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* Honours Maths paper 1 * AFTERMATH

polka dot

Were my class the only ones that all came up crying?

Worst paper I have ever seen, honestly.

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randylonghorn

kahf1_01 wrote: »

cheers for the advice, info, and insights. appreciated.

No worries.

kahf1_01 wrote: »

OK, that guy who guessed his friend "randy" rofl that's weird.

kahf1_01 wrote: »

OK well randylonghorn, Im defo taking your advice, I've spent way to long around this thread today, since 4:45. it's time I stop worrying. and knuckle down to PII. what's done is done. bye

Finally!! Someone listens!

partyatmygaff

bren2001 wrote: »

I would be careful about doing that. I did something similar for my DCU exams after and got in a lot of trouble. You don't own the copyright on the exam or the solutions and subsequently you breach it. Theres being helpful and then theres putting yourself at risk.

How can someone own the copyright to a mathematical function and its solution set?

bren2001

partyatmygaff wrote: »

How can someone own the copyright to a mathematical function and its solution set?

The department of Education have published a paper and own the rights to that paper. Any reproduction of this is a breach of copyright without their approval. The do not own the function set and its solution.

That was the case in DCU. The SEC are no different.

spoomarc

Patriciamc93 wrote: »

LOoking for an a ..... I was nearly crying! The only reason I wasn't was because my friend was and she only wanted to pass .... But she might not have.

It was a ridiculous paper!

Glad to here you rationally decided not to cry, as it would have been in appropriate

partyatmygaff

bren2001 wrote: »

The department of Education have published a paper and own the rights to that paper. Any reproduction of this is a breach of copyright without their approval. The do not own the function set and its solution.

That was the case in DCU. The SEC are no different.

Yes but if he just posts the questions and solutions without using a scan e.t.c. then no harm done.

Paczini

What do you think will be done about this paper?
Will we repeat it or the marks will be adjusted?
But I don't think that the second option would be fair

bren2001

partyatmygaff wrote: »

Yes but if he just posts the questions and solutions without using a scan e.t.c. then no harm done.

Plenty of harm done. If you post the answers to all of your maths book online do you think that is legal? No, you cannot do that it is a breach of copyright. The book does not own the function set or solution.

I am talking from past experience. Paul can choose to do what he likes. I meerly gave him a bit of advice. Its a breach of copyright and what he chooses to do with that information is up to him.

bren2001

Paczini wrote: »

What do you think will be done about this paper?
Will we repeat it or the marks will be adjusted?
But I don't think that the second option would be fair

You won't repeat the paper. The paper was technically speaking was fair as it should of been covered in school.

Marks will be adjusted, thats all that can be done.

jumpguy

Paczini wrote: »

Will we repeat it or the marks will be adjusted?

Don't be absolutely ridiculous - of course we won't be repeating it. The marking scheme will be fair and lenient, that is all. They're not gonna change the paper or give everyone 50 extra marks.

Really, this thread has gone on too long and some claims here are completely sensationalist, to put it mildly.

Get to bed everyone and turn your attention to paper 2.

[Deleted User]

Posting solutions to maths questions isnt a breach of copyright hahaha

randylonghorn

Paczini wrote: »

What do you think will be done about this paper?
Will we repeat it or the marks will be adjusted?
But I don't think that the second option would be fair

0_o

I can guarantee you that you will not be repeating it simply because you thought it was hard, put that right out of your mind!

The marking schemes are likely to reflect the perceived difficulty of certain sections though.

partyatmygaff

bren2001 wrote: »

Plenty of harm done. If you post the answers to all of your maths book online do you think that is legal?

Why wouldn't it be? Where is the evidence that I actually copied the questions from the book? For all it matters, I created those functions myself and solved them myself. Just because certain functions happen to be on an exam paper does not mean I cannot recreate said functions, solve them and publish them. They don't own the functions, their solutions or their order.

bren2001

AdamD wrote: »

Posting solutions to maths questions isnt a breach of copyright hahaha

I did it before. Was told by the DCU disciplinary board that it is a breach of copyright.

By posting them online you are publishing them. To publish the answers is illegal to meerly work the answers out and show it to people is not. Its the distinction between publishing and working out the answers.

bren2001

partyatmygaff wrote: »

Why wouldn't it be? Where is the evidence that I actually copied the questions from the book? For all it matters, I created those functions myself and solved them myself. Just because certain functions happen to be on an exam paper does not mean I cannot recreate said functions, solve them and publish them. They don't own the functions, their solutions or their order.

He is on a Maths Paper 1 forum. Its a bit obvious that he did not make up the functions and solve them.

They do not own the functions as I have said. But Paul is publishing the answers to their exam.

[Deleted User]

The answers to maths questions, which they have definitively not got copyright over.

bren2001

AdamD wrote: »

The answers to maths questions, which they have definitively not got copyright over.

Alright. Then DCU pulled me in for the craic just to wind me up.

Paczini

With that repeating, I just heard some people talking about the possibility

KoolAidRelic

partyatmygaff wrote: »

Why wouldn't it be? Where is the evidence that I actually copied the questions from the book? For all it matters, I created those functions myself and solved them myself. Just because certain functions happen to be on an exam paper does not mean I cannot recreate said functions, solve them and publish them. They don't own the functions, their solutions or their order.

They do own the order, actually. They published them and there's an inherent right to the copyright of the work you publish (the Bern Convention).

If someone publishes a book, they don't own the words - but they own the combination. If you could prove that you made an identical paper through chance, you'd be fine; otherwise you breached copyright.

And the issue of scanning them? Doesn't matter if it's a scan or rewriting, it's republishing them. I don't think the SEC would mind too much, it's a government agency and makes them freely available itself anyway.

NotExactly

I'm finding it hard to see how the results are A 27 21.95% after some people that say they're A students will probably get Cs or ds.

NotExactly

bren2001 wrote: »

Happened to my sister in English. You still get your 50e back.

You only lose the 50 if your grade doesn't change.

randylonghorn

KoolAidRelic wrote: »

And the issue of scanning them? Doesn't matter if it's a scan or rewriting, it's republishing them.

In terms of the actual papers themselves, that's correct.

KoolAidRelic wrote: »

I don't think the SEC would mind too much, it's a government agency and makes them freely available itself anyway.

That also seems to be accurate as to their attitude.

bren2001

NotExactly wrote: »

You only lose the 50 if your grade doesn't change.

As stated before. If your grade goes up or down you get your money back.

C14N

NotExactly wrote: »

I'm finding it hard to see how the results are A 27 21.95% after some people that say they're A students will probably get Cs or ds.

As do I. I think that generally around 10% get A's (give or take a few) and considering that even teachers and the likes of George Humphrey are bemoaning this one, not to mention the response in this thread alone, it seems quite unlikely that many of those people are telling the truth. I call shenanigans.

yannfann

Right so q8c
I did it... lets just say an odd way. What I did was integrate a point, x=r about the y axis, with the volume formula, and disregarded the limits as I was only looking for it on a flat plane. Just wondering if anyone knows if this is right or wrong?
Workings: x=r
pi∫x^2
pi∫ r^2 R=constant
therefore
pi r^2 ∫ 1
pir^2 which is the formula.
Is this complete rubbish or will I get any marks?
(Thought the paper was atrocious btw, absolute shambles)

Maybe_Memories

yannfann wrote: »

Right so q8c
I did it... lets just say an odd way. What I did was integrate a point, x=r about the y axis, with the volume formula, and disregarded the limits as I was only looking for it on a flat plane. Just wondering if anyone knows if this is right or wrong?
Workings: x=r
pi∫x^2
pi∫ r^2 R=constant
therefore
pi r^2 ∫ 1
pir^2 which is the formula.
Is this complete rubbish or will I get any marks?
(Thought the paper was atrocious btw, absolute shambles)

Kinda confused as to what you mean..
What are you integrating with respect to?
And when you integrate a constant you have to get a variable.

LiezlM

spazzy wrote: »

the ppl who clicked A must be from the project maths side of things
i'm an A student and i'd say i got a C!

Oh Please... Don't hate on those doing Project Maths.... I am worried about passing. I'ts very easy to say a different paper was better compared to your's, but quite frankly I would have loved to see you try and get an A in Project Maths!

epicwinning

yannfann wrote: »

Right so q8c
I did it... lets just say an odd way. What I did was integrate a point, x=r about the y axis, with the volume formula, and disregarded the limits as I was only looking for it on a flat plane. Just wondering if anyone knows if this is right or wrong?
Workings: x=r
pi∫x^2
pi∫ r^2 R=constant
therefore
pi r^2 ∫ 1
pir^2 which is the formula.
Is this complete rubbish or will I get any marks?
(Thought the paper was atrocious btw, absolute shambles)

If there aren't limits, you're going to get a "... +c" in the equation and r is a variable, not a constant. They might give full marks for any attempt if they deem the question not to have been on the syllabus (they did something similar in Applied Maths before, I think...)

yannfann

epicwinning wrote: »

If there aren't limits, you're going to get a "... +c" in the equation and r is a variable, not a constant. They might give full marks for any attempt if they deem the question not to have been on the syllabus (they did something similar in Applied Maths before, I think...)

Yeah my idea kinda falls flat now that I look back, but the idea I had was that seeing as it was flat, that you would only be looking for say the face of a cylinder, so I did What I would do in finding the volume of the cylinder, where the limits would give it depth, and ignored the lmits

Dis-regard my way if you want, it was just something I threw together.

B_Fanatic

Anyone notice that the poll is an anti-bell curve?

Also, I know post mortems are useless at this stage, but it's too late to get anything done so I'm just wondering: For part 1 C, I got the square root and got the value +/- 6(I think?) and subbed it in to get b. If I gently put red lines through the negative soltuions (Leaving only 6 and 3) will the examiner correct and give marks to the lightly covered wrong ones? As far as I know the examiner has to correct everything visible.

Da Shins Kelly

Most of yiz that think ye've done terribly probably won't when it comes to marking. If everyone is up in arms over the difficulty of it, then they'll mark it easier to save face. It won't be as bad as ye think. The department doesn't need any more trouble with people doing badly in maths, the argument about leaving cert maths is bad enough as it is, so I reckon they'll definitely mark it way easier because of this. And anyway, ye've still got paper two to come, so be positive!