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How are working students meant to survive?

Tea_Bag

I just got home from work just there, and my boss called me over for a chat. i was hoping he'd say i was getting a Christmas bonus (ive been working 5-6 day weeks for the last 15 months there, only taking 2 weeks off for the entire duration of my employment, and never got a bonus/raise/anything)

Anyway, it turns out the business isnt making enough money (shocker:rolleyes:) and so everyone has to take a 15% pay cut. This brings my hourly rate to €8.00 on the dot. fantastic. (i was previously considering asking for a small raise - pffft)

[RANT]
I am doing a 4 year university science degree. i get ZERO support from my family, infact, my mom has to frequently "borrow" money from me. as a result of my working, my grades were woeful last semester, so this coming semester, I can only justify working 2 days a week @ 5-6 hours a day (full shift)
after calculating my budget, income (being optimistic with hours here) minus my rent = €30 a week left over for bills/groceries/misc.

WTF!

i actually dont know what to do with myself. my work colleague broke down and started crying. im more pissed off. i did nothing to deserve this current economic climate. ive been working since i was 16 and earning **** all. i took a 2 year gap after LC before going to uni, in which time i worked as much as possible. even though i qualified for the dole, and would have been given more than i was earning at the time per week, i refused to be a parasitic leech on the irish system. whenever i lost my job, i found another one within weeks, even though people kept telling me "its hopeless, there are no jobs". **** you loser, ive found several while you stayed scrounging on the dole you lazy ****. i moved out at 17 and have been fully independent ever since (only 3 and a half years, but its 3.5 and counting++)

now though, i dont know where to turn. Im going to try find a job that'll let me work weekends only @ 2 x 12 hour shifts. failing that, i guess im going to have to drop out of college because i cant pay the fees and become a bum on the dole like half my friends. THANK YOU IRELAND/POLITICIANS/DEVELOPERS!

[/RANT]

mods i posted this here and not R&R because i wanted reaction posts too, and people to tell me im an idiot and TL;DR etc..

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Einhard

Credit Union loan?

Also, are you sure you can't get a grant of some kind? I'm thinking of going back to college and when I enquired about grants, they basically threw money at me. Check with your Citizens Information centre. They might be able to dig up some supports you could apply for.

Whispered

OP I work for a company in dublin where the shifts are 8 - 12 hour shifts overnight. Including weekends. They pay a bit more than what you are getting and have recently been hiring. I'm not sure if they are still hiring, but being night work, people come and go regularly enough so if you're interested it'd do no harm to send in your cv. If you're interested pm me and I will give you the company name.

jesster

I totally agree with ya tea bag. It's amazing how many people only patronise. I'm a working student too and I think everyone would agree that working while studing makes grades plumit drastically. Funny thing is, that the students who come from a wealthy family, who get more pocket money in a week than we get through a months wages will have better grades at the end of college, ultimately giving them the better positions in the irish workforce. Thus, creating a chain reaction whereby the counrty is ran by the rich, for the rich. Ireland would be in a much better position if we had people incharge who had an idea of the value of money and how much of a struggle it can be for people in our situation. We work our asses off to try better ourselves but life would be alot easier if we gave up the struggle and became another bum of the state.
the rant was well overdue teabag!

timt

Art student?

Use your skills and either look of extra design work (ads, graphic design etc)

or

Murals, paintind houses etc

or

Do some paintings and try selling them

Theres a lot to be said for entrapenurship, plus your your own boss

EverEvolving

Don't a lot of colleges offer a sort of hardship fund to students who cannot continue their studies due to financial difficulties? Maybe enquire about that, also, you could offer to pay them back when you could. I'd imagine you would have to prove your skintness to them though, which from what you have told us, should be no problem.

Good luck OP.

Tea_Bag

NekkidBibleMan wrote: »

Third level education is not a basic human right. Dunno when people suddenly decided that everyone needed a degree. Nothing wrong with doing a trade or doing some other type of work.

I havent stated its my right. Im not very good at anything other than physics and computer science. so im doing a Physics degree. god knows there's no work for someone who likes to mess with a PC or 2.

NekkidBibleMan wrote: »

If you really want to go to university, you should figure out your budget before you enrol, not in 4th year. If you can't make ends meet, there are plenty of grants and loans available. Universities also allow students to defer their studies for a year, which would be a great time to safe up.

Im actually in 1st year, doing a 4 year course. sorry about the confusion.
as ive stated before, my own bank doesnt want to give me a loan, and i dont qualify for grants. coincidently, another poster reminded me of the main reason (which i had forgot about), being that my father lives in South Africa and therefore his income cannot be judged properly, (being a paranoid old bag he also would never sign his name on any paper i send him.)
as i previously noted, i deferred my degree for 2 years and still dont have any money to speak of. also, that was the worst mistake of my educational life. taking a year or 2 out puts you well behind your classmates in terms of understanding stuff. putting it frankly, ive become quite stupid and forgetful of everything i learned previous to this: school science/maths etc. eg: formula gets written up. i vaguely remember seeing it somewhere. the rest of my class: deriving it and tearing it apart into dimensionless quantities already. back to me: what is the formula trying to do??:(:confused:

I'm well aware that a degree isnt my right, but my god im going to try get it. failing that, my children, like me, and my parents before me, will forever be stuck in this uneducated sespool of the lower economic social group. i just refuse to let that happen.

brianthebard

EverEvolving wrote: »

Don't a lot of colleges offer a sort of hardship fund to students who cannot continue their studies due to financial difficulties? Maybe enquire about that, also, you could offer to pay them back when you could. I'd imagine you would have to prove your skintness to them though, which from what you have told us, should be no problem.

Good luck OP.

Yeah the op could probably get a loan from the su now that you mention it.

Alternatively, have you thought about saying your da is dead? I know some people would look badly on that but from the sounds of things your parents are separated and if his inability to provide forms is the only thing getting in the way of getting the grant I would personally seriously consider doing it.

macquarie

brianthebard wrote: »

Yeah the op could probably get a loan from the su now that you mention it.

Alternatively, have you thought about saying your da is dead? I know some people would look badly on that but from the sounds of things your parents are separated and if his inability to provide forms is the only thing getting in the way of getting the grant I would personally seriously consider doing it.

Bloody hell, don't do this at all. Faking someone's death to a state body is borderline criminal activity.

funky penguin

If your Dad is nowhere to be seen and you're giving loans to your ma, there is NO way in hell you shouldn't get a grant.

EDIT: Mainly because you should just never mention him. Say he's out of the picture. How about getting emancipated?

Tea_Bag

jesster wrote: »

I totally agree with ya tea bag. It's amazing how many people only patronise. I'm a working student too and I think everyone would agree that working while studing makes grades plumit drastically. Funny thing is, that the students who come from a wealthy family, who get more pocket money in a week than we get through a months wages will have better grades at the end of college, ultimately giving them the better positions in the irish workforce. Thus, creating a chain reaction whereby the counrty is ran by the rich, for the rich. Ireland would be in a much better position if we had people incharge who had an idea of the value of money and how much of a struggle it can be for people in our situation. We work our asses off to try better ourselves but life would be alot easier if we gave up the struggle and became another bum of the state.
the rant was well overdue teabag!

if i could thank this post a thousand times, i would. its nice to know im not alone anyway!

EverEvolving wrote: »

Don't a lot of colleges offer a sort of hardship fund to students who cannot continue their studies due to financial difficulties? Maybe enquire about that, also, you could offer to pay them back when you could. I'd imagine you would have to prove your skintness to them though, which from what you have told us, should be no problem.

Good luck OP.

I know of this yea. i also know of a lovely girl who was on it (and really deserved it)
But i also know im still alot better off than many many people who deserve it more, and taking what little money the SU has to give (and they dont get much to give out these days, and had to cut back because of budget adjustments etc) would make me feel "dirty" in a way.
whether i like it or not, €30 is still enough to live on, just not very fun. Lidl/aldi/reduced to clear food in the shops FTW!

Columbia

Wow, I really can't believe the amount of non-advice in this thread, I do hope some of them are borne out of misplaced frustration because they really do reflect very badly on the posters in question. The number of antisocial clowns who go to college and do nothing but cause havoc for four years, and here's a guy doing a good degree and working hard for it, and all he gets is a load of posturing.

OP, find out if your college has a student welfare officer, explain your situation to them (make sure to mention you've had a cut in pay) and they may have access to an assistance fund. Failing that, go seek a student loan - it won't be a huge amount if you've only got one semester left.

carfiosaoorl

OP I know exactly where your coming from. College in this country is elitist, if you cant afford it you cant have it. I hope you find a way to work it out and get your qualification. Good luck:)

RacoonQueen

brianthebard wrote: »

Yeah the op could probably get a loan from the su now that you mention it.

Alternatively, have you thought about saying your da is dead? I know some people would look badly on that but from the sounds of things your parents are separated and if his inability to provide forms is the only thing getting in the way of getting the grant I would personally seriously consider doing it.

When I was in college I tried to tell them my parents were seperated so my dad's earnings wouldn't be counted towards my grant application. They sent my form back to me asking for some sort of legal documents to prove the seperation. I imagine it'll be even more complicated with death.

ArseBurger

macquarie wrote: »

Faking someone's death to a state body is borderline criminal activity.

Eh, it's not borderline criminal. It is criminal, it's fraud.

Buceph

Don't let your pride bite you in your arse, most people involved with the Universities are very willing to help. I wouldn't have my degree if it wasn't for my university's support staff.

Go talk to the SU. You may not want a handout but they can decide on that. (Although I think you'd be stupid not to get any help you can when you're living on 30 quid.) There might not be any handouts but there could be other ways of helping you. They might have jobs reserved for people who need the cash, putting up posters in between classes, typing stuff for them, staff for official events, SU flier hander outer. They're the kinds of jobs suited to someone with a college timetable, who might have an hour off with no real time to do anything during it.

Not many people try this, but it could work. Go talk to the finance officer or fees officer, not the SU people, the main guy in the college. A friend of mine had difficulties similar to you and the Finance Office got him a loan from the bank. When an institution with tens of millions of debts with a bank asks for a few grand to help a future graduate the banks tend to listen. I think it was some deal about temporarily waiving his registration fee, and partly a loan, all on the proviso he'd pay it back when he was finished with the degree. He was refused a loan from his bank as well, but the university sorted it out for him.

Finally, go talk to FLAC (Free Legal Aid Centre.) If your college has a law course there will be a FLAC Society, they give legal advice and are usually supervised by a solicitor that does pro bono work with them. They might be able to help you get a declaration that you have no support from your parents, and this would allow you to apply for the grant.

Coriolanus

I'd have to reiterate the advice to go to your Su financial officer. It's humbling but sometimes life is.
Good luck.

[Deleted User]

Kold wrote: »

I was rejected because I'm unable to get relevant forms from my father. Thankfully I get a small bit of cash from my mother but after rent, €60 a month is not a whole lot to live on.

It's f*cking annoying because art is very rarely cheap to create and in 4th year it's meant to look pretty professional. What's more I won't actually be qualified for bugger all afterwards.

That's odd, when I was applying my father was/is out of the picture and IIRC I just didn't mention him at all

I got the grant though.
Maybe ring up and have a chat with someone in the grant office? They can be helpful

Minstrel27

Tea_Bag wrote: »

my mom has to frequently "borrow" money from me.

Does she not work?

prinz

Mind me asking what you do during the holidays, summer etc, OP?

Tordelback

jesster wrote: »

Funny thing is, that the students who come from a wealthy family, who get more pocket money in a week than we get through a months wages will have better grades at the end of college, ultimately giving them the better positions in the irish workforce.

Is this necessarily true, though? I had to work the whole way through my primary degree (which I had to pay fees for too, I'm that old), and got better results than most. With plenty of parental cash people tended to socialise (drink) and holiday more, which I'd suggest has just as bad an effect on grades. You also tend to value the opportunity to study more when you're working for it rather than being handed it on a plate, which also helps focus the mind. Work can be crushing at exam times, but I suspect you get more studying done during the rest of the year for precisely that reason.

None of this really addresses the OP's point, that €8 an hour is an incredibly difficult wage to live on in this country if you can't get or afford the hours to make it worthwhile. There's definitely no shame in asking for help when you find yourself at that level of income.

jimthemental

A Bsc and a diploma in sales in the bag but I can't get myself into a job which would considered good. Yesterday I got turned down for what was in my opinion the perfect job after wasting two days holidays on interviews for that one. I went to about 15 interviews last year and got this **** job and another which later fell through. OP this morning I'm just disillusioned, I looked at Australia as a prospect last night and am just going to save everything for 2/3 months, sell my car and then go. My advice OP is get a credit union loan to take off the pressure while you finish up college, work like mad for a few months then get the hell out of this country.

COYW

jimthemental wrote: »

A Bsc and a diploma in sales in the bag but I can't get myself into a job which would considered good.

How much experience do you have? In every field you need to spend time working your way up. Gone are the days when a sales person would walk out of college and pocket €100,000 + per year starting off. I am not in sales myself but worked in a company where that was the case.

OP, stick with your uni work and as others have suggested ask your SU for support. I was in your exact situation about 7 years ago but got through it and am now reaping the rewards.

jimthemental

COYW wrote: »

How much experience do you have? In every field you need to spend time working your way up. Gone are the days when a sales person would walk out of college and pocket €100,000 + per year starting off. I am not in sales myself but worked in a company where that was the case.

Over a year but I'm on under 20k without any of the job perks promised, and the wage is ten grand less than advertised. Nearly got myself a good one there but got shafted because the other guy with less experience and no qualification was already living in the area.

Fúck it, Australia and hopefully a lab job or something to tide me over until I make my next move.

[Deleted User]

melekalikimaka wrote: »

surely if your renting your away from home and can apply for all sorts of lovely grants.

I wish it were that easy. They've made it extremely hard to get the grant.

dave 27

as much as you probably dont want to hear this..8 euro an hour is still probably one of the highest wages you can get in europe and many other countries etc for a part time job..just wait until you finish college and get a job in the field of work your qualified for, this is good experience for you if anything

fakearms123

I have always been so confused and curious about how some students are able to go through college the entire year, heading out drinking every week, going on weekends to madrid and sh*t during the college year and then when the summer comes around somehow they have enough money to go on a J1??

How the F*CK do they get the money to do all these things? Where the F*CK is the money coming from? They don't work, they spend all their money in the week and then next thing they're announcing that they are going to f*cking Chicago for the summer!
I finished college last May and had to work from June till November just to pay for a 2 week holiday to Egypt, please please tell me how Barbara down the road was able to afford to go to San Franchigaco Angeles York City for the entire summer then come home for a few weeks and then head of to Australia for a year??

F*CK ME LIKE! :mad:

[Deleted User]

dave 27 wrote: »

as much as you probably dont want to hear this..8 euro an hour is still probably one of the highest wages you can get in europe and many other countries etc for a part time job..just wait until you finish college and get a job in the field of work your qualified for, this is good experience for you if anything

It doesn't matter that we have the highest wages when we also have one of the highest costs of living.

fakearms123 wrote: »

I have always been so confused and curious about how some students are able to go through college the entire year, heading out drinking every week, going on weekends to madrid and sh*t during the college year and then when the summer comes around somehow they have enough money to go on a J1?? How the F*CK do they get the money to do all these things? Where the F*CK is the money coming from? They don't work, they spend all their money in the week and then next thing they're announcing that they are going to f*cking Chicago for the summer!
I finished college last May and had to work from June till November just to pay for a 2 week holiday to Egypt, please please tell me how Barbara down the road was able to afford to go to San Franchigaco Angeles York City for the entire summer then come home for a few weeks and then head of to Australia for a year?? F*CK ME LIKE! :mad:

Way to generalize the entire student population of Ireland.

pow wow

How are working students meant to survive? The way the rest of us who did it did it (excellent grammar there, thanks college education!).

Would dropping down to pt study be an option? It's one that only really flies if your struggling employer has more hours to give you or you can get an alternative/additional job.

Usual 'it's character building' platitudes etc etc.

fakearms123

Deleted User wrote: »

Way to generalize the entire student population of Ireland.

fakearms123 wrote: »

I have always been so confused and curious about how some students are able to go through college the entire year, heading out drinking every week, going on weekends to madrid and sh*t during the college year and then when the summer comes around somehow they have enough money to go on a J1?? How the F*CK do they get the money to do all these things? Where the F*CK is the money coming from? They don't work, they spend all their money in the week and then next thing they're announcing that they are going to f*cking Chicago for the summer!
I finished college last May and had to work from June till November just to pay for a 2 week holiday to Egypt, please please tell me how Barbara down the road was able to afford to go to San Franchigaco Angeles York City for the entire summer then come home for a few weeks and then head of to Australia for a year?? F*CK ME LIKE! :mad:

Yeah I definitely generalized the entire student population of Ireland :rolleyes:

way to read no breath!

Xios

OP
Why are swimming against the current, go on the dole, get back to education allowance and still work part time...

tbh, you're not being smart about any of this. It's like your a kid trying to ram a square into the circle hole.

You have the rest of your life to be a labourer, take advantage of free gov money and think of it as a wage for learning. €190 a week on the dole for being a student full time is worth it, + rent allowance + grant + part time work if you have it.