ISAW wrote: » the John Jayt report was not a survey of 100,000 people. It was a survey sent our to priests!
andyjo wrote: » The 6.2% figure you refer to is 6.2% of all abusers. Look carefully at page. Do not forget also that priests can also be Uncles;).
you keep parroting excerpts from a Newsweek story while you ignore the rest of that same article? You are given hard evidence from proper research but it wont stop you parroting part of an article wiothout reference to the rest of it.
Try again. Try harder this time . Try to find a survey / study which found any other group in society which was found to have 4% of its members accused of child sex abuse/rape ? Preferably in modern times, or in the past 60 years or so , so we are comparining like with like.
Priests are people. The survey was on clergy in America, over 100,000 of them, and found ( and I quote from the staunch conservative Roman Catholic website and its sources ) that "4,392 clergymen—almost all priests—were accused of abusing 10,667 people " http://www.americancatholic.org/news...johnjaycns.asp
The surveys reported 75,694 diocesan priests and approximately 34,000 religious priests in ministry with 4,392 accused of abuse. If the total of the accused priests (4,392) is divided by the total of all priests in ministry between 1950 and 2002 (109,694), the result is 4%; for diocesan priests only, (3,282/76,694), the percentage is 4.27% and for religious priests, (929/34,000), 2.7%.
An overwhelming 94% of respondents indicated that joint legal and physical custody, shared between parents, would be in the child’s best interest, with 78% of respondents indicating that a 50/50 time sharing agreement was appropriate. Another scenario was presented. In the second scenario the father has been accused by the mother of sexually molesting their child. The Department of Social Services and the police conducted an investigation and concluded that there is insufficient evidence to determine whether or not the father committed sexual abuse. The question of custody is again asked. As a result of the unsubstantiated accusation against the father, 79% of the same respondents stated that sole legal and physical custody should be granted to the mother. Only 15% of respondents felt that the father should be permitted a minimum of 50% visitation with the children. In the final survey question regarding the respondent’s personal opinion of child molesters, 42% stated that they should be "locked away for life" and 48% responded that they should "burn in hell". Why do so many mothers file false sexual abuse allegations during custody cases? They work.
The father is not the only victim in a false child sex abuse allegation. Children are also victimized. Not only does the child have to submit to numerous interrogations and invasive tests to determine if abuse occurred, but needless therapy is often prescribed. The child, knowing at first that nothing happened, is subjected to counseling that reinforces the story that abuse has occurred. In time, many children grow to believe and accept that their fathers molested them. The emotional trauma is life-long. This phenomenon has become so common that psychologists have given names to the syndromes that result from false abuse claims, including Parental Alienation Syndrome (PAS) and Sexual Abuse in Divorce (SAID).
ISAW wrote: » Yes you asked for a group with a higher level than 4%.
lmaopml wrote: » I like ISAW, and he/she is not a protestant. Pay more attention..
lmaopml wrote: » ISAW is not a troll....
andyjo wrote: » its quite obvious he is. If you look back over the numerous posts he/ she made on this thread , its obvious that either he is a troll , or else the abuse he claims to have suffered under a Brother when he was at a very vulnerable age has left a deep psychological wound. I feel sorry for him.
PatricaMcKay2 wrote: » I doubt that extremely, I know people who have been sexually abused and he (and its more than certainly a he) doesnt exhibit any of the signs. That he may be a pervert with a power fantasy of being a "Prince of the Church" (a Parish Priest a actually used that term to describe himself to my dad) is very possible though, still he most certainly after that major slip is from a Protestant background.
lmaopml wrote: » Well, I think it's good to approach this thread in humility, but I must say that the opportunists are abundant, and the guess work is beyond bizarre...and not lacking in exuberant name calling.....crazy stuff really. Afterall, nobody wants to debate a fool? Surely....I can entirely guarantee that ISAW is not a fool...
Guitar_Monkey wrote: » He never said he was sexually abused. As for the other rubbish, you are out of order. And i thought personal attacks wern't allowed around here....
PatricaMcKay2 wrote: » The Pslam he referenced in 50 in Roman Catholicism, surely you must know it? Its been set to music so much....Its 51 in the KJV, this isnt my nordie paranoid side kicking, its clear as day light!
PatricaMcKay2 wrote: » Indeed he didnt..andyjo speculated that he had been and I contradicted that. Are you a parent? If you arent its probably impossible for you understand unless you have been abused yourself.
PatricaMcKay2 wrote: » Indeed he didnt..andyjo speculated that he had been .
andyjo wrote: » if you put certain key words inc ISAW in to the search engine at the top of this page, it does not take long to where ISAW admits he was physically assaulted by a Brother. ( page 68 of this thread).
ISAW wrote: » The discussion was specifically about sexual abuse but yes in my experience in schools more physical abuse was doled out by lay teachers then by brothers. And I speak as someone who had a pitchside pole from a sideline flag broken over my back by a Brother when I was ten years old. Actually my vertibrae are weak there and I have no idea if the two are linked. If I met the brother tomorrow I would bear him no ill feelings.
andyjo wrote: » post 1012 of this very thread. A few days ago I remember reading where he implied he had been sexually assaulted too, but I cannot be bothered trying to read through more of his numerous posts to find it.
Guitar_Monkey wrote: » ISAW is not burying his head in the sand and saying that abuse never happened. He is not defending abuse that has occured. In fact he has stated quite .
PatricaMcKay2 wrote: » LOL....I have debated hardcore Unionists who have denied that the Loyalist death squads were a vital part of British policy in the north, and once they get a few beers in them their attitude becomes collusion was no big deal...Similarly here, what does his persistent denial of the insitutional cover up which has been revealed say about? I know what it says but you cant face that reality... As for you being a parent, you obviously believe that the kids abused were ontologically inferior to your own and so had it coming...Not very Christian.
Guitar_Monkey wrote: » So you make an accusation but can't be bothered to supply the proof ?? He has talked about the abuse before. It was non sexual. I'm sure he'll give you details if you so require them.
Guitar_Monkey wrote: » we'd all appreciate it ..
Guitar_Monkey wrote: » Some bishops taking matters into there own hands does not an instituional cover up make. As for the personal attacks....we'd all appreciate it if you could knock it on the head and grow up. Nobody on here has said that abuse was ok. Everyone is in agreement that the abuse was a sickening disgrace.
Guitar_Monkey wrote: » Physically....not sexually. And it wasn't just Brothers who physically assaulted children in schools.
andyjo wrote: » speak for yourself, do not speak for others Nobody on here has said that abuse was ok ISAW has made little of abuse by members of the RCC. He did not report his own abuser and does not advocate that people should report clerical abusers. He was not appalled that abusers were sheltered/ moved around without penalty or criticism. That comes pretty close to saying certain abuse was ok.
PatricaMcKay2 wrote: » Yes it does, especially given the way the RCC is run, and especially with the Ryan report...And no one is has said outright that abuse is okay, however well...Live the same old self enforced ignorance that smiled on internment of kids into work camps where they were sexually abused. The fact of kids being placed into work camps in the first place is sick enough.
of the 13,781 completed cases ( page 27) 29 of these ( 0.22%) are band V
andyjo wrote: » For someone with only a few dozen posts, you seem to know ISAW very well....;) He has posted five and a half thousand posts. Have you read them all ?
andyjo wrote: » post 1012 of this very thread. A few days ago I remember reading where he implied he had been sexually assaulted too, but I cannot be bothered trying to read through more of his numerous posts to find it. The idea of Stockholm Syndrome seems to fit this victim, and may be an explanation for the way he can can blank out the horrible actions and just see the good, like a wife sees only the good in her brute husband who hits her and feels that she is the one in the wrong and that he is doing it for her own good. Indoctrination 24/7 at a vulnerable age has had a lasting effect on the poor fellow. I'll say a prayer for him, he needs it.
