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Rotavator or power harrow

joe17

hi everyone
im thinking of ether getting a power harrow or rotavator in a few months and just wondering which is better. i have a mf 165 so will the power harrow work on my tractor.what are the advantages and disadvantages of these machines and what price would i get one of these in good condition at.what should i look out for when i buy one.
thanks in advance

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joe17

where it says rotater i meant to spell rotavator sorry about that !!!

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jimmy G M

Power harrow much better option as it can level as well as till. Also less likely to seal the ground where the blades come into contact with the ground. You can also carry on the lift and just scratch the ground a little for a handy re-seed of rough ground etc.

However, power harrows don't tend to come any narrower than 3m wide and are usually much heavier than rotavator. I doubt if MF 165 would lift it and if it did you would have no control in fresh ploughing. Also you would need aprox 80hp to driver a 3m harrow.

You'd prob buy a decent power harrow circa 2-2.5k ? Check out D.D. there's usually a few up there. We have a lely 3m one here sound machine, cost 2.5 k , aprox 5 yrs ago. Till / reseed 15 acres p.a.

Rotavater good to till though - buy one with a crumbler on the back otherwise they leave the ground too soft. Price €1 - 1.5k?

joe17

ill be using it just after ploughing because the land has not been ploughed in 30 to 40 years and there has been no manure or fertilizer spread on it either so the land is due some new grass should i go with the rotavator seen as i dont have the power for the power harrow.there are too sizes i was looking at the bigger type one should that one do???will i have to use a land leveler after the rotavator

lab man

spiked rotovator might best option

joe17

lab man wrote: »

spiked rotovator might best option

how much are they going for at the moment and can you get them in the big size and can you get the crumbler on the back and are they better than the other normal rotavator thanks

Man of Aran

Seem to recall that the 165 had enough grunt for a 4ft Krone rotavator (somewhere between 48in -52" anyhow) preparing beet / spuds seedbed after ploughing stubble or leyland way back when.
Dont know that it could do a 60" but you could control that somewhat by depth of tilth.

BeeDI

HOWARD rotovator, requires 7hp per foot plus 10hp on top. That allows for working full depth in heavy soul. AI depending on conditions, you could be fine with less.

joe17

thanks for all the help

joe17

Man of Aran wrote: »

Seem to recall that the 165 had enough grunt for a 4ft Krone rotavator (somewhere between 48in -52" anyhow) preparing beet / spuds seedbed after ploughing stubble or leyland way back when.
Dont know that it could do a 60" but you could control that somewhat by depth of tilth.

i suppose i'd never get away with a 80'' howard rotavator or is that pushing it

moy83

We have a 6ft (roughly around that ill measure it properly tomorrow ) Howard rotaspike with a crumbler .
A neighbour borrows it once or twice a year and it goes on his 165 not a bother .

GERMAN ROCKS

a power harrow is probably out the question as any of the ones i have seen are all 3meters+. also they are all on the 1000 pto afaik and your 165 would only have the 540

joe17

moy83 wrote: »

We have a 6ft (roughly around that ill measure it properly tomorrow ) Howard rotaspike with a crumbler .
A neighbour borrows it once or twice a year and it goes on his 165 not a bother .

GERMAN ROCKS wrote: »

a power harrow is probably out the question as any of the ones i have seen are all 3meters+. also they are all on the 1000 pto afaik and your 165 would only have the 540

thanks for the replys so could you tell me the difference between a howard rotaspike and the normal howard rotavator

nilhg

I'm not sure if a rotavator or rotaspike will really be much use to the OP for reseeding, they leave the ground very fluffy and loose, it'll take ages to get a nice firm sod again.

joe17

nilhg wrote: »

I'm not sure if a rotavator or rotaspike will really be much use to the OP for reseeding, they leave the ground very fluffy and loose, it'll take ages to get a nice firm sod again.

so what would you use after ploughing to get the ground good besides a power harrow dont have enough hp for it

thanks

nilhg

joe17 wrote: »

so what would you use after ploughing to get the ground good besides a power harrow dont have enough hp for it thanks

We have a furrow press similar to this (older model)

and we'd give the ploughed ground a run or two of that before we put a harrow near it.

You could do a similar job with a roller either a flat one or a ring roller, a lot of lads around here would pull a heavy girder sideways behind the roller to drag a little clay to level the furrows, then a few runs with something like a triple K and sow the seeds with a spinner or grass seed barrow.

There is a fella around here who sows for hire with a harrow like this,

it has a grass seed applicator on top, most of the lads who have used him swear by it.

joe17

how much are the older furrow press ones cost and do they do the same job as the new ones and will the old harrows do after

thanks

nilhg

joe17 wrote: »

how much are the older furrow press ones cost and do they do the same job as the new ones and will the old harrows do after thanks

Even the old ones will be expensive if the rings are decent and there is no way that a 165 would handle one anyway, really for reseeding with that tractor you are looking at using a combination of something like a triple K and a roller, plenty of patience and a few days of good weather.

Man of Aran

Why not a good old fashioned disc harrow, trailed.

If reseeding old pasture and already ploughed it up anyhow, why not get a grain crop and undersow with perennial ryegrass and clover. That's how it was done in old days.
Time wise , you would'nt be too far behind the direct reseed and you get a cash crop.

Couple of pints/acre of Gramoxone earlier and the Bettinson 3D drill was another old way.

Milton09

We used an 8ft. Krone Rototiller, see pic. (which is for sale by the way , PM me if you want more info) for years behind a 165, its like a rotospike but has blades instead of spikes so its very easy to drive and performs better in damp conditions. Found it worked very well on ploughed lay ground. Only reason we changed was we got a bigger tractor that was wider than the rototiller.

joe17

nilhg wrote: »

Even the old ones will be expensive if the rings are decent and there is no way that a 165 would handle one anyway, really for reseeding with that tractor you are looking at using a combination of something like a triple K and a roller, plenty of patience and a few days of good weather.

we have an old triple K and used it last year and its a load of s**t keeps getting clogged up had to hire a fellow with a power harrow

joe17

Man of Aran wrote: »

Why not a good old fashioned disc harrow, trailed.

If reseeding old pasture and already ploughed it up anyhow, why not get a grain crop and undersow with perennial ryegrass and clover. That's how it was done in old days.
Time wise , you would'nt be too far behind the direct reseed and you get a cash crop.

Couple of pints/acre of Gramoxone earlier and the Bettinson 3D drill was another old way.

how much are they going for these days second hand disc harrow, trailed. the land we have is very hard ground

jimmy G M

joe17 wrote: »

we have an old triple K and used it last year and its a load of s**t keeps getting clogged up had to hire a fellow with a power harrow

Have you much re-seedin to do? Will you be doing this on an ongoing basis? You might be as well off getting yer man in again to do the job. Save you chasing all around the place lookin for harrows/ disks/rotavators etc

joe17

jimmy G M wrote: »

Have you much re-seedin to do? Will you be doing this on an ongoing basis? You might be as well off getting yer man in again to do the job. Save you chasing all around the place lookin for harrows/ disks/rotavators etc

about 4 acres and will be doing a lot of fields over the years trying to do all the work our self's trying to keep the cost down and the machinery will be used for long term its all way handy to have it

yellow50HX

There are basically two types of rotovators spike and blade. We have used both, had a 70 inch blade for years used it for tilling for spuds, beet and for reseeding. It was a 5000 and 7000 for ages. You could only go one direction and it was pulled over to the right as the tractor would be wider. Gave a nice finish but was a curse with changing blades on Stoney ground. Bought a 100 inch spike with a crumbler from a retiring neighbor about 10 years ago it's probably about 30 years old now great job. Pull it behind a 7610 it's a bit heavy so need the loader for ballast. Use it for the beet, and some veg and spuds as well as resseding.

No need for a land leveler after a rotovator but they can be good before if the ploughing is uneven or if there is a a lot of wheel tracks. If the ploughing is even then you only need a rotovator. We reseeded a few fields with it last year with out ploughing. Gave two runs in oppisite directions then a run of the chain harrow, put out the seed with a wagtail and then another run of the chain harrow to cover and rolled it.

If you want to use one for a few years then get a spike with a crumbler about 70-80 inch for the MF. What HP is it? You ll find that depending on the depth you can match your speed to get a good finish for lots of tilling types. Don't be afraid to give it a second run at a faster speed if need be.

joe17

yellow50HX wrote: »

There are basically two types of rotovators spike and blade. We have used both, had a 70 inch blade for years used it for tilling for spuds, beet and for reseeding. It was a 5000 and 7000 for ages. You could only go one direction and it was pulled over to the right as the tractor would be wider. Gave a nice finish but was a curse with changing blades on Stoney ground. Bought a 100 inch spike with a crumbler from a retiring neighbor about 10 years ago it's probably about 30 years old now great job. Pull it behind a 7610 it's a bit heavy so need the loader for ballast. Use it for the beet, and some veg and spuds as well as resseding.

No need for a land leveler after a rotovator but they can be good before if the ploughing is uneven or if there is a a lot of wheel tracks. If the ploughing is even then you only need a rotovator. We reseeded a few fields with it last year with out ploughing. Gave two runs in oppisite directions then a run of the chain harrow, put out the seed with a wagtail and then another run of the chain harrow to cover and rolled it.

If you want to use one for a few years then get a spike with a crumbler about 70-80 inch for the MF. What HP is it? You ll find that depending on the depth you can match your speed to get a good finish for lots of tilling types. Don't be afraid to give it a second run at a faster speed if need be.

it says in the specs its around 58.3 hp so do you think the 80'' spike with crumbler will work some people say it will and does anyone know anyone in kerry area thats selling one thanks

yellow50HX

60hp will just about drive it, but you'll be a low gears. if your only doing doing tilling for seeding you'll be fine the deeper you go the more power needed. depending on the weight you may need ballast on the front.

joe17

yellow50HX wrote: »

60hp will just about drive it, but you'll be a low gears. if your only doing doing tilling for seeding you'll be fine the deeper you go the more power needed. depending on the weight you may need ballast on the front.

thanks i think ill go with the spike rotavator with crumbler just have to find one in my area

9935452

joe17 wrote: »

thanks i think ill go with the spike rotavator with crumbler just have to find one in my area

The father is a fan of the old howards.
But the only model he will touch is the selactatilth s. Selactatilth is writtrn on the back of the gearbox.
Alexander mills normally has a few and will deliver for about 100quid more.
Make sure you have all the gears when you take the back cover off, there should be a spare set on the cover which u can change to run it at a different speed. Check the main bearings for play, they are expensive to replace. the other thing which goes/wears/cracks is the chain housing which are hard to find

joe17

where is Alexander mills and do you know what prices they are looking for around
thanks

9935452

joe17 wrote: »

where is Alexander mills and do you know what prices they are looking for around
thanks

Alexander mills is in Dungannon in the north.
The website is http://www.alexander-mills.co.uk/pmenu.htm.
Go to the section for cultivation equipment. There is about 10 howard rotavators and rotospikes on it . They are starting around 1100 sterling.

The father bought one over the phone off of him and paid with a bank draft on delivery. He could see from the pictures it was in reasonable nick.

Ken Boohan in croom normally has a few howard rotavators in stock. He brings in machinery from england and would bring in specific things for people.
His web site is http://www.kboohanfarmmachinery.com/farm-machinery.html