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What??? You're running ANOTHER marathon!!!

ncmc

So I’m jumping on the band wagon and have decided to start my own log. I’ve been promised by some of the experts on here that it will keep me motivated over the winter, so with visions of me chomping at the bit to get out jogging, here it goes!

A little bit about me, I’m a 33 year old female, been running on and off for about 3 years, but very intermittent up until this year when I decided I wanted to run DCM. I followed Hal Higdon Novice 2 for the marathon and was delighted to beat my target by 3 minutes, 3:57. I felt the marathon couldn’t have gone better, followed the 4 hour pacers until mile 20 and then pushed on. Got a negative split, didn’t hit the wall or experience any severe fatigue, in fact I felt perfect 5 minutes after the marathon, so I am beginning to wonder now if I didn’t push myself hard enough. I think I have a tendency towards conservatism when it comes to setting goals!

I have almost 900 miles run this year so far, so should have no problem hitting 1000 miles by the end of the year. Seems like a long time ago that I set that goal on a cold January evening!

I haven’t ran many races, only one 10k, one half marathon, and one marathon. My times are as follows:

10k (April): 48:50
½ Marathon (August): 1:48:30
Marathon (DCM): 3:57:47

So my immediate goals are to hit 1000 miles for the year, and race the Waterford ½ marathon in December. I think I will follow the 1:45 pacers as my legs are still a bit tired from the marathon and I don’t want to push it too much. I would aim then to do a 1:40 half in the Spring. Slightly longer term, I would like to run Cork City Marathon in June. I am possibly dreaming, but I have it in my head that I would like to do a Sub 3:30…. Is this a pipe dream?

I intend to follow one of the P&D plans, have downloaded the book and am ready to get stuck in, so I will go from a max of 37 miles on HH2 to a max of 55 miles. I think I could definitely work on my nutrition as well, I ate nothing but rubbish in the run up to DCM.

So here it goes, any advice or comments very welcome!

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upthe19th

upthe19th wrote: »

In relation to the crutches, i never mess unless i'm messing:p

In relation to the fig rolls, i direct your attention to post #306 and your acknowledgement of bringing said fig rolls, and as it turns out ham sandwiches and tay......none of which materialised:mad:;)

If it weren't for the spectacular runners, a certain person's card would be well and truly marked:p

On a side note I think its a good call on the goal time assessment for cork.

Still powerful training though...keep it going.

Ignore. The guys are right. Sorry to put any doubt in your mind N. I have a bad habit of erring on the side of caution all the time, hence my initial response.

Today was a race, but as part of a plan for cork. If it was a goal race and one you were dedicated to with your training, then fair enough. But it wasn't and you got a great pb and the training is obviously working. You're hitting the mileage and this week was no exception.

Dilbert75

ncmc wrote: »

I do suffer very much from self doubt, I think a lot of the time I'm beaten before I step on the course. I don't know if I can fix that mentality in 6 weeks!

This is a bit rich coming from Captain Cautious but: choose to believe you can. Tell yourself over and over. Just for 1 weekend. You'll be surprised how it works. So people may avoid you if you're running along chanting positive mantras but what the heck?

statss

blockic wrote: »

When and what is your next race?

You should continue to train as you were (3:30) and run this next one flat out if its more than 2 weeks before the race. You will have a much better idea where you are then with that result before you have to make a decision.

Plenty time.

I would agree with this advice. Keep going as you were for now, and stay positive

ncmc

You guys don’t believe in letting a girl take the easy way out do you! I won’t rush into any decisions just yet. I will carry on as I was and do my PMP miles at the 3:30 pace for the moment, it will all stand to the good regardless of what I decide to do on the day. The more I think about yesterday, I think I made a mistake in not eating enough before the race. I had a very small bowl of porridge at 6:30 and that was it. I felt hungry before the race and the dead legs/slow down felt very much like fuel having run out. I regret not bringing a gel or jelly babies with me or eating a banana before the race. Not trying to make excuses as I know I just didn’t have it in me on the day, but maybe I didn’t give myself the best shot at it either.

jcsmum

I agree with all the guys - your training has been spot on and there is no reason why you can't go sub 3.30. Like us all, you need to work on your confidence.
Yesterday's course was tough. I was in a position to take note of every bump in the road while pacing 2hr. I kept saying to myself 'jeez, I'm glad I'm not racing this.... flat my ASS!' :rolleyes: Just put it behind you, move on and just focus on this week's training.
1:43 is a super time btw.

Steroo

ncmc wrote: »

You guys don’t believe in letting a girl take the easy way out do you! I won’t rush into any decisions just yet. I will carry on as I was and do my PMP miles at the 3:30 pace for the moment, it will all stand to the good regardless of what I decide to do on the day. The more I think about yesterday, I think I made a mistake in not eating enough before the race. I had a very small bowl of porridge at 6:30 and that was it. I felt hungry before the race and the dead legs/slow down felt very much like fuel having run out. I regret not bringing a gel or jelly babies with me or eating a banana before the race. Not trying to make excuses as I know I just didn’t have it in me on the day, but maybe I didn’t give myself the best shot at it either.

There is too much work done (and done well) to take it easy in Cork! The fuel would be a factor. I had a banana in the car at 9:30 & a gel.
In cork we can both start with the 3:30 pacers & let them do the work.. we can support each other & not let each other slip back. Then we can pass them on Mile 25. Deal or no Deal!?

ncmc

StephenRooney wrote: »

There is too much work done (and done well) to take it easy in Cork! The fuel would be a factor. I had a banana in the car at 9:30 & a gel.
In cork we can both start with the 3:30 pacers & let them do the work.. we can support each other & not let each other slip back. Then we can pass them on Mile 25. Deal or no Deal!?

Haha, now that is optimism, I love it! tbh I would like to run with pacers (tbc which ones I'll follow!) I think it really takes the pressure off having them do the hard work. As you said in your log, we started off a little too fast on the tough first half of the course. If I'd taken it easier on the first half, I could have made up time on the easier second half.

Gavlor

ncmc wrote: »

You guys don’t believe in letting a girl take the easy way out do you! I won’t rush into any decisions just yet. I will carry on as I was and do my PMP miles at the 3:30 pace for the moment, it will all stand to the good regardless of what I decide to do on the day. The more I think about yesterday, I think I made a mistake in not eating enough before the race. I had a very small bowl of porridge at 6:30 and that was it. I felt hungry before the race and the dead legs/slow down felt very much like fuel having run out. I regret not bringing a gel or jelly babies with me or eating a banana before the race. Not trying to make excuses as I know I just didn’t have it in me on the day, but maybe I didn’t give myself the best shot at it either.

Hunger? Maybe.

Tiredness? Definitely.

Next time listen to coach gavlor

Runchick

ncmc wrote: »

You guys don’t believe in letting a girl take the easy way out do you! I won’t rush into any decisions just yet. I will carry on as I was and do my PMP miles at the 3:30 pace for the moment, it will all stand to the good regardless of what I decide to do on the day. The more I think about yesterday, I think I made a mistake in not eating enough before the race. I had a very small bowl of porridge at 6:30 and that was it. I felt hungry before the race and the dead legs/slow down felt very much like fuel having run out. I regret not bringing a gel or jelly babies with me or eating a banana before the race. Not trying to make excuses as I know I just didn’t have it in me on the day, but maybe I didn’t give myself the best shot at it either.

Geez ncmc I didn't realise you had nothing to eat! I took 2 gels during my HM, there's no way I could have finished without them (whether its psychological or not). If you ran a 1.43 on tired legs and with no fuel, imagine what you could do in Cork after taper and plenty of fuel

ncmc

Runchick wrote: »

Geez ncmc I didn't realise you had nothing to eat! I took 2 gels during my HM, there's no way I could have finished without them (whether its psychological or not). If you ran a 1.43 on tired legs and with no fuel, imagine what you could do in Cork after taper and plenty of fuel

Thanks Runchick, I have been trying to run on less fuel lately, I have been avoiding taking gels unless I really need them, but in hindsight I think that was a mistake yesterday. I was quite hungry at the start of the race and as a result the water was kinda sloshing round in an unpleasant manner

I think a banana an hour or so before hand would have been a good idea. And maybe a gel or jellies as insurance.

Runchick

ncmc wrote: »

Thanks Runchick, I have been trying to run on less fuel lately, I have been avoiding taking gels unless I really need them, but in hindsight I think that was a mistake yesterday. I was quite hungry at the start of the race and as a result the water was kinda sloshing round in an unpleasant manner I think a banana an hour or so before hand would have been a good idea. And maybe a gel or jellies as insurance.

I rarely eat before a training run as they are usually first thing but racing is a different thing altogether...gel overload time

What are your fuel plans for Cork?

ncmc

Runchick wrote: »

I rarely eat before a training run as they are usually first thing but racing is a different thing altogether...gel overload time What are your fuel plans for Cork?

I think i'll follow the same plan as Dublin, probably take one at 6,12 and 18. I will be having my trusty High 5 tabs as well in water at each station. I'm hoping that by not taking them much in training, i'll feel the benefit more on race day. Guess I shoulda thought of that yesterday

Dilbert75

Yeah NCMC - you could have done what one of your fellow runners did. Got a text from a guy last night, saw me at the water stop, was telling me he was starving so he got his wife to get him a burger from McD's - she did and handed it to him so he ran part of the race eating it!

ncmc

Are you kidding me, did that actually happen? I struggle to eat a jelly, never mind a burger! Fair play to that man - I like his style

Steroo

Dilbert75 wrote: »

Yeah NCMC - you could have done what one of your fellow runners did. Got a text from a guy last night, saw me at the water stop, was telling me he was starving so he got his wife to get him a burger from McD's - she did and handed it to him so he ran part of the race eating it!

On the final stretch yesterday we ran by the drive thru queue... Body screaming and these fockers queuing for mcd!! Had to look away

Beef

Even though it didn't go too well yesterday you still have a big pb in the bag and are defo heading for a crack at 3:30. If you don't aim for it you'll never achieve it! I thought I'd meet up with you and some others yesterday (I met Stephen and I think it was Druss) but I was bloody freezing after finishing so headed back to the car with my sister. I still think you had some of those Thursday miles in the legs. I was surprised you did that double session so near the race but I didn't want to say anything last week that would put doubts in your head.

ncmc

Totally bummed today when I realised I'd got my weeks mixed up and what I thought was an easy-ish week this week actually calls for a V02 session with 5x1000m @ 5k pace and also 14 pmp miles in this weekends lsr. Boo-urns to that.

Anywho, just have to get on with it. Rested yday and did 8 miles tonight @ 8:53. Legs felt pretty good, but I am struggling to run in this warmer weather (I am aware that I am always complaining about the weather, be it too cold, too wet or too warm!) I'm hoping a few runs done in Warner weather and I'll acclimatise a bit. Otherwise I'll be echoing career move and hoping for the coldest June BH in history!

ncmc

11 miles @ 9:04

Wore my new Wexford HM t-shirt for the first time, I kept thinking there was something strange about it. I was internally giving out that even the t-shirt wasn't working out for me! Was only when I got home and passed a mirror that I realised I had it on back to front the whole time

Dilbert75

There's a lesson for us all in that parable young NCMC - when things don't seem to be working out right it sometimes helps to look at them a different way and they could turn right around...

Signing off,
Fr Dilbert

Beef

Best of luck on your PMP run... I know how much you love those sessions.

Steroo

Beef wrote: »

Best of luck on your PMP run... I know how much you love those sessions.

+1 it's a good chance to get that self belief back in order, well able!

ncmc

18 miles @ 8:22 aka a run of two halves

So was feeling pretty confident about the pmp run today. I'd come down with a bad case of lazy b*tch desease this week so my mileage was pitiful heading into this run and the legs were fresh. Had a good brekkie before heading out to try and avoid the mistakes of last week. Drove up to Cork to run my usual route along the marina, a nice flat route so perfect for pmp miles.

Started off pretty well, 2 miles warm up and then started on my 14 pmp miles. First 8 or 9 were fine, kept a good steady pace of between 7:45-7:55. Came back along the marina and was against the wind now. Legs started to feel very heavy at this stage and my pace was dropping although the effort felt the same. Took a gel to try and get a bit of energy back. But all that did was make me really thirsty and my water was back at the car. Last five pmp miles felt like a total drag, pace had dropped down to around 8:30 for the last 5 miles or so and I was so glad to get the 14 done and get to the cool down stage.

This run really should have been perfect, legs were fresh, I'd eaten, weather was ok bar a bit of a wind. I think it's crystallised in my mind that a 3:30 in Cork is not realistic. I think there's a difference between being optimistic and aiming high and then kidding yourself. I think I would be in the second category if I keep banging the 3:30 drum. I think I could keep the pace for 16 maybe 20 miles, but I think a blow up would be inevitable. I think at this stage I have a good 3:40 in me, nothing I have done in the last 4-6 weeks has convinced me that I can aim much higher than that.

I think I have a 3:30 in me at some stage, but not for this one. It's only my second marathon so I don't feel too bad. If I get a good 3:40, then a sub 3:30 would definitely be my goal for the next one.

So using the Dilbert gold/silver/bronze method (patent pending!). My new goals are:
Gold - 3:37 (20 mins off my PB)
Silver - 3:42 (15 mins off)
Bronze - come in with the 3:45 pacers.

So sorry Stephen, you and Doc Jewel are going to have to fly the 3:30 flag without me. On the plus side, you'll be in the pub first so mines a Carlsberg thanks

Feeling pretty good now about the last 5 weeks of training. I'd massively lost motivation and drive and had started to totally dread the marathon. But feeling much more optimistic about it now.

Steroo

Good session all the same. Understand your choice. If it means you won't dread it and enjoy the next 5 weeks and go in with confidence then you are right.
I was feeling similar yesterday but won't alter anything for now.
Carlsberg it is! Speaking of which, where will be a good place to go & which corconian is organising?!

ncmc

Don't let yesterday's session dent your confidence Ste, you're doing great. I have zero doubt that 3:30 is well within your grasp. As Doc said on you own log, you're carrying a niggle and it's only 7 days after you really pushed yourself at the HM. Plus your session was pretty good! Don't let the doubts creep in cos of one tough run. Concentrate on getting the hip back to 100% and you'll be flying.

I have a couple if ideas for a post race watering hole! Getting advice for some guys in work who know the local pubs inside out. Going to try and find somewhere close to the finish, not too packed and most importantly, no stairs or upstairs loo!

Gavlor

Carlsberg?!!

Surely after running 26.2 miles you deserve to drink something better than CARLSBERG?!!

On a serious note, fair play to you for adjusting your target down. It's not an easy thing to do at this stage in your training. At least you know you'll smash 3.45!

blockic

Gavlor wrote: »

Carlsberg?!!

Surely after running 26.2 miles you deserve to drink something better than CARLSBERG?!!

On a serious note, fair play to you for adjusting your target down. It's not an easy thing to do at this stage in your training. At least you know you'll smash 3.45!

C'mere don't go knocking Carlsberg! That's my tipple also!!

The correct choice I think N, you'll enjoy it much more and as Gavlor says you'll smash 3:45 and it would be a least a 15 minute PB. You are also reducing the risk for getting the GFA for London as If you blew up going for 3:30 anything could happen.

In terms of after-party in Cork, you need to be consulting me in this matter also being a native!!

Woodford, Roundy or Old Oak perhaps? Nice and close to the finish line too.

ncmc

Thanks guys, I'm actually really hopeful of getting a silver or maybe even a gold result, it's seems so stupid for 7-12 mins to make such a difference to the state of mind, but it just gives me a cushion of 15-20 seconds per mile and that feels like a big difference. Just goes to show that half this marathon lark is in the head!

Anywhere but the Old Oak J, I hate that pub! I was thinking Roundy, Raven or I've heard the Vicarstown Inn on North Main St is a really good spot in an old man kinda way. Must check which of them do grub, I think a combination of 26.2 miles, empty stomach and Carlsberg could be dangerous!

Dilbert75

I'm glad N that you didn't finalise this decision too suddenly after your disappointment in Wexford but having had a bit of time to consider it. If you still feel it's the best plan for you then you're dead right to go with it. It's better for your confidence to exceed a more conservative goal that to miss a more aggressive goal.

And I too think you'll smash 3:40. Cos you're well able.

blockic

ncmc wrote: »

T
Anywhere but the Old Oak J, I hate that pub! I was thinking Roundy, Raven or I've heard the Vicarstown Inn on North Main St is a really good spot in an old man kinda way.

North Main Street!! *shudder*

You know that is a dodgy and rough oul street, Sure it's the main passageway that the Northsiders use to infiltrate the south! Explains it all really! :pac: Roundy would be nice alright, especially outside if we hopefully get a nice warm day!..oh wait.......

ncmc

I think the Roundy would be perfect. Hopefully the sun will come out at approx 12:45

Right, you'll be finished first, your job is to grab a table!