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Am I the only one ?

tempura

Sick to death of hearing about people talking about the Celtic ****ing Tiger.

Am I the only one who barely even noticed it. Didn't go mad buying load of stupid ****e like overpriced properties and fancy cars etc.

Yeah, noticed a little extra money coming in, but had the foresight that to see that it might not last, so didn't go mad.

What the hell came over people ?

Im actually only getting to grips now with the amount of materialism the people became obsessed with during the so called boom.

Do you ever stop to think, " well I've only myself to blame "

Was it a live now pay later kind of attitude at the time ?

The mind boggles.

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[Deleted User]

smcgiff wrote: »

I don't know what's more annoying - those that flew around in helicopters a few years ago or the plethora of people now saying they didn't go mad and saw it all coming.

You know, people make millions on correctly predicting the downturn in economies. So, I presume ye are the new millionaires.

I don't know how anyone DIDN'T see it coming. I'm no expert. I've never studied finance. I was in my teens and early twenties during the boom but even at that age, it was obvious that something was not at all right. All my friends' parents were living like Kardashians. New BMWs every year, 3 foreign holidays, daily cleaner, designer bags... there was just no way they could afford all that on wages that were good but not astronomical.

I remember the cleaner at work talking about her second home in the Algarve and her Christmas shopping trip to New York and when I commented on it to my colleague, she told me I was snobby and classist. I'm not snobby or classist. I've worked as a cleaner. That's how I know that a cleaner owning a holiday home and shopping in New York is ridiculous. Society simply doesn't work like that.

It was madness. Absolute madness. I'd grown up in the North where the Celtic Tiger had no/little effect, so to arrive in Dublin and feel like I was in Beverly Hills was really weird.

Ruudi_Mentari

all I remember is a picture of Drico, with blond highlights and a pink shirt twirling the keys to a shiny new lexus

but I think that's the norm for him and he was just advised to tone it down?

starviewadams

No queues in the dole office,those were the days!

DEFTLEFTHAND

They can't stand prosperity as a wise man once said , the Irish are a funny bunch, to psycho analyse them is amazing. They probably have the biggest collective inferiority complex in the world.

Galwayguy35

weemcd wrote: »

No you are not the only one, I'm sick of the talk of Celtic Tiger because I never saw it. I'm 24, and was 18/19 when the global credit crunch began to unravel. Chance would be a fine thing...

You would be Celtic Tiger cub, so I doubt you had it that tough growing up during the boom.

Galwayguy35

tempura wrote: »

Absolute bollix to be honest, when people were borrowing, they were fully informed as to what was expected of them in relation to repayment.

They were also informed as to what would happen if they couldn't meet those repayments.

They were advised to make contingency in the event of their income was to be effected.

People were advised and were fully aware of the responsibility they were taking on.

I can only speak for the financial institution that I work for.

Again, people didn't seem to take any responsibility for their spending and want to blame someone else.

Have to call you out on this, the banks were offering money to people who couldn't afford it, sending out letters saying they were approved for a loan when the salary some folks were on clearly didn't match up.

Sure people were stupid to borrow beyond their means, I've said it before, a quick calcuation on a piece of paper would tell most people if they could afford a loan but the banks and those working in them are by no means blameless.

CaraMay

Bleating on about how clever you were not to get caught up in the Celtic tiger is as smug and self promoting as the morons who bleeped on about how much they had. Both scenarios are promoting your own superiority complex over people you consider to be less 'clued in' than you.

So you didn't buy a house? Big swing... So you live on €1.50 a wee out of choice? Good for you and big swing. Live and let live peeps

People have to take responsibility for their own greed. I work with SME's and Plenty of small businesses would have survived if the directors hasn't plundered the companies to buy jeeps, holiday homes etc etc yet they blame to entire world and the banks for their business going to the walls.

Sunnyisland

Emigrated from Ireland in 94 did not come back till 06, So missed most of it.

When I left Ireland wasn't in great shape, I leave it it booms, I come back and it goes down again, Some of my friends think I am a jinx and I should feck of out again :-)

Hannibal Smith

the Celtic tiger was brilliant!!! I loved every fleeting minute of it!!!! it was all high paced and high paid and the weekends were the best craic ever...would go back in a heartbeat

Hannibal Smith

IzzyWizzy wrote: »

I don't know how anyone DIDN'T see it coming. I'm no expert. I've never studied finance. I was in my teens and early twenties during the boom but even at that age, it was obvious that something was not at all right. All my friends' parents were living like Kardashians. New BMWs every year, 3 foreign holidays, daily cleaner, designer bags... there was just no way they could afford all that on wages that were good but not astronomical.

I remember the cleaner at work talking about her second home in the Algarve and her Christmas shopping trip to New York and when I commented on it to my colleague, she told me I was snobby and classist. I'm not snobby or classist. I've worked as a cleaner. That's how I know that a cleaner owning a holiday home and shopping in New York is ridiculous. Society simply doesn't work like that.

It was madness. Absolute madness. I'd grown up in the North where the Celtic Tiger had no/little effect, so to arrive in Dublin and feel like I was in Beverly Hills was really weird.

people did see it coming but bertie aherne accused them of moaning and cribbing

Sunnyisland

Just a note,

When I came back (2006)the banks where throwing money out to anyone.Two family members were looking for loans for house improvements of 20,000.The banks refused the above amount in both cases saying they can only give out 40,000, One of them took it the other did not. I also was despite being not in the country for 12 years and only back working here in little over a year (2007)able to get two loans .one from BOI and the other from Halifax for over 10,000,I was quite amazed. just saying.

Ps all my loans are now paid back in full :-)

CaraMay

Hannibal Smith wrote: »

the Celtic tiger was brilliant!!! I loved every fleeting minute of it!!!! it was all high paced and high paid and the weekends were the best craic ever...would go back in a heartbeat

I agree it was great craic. Everyone optimistic and can do rather than drab and whiney like now.

Oranage2

Well it all started back in the mid 90s, we got a telephone.

Fast forward 10 years later I was in college, working 3 jobs, several electronic devices, heading into town twice a week and only drinking double vodka red bulls.

fast forward another ten years, one job that paid less then what I made working in a supermarket, head out twice a month and only drink beer.

I think the boom had some kind of effect on everyone.

Wibbs

smcgiff wrote: »

Very true - it doesn't say a lot about us as a people. The recent polls showing support for FF as high as it is. It's like a battered spouse returning to their abuser. Very depressing.

That and for some reason people expected some sort of miraculous change when the current lot got in. Unfortunately the centre politicians of this country are all much of a muchness. FF or FG(Lab)? Six of one half dozen of the other, fleshed out by the oddball and extreme parties. With a few notable exceptions the Irish political class tend to be vote seeking missiles and gombeen men. The electorate are to blame too, it's a two way street.

On topic I recall chatting to a local candidate looking for votes outside the local supermarket in the middle of the bubble. Nice chap, but he was talking about winding our collective heads back in. I told him that I agreed, but look around. Look at the car park, stuffed with Mercs and Beemers in hock on "easy" credit. No one is going to vote for someone suggesting this might all be bullshít cos that would be scary. Better to believe it would all work out. Human nature.

IMH many people did realise it was bullshít. I'm talking about the people buying into it BTW. You could see some of them baulk at the figures being bandied about in their personal lives, but again human nature, they were strapped in for the ride and didn't know how to get off psychologically, never mind financially.

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

Have to call you out on this, the banks were offering money to people who couldn't afford it, sending out letters saying they were approved for a loan when the salary some folks were on clearly didn't match up.

Sure people were stupid to borrow beyond their means, I've said it before, a quick calcuation on a piece of paper would tell most people if they could afford a loan but the banks and those working in them are by no means blameless.

+1000. I saw the same CG. Banks seemed to be nearly trying to get rid of money. My bank(s*) would ring me at least once a month offering me loans, credit cards, hugely increased limits on my one credit card. Dangling the carrot of new car, holidays, home improvements etc. Many's the time you would hear incredulity down the phone line when I told them I was fine I had what I wanted and if I wanted something I'd save for it. This really didn't seem to compute for them.

I knew(vaguely) one guy who was working in a very ordinary job, pretty low wages, early twenties. He had been left a house by a rellie of some nature. No mortgage on it. So he leveraged that house against another, rented that out then leveraged again. And again. This lad when I talked to him mid 06 had nearly ten properties like this. All leveraged against a single nice but nondescript semi dee in an equally nondescript area where gentrification was never likely to be sustainable. The banks were only too happy to build his nonsense up, even went so far as to advise him on his next "investment". I actually said to him at the time why didn't he cash it all in. He was young, get out while the getting was good and enjoy his youth with some cash and at least one gaff. Nothing to do with me having a crystal ball either. I just thought it might be a plan(drink was taken

). He told me without a hint of concern that even if he did - and this was at the height of the bubble - he'd be on a loser. I had some concerns up to then, but that really solidified them for me.

*One biz one private. Sound way flasher than it is

Bullseye1

weemcd wrote: »

No you are not the only one, I'm sick of the talk of Celtic Tiger because I never saw it. I'm 24, and was 18/19 when the global credit crunch began to unravel. Chance would be a fine thing...

Your parents did not buy you a PS3/Xbox and bring you on holidays?

Grayson

darlett wrote: »

Hindsight is amazing but can you say you saw THIS coming? Did you know houses were twice the price they should be? Bully for you then.

Yes, it was ****ing obvious. especially near the end. Prices were rising so fast that people were getting priced out. The number of people who told me that it'd be my last chance.

Journalists were saying it. Bertie told them to commit suicide.

At one point 60% of our tax income came from the building trade.

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

Have to call you out on this, the banks were offering money to people who couldn't afford it, sending out letters saying they were approved for a loan when the salary some folks were on clearly didn't match up.

Sure people were stupid to borrow beyond their means, I've said it before, a quick calcuation on a piece of paper would tell most people if they could afford a loan but the banks and those working in them are by no means blameless.

They're separate issues. just because a bank is offering you a loan, doesn't mean you have to take it. If I walked up to you and offered you heroin, I'd be doing a bad thing. But it's your free choice to take it.

smcgiff wrote: »

I don't know what's more annoying - those that flew around in helicopters a few years ago or the plethora of people now saying they didn't go mad and saw it all coming.

You know, people make millions on correctly predicting the downturn in economies. So, I presume ye are the new millionaires.

Unfortunately, you need money to be able to make more money. And despite my modest savings, I wasn't about to sign up for all the credit everyone else was availing of.
Although fair play to any that managed to pull it off.

CaraMay

Grayson wrote: »

They're separate issues. just because a bank is offering you a loan, doesn't mean you have to take it. If I walked up to you and offered you heroin, I'd be doing a bad thing. But it's your free choice to take it.

Sense at last!!!

People in this country have no personal responsibility for their own cock-ups. There is always someone else to blame and someone else always left to pick up the pieces.

LostBoy101

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

How could you barely notice it??

There were fecking cranes everywhere

And now you can only see 3 or 4 cranes while in the boom there was like 20.. :rolleyes:

ThirdMan

I didn't really notice. I dropped out of school and started an apprenticeship when I was 16. Spent the following 10 years having the craic. Never saved a penny or committed to anything. The only thing I have to show for it is a decent dvd and and cd collection.

Started in college as a mature student 4 years ago, and I've been on a tight budget ever since. But it's the type of tight budget a student can expect to be living on, whether there's a recession or not. So no complaints there.

I realise that the current situation is very hard for a lot of people, but I have to say it's been a positive force in my life. Work on the sites was starting to dry up, so it was a good time to start studying.

Happy days.

smcgiff

If people are talking about house prices being over inflated then yeah the dogs in the street knew this - and I feel sorry for those that bought at the height.

But if anyone is saying that they predicted the mess the banks had got themselves into, which is what bankrupted the state - then congrats mystic meg.

ThirdMan

Bullseye1 wrote: »

Your parents did not buy you a PS3/Xbox and bring you on holidays?

People are still doing all that stuff. I have about €15 to myself every week, after all my bills are paid. And yet I still get away for a few weeks every year. Families will always pull together to create some sort of quality of life for themselves. Playstation's and Ryanair flights aren't the measure of an economy.

But I know what you're saying. I wrote in a previous post that I didn't notice the recession, because I spent around a decade going to festivals, etc. Obviously you could argue that my lifestyle was a product of the boom. But my wages were never that high, so while I was living through an economic boom, my own expenditure was never that significant. So I never felt part of what was going on around me.

However, there was a plentiful supply of work for that 10 years. I never had to worry about where I was gonna finish my apprenticeship or whatever. So that much I can't deny.

[Deleted User]

smcgiff wrote: »

If people are talking about house prices being over inflated then yeah the dogs in the street knew this - and I feel sorry for those that bought at the height.

But if anyone is saying that they predicted the mess the banks had got themselves into, which is what bankrupted the state - then congrats mystic meg.

So where did you think all the money was coming from?

C.K Dexter Haven

You are in a wonderful position OP of being able to learn from other people's financial mistakes, before setting out in life yourself.

While undoubtedly you will end up being the most perfect of investors, never owing anything beyond your means, never making a wrong decision as regards money, there will be other areas of your life that you will undoubtedly mess up royally, because you're putting so much energy into spouting bile with the privileged benefit of hindsight.

I wish you well in your perfect life

smcgiff

IzzyWizzy wrote: »

So where did you think all the money was coming from?

I feel honoured to have you posting on boards. Surely you made millions on bank share prices collapsing. Wouldn't even have taken much money either - but thanks for swinging by to converse with us little people :P

Oh, any tips for the future, or can you only do historical predictions

[Deleted User]

smcgiff wrote: »

I feel honoured to have you posting on boards. Surely you made millions on bank share prices collapsing. Wouldn't even have taken much money either - but thanks for swinging by to converse with us little people :P

Oh, any tips for the future, or can you only do historical predictions

No, it's a serious question. Where did you think the money was coming from? How do you think cleaners on 18K a year were buying holiday homes in Portugal and 22-year-olds getting the keys to city centre flats? Did it never even enter your head that the banks were being a little bit naughty?

Grayson

smcgiff wrote: »

If people are talking about house prices being over inflated then yeah the dogs in the street knew this - and I feel sorry for those that bought at the height.

But if anyone is saying that they predicted the mess the banks had got themselves into, which is what bankrupted the state - then congrats mystic meg.

Honestly, I saw them taking a huge hit. That many properties in negative equity. And with so much money in this country coming from the construction industry, it was going to hit everything in some way.
But I never once thought there'd be a government bailout or anything like that. Just general sh1ttiness and a huge share price drop.

Edit: Kinda saw a recession coming, not a depression.

smcgiff

My question was serious too. The next time you predict the bank's (or any company) share price tanking buy some Put Options.

However, INBS or Anglo did not fail because they gave mortgages to hair dressers (bad an all as that was). They failed because they lent to developers that bought the likes of the glass bottle site for 10s of millions, when it's now worth buttons.

These transactions were a lot less transparent.

So, while INBS was supposed to be a building society (LOL!) it failed because it followed Anglo into bank rolling developers.

smcgiff

whoops - double post

tempura

C.K Dexter Haven wrote: »

You are in a wonderful position OP of being able to learn from other people's financial mistakes, before setting out in life yourself.

While undoubtedly you will end up being the most perfect of investors, never owing anything beyond your means, never making a wrong decision as regards money, there will be other areas of your life that you will undoubtedly mess up royally, because you're putting so much energy into spouting bile with the privileged benefit of hindsight.

I wish you well in your perfect life

Thanks. I appreciate your advice and will keep an eye out for any pitfalls in the future.

However, I have lived through one recession already ( 80's ) and learnt a lot from that.

As regards my impending life cock ups ! Im all up to speed thanks, being a 44 year old divorced mother of teenagers, overseeing their welfare, working a full time job, paying all the bills, and keeping a decent meal on the table, I think I have it covered.

I will keep your words of wisdom in mind though.

C.K Dexter Haven

tempura wrote: »

Thanks. I appreciate your advice and will keep an eye out for any pitfalls in the future.

However, I have lived through one recession already ( 80's ) and learnt a lot from that.

As regards my impending life cock ups ! Im all up to speed thanks, being a 44 year old divorced mother of teenagers, overseeing their welfare, working a full time job, paying all the bills, and keeping a decent meal on the table, I think I have it covered.

I will keep your words of wisdom in mind though.

And here's me excusing the naievity and condescending tone of your opening post by attributing it to your youth and lack of life experience.

In answer to your question so, I've absolutely no idea why some people are not as brilliant as you in managing their money.

Maybe it's because they don't have qualifications in finance, or that a set of circumstances arose that placed them in financial difficulty or that they took calculated risks that werent particularily well calculated or indeed, maybe some of the decisions made by people in the last decade could be blamed on normal early adulthood mistakes or lack of experience.