Saorview Content Speculation

LCDs do "burn in" just takes longer.

You should see Call center status screens. Unusable to recycle for TV.

I am assuming that the Current RTÉ News Now will be very different to the one launched in May (sometime).

Elmo wrote: »

I am assuming that the Current RTÉ News Now will be very different to the one launched in May (sometime).

Except that it will have no adverts. IIRCC, RTE did a deal with CIE to have Sky News replaced by RTE NEWS NOW. Do they have adverts on those screens?

Sam Russell wrote: »

Except that it will have no adverts. IIRCC, RTE did a deal with CIE to have Sky News replaced by RTE NEWS NOW. Do they have adverts on those screens?

That service seems to be different to the online and saorview services (mainly txt based service). BTW should RTÉ wish to place ads on RTÉ News Now online service they may.

I assume once launched the ad breaks during live news will be replaced by extra bits and that RTÉ News Now will be timed to allow for those extra bits. Or they could just shows RTÉ publicity advertising.

Sam Russell wrote: »

Except that it will have no adverts. IIRCC, RTE did a deal with CIE to have Sky News replaced by RTE NEWS NOW. Do they have adverts on those screens?

Yes they do. It's not the same service as the one on DTT or online.

I do not understand why RTE have been restricted to no adverts on the News Now channel. I agree with the kids channels but this smacks of commercial interference not seen since the Ray Burke era. Who benefits?

Sam Russell wrote: »

I do not understand why RTE have been restricted to no adverts on the News Now channel. I agree with the kids channels but this smacks of commercial interference not seen since the Ray Burke era. Who benefits?

No one....it comes out of the licence fee plus commercial entities like sky and tv3 have too much say in the determination of dtt chwnnels. Sky wont even be on dtt and tv3 arent willing to invest in new channels or quality shows - they arent willing to make dtt stronger platform so instead they will try and nuture the public service just so they wont have to invest to compete

Disgraceful stuff really....thats my own opinion anyway

warlikedave wrote: »

Disgraceful stuff really....thats my own opinion anyway

Well, I hope that the new Minister does not stand like a rabbit caught in the headlights, and starts running the show and not listening to these vested interests that have an inordinate level of influence on the BAI. Sky do not pay Irish VAT, (which they should,) and TV3 show us what a restricted RTE would be like.

We need action like merge BAI and Comreg into the same unit. Maybe set the ASO date. Restrict the top salaries of the 'Stars'. We have a new DG, so maybe thing can change.

The Cush

Sam Russell wrote: »

We need action like merge BAI and Comreg into the same unit. Maybe set the ASO date.

Fine Gael's Simon Coveney said this of the merger of the BAI/Comreg during the Broadcasting Bill debate a few years ago "This is something that will probably happen in time". Labour's Liz McManus said similar.

The manifestos of the two government parties have similar plans

Fine Gael

Competition, Consumer and Utilities Commission: To save taxpayers’ money and to streamline resources, Fine Gael will merge the Competition Authority, the National Consumer Agency (NCA), Broadcasting Authority of Ireland (BAI), the Commission for Communications Regulation (ComReg) and the Commission for Energy Regulation (CER) into a single, more powerful Competition, Consumer and Utilities Commission. We will seek to empower this new over-arching regulator and consumer champion to enforce our Fair Trade Act.

Labour

Regulating for the future of broadcasting
Telecommunications regulatory and licensing matters are currently handled by ComReg, whereas broadcasting regulation and licenses will be the responsibility of the Broadcasting Authority of Ireland. Given the convergence of technology in this sector – i.e. video on demand, mobile broadband – we will merge the Broadcasting Authority of Ireland and ComReg to form one regulatory body.

This new pan-regulatory body will also have responsibility for protecting consumers from ‘rip off’ charges and for Quality Assurance.

No specific mention of it in The Programme for Government but I think it will happen.

The ASO month is known - October 2012 as confirmed by RTÉ.

With a BAI / Comreg merger you can get seriously expert consultations. That later implement exactly whatever it was they first had in mind.

watty wrote: »

With a BAI / Comreg merger you can get seriously expert consultations. That later implement exactly whatever it was they first had in mind.

.... or whatever they were told to have in their mind.

icdg

Karsini wrote: »

Yes they do. It's not the same service as the one on DTT or online.

The service on the giant screens isn't really RTÉ News Now, its branded with the same name, but is basically just text headlines from RTÉ with lots of adverts. There are no programmes on it.

Of course this isn't regulated and isn't subject to the Minister's direction.

As for the proposed merger of Comreg and BAI, it is something that should have happened years ago. It should also come with reform of the regulatory regime to abolish the notion of "programme contracts" and replace them with broadcasting licences that covered both content and technical conditions of the service - this happened as long ago as 1990 in the UK.

My fear would be that in the One Regulator to Rule Them All (which would also include the CER, CAR, part of the IAA, the National Transport Authority, and others) the appointed Board/Commissioners would have so many areas to cover that in fact their role would be reduced to rubber stamping decisions already made at much lower level by full time civil servants. I'd leave utility regulations to a seperate utility regulator.

It is a civil service truism that consulations tend to be verification exercises - the Terms of Reference can be written to predetermine the outcome...

I agree with a merger of the technical side of the BAI and Comreg (Comreg's engineers I assume are the people that the BAI talk to about technical issues anyway.) However a separate content regulator is required, if such a regulator does not exist the regulation is purely there for the technical end of broadcasting. Meaning that the monitoring of Broadcaster content may get sidelined in a large organisation that is also concerned with all type of communications infrastructure in the country.

There are Engineers in Comreg. Quite good ones. As to how often their opinions are sought by the paper pushers?

watty wrote: »

There are Engineers in Comreg. Quite good ones. As to how often their opinions are sought by the paper pushers?

And that is where they should be, and they should regulate the spectrum that Saorview and the BAI's commerical muxs use.

The Powers that Be in Comreg do the Regulating. Not the Engineers. Most of the staff are not Engineers as such.

watty wrote: »

The Powers that Be in Comreg do the Regulating. Not the Engineers. Most of the staff are not Engineers as such.

Well you know what I mean, technical regulation from ComReg, Content Regulation from BAI.

Mr McBoatface

There seems to be an additional RTE2 running at the moment, it's called "Unknown 454". So there is "RTE2" in HD, "Temporary" (RTE2) and "Unknown 454".

There is no EPG on "Unknown 454", I've not checked the birate or the resolution. I'm receiving it from Mount Leinster.

glimmerman123

jobyrne30 wrote: »

There seems to be an additional RTE2 running at the moment, it's called "Unknown 454". So there is "RTE2" in HD, "Temporary" (RTE2) and "Unknown 454".

There is no EPG on "Unknown 454", I've not checked the birate or the resolution. I'm receiving it from Mount Leinster.

I take it it's on mux 2. How long has it been on? I'm not picking up anything extra from Maghera.

Elmo wrote: »

Well you know what I mean, technical regulation from ComReg, Content Regulation from BAI.

Am writing an article up on saorview and co-channel interference at the mo so i rang comreg and got a call back from one of thier broadcasting devisions...here is what i learned:

- Rte has full decision on saorview certification and will be contracting it out
- rtenl aquired a licience for 4 muxes in 2007 with channel allocations
- rtenl was the one who decided the channels to use and comreg signed off on it
- communication between other countries in terms of channels used varies
- bai handles most international agreements including the existing MOU

- mount leinster
-- rtenl had invested its time and particular equipment specifically for use of ch 39 +45
-- channels will probably remain as they are
-- power to mt leinster may be increased to counter co-channel interferrence
-- power to transmitter is in rtenls domain of decision
-- mt leinster will be broadcasting with more power than the welsh transmitter

--- Please note...this info is from comreg and since there is overlaps with the BAI and RTENL some details need to be comfirmed and i am awaiting a responce from both the BAI + RTENL

I still voiced concerns in regards to how successful a power boost to the mt leinster would counter preslie especially in good weather conditions and all that was countered with was the possibility of a boost to transmittion power

Not much new info there really

By the way did a scan for mount leinster and no unknown channel 454 @ 9:25pm

Your thoughts?

glimmerman123 wrote: »

I take it it's on mux 2. How long has it been on? I'm not picking up anything extra from Maghera.

I do know that they were testing ch 39 recently on mount leinster....maybe we shall see the first of the new channels soon enough

The Cush

jobyrne30 wrote: »

There seems to be an additional RTE2 running at the moment, it's called "Unknown 454". So there is "RTE2" in HD, "Temporary" (RTE2) and "Unknown 454".

There is no EPG on "Unknown 454", I've not checked the birate or the resolution. I'm receiving it from Mount Leinster.

glimmerman123 wrote: »

I take it it's on mux 2. How long has it been on? I'm not picking up anything extra from Maghera.

Vince also posted in another thread that he had "another channel today carrying rte 2 its called service 1108" from Mullaghanish.

Could it be the second mux testing with different content from Mux 1 inline with the Ministerial decision on the approval of new channels at the end of Feb? Mux 2 must be operational by Sept in any case with the RTÉ 2 HD and RTÉjr/RTÉ Plus channels.

Intermittent second mux testing to date has carried a duplicate of Mux 1 content.

warlikedave wrote: »

- mount leinster
-- rtenl had invested its time and particular equipment specifically for use of ch 39 +45
-- channels will probably remain as they are
-- power to mt leinster may be increased to counter co-channel interferrence
-- power to transmitter is in rtenls domain of decision
-- mt leinster will be broadcasting with more power than the welsh transmitter

Umm, Ofcom won't be happy with that, it would surely make things worse in Wales.

Karsini wrote: »

Umm, Ofcom won't be happy with that, it would surely make things worse in Wales.

My thoughts exactly but ive to wait to hear back from rtenl to verify this

Souriau

jobyrne30 wrote: »

There seems to be an additional RTE2 running at the moment, it's called "Unknown 454". So there is "RTE2" in HD, "Temporary" (RTE2) and "Unknown 454".

There is no EPG on "Unknown 454", I've not checked the birate or the resolution. I'm receiving it from Mount Leinster.

I scanned and got this info from Carin Hill
I am receiving 3 RTE 2 channels, 1 HD and 2 SD

Network Name: RTENL
Network ID: 12801 (0x3201)
Transport Stream ID: 1001 (0x03e9)
Original Network ID: 8564 (0x2174) Version: 3
Descriptor: Network Name Descriptor
DVB-T Frequency 198.500 MHz
Bandwidth: 8 MHz Constellation: 64-QAM
Hierarchy: non-hierarchical, native interleaver Guard Interval 1/32
Code Rate: 2/3
Current Network: True
Descriptor: Service List Descriptor
Service: 1101 (RTÉ One) digital television service
Service: 1102 (RTÉ Two) digital television service
Service: 1103 (TV3) digital television service
Service: 1104 (TG4) digital television service
Service: 1105 (RTÉ News Now) digital television service
Service: 1106 (3e) digital television service
Service: 1107 (Temporary ) digital television service
Service: 1108 () digital television service
Service: 1226 (RTÉ Radio 1) digital radio sound service
Service: 1227 (RTÉ 2FM) digital radio sound service
Service: 1228 (RTÉ Lyric FM) digital radio sound service
Service: 1229 (RTÉ Raidió na Gaeltachta) digital radio sound service
Service: 1230 (RTÉ Radio 1 Extra) digital radio sound service
Service: 1231 (RTÉ Pulse) digital radio sound service
Service: 1232 (RTÉ 2XM) digital radio sound service
Service: 1233 (RTÉ Choice) digital radio sound service
Service: 1234 (RTÉ Gold) digital radio sound service
Service: 1235 (RTÉ Chill / RTÉ Junior) digital radio sound service
Descriptor: Frequency List Descriptor
Terrestrial: 177.500 MHz
Terrestrial: 184.500 MHz
Terrestrial: 191.500 MHz
Terrestrial: 198.500 MHz
Terrestrial: 205.500 MHz
Terrestrial: 212.500 MHz
Terrestrial: 219.500 MHz
Terrestrial: 474.000 MHz
Terrestrial: 482.000 MHz
Terrestrial: 514.000 MHz
Terrestrial: 530.000 MHz
Terrestrial: 546.000 MHz
Terrestrial: 626.000 MHz
Terrestrial: 666.000 MHz
Terrestrial: 674.000 MHz
Terrestrial: 682.000 MHz
Terrestrial: 690.000 MHz
Terrestrial: 706.000 MHz
Terrestrial: 722.000 MHz
Terrestrial: 730.000 MHz
Terrestrial: 738.000 MHz
Terrestrial: 746.000 MHz
Descriptor: Private Data Specifier Descriptor
Private Data Specifier: Unknown
Descriptor: User Private Descriptor: 0x83
Logical channel 1 = MPEG service 1101 (RTÉ One)
Logical channel 2 = MPEG service 1102 (RTÉ Two)
Logical channel 3 = MPEG service 1103 (TV3)
Logical channel 4 = MPEG service 1104 (TG4)
Logical channel 5 = MPEG service 1105 (RTÉ News Now)
Logical channel 6 = MPEG service 1106 (3e)
Logical channel 7 = MPEG service 1107 (Temporary )
Logical channel 200 = MPEG service 1226 (RTÉ Radio 1)
Logical channel 202 = MPEG service 1227 (RTÉ 2FM)
Logical channel 203 = MPEG service 1228 (RTÉ Lyric FM)
Logical channel 204 = MPEG service 1229 (RTÉ Raidió na Gaeltachta)
Logical channel 201 = MPEG service 1230 (RTÉ Radio 1 Extra)
Logical channel 205 = MPEG service 1231 (RTÉ Pulse)
Logical channel 206 = MPEG service 1232 (RTÉ 2XM)
Logical channel 207 = MPEG service 1233 (RTÉ Choice)
Logical channel 208 = MPEG service 1234 (RTÉ Gold)
Logical channel 209 = MPEG service 1235 (RTÉ Chill / RTÉ Junior)

Souriau

It is the same just no teletext on channel 8

RTE2 Channel 7
Program Number: 7/1107
PCR on PID 8190 (0x1ffe)
PMT Version: 8
Service name: Temporary
Logical channel number: 7

Stream Type: 0x1b H.264 Video
Elementary Stream PID 1107 (0x0453)

Stream Type: 0x04 MPEG-2 Audio
Elementary Stream PID 1207 (0x04b7)

Stream Type: 0x06 Teletext/VBI
Elementary Stream PID 1301 (0x0515)

RTE2 Channel 8
Program Number: 1108
PCR on PID 8190 (0x1ffe)
PMT Version: 2
Service name:

Stream Type: 0x1b H.264 Video
Elementary Stream PID 1107 (0x0453)

Stream Type: 0x04 MPEG-2 Audio
Elementary Stream PID 1207 (0x04b7)

RTE and Comreg appear to have a different script regarding Channel Allocations.

It's very strange for Comreg to Claim it's all down to RTE. RTE has no authority to negotiate internationally or allocate Spectrum Licences. Only Comreg in Ireland is allowed to do that.
It's like suggesting the Channel Is. / French Co-channel problems are caused by BBC rather than Ofcom and French regulator lack of attention to detail.

RTE NL probably can suggest at the outset what channels would suit on an Irish National Plan, and may talk unofficially to others.

But final responsibility for ALL International Co-ordination, avoiding co-channel and actually issuing authorisation for a channel is entirely Comregs responsibly and control. RTE NL can ONLY use mux channels from the "pool" issued by Comreg.

The Cush

watty wrote: »

RTE and Comreg appear to have a different script regarding Channel Allocations.

It's very strange for Comreg to Claim it's all down to RTE. RTE has no authority to negotiate internationally or allocate Spectrum Licences. Only Comreg in Ireland is allowed to do that.
It's like suggesting the Channel Is. / French Co-channel problems are caused by BBC rather than Ofcom and French regulator lack of attention to detail.

RTE NL probably can suggest at the outset what channels would suit on an Irish National Plan, and may talk unofficially to others.

But final responsibility for ALL International Co-ordination, avoiding co-channel and actually issuing authorisation for a channel is entirely Comregs responsibly and control. RTE NL can ONLY use mux channels from the "pool" issued by Comreg.

Strange indeed. This was the Ministers reply to Leo Varadkar regarding Ch.39 at Mt Leinster last Oct

Broadcasting Services

478. Deputy Leo Varadkar asked the Minister for Communications, Energy and Natural Resources if there is any impediment to ComReg licensing RTE to use either channels 30, 34, or 39 for public service transmission of RTE from the Mount Leinster transmitter; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [37901/10]

Minister for Communications, Energy and Natural Resources (Deputy Eamon Ryan): The matter referred to by the Deputy relates to the assignment of spectrum, which is a matter for the Commission for Communications Regulation (ComReg). ComReg is the statutory body responsible for the management of spectrum in Ireland, including that used by TV services as referred to in the Deputy’s question, under the Communications Regulation Act 2002. ComReg is also responsible for issuing a licence to RTÉ in respect of television services transmitted by digital terrestrial means under the Broadcasting Act 2009.

I have no direct role in the assignment of specific spectrum.

http://debates.oireachtas.ie/DDebate...ode=3924#N3924

Sponge Bob

Watty is correct, the FINAL say is with Comreg who are the ultimate co-ordinating authority with Ofcom in the UK. It is possible for RTENL/Arqiva/BBC to sort the plan out but not to give full and final approval.

It is entirely possible that the civil servants in the Dept of Comms DO NOT UNDERSTAND this