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Haughey family

dcmraad

Finally a government without this corrupt family included.

If I had my way all of your families assets would have been seized years ago, and your oul fellow stuck against a wall and butchered.

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Snakeblood

cc4life wrote: »

lads im not exactly the brightest at politics but why do people hate haughey so much?

Haughey was paid more than IR£8 million between 1979 and 1986 from various benefactors and businessmen, including £1.3 million from the Dunnes Stores supermarket tycoon Ben Dunne alone.[34] The tribunal described these payments as "unethical".[40]
In May 1989 one of Haughey's lifelong friends Brian Lenihan, a former government minister, underwent a liver transplant which was partly paid for through fundraising by Haughey. The Moriarty tribunal found that, of the £270,000 collected in donations for Brian Lenihan, no more than £70,000 ended up being spent on Lenihan's medical care. The tribunal identified one specific donation of £20,000 for Lenihan that was surreptitiously appropriated by Haughey,[41] who took steps to conceal this transaction.[42][43]
The tribunal found evidence of favours performed in return for money — Saudi businessman Mahmoud Fustok paid Haughey £50,000 to support applications for Irish citizenship.[40]
In other evidence of favours performed, the tribunal reported that Haughey arranged meetings between Ben Dunne and civil servant Seamus Pairceir of the Revenue Commissioners. These discussions resulted in an outstanding capital gains tax bill for Dunne being reduced by £22.8 million. Moriarty found that this was "not coincidental", and that it was a substantial benefit conferred on Dunne by Haughey's actions.[44]
Allied Irish Banks settled a million-pound overdraft with Haughey soon after he became Taoiseach in 1979; the tribunal found that the lenience shown by the bank in this case amounted to an indirect payment by the bank to Haughey.[40]
The tribunal rejected Haughey's claims of ignorance of his own financial affairs[35] and Haughey was accused by the tribunal of "devaluing democracy".[40]

That'll get you started. He was contemptible scum who got a state funeral when he should have got the nation pissing on his grave.

The Pontiac

Charlie might have been corrupt, but I can guarantee you he wouldn't have bankrupt the country.

Ulysses Gaze

How many times does it need to be said.

The corrupt Haughey did not come up with the IFSC concept - Dermot Desmond did.

The corrupt Haughey led us to the brink of the IMF taking over...if it weren't for Ray McSharry, the only Soldier of Bankruptcy I have any time for since Lemass, they would have been running the country in the 1980's.

The corrupt Haughey didn't have the interests of the country at heart...he had his own best interests at heart. A power-hungry, egomaniac with limited talent who thought of himself as a 'World' leader like Mitterand or Reagan.

The fact that people hark back to the Ireland of the corrupt Haughey and think that he was a 'great' leader is quite frightening.

Will people be saying the same things about 'Won it on the Horses' Ahern in ten years time despite the fact that he led Ireland into the clusterfck it is today?

Charlie might have been corrupt, but I can guarantee you he wouldn't have bankrupt the country.

No...but he came bloody close to it in the 1980's

Snakeblood

<Ollie> wrote: »

Charlie might have been corrupt, but I can guarantee you he wouldn't have bankrupt the country.

Charlie *was* corrupt. He was thieving scum, stealing from his friends liver transplant fund. Might doesn't come into it. He'd have bankrupted the country stealing and rezoning anything he could.

cc4life

Snakeblood wrote: »

Haughey was paid more than IR£8 million between 1979 and 1986 from various benefactors and businessmen, including £1.3 million from the Dunnes Stores supermarket tycoon Ben Dunne alone.[34] The tribunal described these payments as "unethical".[40]
In May 1989 one of Haughey's lifelong friends Brian Lenihan, a former government minister, underwent a liver transplant which was partly paid for through fundraising by Haughey. The Moriarty tribunal found that, of the £270,000 collected in donations for Brian Lenihan, no more than £70,000 ended up being spent on Lenihan's medical care. The tribunal identified one specific donation of £20,000 for Lenihan that was surreptitiously appropriated by Haughey,[41] who took steps to conceal this transaction.[42][43]
The tribunal found evidence of favours performed in return for money — Saudi businessman Mahmoud Fustok paid Haughey £50,000 to support applications for Irish citizenship.[40]
In other evidence of favours performed, the tribunal reported that Haughey arranged meetings between Ben Dunne and civil servant Seamus Pairceir of the Revenue Commissioners. These discussions resulted in an outstanding capital gains tax bill for Dunne being reduced by £22.8 million. Moriarty found that this was "not coincidental", and that it was a substantial benefit conferred on Dunne by Haughey's actions.[44]
Allied Irish Banks settled a million-pound overdraft with Haughey soon after he became Taoiseach in 1979; the tribunal found that the lenience shown by the bank in this case amounted to an indirect payment by the bank to Haughey.[40]
The tribunal rejected Haughey's claims of ignorance of his own financial affairs[35] and Haughey was accused by the tribunal of "devaluing democracy".[40]

That'll get you started. He was contemptible scum who got a state funeral when he should have got the nation pissing on his grave.

but none of these things damaged the country..i mean they were bad from a personal perspective and i could understand how hed be hated by lots of people who knew him or were related through business and politics but why do so many normal people hate him?

Monty Burnz

grrrrrrrrrr wrote: »

He wasn't a career politican like Enda

Oh yeah? What was his real job? Possibly a postman - I believe he used to collect a lot of brown envelopes.

cml387

And remember that Charlie's imp was the great Bertie Ahern.

Ulysses Gaze

cc4life wrote: »

but none of these things damaged the country..i mean they were bad from a personal perspective and i could understand how hed be hated by lots of people who knew him or were related through business and politics but why do so many normal people hate him?

After he made his famous 'Living way beyond our means speech' he increased public spending, which soon became out of control, and led to increases in borrowing and taxation at an unacceptable level. My father remembers paying 60p in the pound in taxes under the Corrupt Haughey government.

Then in 1982, his policy to gain the 'Overall Majority' was 'All things to all men' i.e spend crazy money on bribing the public to vote for him and to hell with the economic results. We'll deal with them later. This led to the Gang of 22 incident to oust him. Even his own party thought his policies were crazy.

The Pontiac

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

The corrupt Haughey did not come up with the IFSC concept - Dermot Desmond did.

Desmond wasn't in power though, and a least Haughey was smart enough to take his advice and implement it. There were many business figures giving the current and past governments advice but did they listen? No.

Snakeblood wrote: »

Charlie *was* corrupt. He was thieving scum, stealing from his friends liver transplant fund. Might doesn't come into it. He'd have bankrupted the country stealing and rezoning anything he could.

I totally agree he was corrupt, but he was also a very proud Irish man and would never, ever get us into this mess. He was also very smart. Have you listened to the recent Bertire Ahern interviews? The man is totally deluded. He was still going on about his 'Bertie Bowl' and being a President only a few days. I've never come across a guy like him.

cc4life

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

After he made his famous 'Living way beyond our means speech' he increased public spending, which soon became out of control, and led to increases in borrowing and taxation at an unacceptable level. My father remembers paying 60p in the pound in taxes under the Corrupt Haughey government.

Then in 1982, his policy to gain the 'Overall Majority' was 'All things to all men' i.e spend crazy money on bribing the public to vote for him and to hell with the economic results. We'll deal with them later. This led to the Gang of 22 incident to oust him. Even his own party thought his policies were crazy.

my last question then is why did he keep getting elected?

Snakeblood

cc4life wrote: »

but none of these things damaged the country..i mean they were bad from a personal perspective and i could understand how hed be hated by lots of people who knew him or were related through business and politics but why do so many normal people hate him?

He stole from the people, stole from his party, rezoned land to suit himself, sold favours to people, betrayed his friends, employed dirty tricks in campaigns, ran guns. I'm not sure what exactly more he should have done to deserve contempt. He preached Austerity for the people and lived like a king with money he stole from people. He was more concerned with getting reelected than with actually helping the country, abandoning his austerity program in order to promise airports to win byelections. He made the Gregory deal, with Tony Gregory. Just think the financial sucking noise Healy Rae and Lowry made in return for political support, but for Dublin instead.
There was the bugging of opposition TDs while Haughey was in power.

He rejected the Anglo Irish Agreement, mostly because he couldnt stand Garret Fitzgerald and also because he (Haughey) was a total ****.

There's more, but it boils down to the world would have been a better place if he'd never been born.

Snakeblood

cc4life wrote: »

my last question then is why did he keep getting elected?

He was in Fianna Fail, and Fianna Fail members have shown they can be really incredibly stupid where party loyalty is concerned. Also, he promised people things.

Dan_Solo

Best thread title ever.:)

duque

Degsy wrote: »

Somebody with the surname Haughey running for election in Ireland is a national insult..might as well have somebody called Hitler running for office in Germany.

........or named ceaucescu in romania,Doc in Haiti,mussolini in italy and where are they now?

galwayrush

<Ollie> wrote: »

Charlie might have been corrupt, but I can guarantee you he wouldn't have bankrupt the country.

How on earth can you guarentee that?....lol:pac::pac::pac:

AskMyChocolate

dcmraad wrote: »

Finally a government without this corrupt family included.

If I had my way all of your families assets would have been seized years ago, and your oul fellow stuck against a wall and butchered.

starbelgrade wrote: »

Not much point in doing that.

He's already dead.

We could sell bits of them as souvenirs to American tourists.

Snakeblood

duque wrote: »

........or named ceaucescu in romania,Doc in Haiti,mussolini in italy and where are they now?

Actually, 2 of those 3 are in place.

duque

Snakeblood wrote: »

Haughey was paid more than IR£8 million between 1979 and 1986 from various benefactors and businessmen, including £1.3 million from the Dunnes Stores supermarket tycoon Ben Dunne alone.[34] The tribunal described these payments as "unethical".[40]
In May 1989 one of Haughey's lifelong friends Brian Lenihan, a former government minister, underwent a liver transplant which was partly paid for through fundraising by Haughey. The Moriarty tribunal found that, of the £270,000 collected in donations for Brian Lenihan, no more than £70,000 ended up being spent on Lenihan's medical care. The tribunal identified one specific donation of £20,000 for Lenihan that was surreptitiously appropriated by Haughey,[41] who took steps to conceal this transaction.[42][43]
The tribunal found evidence of favours performed in return for money — Saudi businessman Mahmoud Fustok paid Haughey £50,000 to support applications for Irish citizenship.[40]
In other evidence of favours performed, the tribunal reported that Haughey arranged meetings between Ben Dunne and civil servant Seamus Pairceir of the Revenue Commissioners. These discussions resulted in an outstanding capital gains tax bill for Dunne being reduced by £22.8 million. Moriarty found that this was "not coincidental", and that it was a substantial benefit conferred on Dunne by Haughey's actions.[44]
Allied Irish Banks settled a million-pound overdraft with Haughey soon after he became Taoiseach in 1979; the tribunal found that the lenience shown by the bank in this case amounted to an indirect payment by the bank to Haughey.[40]
The tribunal rejected Haughey's claims of ignorance of his own financial affairs[35] and Haughey was accused by the tribunal of "devaluing democracy".[40]

That'll get you started. He was contemptible scum who got a state funeral when he should have got the nation pissing on his grave.

pity hardly any one attended it

Snakeblood

<Ollie> wrote: »

I totally agree he was corrupt, but he was also a very proud Irish man and would never, ever get us into this mess. He was also very smart. Have you listened to the recent Bertire Ahern interviews? The man is totally deluded. He was still going on about his 'Bertie Bowl' and being a President only a few days. I've never come across a guy like him.

I don't know that he was a proud Irishman. I do know he stole from his country, I'm not sure how much pride that takes. I also know that he was making extravagant election promises in order to be elected wthout apparently paying attention to how much they were going to cost, much like Bertie's brilliant social partnership ideas.

I'm not sure whether Bertie is worse or not. I think Bertie had more money floating around to be given, he didn't have to steal it from a sick friend. he had anonymous friends to give it to him.

Snakeblood

duque wrote: »

pity hardly any one attended it

There's a lot of stupid people out there. It doesn't make him a good person, it just means people are dumb or they wanted to make sure they had the stakes out if he got up again.

AskMyChocolate

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

You must give CJ some credit.

Free travel for pensioners and Artist tax emption.:p

galwayrush wrote: »

I think Bertie was very thankful for that one...

"Eh.. eh... I've never done anything for myself, what I did was in the interests of the next generation of struggling Irish artists coming up"

\yeah that works.

Ghost Buster

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

You must give CJ some credit.

Free travel for pensioners and Artist tax emption.:p

yES. iN POLITICS THATS CALLED "DOING YOUR JOB'
I do my job but if i rob the safe or my customers i get fired.

duque

Zebra3 wrote: »

CJH was a great Irish patriot.

Sure didn't Bertie say so? :rolleyes:

and we all know how much his word meant honourable gentleman that he is!

steddyeddy

<Ollie> wrote: »

Charlie might have been corrupt, but I can guarantee you he wouldn't have bankrupt the country.

His aprentice did when he got the chance I dont see how haughey would have acted differently towards banks and developers. As regards bank regulation why would a man as corrupt as haughey want the banks to have accounts of all transactions?

Tar.Aldarion

Nodin wrote: »

....or is he?

That's what we wanted you to think!

http://oi52.tinypic.com/23uojy8.png

aDeener

dcmraad wrote: »

Finally a government without this corrupt family included.

If I had my way all of your families assets would have been seized years ago, and your oul fellow stuck against a wall and butchered.

ah yes punish the son for the sins of the father. lovely fellow you are :rolleyes:

steddyeddy

aDeener wrote: »

ah yes punish the son for the sins of the father. lovely fellow you are :rolleyes:

The criminal assets buruea siezes belongings obtained by criminal activity which affects the family of the criminal.

AskMyChocolate

bonerm wrote: »

Stalin was the greatest tyrant of the 20th Century. Check their finals scores.

Mao wasn't too bad. ****e overpriced coffee, but as tyrants go.

steddyeddy

AskMyChocolate wrote: »

Mao wasn't too bad. ****e overpriced coffee, but as tyrants go.

he actually only had one ball as opposed to hitler who had two!

AskMyChocolate

Degsy wrote: »

Somebody with the surname Haughey running for election in Ireland is a national insult..might as well have somebody called Hitler running for office in Germany.Israel

FYP