lestat21 wrote: » I know there are many problems in the education system, as I'm a secondary school teacher myself and my mother used to be an SNA, but this is not how you discuss it... You're very negative, aggressive and condescending in your tone. I will not be following this thread any further. Although if micropig ever discloses his/her current position in the education system, I'd appreciate it if someone on here could pm me? The suspense is killing me!!!
micropig wrote: » This indicates to me teachers don't have any solutions to their own problems?
#15 wrote: » Have you considered the possibility that you have misdiagnosed the problems?
micropig wrote: » In my opinion the ratio of the education budget spent on teachers salaries should be reduced and the amount spent on facilities increased. Same amount of money in the pot, just spent differently (I'm only sorry that during the Celtic tiger that schools & equipment were not invested in. We had enough money in the country at the time to provide state of the art facilities for the children but invested most of the education budget in teachers salaries.)
micropig wrote: » What is your opinion of: A teacher who gives a student a worksheet they can not read? Teachers who do not find out if any of their class need extra support? A teacher who plans classes were the students are in their seats for 40 minutes, knowing full well that students won't sit there for 40 mins? Teachers who fail students because they give feedback that the class is boring?
#15 wrote: » During the Celtic Tiger, Irish education was underfunded compared to other countries. Why not just wish that we funded education to the same levels as the OECD average? No need for messing around with ratios then. Also, 70% to 80% of expenditure going towards salaries is normal for nearly all OECD countries. Furthermore, that figure includes all staff in the DES, not just teachers, so it is not accurate to claim that teaching staff account for all of the salary expenditure. This may not be your fault, as our media is pretty poor at paying attention to detail. As are a few ideologues and agenda posters on boards. As well as that, the DES estimate figures for 2011 have pay and pensions taking up 66% of the education budget.
micropig wrote: » What are the problems then? What is your opinion of: A teacher who gives a student a worksheet they can not read? Teachers who do not find out if any of their class need extra support? A teacher who plans classes were the students are in their seats for 40 minutes, knowing full well that students won't sit there for 40 mins? Teachers who fail students because they give feedback that the class is boring?
Feeona wrote: » Seavill answered your first question, yet now you want other teachers to give an opinion on his/her teaching skills. Divisive much? Have you examples of teachers who haven't found out if someone in their class needs extra support? As for your third question, have you ever had to give a talk to a group of people who were up walking around the room? It would be great if you would answer these questions in a non confrontational manner. Shucks, it'd be great if you answered them at all!
#15 wrote: » I would say that is mostly poor practice, at the instruction and planning levels. Isn't that obvious? There are other problems though. I'll address the first and third points you raised: - Why can the student not read adequately? What system allows someone to slip through the cracks for so long? Why was that student not given intensive tuition at an early stage to help him/her catch up? - What causes teachers to plan a 40 min lesson where everyone must remain seated? Lack of confidence? Poor classroom management skills? An exam system that incentivises and rewards this style of instruction? Unruly students, who cannot behave when given the freedom to complete project-based work?
micropig wrote: » Well I have been told my opinion of it is wrong, so yes I think it is necessary to ask others what their opinion of it is examples of teachers who haven't found out if someone in their class needs extra support-Read the thread Why are you talking to them when they are up walking around the room, surely you know they are not listening to you? I never suggested that teachers talk to them while they are walking around the room. In fact I think I suggested that teachers should talk less and give the students the opportunity to learn more through independent learning and research
micropig wrote: » Well in 2009 we had a record education budget and didn't manage to spend it all by December of that year -even though it was evident that many schools need upgrading.
Where are our student attainment levels in relation to other OCED countries? Please provide links
Feeona wrote: » Well in this thread many posters have mentioned you being confrontational. That might have something to do with the fact that people aren't weighing in with your opinion. I found the example you mentioned, but the teacher explained the dynamics of the situation, a situation beyond his/her control. So do you have any examples of teachers who haven't realised that a child needed support in his/her class? I asked you the question 'Have you ever given a talk to people when they're walking around the room?' and you still haven't answered it. All you've done is ask an inflammatory question about my teaching style. So could you answer my question please?
#15 wrote: » What is your point here? That the money isn't needed? Do you know why the money wasn't spent? (I do, so think carefully before you answer) Reading - average Maths - below average Science - above average That's accordiing to the OECD PISA 2009 results, which is an assessment of a sample of 15 year olds. You can look for the link yourself, I own a copy of the report and I'm not going to scan it in for you.:)
micropig wrote: » Why do you see this as an exceptional circumstance? Surely every child who needs additional education support has an IEP (Individual education plan). If this has not been provided formally, surely the previous teacher of the class had it flagged that a child has reached this level and can't read? So no matter what teacher happens to be taking this class can reference this information? No I have never talked while they are walking around the room. I direct the students what to do, where to find the information, what type of information they should be looking for, teach them how to check its valid & reliable information, give them the resources and let them get on with it. I then have time to circulate there classroom and monitor that each student is on task, tackling any disruptive behaviour and helping students who are stuck
Feeona wrote: » I will ask the question for the third time : Have you any examples of teachers who weren't aware of special needs within their class? Thank you for the answer to the other question. Sounds like a normal lesson to me.
seavill wrote: » If he cannot read the question in the first place how is this possible?
micropig wrote: » Ok you couldn't pick it up by reading the thread so here it is. My question: why is the teacher giving the student a worksheet with questions on it the student is unable to read? Why isn't the teacher aware the student has low reading levels and plan accordingly?
Feeona wrote: » The teacher in question explained the dynamics of the situation, and I referred to this in my other posts (you obviously didn't pick it up by just reading my posts). Fourth time : Have you any examples of teachers (not in situations beyond their control, just to make it very clear) not being aware of children in their class with special needs?
micropig wrote: » How is the situation beyond the teachers control? Again surely, extra needs are identified on the pupils file and if a teacher is taking the class, it is up to the teacher to find this out?
Feeona wrote: » So you don't have any examples of teachers being unaware of special needs children in his/her class? Please answer the question yes or no.
micropig wrote: » *sigh, yes the teacher in this thread was not aware a pupil in their class had a particularly low level of reading
Feeona wrote: » So you don't have any examples of teachers (not in situations beyond their control) being unaware of children with special needs in the classroom?
micropig wrote: » Again, why is the situation beyond the teachers control? Why is this information not available to the teacher. Teachers get sick all the time and other teachers have to take the class - surely this information is available to them? What if the teacher died tomorrow- would nobody know which students had high/low levels?
byhookorbycrook wrote: » IEPs are not legally required as EPSEN has never been enacted. I am getting out of this thread now, as Micro-Pig doesn't seem to have a clue of the day to day running of schools and seems to my mind to be trolling.
Feeona wrote: » Still no examples I see. A pity because it would be a good debate if you did have valid examples.
micropig wrote: » Money is needed. Money was provided, money was not spent, children are still in substandard facilities??? No grumble from the union LINKS ?? Do teachers not have to provide links to back up their point. I have links with suggest another opinion. Edit: Is it good enough that our 15year olds are average and below average in Maths & Reading?
micropig wrote: » Perfect example provided & I see you don't answer the other questions I posed to you
#15 wrote: » Firstly, the link is OECD.ORG, download the report yourself. Don't rely on someone else's interpretation or opinion, particularly the average journalist. Never mind crying about someone not directly linking it. Secondly, I'm not a teacher. Thirdly, the DES is in charge of expenditure. Your gripe is with them, not teacher unions. Btw, unions have been banging on about facilities and resources for years. The unspent money was designated for building projects that ended up costing less than the estimates (thanks to the recession). The taxpayer saved money on construction work and you're still complaining? Come off it mate. You want those savings reinvested in education? Join the queue, everyone does. Wrt PISA, why are you asking such basic questions? Who in their right mind would tell you that it's fine to be below average? It's not ok. The argument is over what to do about it. We won't be able to address that as long as people keep making side issues the focus of debate (e.g. underspend on construction projects). All that is still based on the layman's assumption that PISA is the be all and end all of educational assessment.
Feeona wrote: » It's not a perfect example because of circumstances outside the teacher's control. I'm still waiting by the way. Seeing as it took seven or eight attempts for you to answer my questions, sure I might leave it another while to answer yours.
