption ugly. Unfortunately these men do exist and anyone saying looks don't matter is fooling no one. Thankfully this is very rare. Most 'ugly' people can scrub up pretty well.

2. He has major hang ups about women and sex.

3. He has crippling self esteem issues.

4. He's the 'nice guy'.

More than likely it'll will 2-3 or a combination of. All of these can be overcome.

audi12

women dont think i wonder is this guy nice when they meet him they want to be impressed no matter what they so so all this talk i just want to meet a nice guy is crap from women

Mike747

Daveysil15 wrote: »

What does any of that have to do with this thread? He said this is feminized even though its TGC and the majority of the posters are male.

Feminists despise masculinity and want to demonize men. That's all I'll say because I don't want to go off topic. PM me if you want to debate.

audi12

Mike747 wrote: »

Every ladies man I know has a low opinion of women and they're are also pretty cynical in general. I guess that's the downside of being good with women.

I've been thinking a lot about this thread and I believe there are four reasons why a man would have absolutely no luck with women.

1. He's absolute bottom of the barrel, beyond redemption ugly. Unfortunately these men do exist and anyone saying looks don't matter is fooling no one. Thankfully this is very rare. Most 'ugly' people can scrub up pretty well.

2. He has major hang ups about women and sex.

3. He has crippling self esteem issues.

4. He's the 'nice guy'.

More than likely it'll will 2-3 or a combination of. All of these can be overcome.

The truth is a lot of women are selfish backstabbing etc as the line goes women dont like women so how are guys meant to like them. The people who end up happy with a woman have standards and take there time before making sure they have a good one and then maybe settle down with there but you have to be careful no point being innocent thinking most women are all nice

Daveysil15

Mike747 wrote: »

Feminists despise masculinity and want to demonize men. That's all I'll say because I don't want to go off topic. PM me if you want to debate.

Well actually they don't. You're describing the hardcore feminazis. Not all feminists think like that. And you never answered my question. What does any of that have to do with this thread?

Mike747

Daveysil15 wrote: »

Well actually they don't. You're describing the hardcore feminazis. Not all feminists think like that. And you never answered my question. What does any of that have to do with this thread?

I'm not commenting on any of the posters here because I don't know them but in real life I believe men are becoming too weak and shy, too afraid to express their desires. I believe traditional masculinity is a positive thing and I believe its very attractive to women.

Bafucin

Mike747 wrote: »

Every ladies man I know has a low opinion of women and they're are also pretty cynical in general. I guess that's the downside of being good with women.

I've been thinking a lot about this thread and I believe there are four reasons why a man would have absolutely no luck with women.

1. He's absolute bottom of the barrel, beyond redemption ugly. Unfortunately these men do exist and anyone saying looks don't matter is fooling no one. Thankfully this is very rare. Most 'ugly' people can scrub up pretty well.

2. He has major hang ups about women and sex.

3. He has crippling self esteem issues.

4. He's the 'nice guy'.

More than likely it'll will 2-3 or a combination of. All of these can be overcome.

Is the biggest problem the OP has about women ? Because if it is after reading his post that means you are putting a love life above some other rather important stuff.

The OP has difficulty making friends and socializing to the extent where it is affecting his studies and potentially his career choice.

He has bigger issues here. I don't mean to be anything but supportive. But I think you are actually focusing on the smallest issue. His love life.

It is probably peer discussions like this that over emphasize a love life in the OP's head. He needs time to sort other things out and he needs to know his life is valid while he does that. And it is.

The people who end up happy with a woman have standards and take there time before making sure they have a good one and then maybe settle down with there but you have to be careful no point being innocent thinking most women are all nice

25% of women are bitches. Most women are ok. 50% are decent. 25% of women are nice. But they have standards too. I would give the same % for men be because that is actually how I see people. A lot of people say most humans are nice. Well no I think most humans are ok. Some are nice and a few are awful.

diveout

ThomasFlynn wrote: »

Oh I don't normally, I suppose its because I don't have a lot of experience with the opposite sex generally and then I hear/read so much about women having it easier, ladies can get a shag anytime they want and all this stuff, and all I'm doing here is just asking others whether or not these 'stereotypes' are true (because I don't really know). Having said that I don't tend to categorise men and women so broadly as I know its unhelpful to think in those terms. Although it is worth noting statistically women are actually less likely to still be virgins at 40 than men are (1.2% to 0.3% according to a US government study on sexual behaviour), but I take your point regardless I don't draw huge conclusions based on somebody's sex.

Yes I agree but you need to understand however I've not had any friends since the age of 13, as much as I've avoided people, many people actively have avoided me also and then when I try to speak to people and initiate conversations at school or uni or whatever people have looked and acted uncomfortable wanting to get away from me, because I was so awkward. Time and time again throughout school people reacted negatively/uncomfortably towards me every time I went near them, so that's when I started deliberately avoiding people, compounding my problems even more so making it worse. I decided to go into the halls for my first year at uni (BIG mistake!), I said hello to a few people and went into the kitchen and never came out of my room. I hardly knew anyone, and I'm sure most of those guys thought (and rightfully so) that I was weird/strange/creepy. But I was convinced the entire world hated me at that time and didn't want me ruining their social experience with all the 'normal' people so by avoiding people I felt I was helping them. I was crying out for help then in truth but my parents kept telling me I was normal/nothing wrong with me/you'll grow out of it, it was only when I attempted suicide with my increasing depression that I knew I needed help.

Sorry I'm in disagreement with this. I may not overly enjoy some activities sure but how else can I be expected to improve my social skills and create those social opportunities otherwise? Surely that's the whole point if somebody is naturally introverted is put myself out of my comfort zone and ultimately defeat my social anxiety? It 'exhausts' me and have 'nothing to give' is because I'm not used to those situations in the first place and don't have the necessary skills to be in them.

I mean I could ignore a lot of social occasions and stay as an introvert but that would leave me with the same problems as before and almost certainly they would never get corrected. The reason why I am an introvert isn't because I don't like social situations, or because I think they're boring, its because I'm scared of them and ultimately worried that I'll make an idiot of myself. Its a fear I have of social situations.

Thanks for somebody finally pointing that out! My hygiene's fine, I wash daily, brush my teeth twice a day (did I tell you I wanted to become a dentist :pac:), I would like to improve my fitness and diet a bit more though so I'll tackling that in due course.

Here is a suggestion: drama classes. They will bring you out of your shell and also allow you a mask and its all very safe.... as in zero risk. And LOTS of girls.

Fake it till you make it. If you believe it, they will believe it.

It's called shy man's revenge for a reason.

Honestly, the dating concerns are putting the carriage before the horse.

Bafucin

Sorry I'm in disagreement with this. I may not overly enjoy some activities sure but how else can I be expected to improve my social skills and create those social opportunities otherwise? Surely that's the whole point if somebody is naturally introverted is put myself out of my comfort zone and ultimately defeat my social anxiety? It 'exhausts' me and have 'nothing to give' is because I'm not used to those situations in the first place and don't have the necessary skills to be in them.

I mean I could ignore a lot of social occasions and stay as an introvert but that would leave me with the same problems as before and almost certainly they would never get corrected. The reason why I am an introvert isn't because I don't like social situations, or because I think they're boring, its because I'm scared of them and ultimately worried that I'll make an idiot of myself. Its a fear I have of social situations.

Music.

You are in a social setting but with much less talking. You Jam you don't speak.

Join a very amateur choir?

Learn an instrument?

It's a start

Could you start gaming? RPG?? Generally you would meet quite understanding people and there is a framework of what is said and discussed.

Bafucin

diveout wrote: »

Here is a suggestion: drama classes. They will bring you out of your shell and also allow you a mask and its all very safe.... as in zero risk. And LOTS of girls.

Fake it till you make it. If you believe it, they will believe it.

It's called shy man's revenge for a reason.

Honestly, the dating concerns are putting the carriage before the horse.

Another good idea.

Or ..any class...like I dunno..guitar or anything you like ..painting!

OP what do you enjoy?

beano345

Go travelling op it will bring you out of your shell,worked for me,plus you'll meet a ton of ladies along the way who are naturally chatty with other travellers.

SharpshooterTom

diveout wrote:

Honestly, the dating concerns are putting the carriage before the horse.

But you don't think it will be too late for me to begin dating some point later in my life? That's my lingering worry. I know I have other issues to tackle first (i.e. just bloody socialising!!) but it does worry me that my problems are so hard to overcome that I fear I'll miss out on things like love life/family, that's why I started the thread maybe its meant to be, even though you're right, it ironically isn't my biggest concern as of right now.

Bafucin wrote:

It is probably peer discussions like this that over emphasize a love life in the OP's head. He needs time to sort other things out and he needs to know his life is valid while he does that. And it is.

I totally agree with you. I probably see virginity/lack of girlfriends as some sort of barometer to help judge my 'normalness' within my own peer group. Because people of my own age have been doing this for 10+ years and I've gotten absolutely nowhere near close I see it as a sign of failure/rejection and it does play on me and ultimately on my self esteem.

But I know there is a realistic chance that if I choose not visit an escort as suggested earlier in the thread I may die a virgin but if that were so that would be a reflection on my social life never really picking up, I deserve what I get in that I suppose.

Bafucin wrote:

OP what do you enjoy?

Lots of things. I could join a wide variety of sports, I would like to be a bit more physically active for sure, I love to learn how to play tennis, golf, cricket (I grew up in England till I was 14 so never played any Gaelic sports forgive me). I watch a sh!t load of sports on TV (I am a sports nut) but I don't play any of them because of how socially withdrawn I am generally. Honestly there are loads of activities I could enjoy, the sky's limit in that regard.

When I was at college in Belfast last year I was playing with a 'friend' who was a table tennis enthusiast. I've never played much table tennis in my life actually but I enjoyed playing with him during lunch breaks, although he used to kick my arse frequently (but then he did play for his frigging university team) but it was good fun nonetheless. So much so that I might even take it up seriously since I've got a foothold in the sport now and I've improved an awful lot by playing him, a bit more practise and I no longer be his punching bag perhaps. :pac:

Beano345 wrote:

Go travelling op it will bring you out of your shell,worked for me,plus you'll meet a ton of ladies along the way who are naturally chatty with other travellers.

I have actually already done this to be fair. I went to Australia ON MY OWN for 5 weeks believe it or not. This was the height my absolute loneliness 6 months before I attempted suicide/got help. I went over there with some saved money and knew no one, I was stuck in my house in omagh and I just wanted to get out. I figured I was either going to be a billy no mates stuck in my house in omagh or a billy no mates wondering around touring Australia. I chose the later and didn't give sh!t if everyone thought was I an obscure loner (I felt I had no choice but to be like that anyway).

Lets see I went to Adelaide/Kangeroo Island/Melbourne/Brisbane/Byron bay/Canberra/Sydney in 5 weeks. Like I say if I got stuck or was in trouble the nearest people to me were 12,000 miles away, so it was a bit mad, but honestly I think that was probably the first real breakthrough I had in terms of breaking up my social anxiety, it didn't feel like that at first (hence why I ended up being depressed 5 months later thinking the end was nigh) but looking back on it, because I was involved regularly in activities (I was busy most days doing 'something') it actually helped me and I see it as a positive experience now.

I didn't stay in hostels, rather hotels (yeah you see how frigging expensive the whole thing was) but I avoided hostels because of my social phobia at the time/worried by coming across as socially awkward sleeping in the same room as people, so some problems still existed, I didn't do much nightlife either since I was an early riser with 'things to see/do' then. I was a loner but I came out of my shell a little more than on previous occasions.

I've probably had my best socialising years at college I've ever had recently, I just haven't held onto anyone in terms of making permanent contacts. But my social skills are better than they were when I was say 20, when they were bloody non existent.

Bafucin

ThomasFlynn wrote: »

But my social skills are better than they were when I was say 20, when they were bloody non existent.

OP if no one else says this to you I want to say it. Well done. You ARE getting there. Pat yourself on the back. Give yourself credit.