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Child Item

Suicide, where's the help?

MagicMarker

It turns out the son of my mother's friend hung himself yesterday. He was only 17 years old. Now, instead of opening presents together in the morning, they'll be crying over his coffin.

Apparently he attempted suicide last week, and after a trip to the doctors he was prescribed drugs, which obviously were of no help.

Being honest I don't know what kind of help was offered by the doctor, and I'm not criticizing any treatment he did receive, but it would seem there is just not enough immediate treatment available.

Surely if someone attempts to take their own life, they should be considered a danger to themselves and be given immediate access to the right people with regards to therapy etc. If needs be they should be locked in a padded cell, it may seem extreme but if it saves their life then it's warranted imo!

Merry Christmas:(

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Midnight_EG

Shin Bet wrote: »

Hi Magic
I think I know the person your talking about
well I didnt know him but his brother
It was a shock to us all when we found out about it
you obiously knew them much better than us so on behalf of me and my work mates our condolonces

He didn't have a brother, so sorry for the person you have to deal with.

Piste

Jigga wrote: »

I haven't read through the whole thread yet, sorry to hear about the Original poster's friend who committed suicide. Friend of mine did it last year few days before his birthday, his parents told me last year that they didn't feel like putting the Christmas tree up that year but did anyway. Its the worst way to lose anyone, fcukin tragic, and leaves the worst pain for those left behind. When I hear comments from the likes of Bertie Ahern and Jim McDaid it makes me just furious, imagine losing a loved one in such a way, I'm sure they would think twice before making an "off the cuff" remark that shows a complete lack of understanding again. Make sure you are there at this time of year for friends who have lost loved ones to suicide and sympathies to those that have.

What did they say?

Aard

As a young male, who has attempted suicide in the past, I would just like to echo what somebody said above. PIETA HOUSE (http://pieta.ie) in Lucan are a fantastic service. Please let your family members know about this over Christmas, especially young men. It's my belief that the biggest problem for anybody contemplating suicide is not the suicidal thoughts themselves, but the thought that they have nobody to talk to. Suicidal ideation should not be something to be ashamed or embarrassed about, and the more that families talk openly about it, the less of it we'll see.

brightkane

Maybe to much for AF but here go's,

My best friend left this world by his own method almost 3 months ago.

This guy was life and soul of the party, never a bad word to say about anyone. Time for whoever who wanted to see him.

Yet, without warning, in the blink of an eye he is gone. no note, no warning, no answers.

I am left as are many people, looking for answers, looking at the scraps of last conversations, emails, text messages.....

I believe whatever demon he had he couldn’t deal with; he didn’t ask for help or let it be known he needed help.

I went through removal and funeral on auto pilot, being strong as I could yet breaking down unexpectedly.

2 weeks following his passing I decided to go to console.ie, to a support group and I have being going monthly since. I find it great and in some form hope my being there helps others.

FF you’re my best mate, I talk to you daily and until we meet again keep my high stool warm. DS

Shin Bet

Hi Magic
I think I know the person your talking about
well I didnt know him but his brother
It was a shock to us all when we found out about it
you obiously knew them much better than us so on behalf of me and my work mates our condolonces

opinion guy

Jigga wrote: »

When I hear comments from the likes of Bertie Ahern and Jim McDaid it makes me just furious, imagine losing a loved one in such a way, I'm sure they would think twice before making an "off the cuff" remark that shows a complete lack of understanding again.

Christ I saw that Prime-Time episode tonight with clip of Bertie making that gaff. Could not believe he said that. My total lack of respect for him reached a new definition of total after I saw it. Disgraceful.

Jigga

I haven't read through the whole thread yet, sorry to hear about the Original poster's friend who committed suicide. Friend of mine did it last year few days before his birthday, his parents told me last year that they didn't feel like putting the Christmas tree up that year but did anyway. Its the worst way to lose anyone, fcukin tragic, and leaves the worst pain for those left behind. When I hear comments from the likes of Bertie Ahern and Jim McDaid it makes me just furious, imagine losing a loved one in such a way, I'm sure they would think twice before making an "off the cuff" remark that shows a complete lack of understanding again. Make sure you are there at this time of year for friends who have lost loved ones to suicide and sympathies to those that have.

Midnight_EG

I'd just like to let everybody know that this thread does indeed speak about the same person I do in mine, which is a damn crying shame

Any information people might like to know regarding the deceased can be located in my thread.

leddpipe

There's no effective structure in place to deal with this!

The only people worth their weight in salt, are those working with the Samaritans!

Thankless job, from selfless people!

But it doesn't help when your staring into a hole!

Nothing does!

amacachi

My name is URL wrote: »

Well it's possible to have someone commited to a mental institution if you can show that they're a danger to themselves or others.. were the guys family adamant that he was still suffering when talking to the doctors?

It's very difficult to gauge situations when you're not close to them, so doctors can't be expected to make the right calls all of the time.. for all you know they guy told the docs that he was feeling better, and maybe convinced his family of the same

I agree with you though, the system in place needs some big improvements

Not wishing to go into too much detail but I know one person who tried to commit himself and was told after 36 hours that they wouldn't. By the following weekend he was dead. So ****ing sad and disgraceful too.

opinion guy

Sigh.

A topic in which I might have alot to say but I've had a few drinks so now's not the time.

What I will say is my commiserations to the OP and the poor guy's family.

<snip by opinion guy>

sheep-go-baa

Piste wrote: »

What do you think is the best method of changing people's attitudes to make them more open-minded?

Obviously it's not easy, but it all starts with small stuff. For example i would have no problem bringing up this topic with my friends and many people on here seem to be the same. But if you're not what if you try that. Start the ball rolling, even on a small scale.

Piste

sheep-go-baa wrote: »

Ads on tv are only a tiny portion of what needs to be done. Someone with depression could sit in a room with their family, the ad comes on and not a word of discussion about it. A more open minded attitude is what is needed.

What do you think is the best method of changing people's attitudes to make them more open-minded?

SeaFields

Its heartwrenching that this threads exists on Christmas eve. Not only is this Christmas ruined for that family but every Christmas will be a time for grief.

I have a very close relative working as a senior clinical psychologist. I believe it takes a very special person to take on this kind of role. 90% of his caseload at present is what he calls "high dependency" cases with seriously mentally ill people. I know, as I have met some of these over the years, that he has saved the lives of many people and they have told him that, in my presence.

However...

his disillusionment with the HSE is becoming more evident as the months and years go by. He could, should he choose to, spend all his week in meetings discussing policy, rather than dealing with what he is trained for. The organisation that is the HSE is responsible for the lack of many services, swallowing up resources in bureaucracy and other non-essentials.

Its very easy to jump on the bandwagon about the HSE and health services in this country, but until you hear it from someone fighting it, you do not realise how bad it is.

ToniTuddle

There are soo many people walking about, carrying on with their lives and they have a mental illness of some sort.
A mental illness doesn't mean your life is over. Depending on how severe it is, it may only alter your life slightly or it may impact greatly on it. But no matter what you can still have a life.

Once people hear even the slightest indication that someone is "not right", they shut off from them, distance themselves.

If the majority of people in Ireland would be more accepting and open, lives would be saved.

Latchy

I am sorry to hear of the death of this young man OP .It would be so easy to ask why he commited suicide a few days before christmas yet he must obiously have felt so distraught and traumatized to actually do so .Something so painful and tormenting must push people into a dark place that living is just not an option any more .

Loneliness is a big problem for many and people need company ,friendship and human contact more so at this time of year then ever .We all can have an internet life but if somebody has being spending long hours every day ,week in week out, substituting that pc life with real human contact then it must be a terrible lonely expierence to suddenly discover this empty void in their life that cant suddenly overcome by popping out to the local crowded pub or club .There has to be a balance of sorts .We all need human interaction of some kind ,it's the most basic human instinct .If people thinking about suicide dont reach out for help because of a fear of being pre judged ,seen as weak or a failure then that's such a shame because for every suicide there are probably a few hundred other people at any giving time also contemplating it . No man or womon should feel they are an island .You're not alone.

MagicMarker

Hi guys, I appreciate the condolences, but to make it clear, I didn't know this guy myself, I don't even know his name in fact. I only know about it because his mother and my mother know each other.

Midnight_EG wrote: »

OP, I'm in the exact same boat as you, here's the link to my own thread on PI that I think you'd like to see.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055778094

Hi Midnight, looking at your post and location I think we're talking about the same kid. I'm really sorry for your loss man, I can't even begin to imagine what you're actually going through.

sheep-go-baa

Ads on tv are only a tiny portion of what needs to be done. Someone with depression could sit in a room with their family, the ad comes on and not a word of discussion about it. A more open minded attitude is what is needed.

john_d_baptist

there is help, its a program called ASIST and everyone should be aware of it.
Applied Suicide Intervention Skills Training (ASIST)

http://www.youthhealth.ie/index.php?id=159

its a short course and will save someone's life. Learn it, it could help a loved one

Run_to_da_hills

mikemac wrote: »

Well a GP can only do so much, they aren't specialists to a consultant level in any one area.
But help is available out there

I only hope if you have nobody to talk then see your GP who help you in a non-judgemental fashion. And refer you to a specialist if needs be
If you're not comfortable seeing your family GP, see another. Just talk to somebody! Even your best mate

If everyone fails you then post on boards and someone will have your back. If it's not me it'll be somebody else.
"A problem shared is a problem halved."

Christmas is a lonely time for many

Sorry RTDH, reading your post again you lost your cousin, my sympathies

It was a long time ago, mid 80ies, one thing he was a total loner and would spend hours or day at his PC,probably a Sinclair or Commodore 64, and not socializing. No interaction in those days.

It has caused more devastation on his family as they felt responsibility for it. The family was also extremely well off living in one of the most upmarket parts of Cheshire and it made absolutely no difference. It also shows that money isn't everything.

They should also fit a visible phone with a hot line to the Samaritans at the top Cliffs of Moher. It is a well known spot for people taking their own lives. With the amount of cash spent on this place recently it wouldnt be too much to ask.

Piste

El Siglo wrote: »

My deepest sympathies OP, awful thing to happen.
The one thing that strikes me though is how much advertising, campaigning, money being poured in dealing with road traffic accidents? And how much is being poured into counselling and suicide prevention? You won't see Gaybo on the Late Late talking about suicide, because it's all still taboo and people want to live in denial. In 2008 there was 276 deaths from road traffic accidents and in 2006 there was 409 suicides. I'm not saying car crashes are any less painful for families and friends but what I'm trying to indicate is that the services provided for suicide prevention are wholly inadequate by comparison and also because these are the two most common types of premature deaths in the country.

I dunno, I've seen and heard a lot of advertisement for looking after your mental health and reaching out to others if you feel they may be suicidal. Granted I havent seen nearly as much publicity for mental health awareness as I have for Road Safety, but it's definitely there.

My name is URL

mikemac wrote: »

4 million euro is a pittance from the government!

I'm starting to think the HSE can't handle this at all. Just hand the funding to Samaritans and other groups who can possibly help people and have a track record for doing so

Thing is that they could throw all the money in the world at the problem and it won't change that much.. it's as much to do with people's attitudes towards mental health in Ireland as anything else

There's still a stigma attached to it in Ireland, and that alone is a massive reason as to why people don't use the services available to them, and chose to suffer in silence

mikemac

4 million euro is a pittance from the government!

I'm starting to think the HSE can't handle this at all. Just hand the funding to Samaritans and other groups who can possibly help people and have a track record for doing so

thebigcheese22

I think I heard somewhere that only 4 million is spent on suicide prevention by the government while 40 million is spent on road safety, despite the fact that suicide kills more people. Kind of sums up this governments attitude really :mad:

stovelid

koHd wrote: »

You just assume everybody chirps up this time of year. But I've read about so many suicides this Christmas.

I would imagine that Christmas just compounds the misery for many unhappy people. Not least because it's the middle of winter, but also because of the emphasis on relationships, friendships and general happiness.

arybvtcw0eolkf

Samaritians = (Rep.of Ireland) ROI: 1850 60 90 90.

koHd

You just assume everybody chirps up this time of year. But I've read about so many suicides this Christmas. Really sad that they can't even see a nice christmas with people they like to live for. Sorry for anybody that has had somebody close do this. I know it's very hard for people and a lot of people blame themselves and think they could have prevented it. But in most cases you probably would not prevent it as they're so deep into depression. But if you do have worries about somebody you should always try get them to join you to do things they might enjoy at every opportunity.

mikemac

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

I lost a first cousin whose both parents were practicing GP'S at the time. Even they couldn't council with him.

Well a GP can only do so much, they aren't specialists to a consultant level in any one area.
But help is available out there

I only hope if you have nobody to talk then see your GP who help you in a non-judgemental fashion. And refer you to a specialist if needs be
If you're not comfortable seeing your family GP, see another. Just talk to somebody! Even your best mate

If everyone fails you then post on boards and someone will have your back. If it's not me it'll be somebody else.
"A problem shared is a problem halved."

Christmas is a lonely time for many

Sorry RTDH, reading your post again you lost your cousin, my sympathies

arybvtcw0eolkf

stovelid wrote: »

This happened to my brother-in-law and even if the support structures were adequate here, it still must be hard to stop somebody who sets their mind on taking this path.

It's the worst thing that can happen to a family and I really feel for them.

Very same thing happened to me.

He done it on his birthday too.

smemon

I don't think support services work... or make much sense tbh.

I'm guessing the vast majority of young males are successful in suicide attempts so supporting those who fail is like gritting a road after several accidents have occurred...

There needs to be a more proactive approach starting in secondary school imo. Bringing in victim's families to talk (if they'd agree) would probably be the most powerful way of deterring people imo...