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Ok, I suppose 'turned a corner' is over-used...

thebigbiffo

but seriously guys, you cannot argue this is not some of the best news on the economy for a while now...

the budget is still going to be a bitch, it wont stop people emigrating and there's still long dole queues but given some time we'll recover and we'll be better off than the other european countries.

shag it, standard and poors have given us so much s'hit since the crisis that an endorsement like 'turned a corner' starts to mean something.

http://www.independent.ie/business/irish/economy-has-turned-the-corner-experts-say-2376296.html

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senordingdong

thebigbiffo wrote: »

right mate - you stay angry.

and you're right, (if) lenihan said this he would be taking the piss and we would have come full circle. but he didnt, and (hopefully) we havent...

read the shaggin link ffs

But circles don't have corners ffs.

thebigbiffo

DeVore wrote: »

Mate of mine who I have known since school is the owner and director of one of the country's largest, if not THE largest renters of shop space. Think "Stephen's Green Shopping Centre", "Blanchardstown" "Nutgrove" sort of thing. Now in the last 2 years he said business has been pretty bad but in the last 6 months, its picked up to the point where they have little to nothing left on their books to rent.

and dundrum town centre has increased its rents by massive amounts recently - upwards of 100% in some cases i have heard - a sure indication that there's plenty of money being spent.

a fellow i know works for a mercedes dealership - apparently they've had a very good year.

neither of these examples help people on the dole or struggling - but people need to think long term. money NEEDS to circulate in the economy or you'll never have a job again

i agree with everything you said devore

MySelf56

I am ready for the boom. Last i missed it somehow, My wish list for this boom,

Apart from the 42" Flat Screen tele and drink like fish in weekend,

Loans:

Take big loan and give it Michael Lynn to buy property in Bulgaria
Take another loan invest property pyramid scheme in Dubai
Take another loan and buy house with zero or less amenities in Dublin 108 (100 miles from work place)
Take wee loan go to shopping New York for Xmas

Credit Card:

Book the ticket to some English match which i have no connection whatsoever, go and watch.
Book the ski trip in alps with 4**** hotel, but i will stay indoor in a cosy Irish pub.
Book the sun trip in meditarian with 3 *** hotel, but i will again stay indoor in cosy Irish pub.

Credit Union:

Take a loan and buy German made ubur expensive car for my commute

ejmaztec

Fuck the corners, we want the straight and narrow, with a light at the beginning of the tunnel thrown in for good measure.

thebigbiffo

senordingdong wrote: »

But circles don't have corners ffs.

if you've gone around four 90 degree corners arching your route outwards at the point of touching said corners and decreasing your trajectory toward the next corner at the apex of said arch you will have gone 'full circle' ffs

:cool:

_feedback_

thebigbiffo wrote: »

if you've gone around four 90 degree corners arching your route outwards at the point of touching said corners and decreasing your trajectory toward the next corner at the apex of said arch you will have gone 'full circle' ffs

:cool:

I knew failing maths in school would lead me to being confused at some stage in life.

I just didn't think it would be on boards.

Pherekydes

orourkeda wrote: »

We've turned the corner going forward

pfffft, you're supposed to reverse around the corner.

[Deleted User]

Typical Irish trait, when things were good folks thought they would always be good, when things are bad same thing applies. There are jobs out there, the pay may not be what folks want but they are out there. Many folk don't want things to improve, they just want to keep complaining, oh poor me........ bla bla bla...........

smash

thebigbiffo wrote: »

and dundrum town centre has increased its rents by massive amounts recently - upwards of 100% in some cases i have heard - a sure indication that there's plenty of money being spent.

Or perhaps they're trying to make up a shortfall in rents they've lost. Anyway upping rents is not going to get us out of a hole, it's just pushing prices back up again on everything because the extra cost will have to be taken from the consumer.

fontanalis

it depends where the corner leads to. If you were out for a drive and you turned a corner to Longford, would you be happy?

senordingdong

thebigbiffo wrote: »

if you've gone around four 90 degree corners arching your route outwards at the point of touching said corners and decreasing your trajectory toward the next corner at the apex of said arch you will have gone 'full circle' ffs

:cool:

But that's totally not how I turn corners ffs.
Keep it close to the wall.

thebigbiffo

steve06 wrote: »

Or perhaps they're trying to make up a shortfall in rents they've lost. Anyway upping rents is not going to get us out of a hole, it's just pushing prices back up again on everything because the extra cost will have to be taken from the consumer.

i see your point but increasing them by such large margins indicates they're sure tenants have been making profits to cover it - they would hardly try squeeze this much out of them otherwise.

i'm not suggesting that rents in themselves get us out of a hole - i'm saying that they are a good indicator of the health of the retail sector which employs alot of people, contributes to the VAT take, corporation tax etc etc. in general, any individual or company making and spending money is exactly what will get this country out of recession

whitesands

thebigbiffo wrote: »

right mate - you stay angry.

and you're right, (if) lenihan said this he would be taking the piss and we would have come full circle. but he didnt, and (hopefully) we havent...

read the shaggin link ffs

LOL, do you even know who said we turned a corner? It was an italian banker, not S&P.

Very misleading article.

thebigbiffo

whitesands wrote: »

LOL, do you even know who said we turned a corner? It was an italian banker, not S&P.

Very misleading article.

pedantosauraus warning..

right fine, someone called gillian edgeworth (who doesnt sound italian to me, if you want to be pedantic) used the expression but the S&P chief economist was very clear in his comments.

point stands

whitesands

After his [Mr. Beers from S&P]comments, Gillian Edgeworth, an economist at Italian bank UniCredit, which often comments on the Irish economy, said she believed the Irish economy had "turned a corner" although it remained "fragile" as the Government struggled to push down the country's budget deficit.

1 person in Italy said we turned a corner :rolleyes:

smash

thebigbiffo wrote: »

i see your point but increasing them by such large margins indicates they're sure tenants have been making profits to cover it - they would hardly try squeeze this much out of them otherwise.

Sorry but I don't buy that. I've seen company's client lists drop off over the last few years and where the companies have overheads or in most cases a board of directors that want their graphs to go in only 1 direction, the shortfall is placed back on remaining clients and masked as an advanced service offering or investment into r&d etc.

thebigbiffo wrote: »

i'm not suggesting that rents in themselves get us out of a hole - i'm saying that they are a good indicator of the health of the retail sector which employs alot of people, contributes to the VAT take, corporation tax etc etc. in general, any individual or company making and spending money is exactly what will get this country out of recession

and people will stop spending again when prices start to rise.

thebigbiffo

whitesands wrote: »

1 person in Italy said we turned a corner :rolleyes:

yes, yes you're right. totally and completely. run along now...

steve06 wrote: »

Sorry but I don't buy that. I've seen company's client lists drop off over the last few years and where the companies have overheads or in most cases a board of directors that want their graphs to go in only 1 direction, the shortfall is placed back on remaining clients and masked as an advanced service offering or investment into r&d etc.

and people will stop spending again when prices start to rise.

on your first point i simply dont buy it. if i doubled the cost of my business to a client overnight they would simply go elsewhere. i dont know what kind of industry you're operating in but its either very corrupt or your clients are very stupid. certainly not a good analogy when dealing with a point as simple as rental for retail space.

on your second - rising prices do not nessesarily stop people spending. i mean you've heard of inflation? remember the boom? the whole point of an end to this resession is that people DO start spending and prices DO rise...thats how an economy works! as long as any increases are in line with what customers are willing to and able to pay there's no issue!

Lemegeton

im sick of hearing this bull****. This is just somebodys opinion and nothing more. until dole queues start to shorten and unemployment drops then not a damn thing has actually 'changed' in the economy.

ixoy

Let's say we see the glimmering of growth and an increase in GDP... It won't matter. Our current outgoings, to account for public spending and the bank bailouts, mean that we need massive growth to restore the public finances. An anaemic 1% growth rate (i.e. out of a recession), isn't nearly good enough. We'd still be screwed for years.

flash1080

Fair play to Fianna Fáil. They've got my vote.

smash

thebigbiffo wrote: »

on your first point i simply dont buy it. if i doubled the cost of my business to a client overnight they would simply go elsewhere.

But you're saying it's happened in Dundrum... I don't see them going elsewhere!

thebigbiffo wrote: »

i dont know what kind of industry you're operating in but its either very corrupt or your clients are very stupid. certainly not a good analogy when dealing with a point as simple as rental for retail space.

Sorry but rental for retail space is not simple, there are empty retail units EVERYWHERE.

thebigbiffo wrote: »

on your second - rising prices do not nessesarily stop people spending.

100% increase in rental price is enough to increase retail prices so that customers will notice.

thebigbiffo wrote: »

i mean you've heard of inflation? remember the boom?

It's hard to take a condescending tone seriously from someone that can't use cap locks to punctuate correctly when he's trying to make a valid point.

thebigbiffo wrote: »

the whole point of an end to this resession is that people DO start spending and prices DO rise...thats how an economy works!

People will not start spending like they used to because there's not enough money out there. How can you be blind to that? It will be a long long time before it's ever like it was.

thebigbiffo wrote: »

as long as any increases are in line with what customers are willing to and able to pay there's no issue!

That's just stating the obvious, it doesn't mean that rental companies will try and rape their clients.

Biggins

senordingdong wrote: »

But circles don't have corners ffs.

They were squares but Biffo had a few drinks to take the edges off!

thebigbiffo

if this thread has proven anything it's this (substitute the words irish for boardsies where appropriate)

RoverJames wrote: »

Typical Irish trait, when things were good folks thought they would always be good, when things are bad same thing applies. There are jobs out there, the pay may not be what folks want but they are out there. Many folk don't want things to improve, they just want to keep complaining, oh poor me........ bla bla bla...........

Lemegeton wrote: »

im sick of hearing this bull****. This is just somebodys opinion and nothing more. until dole queues start to shorten and unemployment drops then not a damn thing has actually 'changed' in the economy.

its attitudes like this that really piss me off. you lap up the bad news i'd bet? first one on here in the morning looking for someone to blame when there's evidence the dole queues are increasing?

i simply tried to post some good news on the economy for a change. if the front page of the indo today was another bad news story on the economy i wouldnt have had a chance to start a thread on it there'd be that many queuing up to bitch and moan.

@Lemegeton: do you think you'll wake up some morning and everyone will have a job again? your attutude suggests you believe you need to bury your head the sand until all this is over and someone knocks on your door to offer you a job? not a thing has changed in this country since this 'bulls'hit' opinion was given voice no? well how about the fact that our credit rating looks unlikely to be further downgraded by this agency meaning we wont be saddled with even more interest on our loans meaning your dole money/childrens allowance/local hospital budget/public transport/care services etc etc etc wont be cut. is this tangible enough for you?

yes, thats the proper course of action for people like you: you just sit back bitch, moan and complain until your handed what you want. in the meantime, some of us will look at the big picture so your hand can be held through this recession.

ffs people: its this kind of s'hitty attitude that starts a recession and it's only positivity that can get us out. economic recessions are as much about a state of mind as about money - and judging by the attitude in here, we're f'ucked.

sorry for the rant.

southsiderosie

thebigbiffo wrote: »

we havent heard anything like this before, thats the point. standard and poors being positive about us is imo the best news on the economy in 2-3 years! this is not biffo or lenners looking for a soundbite...

if that news doesnt deserve its own thread in the spirit of positivity i dont know what does!

As I said in the other thread on this topic, I have no idea why anyone gives a **** about what S&P or any of the major ratings agencies have to say, given their sorry performance over the last several years.

Thinking a recession is due to negativity rather than underlying economic activity (or lack thereof) is magical thinking at its worst.

Government spending is based on tax revenue from an employment base that simply does not exist anymore. Even if employment were to pick up significantly (and it has not), the government's debt and budget deficits are still running completely out of control. If Ireland is in such great shape, why did the ECB have to intervene and buy some of its sovereign debt? Why are its interest rates the second highest in the euro zone? Why is emigration accelerating?

And frankly I'm amazed to hear commercial rent is going up again. In general, Irish prices still have a long ways to fall for it to be in any way shape or form competitive again.

Executive Steve

orourkeda wrote: »

Biffo' rectum isnt the place to be.

Biffo rectum all right, as did Lenihan and Ahern...

Wrecked all of us in fact... Wrecked our economy, wrecked our services, wrecked our society.

Fuhrer

Brian Cowens planning on turning around this crisis 360 degrees !

fontanalis

thebigbiffo wrote: »

if this thread has proven anything it's this (substitute the words irish for boardsies where appropriate)

its attitudes like this that really piss me off. you lap up the bad news i'd bet? first one on here in the morning looking for someone to blame when there's evidence the dole queues are increasing?

i simply tried to post some good news on the economy for a change. if the front page of the indo today was another bad news story on the economy i wouldnt have had a chance to start a thread on it there'd be that many queuing up to bitch and moan.

@Lemegeton: do you think you'll wake up some morning and everyone will have a job again? your attutude suggests you believe you need to bury your head the sand until all this is over and someone knocks on your door to offer you a job? not a thing has changed in this country since this 'bulls'hit' opinion was given voice no? well how about the fact that our credit rating looks unlikely to be further downgraded by this agency meaning we wont be saddled with even more interest on our loans meaning your dole money/childrens allowance/local hospital budget/public transport/care services etc etc etc wont be cut. is this tangible enough for you?

yes, thats the proper course of action for people like you: you just sit back bitch, moan and complain until your handed what you want. in the meantime, some of us will look at the big picture so your hand can be held through this recession.

ffs people: its this kind of s'hitty attitude that starts a recession and it's only positivity that can get us out. economic recessions are as much about a state of mind as about money - and judging by the attitude in here, we're f'ucked.

sorry for the rant.

Oh give me a f***ing break with your pseudo positive thinking Secret shyte. Positive thinking, go and watch some Oprah.
The recession was caused by people who thought there was something special about Ireland and the rules of logic somehow didn't apply.

flash1080

Executive Steve wrote: »

Biffo rectum all right, as did Lenihan and Ahern...

Wrecked all of us in fact... Wrecked our economy, wrecked our services, wrecked our society.

lulz

thebigbiffo

steve06 wrote: »

But you're saying it's happened in Dundrum... I don't see them going elsewhere!.

of course they can move if rent becomes so high its not profitable for them to be there!

steve06 wrote: »

Sorry but rental for retail space is not simple, there are empty retail units EVERYWHERE..

yes there are, but the point is dundrum (if demand for floor space is anything to go by) is doing well. its very very simple. footfall in dundrum good = increased rents in dundrum. footfall in carrickmacross retail park bad = empty units

steve06 wrote: »

100% increase in rental price is enough to increase retail prices so that customers will notice.

this is not nessesarily the case. most retailers, especially large grocery and fashion houses typical of dundrum, have uniform prices across all store regardless of location and rental costs. profits are based on footfall, not what they can extort from customers.

steve06 wrote: »

It's hard to take a condescending tone seriously from someone that can't use cap locks to punctuate correctly when he's trying to make a valid point...

:rolleyes:

steve06 wrote: »

People will not start spending like they used to because there's not enough money out there. How can you be blind to that? It will be a long long time before it's ever like it was.

i never suggested it would be 'like it was'. people stop spending money whether they have it or not in a recession. 87% of people in this country are working, lot of people have not lost huge money and there's lots of cash jobs still knocking about in trades. this idea that 'there's no money' is just childish. sure why dont we all just lock ourselves in our gaffs if thats the case.

steve06 wrote: »

That's just stating the obvious, it doesn't mean that rental companies will try and rape their clients.

no it doesn't - but my point is who says they're 'raping their clients'!? my point was if they feel they can command these types of rents in dundrum, they must feel client can afford it = everyones happy.

anyway - you're just picking everything i say apart, presumably for the craic or at worst because you cant stand the idea that some things out there arent as bad as you'd like. i didn't make this news, i'm simply pointing out maybe people should stop acting like everyone and everything in this country is f'ucked when its clearly not

thebigbiffo

fontanalis wrote: »

The recession was caused by people who thought there was something special about Ireland and the rules of logic somehow didn't apply.

do you want to expand on that? cos i've a feeling your jumped up attitude is another symptom of why i believe this countries in the state it is.

you were the 'great lad' were ya? you were the one who saw all this coming?