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Dress Codes

blue note

How do you feel about them? Personally, within reason I'm fond of them. I can't understand why though, whatever way I think about it I can't understand why a lad wearing a football jersey would bother me.

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newport2

I'd be the same.

I remember one of the stupidest things I ever experienced was at a golf club years ago. There with a society, really hot humid day. Anyway, we'd finished and were in the bar having some food and a drink. Air conditioning was broken, so hotter again in there with all the windows open. What was mad was the place was half full of older men wearing blazers, several of which looked like they were going to pass out with the heat any minute. The barman told us that the Captain was away on holidays, and any member to not wear a blazer in the bar during dinner hours had to get the Captain's permission. Nuts.

Alrite Chief

Funny how the recession has reduced the strictness of this in most clubs. Remember hearing about an argument over a pair of 'adidas golf' golf trousers which the pro in the shop seen them as tracksuit bottoms. Wouldn't let the lad out. You'd never get that now. A lot of club bars also removed the rule about no denimn.

ssbob

Dress codes are good for golf etiquette though, the majority of the time the guy who doesn't take care when dressing is not going to repair divots and not going to repair pitch marks, however in saying that some clubs are over the top.

I really can't understand for the life of me how anyone can play golf in jeans, I am seeing it more and more nowadays!

foxyboxer

From the Muirfied site.

Dress in the Smoking and Dining Rooms after 10.00am is smart, equivalent to a gentleman's lounge jacket and tie.

So essentially, I would be escorted from the premises for the crime of not wearing a tie? We're there to hit a small white ball around a field, not hob nob with a brandy and a bunch of pretentious gits with delusions of grandeur.

GreeBo

foxyboxer wrote: »

From the Muirfied site.

Dress in the Smoking and Dining Rooms after 10.00am is smart, equivalent to a gentleman's lounge jacket and tie.

So essentially, I would be escorted from the premises for the crime of not wearing a tie? We're there to hit a small white ball around a field, not hob nob with a brandy and a bunch of pretentious gits.

So why would you want to go in there so?

foxyboxer

GreeBo wrote: »

So why would you want to go in there so?

I wouldn't. But if you were in a situation where you were at the club (not playing golf) and happened to enter the dining room, were asked to leave, you queried as to why, and were informed you didn't have a tie. You'd have to see how ridiculous it is.

foxyboxer

ssbob wrote: »

Dress codes are good for golf etiquette though, the majority of the time the guy who doesn't take care when dressing is not going to repair divots and not going to repair pitch marks, however in saying that some clubs are over the top.

I really can't understand for the life of me why how anyone can play golf in jeans, I am seeing it more and more nowadays!

The theory goes in Bars that the dress code (shoes, no trainers) is in place as those with runners would be more likely to start a fight. Makes sense in a way. So perhaps that's the reasoning for the etiquette theory.

GreeBo

foxyboxer wrote: »

I wouldn't. But if you were in a situation where you were at the club (not playing golf) and happened to enter the dining room, were asked to leave, you queried as to why, and were informed you didn't have a tie. You'd have to see how ridiculous it is.

Tbh no I wouldnt.
Why would you be at the club, not playing golf, and not be aware of the dress codes?
I think you are just trying to poke fun at somewhere because they have rules that you dont agree with.
I had to wear a uniform in school that involved a tie. I'd be punished for not wearing that tie as that was the dress code. I dont see why you think its ridiculous at all. If you want to be there obey their rules, if not be somewhere else where the rules suit you.

foxyboxer

GreeBo wrote: »

Tbh no I wouldnt.
Why would you be at the club, not playing golf, and not be aware of the dress codes?
I think you are just trying to poke fun at somewhere because they have rules that you dont agree with.
I had to wear a uniform in school that involved a tie. I'd be punished for not wearing that tie as that was the dress code. I dont see why you think its ridiculous at all. If you want to be there obey their rules, if not be somewhere else where the rules suit you.

True, I guess it feeds into the snobby element of the game that I don't like.

8under

ssbob wrote: »

Dress codes are good for golf etiquette though, the majority of the time the guy who doesn't take care when dressing is not going to repair divots and not going to repair pitch marks, however in saying that some clubs are over the top.

I really can't understand for the life of me why how anyone can play golf in jeans, I am seeing it more and more nowadays!

I agree, maintaining some standards in dress code I believe helps with etiquette and rule observance on the course. I don't agree in the jacket & tie rule but I agree with smart casual in the club house and appropriate golf attire on the course.

I hate to see football jerseys and jeans on a golf course.
If someone wants to wear a football jersey join a football club. Most amateur leagues don't allow odd socks, shorts or jerseys to be worn in club games and football clubs can be penalised if that happens.

Why should golfers tolerate non golf wear such as football jerseys in their sport?

GreeBo

foxyboxer wrote: »

The theory goes in Bars that the dress code (shoes, no trainers) is in place as those with runners would be more likely to start a fight. Makes sense in a way. So perhaps that's the reasoning for the etiquette theory.

I dont think that makes any sense. Seems like a mass generalization to me.
A dresscode because they want everyone to dress at a certain standard to keep up the quality of the place makes a lot more sense to me (whether or not you agree with the standard of that dress code) than runners = fights.

foxyboxer

Common Sense should prevail not pedantry.

e.g.

Golfers must wear smart casual clothing. *with a guideline provided*
Soft Spikes.
No Golf Shoes in the Club House.
Smart Casual attire in the dining room.

Not

Navy ties with a red stripe in a Windsor knot and a dining jacket with three brass buttons must be worn when ordering in the dining room etc.

"Good Morning Sir, could you please leave without a fuss...right now?"
"It's the Half Windor isn't it"
"Precisely, sir"
"Almost!"

GreeBo

foxyboxer wrote: »

Common Sense should prevail not pedantry.

e.g.

Golfers must wear smart casual clothing. *with a guideline provided*
Soft Spikes.
No Golf Shoes in the Club House.
Smart Casual attire in the dining room.

Not

Navy ties with a red stripe in a Windsot knot and a dining jacket with three brass buttons must be worn when ordering in the dining room etc.

"Good Morning Sir, could you please leave without a fuss...right now?"
"It's the Half Winsdor isn't it"
"Precisely, sir"
"Almost!"

Like I said earlier

I think you are just trying to poke fun at somewhere because they have rules that you dont agree with.

:cool:

Following the rules that the majority of members of a club you are in is not being pedantic. Having rules that some people can ignore some of the time is a disaster as you will always get someone who pushes and pushes. Either have rules and obey them all or dont have them, having them but picking and choosing which ones are ok and which are pedantic is rather silly.

foxyboxer

Prohibiting someone from eating their lunch or dinner at a club because they are not wearing a tie (although they could be decked out in Saville Row's finest regardless) is pedantic and deserves to be made fun of. It's the sort of practice that reinforces the stereotype of Golf being a game for snobs. Which it isn't.

I agree with common sense rules as others have outlined already.

GreeBo

foxyboxer wrote: »

Prohibiting someone from eating their lunch or dinner at a club because they are not wearing a tie (although they could be decked out in Saville Row's finest regardless) is pedantic and deserves to be made fun of. It's the sort of practice that reinforces the stereotype of Golf being a game for snobs. Which it isn't.

I agree with common sense rules as others have outlined already.

Ok so is it just ties that are a problem?
How about runners?
How about sandals?
T Shirt?
Hot Pants?
Where do you draw the line?

Again, if the members of this club have decided that they want someone to wear a tie in the dining room then who the hell are you to have an issue with it?

/edit
and you actually make my point for me.
It doesnt need to be Saville Row, if it did then I would have a huge problem with it.
Anyone can get a tie for €1 and then eat their lunch in peace if they want to. If not go somewhere else.

link_2007

GreeBo wrote: »

Like I said earlier
:cool:

Following the rules that the majority of members of a club you are in is not being pedantic. Having rules that some people can ignore some of the time is a disaster as you will always get someone who pushes and pushes. Either have rules and obey them all or dont have them, having them but picking and choosing which ones are ok and which are pedantic is rather silly.

I have no problem adhering to rules Greebo but I think the point foxyboxer is making is that some places appear to have these rules just for the sake of having them.

I mean if my workplace tell me from now on I have to wear my suit jacket as a pair of makeshift trousers than am I being pedantic for not wanting to go along with it?

If I happen to disagree that I should need to wear a tie and suit jacket (I know this is the extreme) in order to have a cup of coffee after a round of golf, I dont think it's unreasonable to question why.

foxyboxer

GreeBo wrote: »

Ok so is it just ties that are a problem?

The ties are just a specific example from the Muirfield site.

foxyboxer

Imagine the following scenario.

The club has the following policy;
Men’s shirts must have collars and long or short sleeves, and must be tucked inside the trousers at all times. Football / rugby style polo shirts are not considered golf dress.

You are the club secretary and someone shows up like this.

Do you let them play or insist they change to a collared shirt or leave the course? Being pedantic, you would have to insist they change but common sense would invoke a little flexibility and allow them to play but remind them of the collared shirt code for future reference.

GreeBo

foxyboxer wrote: »

Imagine the following scenario.

The club has the following policy;
Men’s shirts must have collars and long or short sleeves, and must be tucked inside the trousers at all times. Football / rugby style polo shirts are not considered golf dress.

You are the club secretary and someone shows up like this.

Do you let them play or insist they change to a collared shirt or leave the course? Being pedantic, you would have to insist they change but common sense would invoke a little flexibility and allow them to play but remind them of the collared shirt code for future reference.

Being pedantic that does have a collar.

GreeBo

link_2007 wrote: »

I have no problem adhering to rules Greebo but I think the point foxyboxer is making is that some places appear to have these rules just for the sake of having them.

I mean if my workplace tell me from now on I have to wear my suit jacket as a pair of makeshift trousers than am I being pedantic for not wanting to go along with it?

If I happen to disagree that I should need to wear a tie and suit jacket (I know this is the extreme) in order to have a cup of coffee after a round of golf, I dont think it's unreasonable to question why.

I really doubt they have them just for the sake of it...
If the members want to change them then they would get changed, its the members who vote on these things anyway.

Also most of the time (in anywhere I have played) there are different rules for having a cup of tea in the bar versus eating in the dining room.

dak

Played Old Portmarnock years ago on a very hot June day with my Father in Law (RIP) . I was smartly dressed with chinos and a short sleeved shirt but was stopped going into the members bar at lunchtime until the Caddy master found me a tie and blazer to wear ... what a load of poppyc**k . I wasn't impressed especially on such a hot day !

FixdePitchmark

Was in Dun Laoghaire golf club. The members had all the gear on and a society was in and could wear what they like:D. It seems times are changing.

Some (non golfing) lads who I bring golfing , just find it all a bit daft. I have to say - I do too.

Some of them lads in the blazers are like lads with yellow jackets - it is an act of self importance. I'd say - let them eat cake.

JohnMcClane

I don't understand these dress rules in certain clubs and why they still exist. Club I am a member of has relaxed rules in recent years so jeans are now not only permitted in the clubhouse but also on the course!! If I pay €80 for a pair of jeans and some fella turns up in dunnes chinos he bought for £4 in 1988 and were once navy but are now a strange shade of reddy/brown/very light navy in places......who's to say looks the smarter??

GreeBo

Again the value of clothes is irrelevant. There is a dress code about what you can wear, not how much it had to cost. I think some of you are missing the point. In you're example rainbow man would be told he didn't meet the dress code in my club.

Almaviva

Of course, any club is free to decide how they are going to dress if they wish, and impose that on visitors if they wish.

But, I am totally against any dress code whatsoever, and would prefer to be a member of a club that did not have one.
It all stems from the old class system where your clothes signalled your position in the social structure. And has hung on in the, generally, conservative and upper social milieu of golf clubs (yes I know everyone plays golf these days, but, customs, particularly ones displaying elitism or superiority are slow to change) .
Those hanging on to the more 'relaxed' code of for example no football shirts, or no jeans, are only kidding themselves. The syndrome is the same as the blazer and tie stipulation for the dining room. Just with the line drawn in a different place.
Golf is a social and lesiure activity, and I find it odd that someone should feel he can object to having to see me on the course wearing a collarless tee shirt and cut-off jeans.

Having said all that, I only wear trousers made by my Saville Row tailor in Egyptian cotton sateen, my shirts are a polo style, in a silk/cotton blend of my own specification (all in Titian blue) and made in Paris (the only city in the world one can get polo shirts made with any distinction), and my shoes are hand made in Milan to lasts which they hold for me and update every two years to ensure a perfect fit. But thats just my own preference and I dont believe anyone should be able to object to me dressing as I choose.

Davidth88

I would not wear jeans on the course , I find them heavy and uncomfortable TBH

However , this is an interesting story

Back before the Open was played in Carnoustie in 99 ( I think it was about 1995 ) I was a member up in Arbroath ( about 10 miles north )

I played Carnoustie a couple of times , which by the way is a total beast , on both occasions I joined up with local lads . The local people could be members of the links for about 100 quid at the time ( you had to live in Carnoustie ).

On both occasions the local lads were wearing jeans , no-one cared .

On the other extreme , I have played a course south of London the name of which slips my mind. You were not allowed to wear shoes that had any white on them , and to go into the club house you had to have a blazer , not a suit , a blazer . And you MUST not have gold or silver buttons on said blazer , that was reserved for the captain !

I hate this nonsense of men having to wear knee socks with shorts , whereas women can what they like , its a load of bull.

the_syco

Dress codes, for the most part, are to keep the scumbags, travelers, and/or the general public out of the club house.

A course I used to play on didn't allow runners, jeans, football jerseys, etc, to be worn on the course. I had runners at the time, and when I asked if I could still play, I was told; "Sure. The rules are there so we can refuse people on what they wear" - pretty much so that they could tell people who turned up in their clapped out sh|tmobile wearing trakkies and smoking Johnnie Blue could be told to leave.

TheDoc

Personally have no time for that sort of snobbery. Thankfully my club isn't prehistoric and takes a modern more relaxed approach.
Proper golf wear is expected on the course whilst playing, however within the clubhouse casual wear is permitted.

Simply put most places would sweat for a little outsider business these days. We do decent food in our place, imagine refusing people because they are in jeans and t-shirts...

No, that's prehistoric private golf club nonsense.

Proper attire on the course, casual wear in the clubhouse. That's my feelings on it, and thankfully where I am that is what is allowed.

And in fairness the only golf clubs that would in force a tie during meals or upon entry to the clubhouse, or in some cases blazers, are the sort of pre historic dinosaur clubs that breed

Prejudice against Juvenile and female golfers
Empower the Golfing snobbery stereotype

Seen it first hand at a few clubs, and would totally turn me off every going again, and ensuring I don't recommend them to friends. The condascending in which I was addressed by member simply because I was under the age of 18, despite the clubs hosting very prestigious Juvenille events, was shocking.

I have a pretty strong opinion on it, because its such a turn off for some many people. Not wanting to get into the snobby crowd, the stereotype and all that bollox.

Granted I used to wear runners all the time anyway, and I was never pulled up on it, cause it was just a bit of common sense, then the club changed its dress code to allow casual wear in clubhouse. Progressive thinking, not holding onto the ancient traditions of the private gentleman's club.

Almaviva

TheDoc wrote: »

Personally have no time for that sort of snobbery.

Proper attire on the course, casual wear in the clubhouse.

But you are making the same mistake. : against snobbery, but stating that you want 'proper' attire on the course. Who decides what 'proper' is. You ? Or each individual ? Golf is not like football or skiing where identification of teams or practical protection from the elements is essential. There is no such need in golf. In the 19th century men played in jackets and ties, your game wouldnt be affected if you played in the nip either. So the only 'proper' attire is someone elses decision of how they want to see you.

If you have no time for snobbery, let people wear what they wish.

Jaysoose

Almaviva wrote: »

Of course, any club is free to decide how they are going to dress if they wish, and impose that on visitors if they wish.

But, I am totally against any dress code whatsoever, and would prefer to be a member of a club that did not have one.
It all stems from the old class system where your clothes signalled your position in the social structure. And has hung on in the, generally, conservative and upper social milieu of golf clubs (yes I know everyone plays golf these days, but, customs, particularly ones displaying elitism or superiority are slow to change) .
Those hanging on to the more 'relaxed' code of for example no football shirts, or no jeans, are only kidding themselves. The syndrome is the same as the blazer and tie stipulation for the dining room. Just with the line drawn in a different place.
Golf is a social and lesiure activity, and I find it odd that someone should feel he can object to having to see me on the course wearing a collarless tee shirt and cut-off jeans.

Having said all that, I only wear trousers made by my Saville Row tailor in Egyptian cotton sateen, my shirts are a polo style, in a silk/cotton blend of my own specification (all in Titian blue) and made in Paris (the only city in the world one can get polo shirts made with any distinction), and my shoes are hand made in Milan to lasts which they hold for me and update every two years to ensure a perfect fit. But thats just my own preference and I dont believe anyone should be able to object to me dressing as I choose.

This is just reverse snobbery in fairness, the majority of clubs have relaxed the rules around dress codes so some of the more extreme examples are figments of peoples imaginations and not a true reflection of what is the norm in most clubs.

Why would you refuse to join a club based on the fact that you refuse to not wear football tops and jeans..would the driving factors for joining not be the course itself, proximity to your house, value for money factor or just wanting to improve at the game.

Its kinda sad to hear people say they wouldnt join clubs based on something like this, everybody knows that the majority of clubs look for chino's and polo shirts on the course and in some cases a more relaxed approach in the club house its not like they are targetting individuals its a rule for everybody..

Why anybody would want to play in jean and a football top is beyond me anyway...get a hot day and those jeans would be stuck to after the turn.