Lemlin wrote: » Yep, full team. Conor Gilsenan; Jason McLoughlin, Rory Dunne, Feargal Flanagan; Joshua Hayes, James McEnroe, Robert Maloney-Derham; Damien O'Reilly, Gearoid McKiernan; Michael Argue, Michael Lyng, Niall McDermott; Jack Brady, Eugene Keating, Martin Reilly. I wouldn't be surprised to see Givney in yet.
cavan4sam wrote: » yeah and maybe jack brady making way because we could do with an extra pair of hands around midfield , we didnt get a lot in croke park in midfield against them
nice_guy80 wrote: » As I said before, you get nowhere by having defensive systems at minor and under 21. It develops players with a limited range of skills abilities
tanko wrote: » It has been very successful at u-21 level for the last four years but football at senior level is constantly evolving and has moved on from that style of play.
nice_guy80 wrote: » when did a successful senior football team ever consist of getting 14 lads behind the ball??
tanko wrote: » Hard to know what to say about that. The loss of players like Clarke, Mackey, Dunne etc was too much to cope with. Jason McLoughlin was the only cavan player to play well. Serious rethink needed on the style of play. After last year other counties have worked us out. Roscommon are miles ahead of us.
celt262 wrote: » Our star player walked away during the week and there are rumours that he has been misbehaving.
celt262 wrote: » Things are as bad as they ever were. Im not convinced that things would have been any different if we had the players that are missing. Our star player walked away during the week and there are rumours that he has been misbehaving. 4 Ulster u21's and we haven't a midfielder or dangerous forward its not looking good.
Tom Joad wrote: » What a load of tosh. No county let alone one with Cavan's limited resources could sustain the level of injuries/ players missing that we had this year. Yes it's been disappointing but to sad things are as bad as they ever were is complete crap. Add in to all the injuries the lack of football Givney and Keating have had with the messing at club level. Gearoid McKiernan needs another year to get back fit as well. Division 2 football will bring the team on again and there are another bunch of good minors and under 21s coming through. If anything Cavan football has never been as healthy. Yes we need a few forwards to come through at under 21 level but at least the structures have now been put in place to ensure that the players will be developed.
Yes we need a few forwards to come through at under 21 level but at least the structures have now been put in place to ensure that the players will be developed.
willabur wrote: » I was at the game on Saturday and a few things looked plainly obvious to me. - First and most importantly was that the players looked knackered, they looked absolutely shattered a pale shadow of the players we know that they are. Case in point is Gearoid who lacked any drive from midfield and was lost out there on Saturday. Was he rushed back too quickly from injury? People say that he hasn't played due to the injury so should be fresh but the recovery from that kind of injury is gonna be tough both mentally and physically. - Just 5 players that started Vs Kerry started on Saturday. No team in the land could deal with that kind of turnover (possibly the dubs) - We need to change our approach. Not a root and branch change but the players look paralyzed with fear for turning over possession. We are playing without a half forward line and it is not sustainable as our inside forwards are not sharp enough. Jack Brady looked woefully out of his depth on Saturday but I have seen him play well and he has played well when the forward line has a more natural shape to it
Tom Joad wrote: » No one is suggesting they are happy with the performance on Saturday but that's a world away from saying things are as bad as they ever were - that's just ludicrous. Do you not remember how bad things were with Cavan football over the last twenty years. Have you been happy with the overall performance's of the Cavan Senior team this year? It's not helped by the complete crap posted on internet forums about the team and the management. We've done the sack the manager - get a new lad in over and over again and it doesn't work. Also the complete unsubstantiated rubbish that is posted about rows in the camp and players walking away doesn't help things. I have not seen anyone here say anything about sacking the manager. It's a discussion board people post things that they hear from panel members/friends of panel members they might not always be true but its up to people to believe what they want. All is not perfect but there has been a lot of mitigating circumstances this year with injuries etc. Btw Keating is in Dublin and hasn't played any club football this year - Givney likewise has played damn all and is trying to get a transfer back to Cavan now. None of this helps. Do you know whats going on there? The system does need to be tweaked (as Donegal did in 2012) there is no doubt about that and the lack of quality forwards coming through is a worry but I've still no doubt that Terry Hyland is the right man for the job and now the mess of the minor team has been sorted (hopefully) we will start producing success at minor level. I think it needs a over haul not a tweaking, to play that sort of game you need people who can score from numbers 2 - 15 we don't have that type of player. The real issues that need to be sorted out is the club championship in the county which is the real issue in hampering player development and ensuring that last years messing that went on with the minor team never happens again.
No one is suggesting they are happy with the performance on Saturday but that's a world away from saying things are as bad as they ever were - that's just ludicrous. Do you not remember how bad things were with Cavan football over the last twenty years.
It's not helped by the complete crap posted on internet forums about the team and the management. We've done the sack the manager - get a new lad in over and over again and it doesn't work. Also the complete unsubstantiated rubbish that is posted about rows in the camp and players walking away doesn't help things.
All is not perfect but there has been a lot of mitigating circumstances this year with injuries etc. Btw Keating is in Dublin and hasn't played any club football this year - Givney likewise has played damn all and is trying to get a transfer back to Cavan now. None of this helps.
The system does need to be tweaked (as Donegal did in 2012) there is no doubt about that and the lack of quality forwards coming through is a worry but I've still no doubt that Terry Hyland is the right man for the job and now the mess of the minor team has been sorted (hopefully) we will start producing success at minor level.
The real issues that need to be sorted out is the club championship in the county which is the real issue in hampering player development and ensuring that last years messing that went on with the minor team never happens again.
celt262 wrote: » The leagues this year are a joke also.
celt262 wrote: » I'm entitled to my opinion the same as anyone else. If you guys are happy with the Cavan performances through out the league and championship it is not hard to please you. As i said previous the style of football Cavan play will not beat the better teams and just about got us over the line in Division 3. We don't have a clue how to break down a blanket defense or attack quickly, Roscommon gave a lesson on how to do all that Saturday evening. People have been harping on about the strength in debt in the panel but it's obvious now that it isn't there. Keating and Givney have missed feck all club football as there has only been a couple played in the ACFL so that doesn't account for poor form. It's my worry that the the development of the players is not being done correctly. It looks like players are being encouraged to retain possession rather than shoot with only certain players allowed to shoot. Last Saturday Argue and Brady were the only players from the previous 5 U-21 teams who lined out in the forwards. There must have been 20 forwards from them 5 teams, where are they now? We are developing forwards who will work hard and tackle back not one's who will put the ball over the bar.
baconsarnie wrote: » Decided to wait to let the dust settle somewhat from Saturday before I posted anything. I was tempted to post over a few pints as i was drying off but I'm glad I didn't Firstly, the first half was one of the worst 35mins of football anyone is likely to witness. I hope i never see anything as turgid again in my life. Thank the lord it wasn't televised. Secondly, well done Roscommon. Credit where credit is due, they ramped up their performance in the 2nd half and i genuinely wish them well for the rest of the championship. And they showed the value of quick ball inside to their forward line (admittedly against a shell-shocked Cavan team trying to chase the game) Now, onto our performance. I think a few wiser heads have nailed it: yes, the championship has been a disaster, but let's look at Cavan senior football in a wider context for the year, and especially where we have come from. Everyone, from management, players and seasoned fans said the priority for 2014 for the team's development was to get promoted to Division 2. Mission accomplished. I think we put so much energy and preperation into our league campaign that there wasn't anything left (psychologically or physically) left in the tank- and that's without taking into account the loss of key players. I agree with Willabur- our lads looked shot on Saturday. Not only did they not have the legs, for the first time under Terry's reign (that i can remember), they looked beaten once they went a few points behind. I don't think we can underestimate the loss in the final Vs Roscommon (a game they should have won) as, to me, it looks like it really dented the team's belief. I'm not worried about that. It's time for lads to get some well-deserved break and re-group for next year. And hopefully they will learn from these defeats. I am a little worried about the style of play. To me, Cavan look like a team that is over-prepared with overreliance on drills. Against the Rossies there was an obession with laying ball off to on-running players as if it was rugby with a reluctance (or belief) to play with some spontaneity. I think the real frustration for fans on the night wasn't just that we were beaten (and it could have been worse, Roscommon kicked some dreadful wides in the 1st half and took points in the 2nd where goals could have been taken) was down to the fact that we created so few scoring chances. I may be wrong but apart from the 5 points scored we may have only hit about 5 wides. I really think that there is talent there and hopefully with fresher minds and legs and some tweaking of the system, the team can perform to the standards it has shown last year. Talk of scrapping the management or dropping loads of players is precisely what we don't need. But we genuinely will need to look at out-scoring teams in Division 2: simply closing teams out may work against the likes of Offaly or Fermanagh, but not in division 2. Yes Saturday was grim. But people on here (and other forums) need to cop themselves on a bit.
Lemlin wrote: » Noboy said you're not entitled to your opinion but you've posted rumours on here before about players being dropped which were totally incorrect. You've now posted another unsubstantiated rumour above. I haven't heard what you've said above off any other person in the county, either at the game or after it. Apologies if you haven't heard it I guess it is false. You're consistently negative in your postings, even when we were promoted from Division 3 without being beaten. Yes, we struggled through some games but due to injuries we haven't been able to get near our best 15 on the pitch all year. Despite that, we were promoted with two games to go. That's a huge improvement from the time under the likes of Carr. It's pure muck that is being played though. There have been 10 minute spells in most league games where we have played super football and done enough to win the games. The same happened in the Westmeath game. You might say we won the games so the performance doesn't matter that's well and good but against the better teams it won't cut it. We've won the Leinster junior championship so their obviously is strength in depth in the panel. Experience was lacking on Saturday but that'll have to be worked on. As a poster said above, only five players who started against Kerry last year started on Saturday. Not many panels could cope with that . I don't think that people should be putting any weight towards the Junior it only has a handful of teams in it. But i guess some of you will have the flags out and have big celebrations if we can get the big win in England and reach the final. Who knocked Donegal out of it this year? We would be slightly stronger if we were not missing as many but it would still be the same muck been played which will get us nowwhere fast.
You're consistently negative in your postings, even when we were promoted from Division 3 without being beaten. Yes, we struggled through some games but due to injuries we haven't been able to get near our best 15 on the pitch all year. Despite that, we were promoted with two games to go. That's a huge improvement from the time under the likes of Carr.
We've won the Leinster junior championship so their obviously is strength in depth in the panel. Experience was lacking on Saturday but that'll have to be worked on. As a poster said above, only five players who started against Kerry last year started on Saturday. Not many panels could cope with that
celt262 wrote: » Lemlin wrote: » Noboy said you're not entitled to your opinion but you've posted rumours on here before about players being dropped which were totally incorrect. You've now posted another unsubstantiated rumour above. I haven't heard what you've said above off any other person in the county, either at the game or after it. Apologies if you haven't heard it I guess it is false. It's pure muck that is being played though. There have been 10 minute spells in most league games where we have played super football and done enough to win the games. The same happened in the Westmeath game. You might say we won the games so the performance doesn't matter that's well and good but against the better teams it won't cut it. I don't think that people should be putting any weight towards the Junior it only has a handful of teams in it. But i guess some of you will have the flags out and have big celebrations if we can get the big win in England and reach the final. Who knocked Donegal out of it this year? We would be slightly stronger if we were not missing as many but it would still be the same muck been played which will get us nowwhere fast. Well would you not question someone spouting something on a forum that you haven't heard anywhere else? Particularly when that person had already posted incorrect information regarding players earlier in the season. There are periods in most games where one team has a purple patch and goes through a scoring glut. It's not just common to Cavan. Watch any intercounty game. I'm hardly putting huge weight towards it but it is good to give players experience. The likes of Martin Dunne, Rory Dunne and Martin Reilly were all successful in the juniors before they made the step up so again it would be disingenuous of you to state it isn't helping. This system got us to our first ever All Ireland quarter final last year so I don't see how you can assert it "will get us nowhere fast". Did you also miss promotion to Division 2?
Lemlin wrote: » Noboy said you're not entitled to your opinion but you've posted rumours on here before about players being dropped which were totally incorrect. You've now posted another unsubstantiated rumour above. I haven't heard what you've said above off any other person in the county, either at the game or after it. Apologies if you haven't heard it I guess it is false. It's pure muck that is being played though. There have been 10 minute spells in most league games where we have played super football and done enough to win the games. The same happened in the Westmeath game. You might say we won the games so the performance doesn't matter that's well and good but against the better teams it won't cut it. I don't think that people should be putting any weight towards the Junior it only has a handful of teams in it. But i guess some of you will have the flags out and have big celebrations if we can get the big win in England and reach the final. Who knocked Donegal out of it this year? We would be slightly stronger if we were not missing as many but it would still be the same muck been played which will get us nowwhere fast.
There are periods in most games where one team has a purple patch and goes through a scoring glut. It's not just common to Cavan. Watch any inercounty game.
I'm hardly putting huge weight towards it but it is good to give players experience. The likes of Martin Dunne, Rory Dunne and Martin Reilly were all successful in the juniors before they made the step up so again it would be disingenuous of you to state it isn't helping.
This system got us to our first ever All Ireland quarter final last year so I don't see how you can assert it "will get us nowhere fast". Did you also miss promotion to Division 2?
celt262 wrote: » That's true but most teams then don't revert to passing the ball over and back across field between the half way line and 45 for the rest of the game. They may have played well with the Juniors but they are good players so they were always going to make the break through. We beat who we beat to get to that quarter final and could do no more but they were hardly teams we would expect to lose to London? Fermangah? Derry who were beating by the mighty Longford this year was the one good result.
Lemlin wrote: » Do you not remember the period between 2006 and 2012 where we only beat three Division 4 teams in the championship - Wicklow, Fermanagh and Antrim.
celt262 wrote: » I'm more annoyed with the style of football than anything else. It may be negative in what i'm saying but I think that a lot of guys are brainwashed after wining 4 U'21 titles which is a great achievement but the forwards we are producing are not good enough for Senior inter county football. We have unearthed a couple of good defenders and the Jury is still out on the Midfield.
Lemlin wrote: » So you're boiling our team down to "a couple of good defenders"? That is as ridiculous as your earlier statements tbh. I think you're reading too many tabloids with all this sensationalism. Rory Dunne, Jason McLoughlin, Killian Clark, James McEnroe - I would class all of those as being good defenders. Yes they are good defenders. As for midfield, we need to work on our system and the kick outs but we've three top midfielders available. Top midfielders ? They haven't done anything to prove that. Gearoid has shown lots of potential before his injury,Argue may become one. We need to work on getting the ball to the forwards with more speed but I certainly think that Martin Reilly and Eugene Keating are two very good forwards. Not too mention Cian Mackey. As I said earlier we have not produced any forwards of Senior intercouny quality from out last 5 U-21 teams.
So you're boiling our team down to "a couple of good defenders"? That is as ridiculous as your earlier statements tbh. I think you're reading too many tabloids with all this sensationalism. Rory Dunne, Jason McLoughlin, Killian Clark, James McEnroe - I would class all of those as being good defenders.
As for midfield, we need to work on our system and the kick outs but we've three top midfielders available.
We need to work on getting the ball to the forwards with more speed but I certainly think that Martin Reilly and Eugene Keating are two very good forwards. Not too mention Cian Mackey.
