deathrider wrote: » Can't we just shoot them?
FetchTheGin wrote: » Youth centres are a good deterrent for young kids, most have nothing to do.
teol wrote: » Scumbag kids have plenty of stuff to do. It's just that their parents couldn't give a toss about them.
Paarse Krokodil wrote: » the scumbag problem and yob culture of the British Isles?
FetchTheGin wrote: » What do they have to do exactly? Everything costs money and you will find a lot of these families have very little.
Overheal wrote: » The Real Problem - A generation that is growing up with the void of Corporal Punishment and a very recessed Catholic orthodoxy has basically bred this chaotic point in time when people are still trying to figure out what works, now that you don't have the Church or the Cane to discipline people defacto. .
Vercoda wrote: » A lot of the problems - and blame - can be laid squarely on the parents.
hatrickpatrick wrote: » Punishment simply forces people to behave when there's a chance of getting caught, because they fear the punishment. That's just not good enough in my view. What we need to do is raise a society which doesn't WANT to do these things because they have empathy and compassion for other people. In other words, if I was in England I wouldn't have looted or burned anything down because my first thought would have been "wow, that poor shopkeeper is going to be devastated, I feel sorry for him". Compassion and empathy would make me not *WANT* to screw people over in the way the rioters did, because I was brought up with a principle of feeling sorry for others when bad things happen to them. Where was that compassion with these rioters? We're all human beings, why is it that I (and the vast majority of people) are capable of feeling sorry for others and putting ourselves in the place of those who suffer, and these looters apparently were not? Basically what I'm saying is, it's a sad state of affairs if the only reason you don't steal from others is because you might get punished for it. We should be focusing on teaching these kids not to WANT to steal from others, because it's unkind and causes hardship to those they steal from. In other words, we need to teach them to behave because they care about humanity, not because they're afraid of getting whacked.
My name is URL wrote: » The way people go on here you'd swear that Ireland and the UK are the only two places in the world with a criminal underclass.
Mike 1972 wrote: » Geography fail ! the British Isles > "Ireland and England" now bend over
Einhard wrote: » That's all well and good, but we don't live in an ideal, perfect world, and until we do, we need penalties to for those who engage in criminality. From the outside, society in certain parts of the UK seems extremely disloctaed and fractured, and a holistic approach is needed to remedy this, and, in effect, reform those societies. However, that's a long-term project, and one that will never have 100% success rate, so punishments and penalties will always be needed.
Einhard wrote: » Lots of other places have inefficent, incompetent politicians. Does that mean we shouldn't talk about politics on boards too?
Einhard wrote: » I was watching Question Time on Thursday, and the Tory MP David Davis stated that these peope should take responsibility for their own lives and prospects, rather than blaming society and their situation all the time. In response, a woman in the audience started to angrily denoucne him, demanding if he had any idea of the reality in council estates and the like. To which Davis replied that he did, because he was born and raised in one! It didn't stop the woman's rant, but it should have. The point is that people shouldn't need the state to hold their hands, and provide outlets for them. Of course it's nice if that happens, but it shouldn't be necessary. In fact, it's generally not necessary, as the fact that only a tiny minority of people living in such conditions actually partook in the riots. You state that there is nothing to do. Are there no sports pitches in Tottenham? No local soccer teams? No libraries? No training courses? Of course there are, but lots of young people choose not to use them. And the more we blame society for the actions of those youths (and ignore incidentally, the majority who lead law abiding, respectful lives in the same circumstances), the more the thugs feel that their actions are legitimate, and the less can be done to resolve things.
My name is URL wrote: » Discussion is one thing.. irrational and ill informed rants are quite another. Nothing more than an excuse for some to bleat on about the humiliation they'd like to see dished out to those below them. I doubt crime even comes in to it for a lot of people, just the fact that what they see as a 'skanger' culture exists. Take away their welfare.. Evict them.. Deport them.. Bate the **** outta them.. not really the most well thought out of ideas on how to reduce crime rates are they?
hatrickpatrick wrote: » I agree, that's why we have prisons. What I'm saying is when you're dealing with kids who don't understand the world yet, why the f*ck would you give them the mindset of "don't steal because if I get caught I'll be whacked... No chance of getting caught? Well sure why not then" rather than bringing them up to be decent human beings who care about other people? As I said, I was never caned (nor were the majority of my generation I imagine) and I have never felt inclined to join a looting mob simply because I was brought up with a sense of belonging to the human race with everyone else and not wanting to cause harm to others that I wouldn't want caused to me. Compliance out of fear isn't good enough, it only creates a society where "not getting caught" becomes paramount rather than "being nice to others".
FetchTheGin wrote: » 2011 is a lot different to the 1960s. Society is a lot different and there are a lot less opportunites and more social pressures.
