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When will Ireland have its freedom from the Catholic Church?

dilbert2

Obviously, I'm not referring to people practicing their religion here, or wanting to remain Catholic. No, I'm referring to the continuing grip that the Catholic Church holds on our countrys governments and institutions, particulary in some areas of policy, little more than string puppets for Rome and its backward ideology. When is this country going to be a Republic along the lines of other Republics which took their influence from Enlightenment ideology and philosophies, which were more often quiet adamant in ridding Europe and the West of the tyranny of Catholic authoritarian rule.

Ironically, despite claiming ourselves to be a Republic, much of our government and people have been controlled by this institution since the inception of the state. When are Irish people and the Irish government actually going to release themselves from the grip of Roman Catholic mind control and teachings, and become a republic like say France, whose government and society is based on pluralistic and enlightenment notions of citizenship and personal freedoms, as opposed to much of Ireland were the Church has pretty much ruled the country from behind the scenes like a fiefdom.

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Doc Ruby

Killer Pigeon wrote: »

The Queen and the Pope ... burn them all!!

What was it yerman said... people will only be free when the last queen has been strangled by the entrails of the last priest...

parrai

dilbert2 wrote: »

I believe that an atheist, or simply a non-religionist of any shade should not be forced to take an oath to a god they do not believe in just becuase they want to run for office. Why should they? As an atheist, I take great offence at such a concept.

Cause they want the money!! it's all about the money.

yutta

dilbert2 wrote: »

I believe that an atheist, or simply a non-religionist of any shade should not be forced to take an oath to a god they do not believe in just becuase they want to run for office. Why should they?

Like I said in my post, the purpose of the public oath is to keep people in line. The public can hold the office-holder to their oath. To simply do away with oaths is to put a crack in the dam of corruption. Better to err on the side of caution.

KeithAFC

dilbert2 wrote: »

I believe that an atheist, or simply a non-religionist of any shade should not be forced to take an oath to a god they do not believe in just becuase they want to run for office. Why should they? As an atheist, I take great offence at such a concept.

Turn the Bible and find Jesus then. Not difficult.

Mike 1972

KeithAFC wrote: »

Reject Rome and that is it.

How are you with Milan ?

I Heart Internet

dilbert2 wrote: »

I believe that an atheist, or simply a non-religionist of any shade should not be forced to take an oath to a god they do not believe in just becuase they want to run for office. Why should they? As an atheist, I take great offence at such a concept.

I see your point. I'd encourage you to lobby your TD, write to newspapers, etc to have the constitution changed to better reflect your point of view. But don't blame the RCC because our constitution doesn't quickly change to reflect your particular, niche, point of view.

petroltimer2

women mostly want to get married in a church and have babies baptised. Until they come to their senses the church will still have power.

Killer Pigeon

Doc Ruby wrote: »

What was it yerman said... people will only be free when the last queen has been strangled by the entrails of the last priest...

Yes. Yerman, the Philosopher, of the Yerman tribe.

ColeTrain

I Heart Internet wrote: »

And yet, last time I checked, it was government controlled licensing laws. Strange that.

Which bishop, priest, nun, monk, or RCC organisations is preventing government from changing this piece of legislation?

No Catholic Church = Pubs open on that day.

Doc Ruby

Killer Pigeon wrote: »

Yes. Yerman, the Philosopher, of the Yerman tribe.

The very fellow...

yutta

ColeTrain wrote: »

No Catholic Church = Pubs open on that day.

Heaven forbid you had to take a day off drinking. I assume you don't have a problem with not drinking the odd Friday?

Anyway, you can always go down to the off-licence and stock up on a Thursday and have a "Good Friday Facebook Party" and invite all your heathen mates over...

I Heart Internet

ColeTrain wrote: »

No Catholic Church = Pubs open on that day.

No Catholic Church = No Catholic Church

No Catholic Church /= Pubs open on that day

Legislators change law = Pubs open on that day

Equals sign /= automatically making your comment more sensible

old hippy

As long as they are indulged, revered and allowed to continue with their nefarious ways, Ireland will never be rid of this pestilence.

Galwayguy35

petroltimer2 wrote: »

women mostly want to get married in a church and have babies baptised. Until they come to their senses the church will still have power.

And they are perfectly entitled to do so if the wish. Get over it.

old hippy

petroltimer2 wrote: »

women mostly want to get married in a church and have babies baptised. Until they come to their senses the church will still have power.

In which circles? In what context?

Less than half my female friends want that. Yeah, some want & do get married (registry or otherwise) and some have babies but not "most", IMHO

OldGoat

yutta wrote: »

Taking a figurative oath to a higher power isn't the end of the world for non-believers (they are, after all, non-believers). There's both a historical precedence and constitutional continuity to be mindful of. Endless tinkering with the constitution based on the popular opinion of the day will ultimately render the broad thrust of the constitution to the grave.

Anyway, having to swear an oath before God is pretty serious business for believers and it's better to keep it in the constitution even if only 50% of the population identify with God. Public oaths before God are another layer of protection against evil acts. Should we remove these oaths, we'll be opening the flood-gates.

Snakeblood wrote: »

How do you know that it's not a big deal to nonbelievers?

Plus 1
You are advocating that the President of the country should start off his role of office with a hypocritical lie to the people of the nation? Just because we profess no religeon dosen't mean that we have no sense of integraty and as such lying under oath is a bit much to ask of anyone.

yutta wrote: »

Like I said in my post, the purpose of the public oath is to keep people in line. The public can hold the office-holder to their oath. To simply do away with oaths is to put a crack in the dam of corruption. Better to err on the side of caution.

I didn't see anyone ask to do away with the oath but I for one would be happy to see a non-secular oath in it's place.

I Heart Internet wrote: »

I see your point. I'd encourage you to lobby your TD, write to newspapers, etc to have the constitution changed to better reflect your point of view. But don't blame the RCC because our constitution doesn't quickly change to reflect your particular, niche, point of view.

Or perhaps have a discussion on it in a public forum?

Niche? Really?

mcmoustache

Killer Pigeon wrote: »

In before philologos (a.k.a., Jakkass)

He's no Catholic.

Piriz

texidub wrote: »

Some commentators believe it will happen around tea time. I'm more inclined to think it will be after the cows have been milked in the morning. Either way Ireland will definitely be free from the yoke of oppression before lunch and --depending on which part of the country you are in-- after the postman comes.

I hope this helps.

nice effort but didn't work unfortunately (for you)

Ellis Dee

Ireland will have its freedom from the Catholic Church (and from many other forms of ignorance) when enough people have copped on to the absurdity of all that sky fairy bumpf and the reality that the church is more concerned about its wealth and power than in tackling things like its big kiddy-fiddling problem. In the meantime - happy that I was able to have my kids raised as atheists abroad and not subjected to the pressure they would have been under in Ireland - I essentially just ignore it and hope I live to see the day we write a new constitution and remove all references to that imaginary entity god from it.:D:D

Ellis Dee

mcmoustache wrote: »

He's no Catholic.

Surf, Daz, Persil --- :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes: Different packs, same contents.:)

I Heart Internet

OldGoat wrote: »

Or perhaps have a discussion on it in a public forum?

Yeah, by all means, that as well. Democracy is open to all but, like I said, don't blame the RCC (or anyone else) if people don't agree with you and organise a referendum for you.

OldGoat wrote: »

Niche? Really?

Yeah - we're all in a niche of one.

ColeTrain

yutta wrote: »

Heaven forbid you had to take a day off drinking. I assume you don't have a problem with not drinking the odd Friday?

Anyway, you can always go down to the off-licence and stock up on a Thursday and have a "Good Friday Facebook Party" and invite all your heathen mates over...

I can't say it annoys me that much but it would be better for everyone to decide for themselves. At least they don't shut down the butchers.

I Heart Internet wrote: »

No Catholic Church = No Catholic Church

No Catholic Church /= Pubs open on that day

Legislators change law = Pubs open on that day

Equals sign /= automatically making your comment more sensible

The law is there because of the church, that's the point. I didn't know an equals sign would offend you that much. Must be outlawed in the bible.

Benny_Cake

Aside from the whole area of the education system - which can and must be changed,although I suspect that the main reason it hasn't is inertia rather than religious pressure - how is today's Ireland not free from the Catholic Church? I doubt whether the church has ever been as weak in this country as it is right now.

gurramok

Benny_Cake wrote: »

Aside from the whole area of the education system - which can and must be changed,although I suspect that the main reason it hasn't is inertia rather than religious pressure - how is today's Ireland not free from the Catholic Church? I doubt whether the church has ever been as weak in this country as it is right now.

Its very important for the church to control the schools, they need to brainwash the kids before they the kids older to decide for themselves plus its a fine hunting ground for paedo priests and lay people.

Benny_Cake

gurramok wrote: »

Its very important for the church to control the schools, they need to brainwash the kids before they the kids older to decide for themselves plus its a fine hunting ground for paedo priests and lay people.

I agree that there are plenty of people in the Catholic Church as well as in other denominations that would want to block change in this area. The question is whether they have the power to succeed.I'd doubt it - not anymore.

I Heart Internet

ColeTrain wrote: »

The law is there because of the church, that's the point.

So the church also grants us a day off at Christmas? And it's to blame for outlawing murder? Powerful thing this church.

ColeTrain wrote: »

Must be outlawed in the bible

That joke is so weak it actually made me a little sad. You can do better.

ColeTrain

I Heart Internet wrote: »

So the church also grants us a day off at Christmas? And it's to blame for outlawing murder? Powerful thing this church.

It was a very powerful thing. It had serious influence on the state, y'know?

I Heart Internet wrote: »

That joke is so weak it actually made me a little sad. You can do better.

It wasn't a joke, probably in there somewhere.

saa

When we reform our Catholic pandering laws and then the schools and the form places for people to reflect, gather, connect, meditate, and avail of assistance without being threatened with hell.

It always struck me as strange how 100's of people could go to mass on a Sunday for years and not get to know anyone around them or not have that support outside of mass, or how many priests can act out a mass only actually talking to the people between the routine.

At least the mormon church seems to be more community orientated, but I think you have to pay a subscription to Jesus.. but I have heard they have a welfare system hmm *strokes chin*. Oh you'll have to circumcise your boy, wow harsh.

smokingman

Given that there are unicorns in the bible, you'd think people would have figured out that it's all bull by this stage....and yet, they still get antsy when you say it's all made up.

yutta

saa wrote: »

When we reform our Catholic pandering laws and then the schools and the form places for people to reflect, gather, connect, meditate, and avail of assistance without being threatened with hell.

Sounds very wishy-washy, airy-fairy to me. Are you a fully paid up member of the CC? Funny how those from outside the church see best fit as to how it should be run.

saa wrote: »

It always struck me as strange how 100's of people could go to mass on a Sunday for years and not get to know anyone around them or not have that support outside of mass, or how many priests can act out a mass only actually talking to the people between the routine.

People go to Mass to participate in the Holy Sacrafice and receive the sacraments. Mass is not primarily a social occasion, though there certainly is a community aspect to it.

saa wrote: »

At least the mormon church seems to be more community orientated, but I think you have to pay a subscription to Jesus.. but I have heard they have a welfare system hmm *strokes chin*. Oh you'll have to circumcise your boy, wow harsh.

Off you go so.