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Boxer from N Ireland on Irish Olympic team

MJ23

Why is there a boxer from the North on Irish Olympic team?

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bwatson

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

The olympic council of ireland is an all Ireland body.
/thread

This is obviously not the reason, if it was we simply wouldn't have the likes of Alan Campbell competing for Great Britain.

As enthusiastic as the OCI are about maintaining they represent the whole island, thats not really how it works in the Olympics. The games are a different kettle of fish to playing cricket or rugby on an all-Ireland basis for example, where international representation doesnt really exist in the same raw, defined way as it does in the Olympics.

People represent their nation, their state, their flag etc at the games and not a geological formation.

One thing that does strike me as bizarre though is that Paddy Barnes, the boxer from Belfast competing for Ireland, actually represented Northern Ireland in, of all events, the Commonwealth Games in 2010.

Jaysoose

bwatson wrote: »

This is obviously not the reason, if it was we simply wouldn't have the likes of Alan Campbell competing for Great Britain.

As enthusiastic as the OCI are about maintaining they represent the whole island, thats not really how it works in the Olympics. The games are a different kettle of fish to playing cricket or rugby on an all-Ireland basis for example, where international representation doesnt really exist in the same raw, defined way as it does in the Olympics.

People represent their nation, their state, their flag etc at the games and not a geological formation.

One thing that does strike me as bizarre though is that Paddy Barnes, the boxer from Belfast competing for Ireland, actually represented Northern Ireland in, of all events, the Commonwealth Games in 2010.

Whats bizarre about it? he is from northern ireland..its not an option in the olympics so rather than represent great britain and without the option to declare for the north he fights for ireland.

Its fairly straightforward.

Dyr

Sure Wayne MCCullough was one of the other lot and he represented Ireland, no harm done and good luck to him

LordSutch

Duffy the Vampire Slayer wrote: »

Athletes from the north have had the right to compete for either Britain or Ireland in the Olympics since 1952. A lot of northern people regard themselves as Irish and wouldn't want to compete for Britain and I'm glad they have the choice seeing as they wouldn't feel any pride in winning medals for the country that would historically be seen as their oppressor.

The flip side might be . . .

Athletes from Northern Ireland have had the right to compete for either Britain or Ireland in the Olympics since 1952. A lot of northern people regard themselves as British and wouldn't want to compete for Ireland, and I'm glad they have that choice seeing as they wouldn't feel any pride in winning medals for the country that would historically be seen as foreign to their British culture.

gurramok

Anyone wrote: »

How many Northern Irish athletes declared for GB in this Olympics? Only ones I know are the rowers, and the cyclist who was cut from the team(and wasnt very happy about it).

Tried googling it but cant find any answers.

Simples answers.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-19019557

Seanchai

alastair wrote: »

Or they didn't make Team GB.

You've quite the opinion of your own side. Given that your crowd can't even organise the Olympics properly and that "backward" countries like Estonia, Slovenia and Jamaica are winning far more medals per capita than Britain in the current Olympics, you really ought to keep in touch with Olympic reality more.

alastair

Seanchai wrote: »

You've quite the opinion of your own side. Given that your crowd can't even organise the Olympics properly and that "backward" countries like Estonia, Slovenia and Jamaica are winning far more medals per capita than Britain in the current Olympics, you really ought to keep in touch with Olympic reality more.

Eh. Dublin born and bred. Aside from that... Loving the bitterness!

And wouldn't that be your crowd?

ArmaniJeanss

Seanchai wrote: »

You've quite the opinion of your own side. Given that your crowd can't even organise the Olympics properly and that "backward" countries like Estonia, Slovenia and Jamaica are winning far more medals per capita than Britain in the current Olympics, you really ought to keep in touch with Olympic reality more.

'Medals Per Capita' is not a valid measurement of success when so many sports only allow one entrant per country.

e.g., If allowed enter contestants in line with their abilities then Britain would get silvers and bronzes galore in cycling/rowing to add to those lovely golds.

karma_

ArmaniJeanss wrote: »

'Medals Per Capita' is not a valid measurement of success when so many sports only allow one entrant per country.

e.g., If allowed enter contestants in line with their abilities then Britain would get silvers and bronzes galore in cycling/rowing to add to those lovely golds.

It's more to do with money. Countries invest heavily to win medals, it's no longer about sport. It's no surprise the more affluent nations win more medals, none at all. Britain invested heavily so they could be more competitive for their home Olympics, and only yesterday I was reading about how many of the British medal winners came from private schools, make no mistake privilege plays a huge part in the modern Olympics.

Kerrydude1981

Paddy Barnes has Commonwealth medals for the North but boxes for Ireland in the Olympics,I suppose the Olympic boxing team is a bit like the rugby we're all in it together.

LeinsterDub

bwatson wrote: »

This is obviously not the reason, if it was we simply wouldn't have the likes of Alan Campbell competing for Great Britain.

As enthusiastic as the OCI are about maintaining they represent the whole island, thats not really how it works in the Olympics. The games are a different kettle of fish to playing cricket or rugby on an all-Ireland basis for example, where international representation doesnt really exist in the same raw, defined way as it does in the Olympics.

People represent their nation, their state, their flag etc at the games and not a geological formation.

One thing that does strike me as bizarre though is that Paddy Barnes, the boxer from Belfast competing for Ireland, actually represented Northern Ireland in, of all events, the Commonwealth Games in 2010.

It's based on the sports governing bodies and the arraignments they have with other governing bodies in the same sport . So swimmers must swim for Swim Ireland , Boxers must box for Boxing Ireland, other sports they have a choice between GB and Ireland. I'm not aware of a case where they must represent GB

I am pie

Seanchai wrote: »

You've quite the opinion of your own side. Given that your crowd can't even organise the Olympics properly and that "backward" countries like Estonia, Slovenia and Jamaica are winning far more medals per capita than Britain in the current Olympics, you really ought to keep in touch with Olympic reality more.

Lemons Lemons, soooo many lemons. How does one cope?

wicklowbiker

bwatson wrote: »

This is obviously not the reason, if it was we simply wouldn't have the likes of Alan Campbell competing for Great Britain.

As enthusiastic as the OCI are about maintaining they represent the whole island, thats not really how it works in the Olympics. The games are a different kettle of fish to playing cricket or rugby on an all-Ireland basis for example, where international representation doesnt really exist in the same raw, defined way as it does in the Olympics.

People represent their nation, their state, their flag etc at the games and not a geological formation.

You'll notice that most of the those from the north east of the country who win anything while competing for GB and bits of Ulster (the NI statelet), are competing as part of teams, basically been carried along by England as they tag along at the back which would epitomize their relationship to with the British. But as you say, people represent their nation Ireland and so proudly march behind the tricolour

One thing that does strike me as bizarre though is that Paddy Barnes, the boxer from Belfast competing for Ireland, actually represented Northern Ireland in, of all events, the Commonwealth Games in 2010.

Under the IBA setup, boxers from the six counties can take part in the 3rd rate Olmypics called the Commonwealth Games. Barry McGuigan from Monaghan even competed in them in 1978, would you see this as once again a case of a foreigner interfering in the affairs of ' Ulster ' ?

Crooked Jack

what the...? How has this not been locked yet?

fryup

Bambi wrote: »

Sure Wayne MCCullough was one of the other lot and he represented Ireland, no harm done and good luck to him

thats a nice way of putting it:rolleyes:

DEFTLEFTHAND

Seanchai wrote: »

You've quite the opinion of your own side. Given that your crowd can't even organise the Olympics properly and that "backward" countries like Estonia, Slovenia and Jamaica are winning far more medals per capita than Britain in the current Olympics, you really ought to keep in touch with Olympic reality more.

Why do you think the countries you've named are backward?

2ndcoming

Interestingly it's actually more incorrect for Northern Irish athletes to compete for Great Britain, regardless of their religious or cultural background.

Northern Ireland is not in Great Britain, it's a part of the United Kingdom of Great Britain & Northern Ireland, so Team UK would be more accurate to describe that team.

At present Northern Ireland gets no credit for it's competitors who represent Team GB, and this has seen calls from politicians on both sides for it to be called Team UK or for NI to have a team of its own.

fryup

Seanchai wrote: »

You've quite the opinion of your own side. Given that your crowd can't even organise the Olympics properly and that "backward" countries like Estonia, Slovenia and Jamaica are winning far more medals per capita than Britain in the current Olympics, you really ought to keep in touch with Olympic reality more.

ha ha ha ha i love that per capita spin the brit bashers are using:rolleyes:

and this is the best run Olympics ever, even better than Bejing

jack presley

The full title of the team is Great Britain and Northern Ireland. It just gets shortened to Team GB for convenience

wicklowbiker

2ndcoming wrote: »

Interestingly it's actually more incorrect for Northern Irish athletes to compete for Great Britain, regardless of their religious or cultural background.

Northern Ireland is not in Great Britain, it's a part of the United Kingdom of Great Britain & Northern Ireland, so Team UK would be more accurate to describe that team.

At present Northern Ireland gets no credit for it's competitors who represent Team GB, and this has seen calls from politicians on both sides for it to be called Team UK or for NI to have a team of its own.

:rolleyes: And while we're at it, maybe Scottish nationalists should be accomadated like the unionists with their own team, and Welsh nationalists and the People's Republic of Cork and Dublin. In fact in Dublin's case, lets have a north side and south side team :rolleyes:

mike65

What pisse me off is that Norn Irons basically get two bites of the cherry - and not just in athletics but football and TV phone/text competitions!

xxyyxx

wicklowbiker wrote: »

:rolleyes: And while we're at it, maybe Scottish nationalists should be accomadated like the unionists with their own team, and Welsh nationalists and the People's Republic of Cork and Dublin. In fact in Dublin's case, lets have a north side and south side team :rolleyes:

You missed the point of that post completely.

LuckyLloyd

alastair wrote: »

Or they didn't make Team GB.

Conlon and Barnes would make team GB, make no mistake about it.

Anyone

jack presley wrote: »

The full title of the team is Great Britain and Northern Ireland. It just gets shortened to Team GB for convenience

Was more of a marketing thing really.

Guy:Incognito

2ndcoming wrote: »

Interestingly it's actually more incorrect for Northern Irish athletes to compete for Great Britain, regardless of their religious or cultural background.

Northern Ireland is not in Great Britain, it's a part of the United Kingdom of Great Britain & Northern Ireland, so Team UK would be more accurate to describe that team.

At present Northern Ireland gets no credit for it's competitors who represent Team GB, and this has seen calls from politicians on both sides for it to be called Team UK or for NI to have a team of its own.

Team GB is a branding. Thats all. Team UK wouldnt be correct either btw

wicklowbiker

xxyyxx wrote: »

You missed the point of that post completely.

I'm afraid it's you who have missed my point

Duffy the Vampire Slayer

LordSutch wrote: »

The flip side might be . . .

Athletes from Northern Ireland have had the right to compete for either Britain or Ireland in the Olympics since 1952. A lot of northern people regard themselves as British and wouldn't want to compete for Ireland, and I'm glad they have that choice seeing as they wouldn't feel any pride in winning medals for the country that would historically be seen as foreign to their British culture.

Of course. But that's not a big deal, because officially they are in the UK and there would be no question of them being allowed to compete for Britain. Northern nationalists on the other hand, have historically often been unable to compete for the country they feel a stronger attachment to.

wicklowbiker

Duffy the Vampire Slayer wrote: »

Of course. But that's not a big deal, because officially they are in the UK and there would be no question of them being allowed to compete for Britain. Northern nationalists on the other hand, have historically often been unable to compete for the country they feel a stronger attachment to.

Dunno about that. Apart from soccer, most sports - rugby, boxing and even bloody cricket compete on an all Ireland basis.

Larbre34

Ive not read all the thread but I know the jist of it

Im fed up of all this confusion in the nationality of sportsmen. There was BBC NI this morning claiming both the Irish Northern Irish and British Northern Irish medals. The Olympic Teams are all of Ireland under a tricolour and GB & NI under the union flag. No wonder the Aussie gob****e journo suggested we should just join Team GB. It has always been thus for Rory McIlroy, Eddie Irvine, Mary Peters, Wayne McCullough etc etc etc. The story itself of the history of internecine quarrels in Irish sporting bodies since 1922 makes a bewildering read

Its simple, the governments in all the British and Irish jurisdictions need to sit down and hammer out a policy and put it to a referendum in Northern Ireland - and in Scotland and Wales if they feel like it. The question should be -

"It is proposed to regularise the cluster f*ck that is sporting nationalities in Britain and Ireland. Do you wish your sportsmen and women to be -

a) Irish - representing Ireland in all things, all sports, under a tricolour

b)British - representing the United Kingdom in all things, all sports, under the Union flag

c) Northern Irish - representing NI in all things and all sports, withdrawal from each all Ireland and all British sporting body and standing alone as Northern Ireland in every international sport, be it rugby, soccer, athletics, golf or tiddlywinks, under the Red Hand

The choice is yours!"

I know this will never happen as it would cause a pure schism especially in the GAA and IRFU but someone needs to do something

2ndcoming

wicklowbiker wrote: »

I'm afraid it's you who have missed my point

You didn't really have a point, and if you did it was ignored due to your use of the roll-eyes emoticon. The calling card of the Daily Mail/Joe Duffy poster.

Cork is in Ireland, the Republic of. As is Dublin. Scotland is in Great Britain. As is Wales.

Northern Ireland is part of the United Kingdom, but not part of Great Britain. It is also, to anyone who knows anything about Irish history, a hugely contentious area for those reasons, so special arrangements are in place to accomodate dual-citizenship etc under the Good Friday Agreement. Cork does not have a Good Friday Agreement, for obvious reasons. Spot the difference? :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:;)