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Child Item

EUR100m a year government funding goes to Private schools

Leftist

According to newstalk.

You have to laugh.

There has been numerous people texting in with the same schtick: my children deserve it. We saved up. We shouldn't be begrudged.

begrudged government handouts... for FEE-paying schools

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MagicMarker

Thought it'd be a lot more.

Rented Mule

Sounds like a bargain to me.

Zillah

This goes on the teacher's salaries though, right? The school still pays for everything else.

seamus

There was a thread about this a while back.

It was determined that this is actually a bargain, saving the state a few hundred milion per year because it doesn't have to provide facilities for those students.

MagicMarker

TBH, I don't see why these schools are referred to as "private". If they receive public funding then they are not, imo, private. They are simply fee paying.

joydivision

Government pays for stuff shocker .

gozunda

How much is given to state funded 'public' catholic schools?

As far as I am aware that figure includes the Gaelscoile out there and not just the Eton / Hogwarts type institutions that everyone envisions ...

Mr Benevolent

Meh. In other news, the government gives me a few mill a year, I'm not complaining about that!

FatherLen

Leftist wrote: »

the government is spending money on people other than me

fyp

COYW

Complete no brainer this. Private schools save the government a fortune.

Leftist

wow....

I imagine those championing public spending on a resourse for the wealthy, during a time of austerity, are the same people who think people from disadvantaged areas have no excuse and their self proclaimed 'entitlements' should be stripped.

kinda sad. but shows why the country is in such a shocking state.

seamus

Nobody's championing anything. You've posted some rhetoric about wealthy versus disadvantaged and provided absolutely zero content.

Why is this €100m poorly spent?

As I say, this was discussed a few weeks back. If you removed the teacher funding from private schools, not only would you see an exodus of the best teachers out of the public system, but a huge glut of private kids would suddenly be foisted onto the public system as their parents became unable to afford soaring private fees.
This would in the short to medium term increase the dept of education's expenditure by far more than €100m, resulting in a net cost to the state.

Leftist

ah, I follow now. kind of like if we expect proportional tax on corporations, they might leave?

seamus

Leftist wrote: »

ah, I follow now. kind of like if we expect proportional tax on corporations, they might leave?

No, nothing like that whatsoever.

There's a common misconception that the parents who put their children in private schools are the top-tier salary earners like barristers, bankers, politicians, etc. This is true of handful of private schools, but in most cases the private schools are primarily catering to middle-class families who would be unable to afford a massive jump in these fees.

There are about 30,000 students in private education each year, and the cost to the state of providing public education is about €8k per head per annum. It would cost the state nearly a quarter of a billion to educate these students, instead they're getting away with paying less than half of it.
If the state was to pull this funding, private schools would have to raise fees by €3,500 per student to cover costs. In many private schools, this would represent an increase of more than 100% in their fees, which many parents could not afford. Which in turn would require the school to raise fees further to meet a shortfall until you reach an equilibrium where you have a small elite of parents who can afford to pay €8k+ per year to a private school, and the state is footing the bill for the majority of the other students who are now shoehorning themselves into the public schools.

Have you done any research on this at all?

[Deleted User]

seamus wrote: »

No, nothing like that whatsoever.

There's a common misconception that the parents who put their children in private schools are the top-tier salary earners like barristers, bankers, politicians, etc. This is true of handful of private schools, but in most cases the private schools are primarily catering to middle-class families who would be unable to afford a massive jump in these fees.

There are about 30,000 students in private education each year, and the cost to the state of providing public education is about €8k per head per annum. It would cost the state nearly a quarter of a billion to educate these students, instead they're getting away with paying less than half of it.
If the state was to pull this funding, private schools would have to raise fees by €3,500 per student to cover costs. In many private schools, this would represent an increase of more than 100% in their fees, which many parents could not afford. Which in turn would require the school to raise fees further to meet a shortfall until you reach an equilibrium where you have a small elite of parents who can afford to pay €8k+ per year to a private school, and the state is footing the bill for the majority of the other students who are now shoehorning themselves into the public schools.

Have you done any research on this at all?

The €3,500 per student is just for teachers wages there are additional costs to the state for fee paying schools

Zab

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

The €3,500 per student is just for teachers wages there are additional costs to the state for fee paying schools

Nothing of note, no. There is a tiny amount of capital spending grants but no capitation grants.

steddyeddy

Ah what the feck? Another private schools thread?? Everyone knows starting threads on that is my job :-P

[Deleted User]

Zab wrote: »

Nothing of note, no. There is a tiny amount of capital spending grants but no capitation grants.

How much is tiny, €10 million?

Zab

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

How much is tiny, €10 million?

€2.8 million last year, it's been steadily decreasing for the past few years. Obviously it's a reasonable sum of money but it isn't going to change an argument where we're already using rough figures like €3500 per head.

Dodge

COYW wrote: »

Complete no brainer this. Private schools save the government a fortune.

I do love the fact the moderator of the Hockey forum posted this.

griffdaddy

I for one am sick of my tax going towards rugby balls, blazers and elocution lessons.
I got bet around with hurls and fondled by Christian Brothers and it done me no harm.

Bruce7

Leftist wrote: »

ah, I follow now. kind of like if we expect proportional tax on corporations, they might leave?

Yes, kind of like that, well done. Sometimes if you try to grab too much, you end up with less than if you just left things alone.

You'll find logic in a lot of different places. And poetry. And rhetoric.

COYW

seamus wrote: »

There's a common misconception that the parents who put their children in private schools are the top-tier salary earners like barristers, bankers, politicians, etc.

Correct. One man I work with sends his two children to a private school. He decided to invest the money he would have spent on family holidays and such luxuries on education instead. The short term pain is worth the long term gain, in his eyes.

Jo King

seamus wrote: »

No, nothing like that whatsoever.

There's a common misconception that the parents who put their children in private schools are the top-tier salary earners like barristers,

Have you done any research on this at all?

Barristers, in practice, don't earn salaries.

Have you done any research on this at all?

byhookorbycrook

Gaelscoileanna are neither private or feepaying

frozenfrozen

I don't really see where this thread can go from here... fee paying schools are cheaper for the government, and they're not elite.... so there we have it

steddyeddy

Well in fairness people are throwing around this "cheaper for the government thing" but I would rather focus on what is right. Are children being treated equally regarding education?

frozenfrozen

steddyeddy wrote: »

Well in fairness people are throwing around this "cheaper for the government thing" but I would rather focus on what is right. Are children being treated equally regarding education?

What about grinds? What about children who's parents bought them nice books, and educational toys? What about those damned children who had a teacher as a parent? How is that fair???

Dyr

Not sure what the issue is, it's a well known fact that perpetuating inequality is worth every cent the govt spends on it.

steddyeddy

frozenfrozen wrote: »

What about grinds? What about children who's parents bought them nice books, and educational toys? What about those damned children who had a teacher as a parent? How is that fair???

You dont see a difference between six years of schooling and the above?