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Well done Aer Lingus

Kermit.de.frog

Firstly I love Aer Lingus and fly with them as regularly as I can but I completely support this action against these striking workers.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2014/0603/621344-aer-lingus/

My reasons are two fold.

1. The inconvenience and reputational damage to the airline and the country by their actions. They still seem to think the airline is a public company they can push around.

2. The as yet not fessed up to culpability of the entire trade union movement particularly in the public sector in the mess we are in today.

They messed us up when we had money and now they want to do it again when we don't.

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jmayo

Collie D wrote: »

Fixed that for you. The man's a bully

And that is the bully that made it possible for most Irish people to get on and off this bloody island, bar taking a boat, without having to fork out a few weeks or months salary.

I always remember hearing Tom Mcgurk gushing on Marian Finucane show about getting on Aer Lingus flight in London, having a fry and how it brought him closer to home back in 80s.
She quickly brought him back to earth by reminding him the flight was totally unaffordable to most people back then.

For as long as I remember Aer Lingus's primary function was to provide perks and jobs for life to it's employees and transportation to the Irish people, it's long term owners and benefactors, came a poor second.

tayto lover

irishfeen wrote: »

Of course it will happen eventually but I get the feeling if the staff go out again there could be a major public backlash for them, not Aer Lingus - maybe its something AL might actually want to see happen so they can hold the upper hand.

We have to remember that this airline is still part semi-state run, ~25% of this company is ours so we should be looking for the AL hierarchy to get the best deal for the taxpayer.

FFS the public didn't even protest the water charges, HHC or Property Tax.
The only public backlash was in the local elections when they didn't have to really do anything but put an X on a piece of paper.
This latest action by AL is just posturing and the workers know it.
Sit down and talk it out is the way to go.

My name is URL

jmayo wrote: »

And that is the bully that made it possible for most Irish people to get on and off this bloody island, bar taking a boat, without having to fork out a few weeks or months salary.

That itself has plenty of downsides. Why exactly should air-travel be cheap anyway?

suicide_circus

jmayo wrote: »

For as long as I remember Aer Lingus's primary function was to theyovide perks and jobs for life to it's employees and transportation to the Irish people, it's long term owners and benefactors, came a poor second.

+1
Older and retired EI staff have a pretty serious god complex, guess no obe told them they're glorified bus drivers and waitresses.

tayto lover

suicide_circus wrote: »

+1
Older and retired EI staff have a pretty serious god complex, guess no obe told them they're glorified bus drivers and waitresses.

Bus drivers and waitresses do very important jobs. Never look down your nose at anybody.

Hootanany

suicide_circus wrote: »

+1
Older and retired EI staff have a pretty serious god complex, guess no obe told them they're glorified bus drivers and waitresses.

I concur.

suicide_circus

tayto lover wrote: »

Bus drivers and waitresses do very important jobs. Never look down your nose at anybody.

Sorry comrade

frostyjacks

Where can I get one of these erotic rosters? They sound fun.

But seriously, people in cushy jobs striking over minimal inconvenience is laughable. They should swap jobs for a week with someone who works in the real world, they might appreciate the handy number they have then.

Cork Lass

suicide_circus wrote: »

+1
Older and retired EI staff have a pretty serious god complex, guess no obe told them they're glorified bus drivers and waitresses.

Shameful post. Degrading to all mentioned.

curioser

Sounds as if AL has decided to go sh1t or bust. They know that the cabin crew will go ape at the withdrawal of travel privileges and escalate the industrial action, whereupon the company will lay off a good chunk of the cabin crew and source a cheaper cohort of cabin crew in the US for the transatlantic service. Rather simplistic outline I know but I can see this as the endgame.

tayto lover

curioser wrote: »

Sounds as if AL has decided to go sh1t or bust. They know that the cabin crew will go ape at the withdrawal of travel privileges and escalate the industrial action, whereupon the company will lay off a good chunk of the cabin crew and source a cheaper cohort of cabin crew in the US for the transatlantic service. Rather simplistic outline I know but I can see this as the endgame.

Nah. It's like the lad in a fight shouting "let me at him" while being safely held back by his mates.

Beefy78

irishfeen wrote: »

I was under the impression that they had turned the corner, their new US Direct flights are doing very well and short distance flights were they last time I read doing well too??

Judging by the number of emails I get from them plugging extra sales promotions I'd guess that they're not doing as well this year as they had hoped.

curioser

curioser wrote: »

Sounds as if AL has decided to go sh1t or bust. They know that the cabin crew will go ape at the withdrawal of travel privileges and escalate the industrial action, whereupon the company will lay off a good chunk of the cabin crew and source a cheaper cohort of cabin crew in the US for the transatlantic service. Rather simplistic outline I know but I can see this as the endgame.

(Similar scenario to the Bausch & Lomb set up in Waterford, where the company puts a package that they know is unacceptable to the workforce, thereby setting up a position where they close down the plant, which is what they intended to do in the first place.)

ProfessorPlum

Mr. Incognito wrote: »

They are being unrealistic. Are lingus is barely hanging on, many more hits like this and the cabin crew will have no hours to work. Good luck to them when that happens.

Citation needed. Infact Aer Lingus is out performing most european and US carriers.

bumper234 wrote: »

the workers agreed a roster when they signed a contract of employment. Do you think anyone else can walk into their bosses office tomorrow and demand their working hours be changed?

The rosters they are working is not what they signed up for. There have been whole hosts of changes since many of them signed their contracts. If you actually looked at what's being asked for, and more importantly what would be accepted, you'll see that what's being asked is not unreasonable. Aer Lingus had the same response to pilot requests for a fixed pattern roster (available at many carriers, even Ryanair) and were not for turning until the pilots proved to them they could work the roster without any loss of productivity. Management just seemed not to be bothered before that, despite the fact that pilot sick leave had gone through the roof at that time (was still low in comparison to other sections, but v high for pilots). There is no reason that something acceptable to both sides can't be worked out, but they need to sit down and talk.

smileyj1987 wrote: »

While I do agree with trade unions and the help and things they can do for you in employment . The trade union is out of line at this moment in time .

1). The company is barely holding on .
2). These people signed up to a job that would demand tough hours and a lot of flexibility .
3). The amount of people out of work that would gladly take the jobs and hours that goes with it is through the roof .

1) The company is not barely holding on.
2) These people are happy to do a job that demands tough hours and a lot of flexibility.
3) In that case, lets pay everyone peanuts and treat them like sh1t, as surely there will be someone willing to take the jobs.

suicide_circus wrote: »

+1
Older and retired EI staff have a pretty serious god complex, guess no obe told them they're glorified bus drivers and waitresses.

You'll change your tune pretty quickly if you're ever on on aircraft that's having a problem. Amazing how the loud mouths suddenly get very quiet (apart from the whimpering)

Pumpkinseeds

It's getting to a point with Aer Lingus staff that if you're thinking of going away for a bank holiday weekend then you'd seriously consider flying with another airline. I'm glad Aer Lingus didn't roll over on this one. The staff will only have themselves to blame when the loss of revenue caused by strikes and the publics loss of confidence in Aer Lingus leads to job losses.

suicide_circus

Cork Lass wrote: »

Shameful post. Degrading to all mentioned.

Shameful? Lol. As someone who interacts with EI staff on a daily basis in work, I can tell you the majority are wedged firmly up their own holes.

Cork Lass

suicide_circus wrote: »

Shameful? Lol. As someone who interacts with EI staff on a daily basis in work, I can tell you the majority are wedged firmly up their own holes.

You sound like someone with an inferiority complex to be honest. As for bus drivers and waitresses, have you found all of them to be "up their holes" also. I stand by my comment - your post was shameful.

suicide_circus

Cork Lass wrote: »

You sound like someone with an inferiority complex to be honest. As for bus drivers and waitresses, have you found all of them to be "up their holes" also. I stand by my comment - your post was shameful.

Ok. I am shamed.

sid waddell

suicide_circus wrote: »

Shameful? Lol. As someone who interacts with EI staff on a daily basis in work, I can tell you the majority are wedged firmly up their own holes.

Perhaps they should all go and do what Bertie Ahern once asked the "naysayers" and the "doomsayers" to do, as your user name implies?

WilyCoyote

tayto lover wrote: »

Bus drivers and waitresses do very important jobs. Never look down your nose at anybody.

Ah Jasus Tayto. If you're ten or twenty thousand feet in the air and you're wheeling a trolley up and down the aisle ....... it's very difficult to look at anyone - either passengers or mere mortals walking the earth - unless it's down one's nose.

SaveOurLyric

tayto lover wrote: »

Then why can't they sit down with the workers and agree a roster? Simple thing to do and will happen in the end as usual.

By Jove you've got it!

Agree a roster. No customer disruption, no loss of revenue, happy cabin crew.

AL just havent thought of that one. Hopefully they read boards.ie and will realise thats the solution, since, as you say, it is easy to agree a new roster.

gandalf

About time AL took a stance like this. They used to be my airline of choice going away. These days (when I finally get to go away again) they will be my last choice. I am not going to risk my holidays being ruined by people who haven't grasped the reality of their industry.

SaveOurLyric

curioser wrote: »

(Similar scenario to the Bausch & Lomb set up in Waterford, where the company puts a package that they know is unacceptable to the workforce, thereby setting up a position where they close down the plant, which is what they intended to do in the first place.)

So the sensible action is to call their bluff and find out. Take the pay cut. Its a free bet, and if luckily you are wrong, and they didnt intend to shut, then you stay in a job.

ProfessorPlum

SaveOurLyric wrote: »

By Jove you've got it!

Agree a roster. No customer disruption, no loss of revenue, happy cabin crew.

AL just havent thought of that one. Hopefully they read boards.ie and will realise thats the solution, since, as you say, it is easy to agree a new roster.

Funny that that's exactly what happened with the pilots 3 years ago. By Jove!:rolleyes:

end of the road

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

The inconvenience

you'l be fine

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

reputational damage to the country by their actions.

1. what reputation?
2. workers going on strike happens in many if not every country at some stage

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

The as yet not fessed up to culpability of the entire trade union movement particularly in the public sector in the mess we are in today.

nothing to fess up to, no culpability, just people looking after their members, whats expected of them

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

They messed us up when we had money and now they want to do it again when we don't.

no, they didn't, they looked for something and got it.

jjbrien

Ah geeze i know by the removing of free travel privileges it means another strike and I am booked in August with AL. I just want this over with.

end of the road

suicide_circus wrote: »

proper order.

no it isn't "proper order" its counter productive, will inflame tensions and will make it much harder to come to an agreement

bumper234

end of the road wrote: »

no it isn't "proper order" its counter productive, will inflame tensions and will make it much harder to come to an agreement

But striking is not counter productive :rolleyes:

end of the road

gramar wrote: »

Proper order. I'm 35 and for as long as I can remember Aer Lingus has been held to ransom by trade unions. The company is still riddled with a sense of self-entitlement and a job for life attitude among it's staff.

as i said not "proper order" stupid and will drag it out for longer, no sense of entitlement or a job for life attitude, and nobody is being "held to ransom" nobody goes on strike unless its a genuine reason, as the members voted then they did so as a very last resort

Lord Trollington

Having worked in Aer lingus many years ago I can empathise with the workers.

As far as I'm aware they have conceded a lot to the company over the last number of years in order to keep things afloat.

But like all companies they will want more and see how much they can get to keep costs down and that is understandable too. For people who don't work in the aviation industry it can be hard to understand it.

For example. A 6am flight to Malaga. Crew "clock in" at 5am for a safety briefing. This would mean for a lot getting up at 4am to prepare. On board for boarding at 5.30 for 6am departure. Presuming it departs on time it should land in Malaga for 9am Irish time. An hour on the ground in Malaga, refueling, passengers baggage, plane clean and depart roughly at 10am to return home. 3 hours coming back, taxi to gate, allow passengers off plane and be hopefully off the aircraft before 2pm.

This would be an ideal day. But very often this is not the case. Delays, lost baggage, technical issues, missing passengers ect can mean missing a take off slot and delays by hours. All of a sudden your 5am - 2pm duty turns in to 4pm.

The following day you might have to do the same all over again. Only you could be rostered the later flight. You might have one day off and then back on early flight again. The rostering is very erratic and it's that way for a reason. It can be taxing on the body, any air staff I know whilst they have perks have no real social life. Plans go out the window in minutes.