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That just doesn't make sense!

Myrddin

Trek is riddled in things that just don't make sense. For instance, I was watching TNG "The Next Phase" last night & thought to myself, ok Geordi & Ro can pass through walls, bulkheads, & basically all matter. Why don't they fall through the floors?

What other examples of plot device failures have you noticed?

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Myrddin

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

why is it that the CO, XO, CE and 2nd and 3rd officers all work on the same shift always? Surely it's worth having at least one high ranking officer on one of the two other shifts?

But we've seen Data, Troi [lt.cmdr] & Crusher [cmdr] all man the night shift. It's probably a rotational thing

syklops

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

why does none of the shit ever go down on the night shift?

why is it that the CO, XO, CE and 2nd and 3rd officers all work on the same shift always? Surely it's worth having at least one high ranking officer on one of the two other shifts?

I'd also love to see the design thinking behind DS9, cos I always though that it's a crazily badly layed out place.

Its probably an 8 hour shift, and they are all staggered normally, and its only when the sh1t hits the fan that they all gather on the bridge. Its the same on my team. 3 sub teams on 3 different continents, coving the 24 hours, but if the sh1t hits the fan, people get woken up. Thankfully it doesn't happen that often.

How many times have we heard "Captain Picard to the bridge", Commander Data to the bridge etc.

IvySlayer

syklops wrote: »

Its probably an 8 hour shift, and they are all staggered normally, and its only when the sh1t hits the fan that they all gather on the bridge. Its the same on my team. 3 sub teams on 3 different continents, coving the 24 hours, but if the sh1t hits the fan, people get woken up. Thankfully it doesn't happen that often.

How many times have we heard "Captain Picard to the bridge", Commander Data to the bridge etc.

How does a combadge know when you finish/start a sentence though? I know they tap it once but they NEVER tap it again!

Also if Riker is going 'Captain Picard to the bridge' how the hell does the combage know who it's talking to before they say a name? The Captain part shouldn't be heared

filmbuffboy

IvySlayer wrote: »

How does a combadge know when you finish/start a sentence though? I know they tap it once but they NEVER tap it again!

Also if Riker is going 'Captain Picard to the bridge' how the hell does the combage know who it's talking to before they say a name? The Captain part shouldn't be heared

Well there is only one Captain on the ship, so the combadge would know who to direct it to. Also, there could be a timelag ofa second when sending communications so the computer knows where its going.

A Combadge could terminate communication once it hears a prolonged silence, or could have some sort of word recognition software that stops transmission upon certain words such as Understood Sir, Riker out. etc.

I think most of the things that don't seem to make sense in the ST universe can be explained logically.

Myrddin

filmbuffboy wrote: »

Also, there could be a timelag ofa second when sending communications so the computer knows where its going

Yeah that's true, there could be a lag while the computer determines who to open the channel to, & from there on out it's real time.

As to when it knows when to close the channel, not everyone says 'out', & there isn't always a prolonged silence to determine if the conversation is over. I'd suggest there could be some kind of intelligent analysis going on of the conversation, & based on whats said, the tone of it, & other factors, the computer 'knows' that the conversation is finished. The computer is very adept at taking verbal input for library enquiries etc, so I'd suggest it's able to analyze language & understand basic context etc.

downwithpeace

IvySlayer wrote: »

How does a combadge know when you finish/start a sentence though? I know they tap it once but they NEVER tap it again!

Also if Riker is going 'Captain Picard to the bridge' how the hell does the combage know who it's talking to before they say a name? The Captain part shouldn't be heared

I have a feeling I've seen Riker touch his badge once or twice after talking in TNG, on other occasions he slightly lifts his head as if talking to a room intercom and doesn't touch his combadge but they were "Captain Picard to the Bridge" as if ship wide announcement.

somuj

filmbuffboy wrote: »

Well there is only one Captain on the ship, so the combadge would know who to direct it to. Also, there could be a timelag ofa second when sending communications so the computer knows where its going.

A Combadge could terminate communication once it hears a prolonged silence, or could have some sort of word recognition software that stops transmission upon certain words such as Understood Sir, Riker out. etc.

I think most of the things that don't seem to make sense in the ST universe can be explained logically.

Com badges were explained in the Star trek magazine years ago. Cant recall the details but it all made sense. Its probably online somewhere.

c_man

So we've seen a few times in Voyager, where they were hard up for energy and would "recycle" previously replicated items in the replicator to get some energy... If it's that easy to get energy, why not constantly feed them asteroids etc.?

Myrddin

c_man wrote: »

So we've seen a few times in Voyager, where they were hard up for energy and would "recycle" previously replicated items in the replicator to get some energy... If it's that easy to get energy, why not constantly feed them asteroids etc.?

You have to expend energy mining the asteroid, refining it & processing it to be absorbed. There's probably a futile return on the amount you get back.

c_man

EnterNow wrote: »

You have to expend energy mining the asteroid, refining it & processing it to be absorbed. There's probably a futile return on the amount you get back.

Well no, just blast it to bits and keep shoving the debris into the replicator

We're never told that something has to be refined to be recycled.

Think outside of asteroids, basically anything and everything else. Feed the replicator and all Voyager's energy needs (which disappeared by season 4?) would have been met.

Myrddin

c_man wrote: »

Well no, just blast it to bits and keep shoving the debris into the replicator We're never told that something has to be refined to be recycled.

Think outside of asteroids, basically anything and everything else. Feed the replicator and all Voyager's energy needs (which disappeared by season 4?) would have been met.

Blast it to bits - Uses energy for phaser use. Use tractor beam energy to hold stop shattered asteroid fragments from flying away from the ship.
Shove debris into replicator - Use energy making pieces of asteroid small enough to be absorbed by replicator.
Lack of refining - I';m pretty sure there are things that arn't useful to absorb, things that interfere with the systems also like radioactive particles etc. You really would have to refine the raw material to make absorbing it anywhere near efficient.

Outside of asteroids - I'm pretty sure this is the main function of the buzzard collectors on the warp nacelles. They collect gaseous matter from nebulae & convert it into useable fuel, likely for impulse/fusion power generation.

I think it was Deuterium needed as a warp power reactant.

IvySlayer

Janeway was using all the nebulas for coffee.

Myrddin

Why is it that altering the past in First Contact, affects & changes the current timeline - and altering the past in the newest film, creates a new timeline & leaves the old one still existing?

downwithpeace

Sticking with that, if First Contact changed the future then why was Borg first contact when Q threw the Enterprise into their path and not when the scientists found the crashed sphere on that ice planet where Enterprise NX-01 came to the rescue.

Separation of Startrek and Enterprise would explain it given the episode number but still it would only connect the two given the film is Startrek.

Myrddin

downwithpeace wrote: »

Sticking with that, if First Contact changed the future then why was Borg first contact when Q threw the Enterprise into their path and not when the scientists found the crashed sphere on that ice planet where Enterprise NX-01 came to the rescue.

Separation of Startrek and Enterprise would explain it given the episode number but still it would only connect the two given the film is Startrek.

As far as I remember, the Borg craft in the ENT episode was destroyed in the end, & all they got off was a signal towards the Delta Quadrant. It's possible this signal never made it back to the collective...thus the collective were not aware of Earth until later on.

downwithpeace

EnterNow wrote: »

As far as I remember, the Borg craft in the ENT episode was destroyed in the end, & all they got off was a signal towards the Delta Quadrant. It's possible this signal never made it back to the collective...thus the collective were not aware of Earth until later on.

I think it was destroyed as well but the wreckage found was spread over a massive area but I don't think they said where, just an artic type area. The scientists did find three drones which reactivated, did their thing and later on hail Enterprise and call themselves The Borg, that would have been first contact.

Myrddin

downwithpeace wrote: »

I think it was destroyed as well but the wreckage found was spread over a massive area but I don't think they said where, just an artic type area. The scientists did find three drones which reactivated, did their thing and later on hail Enterprise and call themselves The Borg, that would have been first contact.

Ah you mean the Sphere? Yeah it was scattered over a wide area & prob mostly burned up on re-entry.

I remember listening closely during the episode, I'm not entirely sure they ever identified themselves as the Borg...I could be wrong now, if that can be double checked

downwithpeace

EnterNow wrote: »

Ah you mean the Sphere? Yeah it was scattered over a wide area & prob mostly burned up on re-entry.

I remember listening closely during the episode, I'm not entirely sure they ever identified themselves as the Borg...I could be wrong now, if that can be double checked

Just scanning through the episode and you might be right about the lack of identification, they only say you will be assimilated resistance is futile in the communication.

Myrddin

downwithpeace wrote: »

Just scanning through the episode and you might be right about the lack of identification, they only say you will be assimilated resistance is futile in the communication.

Yep I thought thats roughly all they said in the ep too, it seems the ENT writers did at least give some plausibility to pooing all over the established cannon

Cookie_Monster

EnterNow wrote: »

Why is it that altering the past in First Contact, affects & changes the current timeline - and altering the past in the newest film, creates a new timeline & leaves the old one still existing?

Because the newer film is a load of BS.

downwithpeace wrote: »

Sticking with that, if First Contact changed the future then why was Borg first contact when Q threw the Enterprise into their path and not when the scientists found the crashed sphere on that ice planet where Enterprise NX-01 came to the rescue.

because when the Q first contact happened the time line hadn't yet been changed

Also that ice planet was earth, and Star Fleet had it so highly classified that no knowledge of it had been released so know one else would have know about it when EntD met the borg...

downwithpeace

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

Also that ice planet was earth, and Star Fleet had it so highly classified that no knowledge of it had been released so know one else would have know about it when EntD met the borg...

Nah, EnterNow already solved this one, more in line with Star Trek then your Section 31 take.

Cookie_Monster

downwithpeace wrote: »

Nah, EnterNow already solved this one, more in line with Star Trek then your Section 31 take.

but were that the case, despite not knowing them as the borg, the cybernetic nature would be known as well as the general modus operandi, no?

Myrddin

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

but were that the case, despite not knowing them as the borg, the cybernetic nature would be known as well as the general modus operandi, no?

All that was established was that a small group of robots were found buried in ice, they were inadvertently revived & killed the science team. They managed to escape & were eventually destroyed...only getting off a signal before destruction.

The incident was likely classified by Starfleet & they wern't seen again for over two hundred years. It nowhere near warrants the 'first contact' tag for me, & adequately maintains the accepted cannon

downwithpeace

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

but were that the case, despite not knowing them as the borg, the cybernetic nature would be known as well as the general modus operandi, no?

There might have been some documents on the issue but I think EnterNow might be right on the situation being classified, if you think about it the episode was done very well not to allow for time screw ups.

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

IvySlayer wrote: »

How does a combadge know when you finish/start a sentence though? I know they tap it once but they NEVER tap it again!

Also if Riker is going 'Captain Picard to the bridge' how the hell does the combage know who it's talking to before they say a name? The Captain part shouldn't be heared

didnt voyager say once that the computer scans the brainwaves of all crew at regular intervals? I guess it has something to do with this... freaky communist starfleet invasion of privacy

Myrddin

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar wrote: »

didnt voyager say once that the computer scans the brainwaves of all crew at regular intervals?

Emm.....no?

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

Magical Security Cam: Happens so often and so early in the setting that it can be considered a technological standard. At this point, anything else would be a deviation from canon.

Taken to its logical extreme in Voyager, where the ship recorded all of the crew's brainwaves.

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Franchise/StarTrek?from=Main.StarTrek

all I can find is more references to SFdebris pointing that out
i think it was from the ep where that vulcan serial killer fella was going nuts and tuvok just off mentions something about it

ill look more later

Myrddin

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar wrote: »

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Franchise/StarTrek?from=Main.StarTrek

all I can find is more references to SFdebris pointing that out
i think it was from the ep where that vulcan serial killer fella was going nuts and tuvok just off mentions something about it

ill look more later

Never heard of that, it seems to be a description of how cctv footage is viewed 'in episode'.

In any situation where someone watches a recording of an event that the audience has already seen happening, the recording will — by the purest coincidence — happen to use exactly the same footage that the audience has already witnessed. That is to say, it will include all the same dramatic camera angles, pans and zooms as the original scene, despite that there's no way an in-universe device (especially a stationary device, like a fixed security camera) could have captured and produced such, well, cinematic footage.

Sometimes this is Hand Waved by overlaying visual effects on the recording — conversion to black-and-white, simulated scanning lines, a date/time stamp or watermark, meaningless computerese, and so on; this still doesn't change the fact that the director is simply recycling footage from the previous scene, rather than attempting to recreate the scene as it would actually appear to the in-universe device (which, as Real Life can attest, often turns out dull, grainy, over- or under-exposed, off-center, and etc.)

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/MagicalSecurityCam

I don't recall this ever being mentioned in any cannon. I know the ep your talking about, same actor that played Luther Boggs in X-Files [a damn good actor too!]...I'll have to rewatch it to be sure

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

no, its not the security cam
there was definitely some mention of it, i just had a look at the review I thought pointed out the moment but it wasn't in it.. so not that episode "Meld"

all I can find is other people referencing the fact that voyagers computer scans the crews brain waves at regular intervels, but I can't find any actual reference to what episode it's pointed out in and i'm sure as hell not watching voyager again to find out

i'm quite sure I saw it pointed out somewhere though, with a good reference to the episode in question as I remember "wtf"'ing about it at the time

--edit

actually leave it with me, my exams are over this day next week and ill have nothing to do over the summer except trawl the internet for a 5 second reference to a one second reference in a godawful tv show i'd hoped never to watch again.

Myrddin

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar wrote: »

actually leave it with me, my exams are over this day next week and ill have nothing to do over the summer except trawl the internet for a 5 second reference to a one second reference in a godawful tv show i'd hoped never to watch again.

Enjoy