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Is there a differance between the Real IRA and the Continuity IRA?

The who

I was wondering what was the difference between the two but I do the C.I.R.A split from the provo's in the eighties and the R.I.R.A split after the ceasefire in 1996. Also did they join up?

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back2education

An Coilean wrote: »

Just to be clear then, the British and American airmen who dropped bombs on German cities during WWII are also murderers, ya?

I believe the germans called them terror pilots or terrorfleiger, Dresden was inexcusable mass murder also, the war was won and the set out to decimate the city and its population.

Dont forget the bombs there dropping at the moment in pakistan and afhganistan also

An Coilean

Manassas61 wrote: »

God almighty, they planted a bomb in a busy place with lots of people. Of course it was murder. They ripped people apart with the bomb. Only in this country could you plant a bomb in a civilian populace place and when it kills people, say it isn't murder.

They planted the bomb and they murdered people. They are to blame.

Just to be clear then, the British and American airmen who dropped bombs on German cities during WWII are also murderers, ya?

Fratton Fred

The who wrote: »

The R.I.R.A had mixed up the position of the car bomb. It was supposed to destroy this building (for the life of me I can't remember what the building was) but they couldnt get as close to the building as they wanted.They rang the authorities to notify them the whereabouts of the bomb (as they always do when their main target is a building and not innocent people) and they told them it was beside the building, but it wasnt. They rang two more times and gave a differant position each time because they genuinely didn't know where the bomb was. So, obviously the authorities were completely confused about where the bomb was and ended up hording everybody in the area down the street with the bomb but they didn't know the bomb was there.The Omagh bomb was a disaster for the IRA. They did not set out to kill these civilians and the IRA's numbers of supporters dramatically dropped after it (obviously people didn't know it was an accident.).Call it murder if you want but personally, as a republican I can accept this as a disastrous mistake and not a brutal murdering. P.S the IRA only give like 15-10 minutes warning so yes innocent people probably would have died anyway but not half as much

So how would you describe people who carry out an attack?

Also, why did they not bomb this strategically important building at 4am?

While your at it, would you mind answering my earlier question, how would you describe an "army" that detonates a bomb outside McDonalds in a busy high street on a Saturday lunch time?

Manassas61

SoulandForm wrote: »

Of course there are also serious questions about how much both the Free State and MI5 knew about the bomb- issues of agents provocateurs and them deliberately letting it happen. Im sure you wont be concerned about them at all though. I dont agree with him on a lot I think Sean Gabb summed up Ulster Unionists pretty well.

Always the conspiracies. Just face up to the facts. A bunch of murderous thugs decided to go out and plant a bomb in a public place. It murdered people. That is all there is to it.

SoulandForm

Manassas61 wrote: »

They murdered the people at Omagh when they planted the bomb. Not only murderous thugs but incompetent murderous thugs.

Of course there are also serious questions about how much both the Free State and MI5 knew about the bomb- issues of agents provocateurs and them deliberately letting it happen. Im sure you wont be concerned about them at all though. I dont agree with him on a lot I think Sean Gabb summed up Ulster Unionists pretty well.

back2education

Charlie Rock wrote: »

The anti-culture of Unionism/Loyalism.

Anti-democratic
Anti-southern
Anti-Catholic

Anti southern?
Where are you getting that from they draw funding from southerns and have power base in Dublin right?

back2education

Manassas61 wrote: »

Both are terrorist groups, hate Protestants. That just about sums it up.

They idolise some protestants!

Sigourney

The who wrote: »

I was wondering what was the difference between the two...

A bit like Diet Coke v Pepsi Max.

timthumbni

Manassas61 wrote: »

They murdered the people at Omagh when they planted the bomb. Not only murderous thugs but incompetent murderous thugs.

In saying that maybe we shouldn't label them murderers. I mean you know yourself how sometimes you "accidentally" leave a massive bomb in a car in a busy town on a Saturday.

It happens me all the time.

timthumbni

The who wrote: »

The R.I.R.A had mixed up the position of the car bomb. It was supposed to destroy this building (for the life of me I can't remember what the building was) but they couldnt get as close to the building as they wanted.They rang the authorities to notify them the whereabouts of the bomb (as they always do when their main target is a building and not innocent people) and they told them it was beside the building, but it wasnt. They rang two more times and gave a differant position each time because they genuinely didn't know where the bomb was. So, obviously the authorities were completely confused about where the bomb was and ended up hording everybody in the area down the street with the bomb but they didn't know the bomb was there.The Omagh bomb was a disaster for the IRA. They did not set out to kill thesecivilians and the IRA's numbers of supporters dramatically dropped after it (obviously people didn't know it was an accident.).Call it murder if you want but personally, as a republican I can accept this as a disastrous mistake and not a brutal murdering. P.S the IRA only give like 15-10 minutes warning so yes innocent people probably would have died anyway but not half as much

I do wish to call it murder. Calling it an "accident" may suit republicans but most decent people can see through that. Your definition of the word accident is obviously different to mine.

Making excuses for the omagh bombing highlights some republicans mindset very clearly. Embarrassed by nothing.

Manassas61

SoulandForm wrote: »

Do you understand the difference between the concepts of murder and manslaughter in law?

They murdered the people at Omagh when they planted the bomb. Not only murderous thugs but incompetent murderous thugs.

SoulandForm

Manassas61 wrote: »

God almighty, they planted a bomb in a busy place with lots of people. Of course it was murder. They ripped people apart with the bomb. Only in this country could you plant a bomb in a civilian populace place and when it kills people, say it isn't murder.

They planted the bomb and they murdered people. They are to blame.

Do you understand the difference between the concepts of murder and manslaughter in law?

Karl Stein

SoulandForm wrote: »

Its not they particularly like the English or the Welsh- its more they dislike or distrust southerners more.

The anti-culture of Unionism/Loyalism.

Anti-democratic
Anti-southern
Anti-Catholic

Manassas61

The who wrote: »

The R.I.R.A had mixed up the position of the car bomb. It was supposed to destroy this building (for the life of me I can't remember what the building was) but they couldnt get as close to the building as they wanted.They rang the authorities to notify them the whereabouts of the bomb (as they always do when their main target is a building and not innocent people) and they told them it was beside the building, but it wasnt. They rang two more times and gave a differant position each time because they genuinely didn't know where the bomb was. So, obviously the authorities were completely confused about where the bomb was and ended up hording everybody in the area down the street with the bomb but they didn't know the bomb was there.The Omagh bomb was a disaster for the IRA. They did not set out to kill these civilians and the IRA's numbers of supporters dramatically dropped after it (obviously people didn't know it was an accident.).Call it murder if you want but personally, as a republican I can accept this as a disastrous mistake and not a brutal murdering. P.S the IRA only give like 15-10 minutes warning so yes innocent people probably would have died anyway but not half as much

God almighty, they planted a bomb in a busy place with lots of people. Of course it was murder. They ripped people apart with the bomb. Only in this country could you plant a bomb in a civilian populace place and when it kills people, say it isn't murder.

They planted the bomb and they murdered people. They are to blame.

The who

timthumbni wrote: »

So just misguided, psychopathic republican terrorists with minimal support then. Right oh. As they proved in Omagh they even think murdering Spanish tourists and shoppers will get them to their new all Ireland destination.

They are on to a winner I tells ya.

The R.I.R.A had mixed up the position of the car bomb. It was supposed to destroy this building (for the life of me I can't remember what the building was) but they couldnt get as close to the building as they wanted.They rang the authorities to notify them the whereabouts of the bomb (as they always do when their main target is a building and not innocent people) and they told them it was beside the building, but it wasnt. They rang two more times and gave a differant position each time because they genuinely didn't know where the bomb was. So, obviously the authorities were completely confused about where the bomb was and ended up hording everybody in the area down the street with the bomb but they didn't know the bomb was there.The Omagh bomb was a disaster for the IRA. They did not set out to kill these civilians and the IRA's numbers of supporters dramatically dropped after it (obviously people didn't know it was an accident.).Call it murder if you want but personally, as a republican I can accept this as a disastrous mistake and not a brutal murdering. P.S the IRA only give like 15-10 minutes warning so yes innocent people probably would have died anyway but not half as much

Elmer Blooker

Fratton Fred wrote: »

What exactly did British intelligence have to gain my keeping the conflict going? How did they benefit from the Dublin and Monaghan bombs?

After the August 1969 rioting, James Callaghan the Home Secretary in Harold Wilson's Labour government, promised reforms in employment and housing.
He visited the Bogside (only 2 weeks after the Battle of the Bogside) and was applauded by a huge crowd. In June Edward Heath became PM, he didn't promise reforms, instead he imposed an illegal curfew on the Falls Road area and sent in the Black Watch regiment who smashed the place up including religious statues. The Provisionals at that stage were only in existence for a few months and were basically a small splinter group compared with the Officials. That soon changed.
By the way, the Black Watch is a Scottish regiment (lets just say you won't find any Celtic fans in their ranks) who wear tartan as part of their uniform and at that time the Orange mobs aided by the RUC who were burning Catholics out of their homes were known as "tartan gangs" Sending them in to the Falls was a deliberate plan to escalate the conflict by bringing the Provos and Officials out into the open and finish them off, the same goes for Bloody Sunday, that was also an attempt to bring the Provisionals out into the open. We know the rest.

Crooked Jack

Manassas61 wrote: »

It was the debate around 2011.

Oh, that single debate they had in 2011? I know what you're referring to now.

Manassas61

It was the debate around 2011.

SoulandForm

Fratton Fred wrote: »

It is, but the nationalists have organised themselves superbly. They have a master tactician at the helm and unless unionists sort themselves out and rally behind one moderate, unbigoted party, they will continue to lose ground.

The thing is that the DUP and to lesser extent the UUP are not Unionists the way the Labour Party in Scotland and Wales are Unionists- they are more Ulster Protestant particularists (or supremacists if you want to be harsher). Their perfect situation would be "Ulster independence" or the type of devolution that existed under the old Stormount. Northern Ireland politics are actually pretty different from the UK mainland. Its not they particularly like the English or the Welsh- its more they dislike or distrust southerners more.

maccored

Crooked Jack wrote: »

I tried viewing it on my phone, laptop and work computer, it's not coming up on any of them.

i see that too myself ....

SoulandForm

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Gerry Adams knows what to say and what to do at exactly the right time. Politically, I think Sinn Fein are very clever, God forbid they ever get near to actually running the country though.

Well a lot of PSF's rise in the north was down to their enemies- David Trimble's carry on a Portadown helped them a lot. Also in the south the ULA have totally messed up in true Trotskyite fashion, the Green Party have committed suicide and well Labour isnt much of an alternative so who is anyone roughly on the left going to be voting for?

Banjo String

timthumbni wrote: »

So just misguided, psychopathic republican terrorists with minimal support then. Right oh. As they proved in Omagh they even think murdering Spanish tourists and shoppers will get them to their new all Ireland destination.

They are on to a winner I tells ya.

You realise you're referring to a splinter/breakaway group, with zero ties, politically our ideology to S.F right?

I would agree with you though, that have absolute minimal support.

Banjo String

Manassas61 wrote: »

They are economically illiterates. Gerry Adams proved that when he was taking part in the debates a few years ago. Some of the nonsense he was coming out with as if money would just magically appear.

Two things.

Gerry Adams doesn't, and never has claimed to be a finance/economics genius. His strengths lie in political tactics and ideas. For proof of this, one only needs to look at the progress they've made in the north, and the gains being made in the south.

Secondly, at least Gerry Adams takes parts in televised debates. Enda Kenny wouldn't even face down Micheál Martin in the upcoming referendum, reason given 'he didn't want to embarrass him'.

Crooked Jack

maccored wrote: »

thats because its a mobile link and youre probably trying to view it on a desktop

I tried viewing it on my phone, laptop and work computer, it's not coming up on any of them.

maccored

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

That redirects to youtube's homepage.

thats because its a mobile link and youre probably trying to view it on a desktop

Iwasfrozen

Manassas61 wrote: »

Ok, so you tell me how you just make money appear without consequences? The state of the Republic is bankrupt. Just go and look at what he said during the debates and the ludicrous idea he had.

http://m.youtube.com/index?hl=en-GB&gl=GB&desktop_uri=%2F%3Fhl%3Den-GB%26gl%3DGB#/home

That redirects to youtube's homepage.

Manassas61

Crooked Jack wrote: »

This daft copy and paste response when people run out of things to say always amuses me. Sinn Fein's economic policies are radical and different from thise of the other parties. surely, given the last ten years, thats a good thing. if you cant understand the simple fact that the polcies of the past clearly havent worked and its time to try something new, then per haps youre the economic illiterate.

Ok, so you tell me how you just make money appear without consequences? The state of the Republic is bankrupt. Just go and look at what he said during the debates and the ludicrous idea he had.

http://m.youtube.com/index?hl=en-GB&gl=GB&desktop_uri=%2F%3Fhl%3Den-GB%26gl%3DGB#/home

SoulandForm

Manassas61 wrote: »

They are economically illiterates. Gerry Adams proved that when he was taking part in the debates a few years ago. Some of the nonsense he was coming out with as if money would just magically appear.

Gerry Adams I dont think really has a sound grasp on economics but Pearse Doherty does.

Crooked Jack

Manassas61 wrote: »

They are economically illiterates. Gerry Adams proved that when he was taking part in the debates a few years ago. Some of the nonsense he was coming out with as if money would just magically appear.

This daft copy and paste response when people run out of things to say always amuses me. Sinn Fein's economic policies are radical and different from thise of the other parties. surely, given the last ten years, thats a good thing. if you cant understand the simple fact that the polcies of the past clearly havent worked and its time to try something new, then per haps youre the economic illiterate.

Manassas61

Charlie Rock wrote: »

Nothing like a bit of SF bashing is there lads?

Isn't it just horrible when democracy produces the result you don't want?

They are economically illiterates. Gerry Adams proved that when he was taking part in the debates a few years ago. Some of the nonsense he was coming out with as if money would just magically appear.